Posted on 10/21/2009 11:51:18 AM PDT by nickcarraway
You can divorce an abusive spouse. You can call it quits if your lover mistreats you. But what can you do if the source of your misery is your own parent?
Granted, no parent is perfect. And whining about parental failure, real or not, is practically an American pastime that keeps the therapeutic community dutifully employed.
But just as there are ordinary good-enough parents who mysteriously produce a difficult child, there are some decent people who have the misfortune of having a truly toxic parent.
A patient of mine, a lovely woman in her 60s whom I treated for depression, recently asked my advice about how to deal with her aging mother.
“She’s always been extremely abusive of me and my siblings,” she said, as I recall. “Once, on my birthday, she left me a message wishing that I get a disease. Can you believe it?”
Over the years, she had tried to have a relationship with her mother, but the encounters were always painful and upsetting; her mother remained harshly critical and demeaning.
Whether her mother was mentally ill, just plain mean or both was unclear, but there was no question that my patient had decided long ago that the only way to deal with her mother was to avoid her at all costs.
Now that her mother was approaching death, she was torn about yet another effort at reconciliation. “I feel I should try,” my patient told me, “but I know she’ll be awful to me.”
Should she visit and perhaps forgive her mother, or protect herself and live with a sense of guilt, however unjustified? Tough call, and clearly not mine to make.
But it did make me wonder about how therapists deal with adult patients who have toxic parents.
(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...
Pointless article.
Great, let’s lay the groundwork for further divisiveness. Let’s create laws allowing children to divorce their parents. Maybe liberals can develop big and powerful government programs to help separate children from their parents. You know, it will be “for the children”.
Can we hear sob story after sob story about how we have to do “something” for children in homes with mean parents. Will liberals demand that you can only demonstrate compassion by saving the child and removing them from the parents. Yeah, that ought to work, and this is a start.
I have a question I want to ask a shrink one day: “If a man grows to hate his wife and their daughter is just like the mother, how can the father truly love the daughter?” I’ve asked several people this question and the answer is usually “I tolerate the kid”.
Oh no, it’s got a point. The point is, “Parents who do not accept the sexual proclivities of their children are toxic and akin to gangrene.”
I noticed that as well. Separate him from the only relationship that is loving enough to point out his sin.
My mother used her doctorate in psychology to manipulate and torment everyone around her for years. She stole my SSN and racked up $500,000.00 in debt in my name. She tried to break up my marriage. I was told by everyone around me that I "had" to maintain a relationship with her "because it's your mom!"
When I discovered that she had emptied my daughter's piggy bank and used her SSN to open a credit account, I severed our relationship and have never looked back.
How can the relationship between the father and daughter be the same as between the husband and wife? And, because it’s a different relationship entirely, why can’t the father still love the daughter even tho he dislikes things about her?
I have had friends I could tolerate who I would not want to be married to.
I have known parents who did that to their children when they found religion.
Pretty damned simple.
1) Move, if possible.
2) Change your phone number.
3) Change your e-mail address.
4) change the locks
5) forget the old bag, since she doesn’t love you.
Get a life.
Sin you say?! Oh you are so intolerant! And tolerance is really the ONLY sort of love that is accepted! (well, except that other kind of love practiced by Polanski...)
That's not the only talking point -- parents, in general, are toxic, because they dare to impose their values on their children. A major offense in the land of the liberals.
Ask Bill Ayers, who'd like to yank toddlers from their "toxic" families as young as possible, and re-program them.
LOL
Known parents who did what?
You are correct. Sorry, I missed that point. I wonder if liberals should have their kids yanked from them too because, they are, after all, crazy!
What’s the old saying? “You can pick your nose but you can’t pick your relatives”.
Parents who would attack their children etc. because they had found religion.
And of course, we are only hearing ONE side of this story. Who knows what else transpired.
Remeber this? When a toxic parent dies....
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2063325/posts
Obituray
Times-Herald ^ | Aug. 7, 2008 | unknown
Posted on 08/17/2008 10:20:46 AM PDT by Daffynition
Dolores Aguilar 1929 - Aug. 7, 2008
Dolores Aguilar, born in 1929 in New Mexico, left us on August 7, 2008. She will be met in the afterlife by her husband, Raymond, her son, Paul Jr., and daughter, Ruby.
She is survived by her daughters Marietta, Mitzi, Stella, Beatrice, Virginia and Ramona, and son Billy; grandchildren, Donnelle, Joe, Mitzie, Maria, Mario, Marty, Tynette, Tania, Leta, Alexandria, Tommy, Billy, Mathew, Raymond, Kenny, Javier, Lisa, Ashlie and Michael; great-grandchildren, Brendan, Joseph, Karissa, Jacob, Delaney, Shawn, Cienna, Bailey, Christian, Andre Jr., Andrea, Keith, Saeed, Nujaymah, Salma, Merissa, Emily, Jayci, Isabella, Samantha and Emily. I apologize if I missed anyone.
Dolores had no hobbies, made no contribution to society and rarely shared a kind word or deed in her life. I speak for the majority of her family when I say her presence will not be missed by many, very few tears will be shed and there will be no lamenting over her passing.
Her family will remember Dolores and amongst ourselves we will remember her in our own way, which were mostly sad and troubling times throughout the years. We may have some fond memories of her and perhaps we will think of those times too. But I truly believe at the end of the day ALL of us will really only miss what we never had, a good and kind mother, grandmother and great-grandmother. I hope she is finally at peace with herself. As for the rest of us left behind, I hope this is the beginning of a time of healing and learning to be a family again.
There will be no service, no prayers and no closure for the family she spent a lifetime tearing apart. We cannot come together in the end to see to it that her grandchildren and great-grandchildren can say their goodbyes. So I say here for all of us, GOOD BYE, MOM.
I suspect that’s true, a parent might attack their child if that child found religion. But, I’m not sure what that has to do with this thread.
Not entirely.
I have the family history to argue its validity. Mine is "The Wrong Kid Died" story. Decades later, I believe I should have followed my instincts and left my parents to live with loving relatives far away.
The mention of memory problems is interesting to me. I've blocked huge chunks of my childhood. Years. All gone, but not the feelings.
Being the NYTimes, naturally they throw in the Gay issue but I think the article has merit and I'm glad to have seen it.
This is a two-way street. Once a child has survived to adulthood, if they cannot break their relationship with one or both bad parents, then they are as much of the problem as are that or those parents.
It is trendy right now to refer to “helicopter parents”, individuals who are overprotective and over-controlling of their children. But this is a two sided coin. Parents can be protective of their children, and need to be, but when parents go beyond protecting, and begin defending their children, from real and imagined challenges, they actively try to make their children dependent on them in the long term.
A test of this is to take the children, of whatever age, into a situation where they face challenges, some of which are insurmountable, to see how they react to them.
If the problem can be solved, but it takes patience and persistence, and the child quits early, they are used to having problems solved for them. They are “needy” people, used to being waited on.
If they are faced with an insurmountable problem, and they experience great stress and anguish, in past they were likely put in situations where their parents knew they would *have* to ask for help, their parents making an issue of their “weakness”. The children have difficulties dealing with failure.
Importantly, such problems can be physical, intellectual, or emotional, and the same rules apply.
The flip side to parents paying too much attention to their children is abject neglect. These are children who are very capable at problem solving, because they always had to solve their own problems, and likely other people’s problems as well.
These are children who are often overly responsive to any kind of praise or attention. Sometimes they become “attention junkies”, because they felt neglected at home. This is common among prostitutes, whose big motivation is often “attention” of any kind, with the same force that heroin junkies need their heroin. It doesn’t matter if a pimp is dancing with them or beating them, as long as he is paying attention to them.
But such children have little or no connection to their parents, so they are opposite of the “needy” children. They just get the attention they crave from strangers.
A common sense decision you made as an adult, not as a minor child.
I like your question.
Here’s what I understand.
If mommy hates daddy - and daddy hates mommy, then the child tries to deal with feelings that - since she is half mommy and half daddy, then her parents hate her too.
But of course, divorce experts tell us that children are so resellient - so adaptive.
Bingo. Exactly where this is likely going. Maybe not today, but this is how the ground work gets layed.
My dear dear friend (we have adopted each other as sisters) has a toxic mother AND father. Mother was nuts, father was an abusive alchoholic. She still has limited contact with her mom, but it’s easier to just move on without her.
It’s hard to see her pain because she is such an amazing woman and we have been best friends since we were little girls, I just don’t know how those people created her.
Doesn’t it have everything to do with this thread. Besides the red herring about a homosexual child, there are toxic parents.
OK
I think you had a bad Mom...
Now dont go and do likewise...
I thought you were talking about religion.
There are a few people who are evil who become parents. Becoming a parent does not cure their evil ways.
“Unequally yoked” can refer to a perfectly good child being born to an evil parent. Sometimes, for one’s spiritual survival, it is necessary to discontinue contact with certain people, including a parent or parents. It is a very, very sad situation, but true.
As an evil person ages, they tend to be seen by society as “a nice little old lady/man” and the abused child finds himself/herself in a very trying position. Unfortunately, aging rarely “cures” the evil behavior.
And no, I am not talking about judging/condeming a child for homosexuality; that is a matter that is separate from just downright destructive abuse.
Did you read the article? I’d say by your post you didn’t and don’t understand they are talking about ADULT children.
Sin says I! I have never been accused of being very tolerant. ;)
I apologize to everyone who thought that my comment (”pointless article”) was off base. I guess that I was looking for instant insight. But, I should have known that this subject is too complex for a newspaper to do in a drive-by effort.
I just can’t imagine the pain that some people have had to live because of their parents. It has not been my experience, thank God and good fortune.
I see your point. I didn’t get that.
Toxic relationships are very hard to deal with, whether it is parents or someone else. Mr G has a toxic brother. We tried for years to have a relationship with him, but finally realized he was a very real danger to our family (not physically, but by creating problems with CPS and LEO that were totally unjustified. Read... ****extreme**** liberalism in action) and we no longer communicate with him in any way. Not even Christmas cards.
Confession and if you don’t want to read it, that’s cool.
I am the child of VERY toxic parenting. We’re talking alcoholism verbal and emotional abuse for over two decades. The solution for me is setting boundaries with my parents and forcing them to adhere to those boundaries. If they cross the line, I leave or get off the phone. It’s that simple. As for funerals, I’ll muster as much dignity as I can and honor them for giving me life.
That describes the situation with my mother-in-law to a tee. She looks so sweet and innocent with her gray hair and wrinkled skin. After 27 years and numerous attempts to win her over, I finally gave up. We have crossed paths once (at my son's wedding) in the past 4 years. It has been the best 4 years of my marriage.
There is no debate, family is family. You do for them, period.
Yes at times you must sever ties, drug addicts, criminality, violence etc, but just because they are “mean” to you does mean they are less human or less family.
Stinks when this is the situation, but you still do.
My kid, 23, has me convinced I was a toxic parent.
Good. Little B****** deserved it.
The kid is a carbon copy of her mother. The dad can’t stand being around the mother. The mother hates the dad. The kid can’t stand being around dad. Or it could be the son. Bottom line is I’ve seen it many times where you could tell the mother did not like the son because he reminded her of the ex husband. I’ve seen the dad have the same arguments with the daughter that he had with his ex wife. This happens when one or both spouses try to turn the kids away from the other.
Bottom line is a lot of us, me included, married the wrong person and should not have had kids together. It’s not saying anything bad about the other spouse. They simply both made a huge mistake.
That is exactly the point. The libs want to gain dominance over the expression of parents in their homes like they do in Universities and in workplaces. If you are politically incorrect, you are a toxic parent. They are already doing this in Britian.
Everyone says my mother is toxic but I am used to her so it doesn’t bother me. Criticism is her mission in life. She actually called me the other night. It was the first time in 3 years so I didn’t mind the criticism.
She has led an interesting life (invited to play Bridge at the White House) so I like to pick her brain. She really is fun.
Again, if I may, children of parents labeled toxic will likely answer these differently than those who don't. The word ‘mother’ doesn't bring an idea of comfort, love, caring, or warmth. The word brings thoughts of anxiety, inferiority, dread, being demeaned, ignored, or used — and these are thoughts from childhood, not just adulthood. Forcing oneself to be around people who are supposed to inspire love and confidence, but instead treat one like a thing to be manipulated (and always have), can be the surest way to insanity.
And they should act like adults where the kids are concerned. Sorry, but even if your child reminds you of someone you don’t like, you can’t act like a child yourself. There are so few adults out there today.
No apology needed (to me, anyway) but thank you for that thoughtfulness. I didn’t think your comment was off base; just one made, understandably, in ignorance. (Good ignorance!)
I’m lucky, my mom only bad thing is sendind me spam. At least she now checks snopes and other sites prior to hitting ‘send’.
Sorry, but unless this person is abusive, and I mean abusive, not just mean, then family is family. If they are lost to drugs or other issues, severing ties is understandable, but when they are just “mean people” that’s not a good enough reason.
Family IS family. EVERYONE has their crosses to bare in life. You do for family, period.
Its the ignoring of that fundamental precept that creates the socialist welfare dependency state to begin with.
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