Skip to comments.John Birch Society and Mormon Prophecies about the US Constitution
Posted on 01/10/2010 12:47:27 AM PST by CondoleezzaProtege
"...G. Vance Smith, a committed Mormon, now leads the Society. Vance Smith is systematically removing people from leadership positions within the John Birch Society and replacing them with Mormons. One gathers that Smith does not feel that he is accountable to the membership concerning his reasons for the replacement of longtime leadership. There seems to be no accountability factor. Longtime Birchers are leaving the Society en masse.
There seems to be a major concern that the Society is fast becoming a puppet for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. One document that I received suggests that Smith's course of action is tied in with his Mormon belief that, "The time will come when the destiny of the nation will hang upon a single thread."
Note the words of Mormon Prophet Brigham Young:
"Will the Constitution be destroyed? No; it will be held inviolate by this people; and, as Joseph Smith said, 'The time will come when the destiny of the nation will hang upon a single thread. At that critical juncture, this people will step forth and save it from threatened destruction.' It will be so." (Journal of Discourses,7:15.) Young also made another "prophecy" about the same circumstances: "Brethren and sisters, our friends wish to know our feelings towards the Government. I answer, they are first rate, and we will prove it too, as you will see if you only live long enough, for that we shall live to prove it is certain, and when the Constitution of the United States hangs, as it were, upon a single thread, they will have to call for the "Mormon" Elders to save it from utter destruction; and they will step forward and do it." (Journal of Discourses, 2:182.)
There is yet a third voice explaining this" prophecy," and that is the voice of Orson Hyde, a contemporary of Joseph Smiths because he was one of his Twelve Apostles, who wrote this, also quoted in Journal of Discourses:
"It is said that brother Joseph in his lifetime declared that the Elders of this Church should step forth at a particular time when the Constitution should be in danger, and rescue it, and save it. I believe he said something like this - that the time would come when the country would be in danger of an overthrow; and said he, If the Constitution be saved at all, it will be by the Elders of this Church. I believe this is about the language, as nearly as I can recollect it." (Journal of Discourses, 6:152) Does Vance Smith believe that this is a prophecy made by his Prophet that has yet to be fulfilled, and does he see the Birch Society in all of its endeavors striving to be the group to "step forward and do it" to save the Constitution in junction with the LDS Church? Is this why he is systematically removing longtime Birchers from leadership positions and replacing them with Mormons? Time will tell."
That was painted by a **shock** Mormon!!!
What does the religion of the painter have to do with anything, I was pointing out that Washington was a Christian, something that you were implying that he was not.
Was that your Mormonism speaking? Why is this the first response from you when I have posted many political posts pertaining to Mitt Romney and his political liberalism to you, today?
Do you discuss politics or only Mormon topics?
Who would have thrown the Christian, George Washington under the bus, and who is they?
And I’m not a big Romney fan, again, why should I rise to useless bait?
So you don’t think that Mason’s are anti Christian? Most “traditional” Christians do.
I do know know that Christians know that George Washington was a Christian, regardless of what you keep hacking at, and I notice that you seem only to focus on what you perceive as religious issues, not politics.
I never baited you in my posts about Mitt Romney, those were substantive, political posts that you would not answer, now I can’t get rid of you because you keep wanting to bash Christianity, Christians and our founding fathers, and promote Mormonism.
Wow, interesting interpretations of my posts and lack of same.
Don’t worry, consider yourself “rid” of me.
Lest you all have too much fun here with this conspiracy thread by it’self, look what someone else just posted.
McCain aide: Palin believed candidacy ‘God’s plan’
Look I know that you only just recently signed up to promote Mitt Romney and Mormonism(although you will not discuss Romney) and that you are not a fan of Governor Palin, but trying to hijack a thread with an unrelated post of another thread link seems a little over the top.
I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.
17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the otherThis is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!
18 My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)and which I should join.
19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.
20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself lying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, mother inquired what the matter was. I replied, Never mind, all is wellI am well enough off. I then said to my mother,
2 Corinthians 11:12
And I will keep on doing what I am doing in order to cut the ground from under those who want an opportunity to be considered equal with us in the things they boast about.
I don't feel restrained - how 'bout the rest of you Flying Inmen? (and ladies; too)
As for the founding father beliefs? I'd say it's like most people many as they age become more conservative in their religious beliefs both by reading and through personal experience and soon find out for themselves by revelation through The Holy Spirit the truth.
Churches today in many places are falling or fallen and it's beyond a any one denomination problem many have been affected and many have such within their clergy. The more conservative churches are removing such from their leadership positions. Others of the more liberal sects are chosing them as pastors.
Ones allowing such abandon even the very basic laws and commandments GOD gave. I'm talking about the adoption of policies supporting gay marriages, gay clergy, etc. But the one church I see as doing the most harm to the nation as a whole is the United Church of Christ. Look up separation of church and state and see who heads it and profession. Not to be confused with the far more conservative Church of Christ. As I understand it maybe 3 of the 55 were not actually active members of a church. Then again neither am I.
If anyone is trully seeking and reading the Bible I don't think they could remain a Deist for long. There is but one sin which can not be forgiven a person. Blasphemy of The Holy Spirit which brings the absolute rejection of Jesus Christ. It is a state of ones heart so hardened toward GOD it will not change.
There goes our SINGLE ISSUE status!
Will still next year, too!
That was meant to be posted about the formers of the U.S. Constitution.
"Fifty two men of the 55 who formed the Constitution were active Christians. Although many of them by today's church standards would be rejected because they were Deist."
"Which ones were not Christians and which ones would not have been allowed in our current Christian churches? You think that current America is more Christian than our founding fathers, and presumably the Americans that they served? "
Happy clappy “Yuz Jay-Sus luvs me” Churchianity is a product of the Second Great Awakening, and was largely a movement of the rural masses. The founding fathers were a combination of deists, congregationalists, and Episcopalians. All were suspicious of clerical influence on the government, and most had no love for Rome.
Of course they were almost all Protestant Christians, I think that 2 or 3 were Catholic Christians.
I’m not aware of any of them that denied Christ, or that were atheists.
The Holy Spirit will lead all people and all churches who seek the Lord to the truth in the Lords anointed time. Considering the LDS church of today vs it's early days a lot has happened and changed in a short period of time. Remember as well even the Israelites took many, many, years to teach. We want things right here and right now changed. GOD gave us time for our own needs but as such our time and GOD's time are not the same thing.
Is this the White Moose prophecy?
Someone on here told me not too long ago they were a member for years and then quit.
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There are several EX-LDS here on FR.
Time to move on... Its been fun people.
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Way to defend the faith, Rip.
As I understand it, every male Mormon in good standing over the age of 12 is an elder.
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Every “worthy” male member of the LDS over the age of 12 is ordained to the LDS priesthood. “Elder” is one of the offices of the second or “higher” priesthood.
LDS priesthood goes like this:
# Deacon - Age 12
# Teacher - Age 14
# Priest - Age 14
# Elder - Around age 18/19; for converts soon after baptism
# High priest - Adult men usually after they have been called as a “bishop”.
CORRECTION: Priest is 16, not 14 as in my prev post.
LDS priesthood goes like this:
# Deacon - Age 12
# Teacher - Age 14
# Priest - Age 16
# Elder - Around age 18/19; for converts soon after baptism
# High priest - Adult men usually after they have been called as a bishop.
I am not Mormon, nor am I a member of John Birch. I went to the website and they claim John McManus is the President at least according to the Press section dated 1/9/10. There is no Vance Smith listed on Board or in contact. Not sure what the true story is....
Vance Smith was president until 2005.
Deists, un-Churched, Congregationalist, Episcopalian, or Quaker, few of the founders had anything in common with the fundamentalist charismatic faith so common in the megachurches today, and had nothing in common (philosophically or religiously) with the Church of Rome. Anything to the contrary is ahistorical revisionism at its worst. For a true lesson on fundamentalist protestant revivalism, see the Second Great Awakening to get a better clue as to why we are where we are today religiously in the US, and how the Bible Belt became the Bible Belt.
THEY are the one's who claim to have the RESTORED GOSPEL!
There has been NOTHING in their 'doctrine' that has changed - why have they?
THEY are the ones who proclaim that the jots and tittles are SO important; why do they IGNORE GOD's word in D&C 132?
THEY are the ones who claim that their Temple Rites® are so IMPORTANT; yet they have CHANGED even those!
Led by GOD or MEN?
The reader will decide.
28. Then they asked him, "What must we do to do the works God requires?"
29. Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."
No; this is the antithesis of the ...
"WE believed it before we didn't believe it." claim of present day MORMON leadership.
So then; them boys are GENTILES ‘til they turn 12??
Don’t the GIRLS get any special labels?
The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:
Which [was] a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;
[Which stood] only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed [on them] until the time of reformation.
But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;
Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption [for us].
I don't know how you can speak for me. I don't argue theology with a complicated, dead genius from 200 years ago that was not a religious leader but instead was a president.
When a guy is a baptized Christian that attends Christian church religiously, that has lifelong church membership and is educated by, married by, and buried by his Christian leaders, then I assume the guy was a Christian.
Depends on your view of the terminology.
The Bible, in my belief, is a step beyond “inspired” or “divinely inspire”, but is the very real Word of God, penned by men, but lead by God Himself.
The use of the term “divinely inspired” can correctly be attributed to more than the Bible. Have you ever been inspired by anything to take a course of action? To write a letter? To DO something?
Further, has God ever inspired humans to do anything beyond penning the original manuscripts of the Bible (the only complete and perfect version of the Bible is that which was originally penned, but now has been lost)?
Some of our founding fathers and even later leaders called the foundation of these United States as being from Divine Providence. When you consider that the odds were overwhelmingly against the young American nation in her war for independence, one can see that the eventual victory came at the hand of God.
Is it a stretch that God could “inspire” men to write the founding documents of a nation His Divine Hand lead to independence? After all, many of the authors of the Constitution were Christian, or at minimum, held to a firm belief in deity and HIS providential hand.
Now - to say that the Constitution is the infallible Word of God - yes that would most definitely be blasphemous.
But the term “divinely inspired” does not necessarily = “God-breathed”. I hold the “God-breathed” view of the Bible, but believe HE has inspired people to take courses of action (maybe even including to put together the best constitution a nation has ever been formed under).
Glen Beck was not trying to equate the US Constitution with scripture in any way - just demonstrating that God had to have had a guiding hand in the writing of it. Nothing blasphemous about that.
How can a church whose founder supposedly was given the "restored gospel" directly from God have a learning period?
Those who read the book for the first time will find within its pages the course laid out for eternal life. They will be able to conclude, with the testimony of Joseph Smith that "I told the brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct book of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man could get nearer to God by abiding by its precepts, than by any other book."
I’ll throw this in as well. To me this all says that he was a church going Christian, of whom religious experts can sit around and debate his eccentricities or imperfections, or his vanities, etc, but they can not just decide that the man was not a Christian and start teaching that our founding fathers were not of the Christian faith.
“He served on the vestry, or governing body, of Episcopal parishes. He attended church regularly, and often those churches were Episcopalian. He contributed to Episcopal churches regularly, and he had his children not only baptized but also married under Anglican and Episcopal auspices.”
Chocolate moose prophecy
If it was not put in the "Doctrine and Covenants" it is not considered a prophecy.
And Christ is our ONLY high priest.
It physically sickens me to think that they so pridefully equate themselves with Jesus as being High Priests after the order (type) of Melchizedek. They do not realize that they denigrate Christ’s place in doing so.
But the term divinely inspired does not necessarily = God-breathed.
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Entemologically, that is EXACTLY what it means. Inspired - from O.Fr. inspiration, from L.L. inspirationem (nom. inspiratio), from L. inspiratus, pp. of inspirare “inspire, inflame, blow into,” from in-”in” + spirare “to breathe”,
Divine means God. Therefore, while the term may be misused in Modern English, “divinely inspired” literally means “the divine (God/gods) breathed in”.
Also, Becks theology allows (even insists) that the Constitution is literally “God breathed”. This comes from the LDS idea of Replacement theology, that the Latter Day saints are God’s new chosen people and the US is God’s promised land. This is also seen in their doctrines that Zion will be built here in America and that the Garden of Eden is located in Missouri.
Thanks for not pinging me. Of the 55, 52 I’ve read were Active Church Members. My wording on the first post was slightly off and YOU in your typical Trollish manner made it an issue after that and IGNORED Clarifications made thereafter. I personally consider you a troll and will never post or answer any additional post from you again on any subject manner as this was the last straw. Badgering posters is not the same as civil debate and you need to learn the differencee.
How can 12 of Christ chosen sit and argue over trivial matters years after the cross that caused a division? How can they misinterpret a passage of scripture that one among them would not die? Where did even Peter's knowledge come from? Yet Peter too was human. I have better things to do than to go on a Mormon and JBS witch hunt. I do believe this. Of the churches of today the doctorine mistakes of Mormons are gnats compared to some other well respected considered mainstream Christian Churches are not near as serious as the following. Ones who allow such abominations ass those who teach and marry persons into a practice of abomiunation in the pulpit. Which would I rather have as a neighbor? No contest!
About this edition: Some minor errors in the text have been perpetuated in
past editions of the Book of Mormon. This edition contains corrections that
seem appropriate to bring the material into conformity with prepublication
manuscripts and early editions edited by the Prophet Joseph Smith.
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