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How Did Dogs Acquire a "Guilty Look?"
Self | September 18, 2009 | PJ-Comix

Posted on 09/18/2009 3:06:19 PM PDT by PJ-Comix

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To: brytlea

mine i don’t think know the difference..... we refer to them as arizona dog biscuts :)


151 posted on 09/18/2009 6:40:34 PM PDT by Americanwolf (Palin/Beck 2012!!..... Wilson/Palin 2012!!!...... Palin/Wilson2012!!!)
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To: PJ-Comix
Dogs Interpret (Human) Signals Better Than Chimps


152 posted on 09/18/2009 7:03:43 PM PDT by blam
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To: thecabal
tooo funny...
153 posted on 09/18/2009 7:50:22 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist *DTOM* -ww- I AM JIM THOMPSON!)
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To: AnAmericanMother

No kidding? I wonder if that is what my little Rex has. He can literally come to a stop and not move for about 5 minutes.

I have been saying for years he is a dork and lazy. I just pick him up.

Does it affect cockers or is my little guy just a little lazy?


154 posted on 09/18/2009 7:52:24 PM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it.)
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To: nnn0jeh

Cute pictures on this thread and see video at post 25


155 posted on 09/18/2009 7:55:22 PM PDT by kalee (01/20/13 The end of an error.... Obama even worse than Carter.)
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To: Vendome
Don't know if it's been identified in cockers or not, but what you're describing doesn't sound like it. The hind end collapses while they're still trying to run in front. Here's video showing the characteristic progress of an episode -- it's very disturbing at first glance, but then you see that the pup keeps on wagging, fetching, and looking perfectly happy even while she's dragging her hind legs. It doesn't seem to bother THEM - just their owners!

Exercise Induced Collapse

The University of Minnesota Vet School is the outfit that isolated the gene and developed the blood test.

156 posted on 09/18/2009 8:26:48 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: AnAmericanMother

I could only watch a couple of seconds of that video.

You are right. That ain’t my little boy. He’s just lazy. I don’t care.

I love him and sometimes they what they is.

thanks for the video, erh, sort of.

Thank you.


157 posted on 09/18/2009 9:23:00 PM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it.)
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To: AnAmericanMother
What a great story...goats can be taught lots of things...I had one born to a young nanny that was not suppose to be preg...She had a buck that I named after my Son-in-Law...I taught him to shake paws for a hand-full of corn...He got ornery at about 4 when I let him breed for the first time...

Our first kidding season (my hubby and I being city folk that decided to raise goats) we lost 3 out of 4 of our first year...But the one I was able to save became quite a pet...He was the only one that I could let out of the pasture and he would follow me around the farm, if he lost track of me he'd baaa baaa until I called him...I spent so much time with him and carried him to the alfalfa field (he was too weak to walk) and I'd hold him up with my calfs (leg muscles not cow) and let him eat all he wanted and supplemented him with a bottle several times a day...A neighbor around the corner raised dairy goats and I'd go buy a gallon from her for my little guy (that ended up being his name)

Angora's don't smell like a lot of breeds of goats as they are like deer and have a breeding season (2 months) at that time the breeding billys stink to high heaven...They urinate on themselves and I guess that is irrestistible to the nannys...Just not to the owners....You can smell those guys from 30 feet away...P.U.

As a general rule 1 goat is a lonely goat, being a flock animal they are more at ease with others...

I got on a thread quite a while back of with one gal that was able to housebreak her goat...she sent me a picture...now thats a woman with patience...but she too had a great story....

158 posted on 09/18/2009 9:49:28 PM PDT by goat granny
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To: Vendome
Yep, that's why I mentioned that it is pretty disturbing.

But as long as the dog seems o.k. and not frightened, it's not as bad as it would be otherwise. It's when they're scared of what's happening that it's really bad.

When Ruby went down, she had four of us working over her and one on the phone to the vet. She had no idea what the fuss was about, but she enjoyed it very much, she was wagging her tail and smiling and licking everyone's hands . . . one of the pro trainers said, "Ruby, I hope you're not doing this just to get all this attention."

159 posted on 09/18/2009 10:26:20 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: goat granny
If we had kept Leona, I would have had a shot at housebreaking her. She was very intelligent, and affectionate too. It may have just been cupboard love, because she lived like a pampered princess with us, but she learned to recognize the sound of my car motor (and my footsteps) and would bleat for me to 'hurry up please!'

I was warned not to keep a billy! Oddly enough the lady down the hill on the OTHER side had an old billy goat with one horn and he WAS a stinky old fellow. She kept him on a tether in the yard to eat the kudzu.

This neighborhood was in downtown Atlanta but you might as well have been somewhere out in the country in north Georgia. The area was settled by folks out of NW GA who came down to Atlanta to work in the Tull Sheet Metal factory, and they brought the country with them. We loved it!

160 posted on 09/18/2009 10:32:11 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: AnAmericanMother
Personally I wouldn't keep a un-neutered billy as a pet, just to eliminate the smell, but they don't go into breeding mode. Some can get real cantankerous during that time....I never worried about walking into the pasture with 50 goats unless it was breeding season, then I always looked to see where my big billy was before going in...A neutered male is much like a nanny in disposition.

The will eat everything except wild mustard but you have to dig out burdock cause that can poison them. We had different pastures that could be closed off to let the timothy and alfalfa regrow..

Wild mustard looks a lot like alfalfa and I wondered how they told the difference so I chewed a piece one day, spit real quick, its very bitter... A city girl can learn real fast...:O)

161 posted on 09/18/2009 10:54:28 PM PDT by goat granny
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To: PJ-Comix

162 posted on 09/19/2009 6:52:44 AM PDT by csvset
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To: AnAmericanMother

EIC? I guess I haven’t kept up with labs, what is that?


163 posted on 09/19/2009 2:16:46 PM PDT by brytlea (Jesus loves me, this I know.)
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To: Vendome

We alphas are great...as long as every one else toes the line! ;)


164 posted on 09/19/2009 2:17:39 PM PDT by brytlea (Jesus loves me, this I know.)
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To: Americanwolf

Pauli has started thinking that when we get back from our morning walk, it is ice time. She goes and stands by the dispenser. I just hope she never figures out how it works!


165 posted on 09/19/2009 2:21:18 PM PDT by brytlea (Jesus loves me, this I know.)
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To: kalee

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLzmaqQ6nZY


166 posted on 09/19/2009 2:26:20 PM PDT by brytlea (Jesus loves me, this I know.)
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To: brytlea

AHHHHHH! Too cute!


167 posted on 09/19/2009 3:13:49 PM PDT by kalee (01/20/13 The end of an error.... Obama even worse than Carter.)
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To: Cailleach

ping 166


168 posted on 09/19/2009 3:14:42 PM PDT by kalee (01/20/13 The end of an error.... Obama even worse than Carter.)
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To: brytlea
Post 150 explains what it is. Post 156 has a video from the University of Minnesota website.

I'll warn you that it's a little unnerving to watch, but it's also obvious that the dog is not in pain and perfectly happy.

Miss Ruby has only had one episode, which scared us half to death, but she's never had another and seems none the worse for her experience. Some dogs have a more acute form than others - a few can collapse just from excitement without much exertion or heat. But that's the exception not the rule.

They've seen it in other retrievers, but most cases are in high-bred, high-strung field Labs. They think the gene is VERY common, but if the dogs are not pushed to the limit they never have an attack, so your average couch potato retriever is not going to be doing repetitive 200 yard blinds in hot weather with multiple whistle stops and collar corrections. That's generally what brings it on.

169 posted on 09/19/2009 3:21:41 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: kalee

That was such a cute puppy! But he was very noisy!


170 posted on 09/20/2009 11:34:47 AM PDT by brytlea (Jesus loves me, this I know.)
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To: AnAmericanMother

Yes, I saw your explanation. I guess I had not heard it referred to by the initials and my brain was too lazy to decipher! I had one golden who collapsed one day, chasing a ball in the hot E TX sun. I wasn’t there, my son was, he called his dad and was told to hose her until she got better. By the time I got home she was fine. I *think* it was heat stroke (she is a ball fanatic and will not stop and my son didn’t know she would keep going no matter what).
Later, when I first heard about that, I wondered if it was something like that instead of heat stroke, but she’s never had another episode. Then again, she is an indoor couch potato. FWIW she was never bred.


171 posted on 09/20/2009 11:37:12 AM PDT by brytlea (Jesus loves me, this I know.)
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To: brytlea
As we found out by researching it and talking to our vet, the way to tell the difference between EIC and heat stroke is twofold:

1. Heat stroke is a general collapse, with unconsciousness, hyperventilation, vomiting, and diarrhea. EIC onset is sudden, it is almost always confined to the hind end weakness/paralysis, and the dog otherwise remains alert and happy, although sometimes a little bit confused or 'out of it'.

2. Genuine heat stroke (as opposed to mere heat exhaustion) takes several days to recover from - the dog will only gradually recover and remain weak, somewhat dehydrated, vomit, etc. With EIC they are right as rain in 10-15 minutes or half an hour, as though nothing at all happened. Ruby was up trotting around, sniffing, and watering the shubbery in 10 minutes without a care in the world.

The fact that your golden was fine by the time you got home indicates EIC. The emotional excitement of being a ball fanatic, the heat esp. with a heavy coat and the exertion, would line up with EIC.

The UMinn guys say that they believe the gene is JUST as common in conformation Labs as field Labs. But a dog that doesn't do the strenuous, stressful work of a field dog may never have an attack.

In fact, they believe the gene's so common it will never be completely eradicated. And it may be unwise to do so because EIC seems to actually be genetically associated with the high-energy traits that make a good retriever. . . the breeding goal for now is to try to eliminate affected dogs with two copies of the gene, not the carriers with one copy.

You might Email the UMinn guys and ask if they have ID'd the gene in Goldens . . . . they might be interested in a blood test if they haven't.

172 posted on 09/20/2009 11:53:08 AM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of Ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: AnAmericanMother

Wow, thank you for the info. I thought it odd that she was fine by the time I got home (altho it was probably 2 hours after the fact, they didn’t call me because they didn’t want me to worry—my poor son called my husband and said, “I think I’ve killed Mom’s dog!” Funny in hindsight, but not at the time.


173 posted on 09/20/2009 11:59:36 AM PDT by brytlea (Jesus loves me, this I know.)
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To: brytlea

DEFINITELY not funny at the time!!!! I understand why they didn’t tell you though, didn’t want you to have a wreck speeding to the dog’s side . . . .


174 posted on 09/20/2009 12:13:30 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of Ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: AnAmericanMother

Exactly! My poor son.


175 posted on 09/20/2009 1:29:57 PM PDT by brytlea (Jesus loves me, this I know.)
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