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So Much for Stagnating Mac Growth
Tech Night Owl ^ | August 24th, 2010 | Gene Steinberg

Posted on 08/25/2010 3:41:47 AM PDT by Swordmaker

I have to constantly remind myself that sales estimates can be all over the place, so when a recent report suggested Macs sales weren’t improving as fast as some expected, I was ready to attribute that state of affairs to the extreme success of the iPad.

However, it now appears that Mac sales may actually be growing faster than previously believed.

There’s a story in this week’s issue of Fortune that, in June, sales of new Macs to the enterprise actually soared nearly 50%, about three times higher than the rest of the PC industry. In addition, sales to government soared 200%, which is 16 times faster than the rest of the market.

At the same time, sales to consumers improved by roughly 35%, so it’s clear Macs aren’t losing their luster for home users either.

But the enterprise? Now maybe it’s just a statistical blip, since Apple has such a small market penetration in the business world. Perhaps the same is true for government users, but maybe, just maybe, so many business users are sick and tired of the ongoing problems with Windows that they’re looking for an exit plan. Sure, perhaps Windows 7 is far better than its predecessors, but when Microsoft can only list such silliness as pinning document windows on the corners of the screen as one of the most compelling new features, you just know that they have nothing important to say.

But what’s most fascinating is the fact that this is all happening when the iPad seems to be selling far more copies than anyone expected. At the same time, are new iPad users buying them as extra devices, or are sales being cannibalized from other products?

If the latter, just what products are we talking about? Macs? Evidently not, unless you want to argue that far more Macs would otherwise be sold. PCs? Perhaps, since sales of new PCs, outside of the business market, haven’t gone so well this summer, particularly in the netbook category.

Of course, you have to realize that a netbook is not a terribly inviting product. There’s not an ounce of innovation to be found. All the PC makers did was to shrink notebooks down as small as they can, and use cheaper components, including slow processors. It’s hard to take a $300 netbook and expect it to offer anything close to credible performance for all but the most basic tasks. Everything is a compromise.

The iPad is a totally different product with extremely snappy performance and a smart, intuitive interface that actually takes the PC into a whole new dimension. Consider that, until the iPad came out, no other PC maker had a clue what to do about tablets. After touting the arrival of tablet PCs 10 years ago, the best Microsoft could so was to deliver a clumsy alternative to the regular Windows computer with a stylus to click buttons on the screen.

Watching one of these tablets in action certainly demonstrates how bad they are, and why they have been abject failures outside of certain business categories.

Our family doctor, for example, has a network of Fujitsu tablet computers in his office. The doctor and his assistants carry them around while examining patients and consulting records. They employ the ever-present stylus to activate functions using a special vertical market application that’s designed for physicians. But actual text is still entered via the keyboard. We’re not talking about an iPhone-styletouch interface here, but a kludge based totally on a traditional PC that employs a stylus in place (or in addition to) a touchpad or mouse.

It’s no wonder such devices didn’t catch on for the vast majority of users.

Of course, now that the iPad has been a proven success even early in its lifetime, the rest of the PC world is madly scrambling to deliver a credible competitor. But so far rather than deliver product, they are delivering hype. Claims mean nothing without a powerful product lineup to demonstrate they can truly deliver the goods.

Consider that recent silly statement from Chang Ma, vice president of marketing for LG Electronics’ mobile-devices unit, who praised the iPad and then promised they could build a better tablet. All this without any evidence that LG can develop an operating system that comes close to matching the iOS. Or maybe they plan to rely on the forthcoming Google Chrome OS, but that would put the LG tablet computer in the same range as other products using a Google-based OS. Where’s the differentiation?

Indeed, why are members of the mainstream press taking anything Chang Ma says seriously? Does he have experience in this product category that he can point to in order to prove his claims? Not a chance.

With all this nonsense, you don’t have to wonder why more and more businesses have opted to order the real thing: a Mac.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Computers/Internet
KEYWORDS: apple; mac; spammer
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1 posted on 08/25/2010 3:41:53 AM PDT by Swordmaker
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To: ~Kim4VRWC's~; 1234; 50mm; Abundy; Action-America; acoulterfan; AFreeBird; Airwinger; Aliska; ...
As usual the facts shoot down the FUD spreading rumor mongers, Mac sales are not languishing, iPads sales are not cannibalizing Apple notebook sales, and in fact, the opposite is the truth! PING!

Please!
No Flame Wars!
Discuss technical issues, software, and hardware.
Don't attack people!


Apple Mac Computer Sales and Market Share Growth Ping!

If you want on or off the Mac Ping List, Freepmail me.

2 posted on 08/25/2010 3:47:50 AM PDT by Swordmaker (This tag line is a Microsoft product "insult" free zone!)
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To: Swordmaker
In addition, sales to government soared 200%, which is 16 times faster than the rest of the market.

Given the current conditions and situation, do you think this is really good news?

3 posted on 08/25/2010 3:55:41 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
At the same time, sales to consumers improved by roughly 35%, so it’s clear Macs aren’t losing their luster for home users either.

Impressive sales growth. We will see what the figures are for the next quarter, but I anticipate it will be more of the same.

I was in a Apple store last Saturday. The place was extremely crowed. There were over sixty people in line to buy an iPhone. I would imagine that some of those people are new Apple customers who may later more on to buying a Mac.

4 posted on 08/25/2010 5:21:49 AM PDT by stripes1776
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To: stripes1776

I’ll wait for a reponse the the question that was asked.


5 posted on 08/25/2010 5:25:38 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
> Given the current conditions and situation, do you think this is really good news?

While it's certainly unfortunate that the PC market in general is not doing as well, conservatives can take comfort in the fact that an innovative, capitalist American business is flourishing in otherwise tough times.

Regardless of your feelings about Apple or their products (I don't recall if you've said you're an Apple customer or not), it's nice to see signs that not all computer businesses are in trouble.

I don't have shares of any of these companies, but I imagine the holders of AAPL are pleased.

6 posted on 08/25/2010 6:39:03 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored
While it's certainly unfortunate that the PC market in general is not doing as well, conservatives can take comfort in the fact that an innovative, capitalist American business is flourishing in otherwise tough times.

Given the political leanings of Apple's executives and directors, and the propensity of this adminstration to use government contracts to reward political allies and campaign contributors I'm sketical of attempts to portray it as nothing more than the technical superiority of the product. I'm not drinking that Kool Aid.

7 posted on 08/25/2010 6:46:13 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
>> In addition, sales to government soared 200%, which is 16 times faster than the rest of the market.

> Given the current conditions and situation, do you think this is really good news?

I think I misunderstood your question, in my response above #6.

Perhaps you meant, is it a good idea for Apple to be selling computers to the government?

I personally don't have a problem with more Macs going into government offices; I use both Windows and OS-X extensively and I'm sure Macs would serve as well in those applications, with a small period of adjustment, similar to the adjustment necessary from XP to Win7.

8 posted on 08/25/2010 6:49:03 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored

Do you have any experience integrating MACs into a Windows Security Domain?


9 posted on 08/25/2010 6:51:39 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
> Given the political leanings of Apple's executives and directors, and the propensity of this adminstration to use government contracts to reward political allies and campaign contributors I'm sketical of attempts to portray it as nothing more than the technical superiority of the product. I'm not drinking that Kool Aid.

My understanding is that Apple is the only American computer company that does NOT make political contributions.

All the major computer companies lean a little to the left. What's your point? Just bashing Apple? Microsoft leans at least as far left, AND make contributions to leftist political causes. That make you feel better?

There's no conservatively-politically-acceptable choice, sorry to say.

10 posted on 08/25/2010 6:52:24 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: tacticalogic

Can’t speak to that, but NSA put out some time ago their recommendations for securing Macs in government use. I’m not sure if the current revision of that document would answer your questions or not.


11 posted on 08/25/2010 6:56:34 AM PDT by Sam_Damon
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To: dayglored

Let’s just say that I find the proposition that I have no reason to be suspicious of the political connections of a corporation who’s board of directors includes Al Gore to be dubious at best.


12 posted on 08/25/2010 7:00:13 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: dayglored
There's no conservatively-politically-acceptable choice, sorry to say.

From what I've read, Dell has consistently supported conservative political causes and candidates.

Being both a hardware and softare vendor does give Apple proponents the flexibility to comapare them to Microsoft or various hardware vendors, depending on what's convenient at the moment.

13 posted on 08/25/2010 7:05:04 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
> Do you have any experience integrating MACs into a Windows Security Domain?

I use Active Directory for authentication and authorization within my company's Windows Domain, but there are limits to its usefulness on account of its incompatibility and non-interoperability with most of our mission-critical applications, which are not from Microsoft. AD plays nicely with the Microsoft apps, in general.

We've addressed AD's incompatibility issues in a variety of ways; on the Macs we have VM's for talking to the Microsoft apps that are incompatible with anything but Windows. After fighting with AD for a couple years, we now use a combination of Samba and OpenLDAP for most of our applications very successfully.

Microsoft's Active Directory intentionally does not play well with non-Windows computers. It's designed to lock out anything that's not from Microsoft. Unless you're an all-Microsoft shop, using AD is a royal pain. Which is, of course, Microsoft's intention. As the marketshare leader, they historically haven't have any business motivation to make it possible to use anything else.

However, as more outfits discover the alternatives, my guess is that AD will be relegated to the All-Microsoft shops, and everyone else will find better ways to make things play nice.

14 posted on 08/25/2010 7:07:17 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: tacticalogic
> Let’s just say that I find the proposition that I have no reason to be suspicious of the political connections of a corporation who’s board of directors includes Al Gore to be dubious at best.

Yawn. Nothing personal... but look at all the BoDs and you'll find there's nothing much different. If you've got a particular case on for Gore, so be it, avoid Apple's products. Done. I have no argument with your personal choices.

15 posted on 08/25/2010 7:11:27 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored

What would be your assesment of the government’s ability to implement secure heterogenous networks?


16 posted on 08/25/2010 7:12:56 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
> From what I've read, Dell has consistently supported conservative political causes and candidates.

Could be; I don't have stats close to hand, one way or the other.

> Being both a hardware and softare vendor does give Apple proponents the flexibility to comapare them to Microsoft or various hardware vendors, depending on what's convenient at the moment.

Or conversely, being a SYSTEM vendor, Apple doesn't compete with just Microsoft or just Dell. Rather, you have to assemble a SYSTEM from various PC software and hardware vendors, and then compare it to a Mac.

It's not "convenience", it's a matter of definitions.

17 posted on 08/25/2010 7:14:53 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored
Yawn. Nothing personal... but look at all the BoDs and you'll find there's nothing much different. If you've got a particular case on for Gore, so be it, avoid Apple's products. Done. I have no argument with your personal choices.

So basically, if you don't like Apple, don't buy the product but you don't have any business questioning those government contracts? I'm afraid we're going to disagree about that.

18 posted on 08/25/2010 7:18:28 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: dayglored
Or conversely, being a SYSTEM vendor, Apple doesn't compete with just Microsoft or just Dell. Rather, you have to assemble a SYSTEM from various PC software and hardware vendors, and then compare it to a Mac.

It's not "convenience", it's a matter of definitions.

Microsoft doesn't do that, but the comparison to MS will show up, even in purely hardware related threads.

19 posted on 08/25/2010 7:26:07 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
> So basically, if you don't like Apple, don't buy the product but you don't have any business questioning those government contracts? I'm afraid we're going to disagree about that.

Hardly -- you're welcome to your opinion and you can question whatever you want, as can I.

I'm just saying, if you don't like Apple's products, or Apple's BoD, don't buy their products. Your boycott of their products is entirely your right and I encourage you to express your opinion that way. But there's no additional screaming need to come to an Apple thread and pee all over it, to no overall good effect. :)

That is, IMO, the conversation about network security is cogent. Pissing and moaning about Al Gore, not so much; been there, done that. YMMV.

20 posted on 08/25/2010 7:31:04 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: tacticalogic
> What would be your assesment of the government’s ability to implement secure heterogenous networks?

Frankly, I don't have direct professional experience with the government's networks; my career is pretty broad but has been mostly aerospace/industrial/commercial.

I don't have a lot of faith in the government's ability to do -anything- right, but that's a larger question. :)

I don't think heterogeneity has a bad effect, and might be a benefit. A Windows monoculture is proven to be a bad idea, security-wise, but that's true of any monoculture.

Gonna have to run to work now... I'll catch up with the thread later today...

21 posted on 08/25/2010 7:31:20 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored
I don't think heterogeneity has a bad effect, and might be a benefit. A Windows monoculture is proven to be a bad idea, security-wise, but that's true of any monoculture.

What's your basis / criteria for this "proof"? Securing heterogenous networks has consistenly proven more problematic than homogenous networks.

22 posted on 08/25/2010 7:42:41 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
Here's a list of Steve Job's political campaign contributions.

All hyper-lefties as you might expect. But then, notice something unusual. He hasn't made one since 2004.

I doubt if it's because Rahm Emanuel forgot to ask.

OTHO Here's a list of Bill Gate's contributions. He goes about half and half giving to ultra-libs like Harry Reid & Pelosi, and conservatives like John Thune.

It seems he's trying to go the Orren Boyle route whereas Jobs is taking the Hank Rearden one.

And Gates doesn't seem to have a problem shoving money at International Planned Parenthood

23 posted on 08/25/2010 7:53:59 AM PDT by Tribune7 (The Democrat Party is not a political organization but a religious cult.)
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To: tacticalogic; dayglored

I thought you were wrong about Michael Dell so I went searching for answers. You are right. He supports Republican conservatives.


24 posted on 08/25/2010 7:59:30 AM PDT by Mind-numbed Robot (Not all that needs to be done needs to be done by the government)
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To: Swordmaker
All the PC makers did was to shrink notebooks down as small as they can, and use cheaper components, including slow processors. ... The iPad is a totally different product with extremely snappy performance

Most netbooks have more powerful processors than the iPad, and more memory. The difference is that the iPad runs an OS made for low-power mobile devices and most netbooks are running desktop Windows to bog them down. You can get snappy performance from a netbook by installing a slimmer netbook-oriented OS like Moblin or one of the other slimmed-down Linux distros. The iPad's main speed advantage over the average netbook is the use of flash memory for storage, but then you can get a flash netbook too.

25 posted on 08/25/2010 8:21:51 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: tacticalogic
Given the current conditions and situation, do you think this is really good news?

Let's just hope they're replacing EOL Windows systems instead of filling new seats, and have the proper management in place to take advantage of the Mac's lower TCO.

Not likely? Well, I said "hope."

26 posted on 08/25/2010 8:24:13 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: tacticalogic
Do you have any experience integrating MACs into a Windows Security Domain?

That's easy. The whole network uses the MAC (Media Access Control) sublayer of the Data Link layer of the OSI model. The MAC (Mandatory Access Control) in Windows 7 and Server 2008 hasn't caused any problems either. I'm pretty sure our CPUs have basic MAC (Multiply-ACcumulate) in their instructions sets, no problem so far.

27 posted on 08/25/2010 8:37:40 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: Mind-numbed Robot
You are right. He supports Republican conservatives.

Just what we need, another business cheat supporting Republicans so the Democrats can point.

28 posted on 08/25/2010 8:40:50 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat

Thank you. I’m sure that will be very useful.


29 posted on 08/25/2010 8:46:11 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
Thank you. I’m sure that will be very useful.

If you wanted to know about Macs, you should have asked about Macs, not MACs.

The big problem with Macs in AD is that you can't use much of Windows group policy on them. Of course, in reverse, you can't use much of the Mac's equivalent of group policy on Windows machines. They are different architectures after all. But you can buy software that will allow more fine-grained management of Macs on a Windows network.

30 posted on 08/25/2010 9:09:11 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: tacticalogic
I’ll wait for a reponse the the question that was asked.

Sorry, I meant to ping Swordmaker. But since I pinged you by mistake, I will respond to your question. I am not making light of the poor state of the economy. But even in the Great Depression, there were companies that made millions. For example the movie industry made a lot of millionaires. And people who owned chains of movie theaters made millions. I think that Apple will be one of those companies that will make millions during the current recession, or depression.

31 posted on 08/25/2010 9:26:21 AM PDT by stripes1776
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To: stripes1776

You might be right. Apple’s products seem to have a lot of “entertainment appliance” intent in their design.


32 posted on 08/25/2010 10:28:24 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: antiRepublicrat
Just what we need, another business cheat supporting Republicans so the Democrats can point.

Well, if they bring up again the issue of Jobs legally backdating his stock options this might be good information. Dell himself was fined several million and the company was fined over $100 million for taking money from Intel to use only their chips rather than AMD's.

33 posted on 08/25/2010 10:39:25 AM PDT by Mind-numbed Robot (Not all that needs to be done needs to be done by the government)
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To: tacticalogic
I’ll wait for a reponse the the question that was asked.

Your question was a political statement, not a real question.

34 posted on 08/25/2010 11:51:19 AM PDT by itsahoot (We the people allowed Republican leadership to get us here, only God's Grace can get us out.)
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To: tacticalogic
I'm not drinking that Kool Aid.

Do you know what the MS in MSNBC stands for?

Pretty heave dose of kool aid there for you. As a matter of fat can you name one major old line corporation that does not donate to whomever is in power. Apple was a big supporter of Bill Clinton, they nearly went broke during that period.

Bill Gates is trying to give his billions along with his friends billions, to the UN. That idiot Ted Turner who was once considered too right wing to own one of the big three broadcasting companies, created CNN and became a loonie lefty, who wants to go duck hunting with Castro.

35 posted on 08/25/2010 11:58:21 AM PDT by itsahoot (We the people allowed Republican leadership to get us here, only God's Grace can get us out.)
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To: itsahoot
Your question was a political statement, not a real question.

One way to make sure nobody asks any questions you don't like is to simply declare them not to be questions.

36 posted on 08/25/2010 12:21:12 PM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: itsahoot
Pretty heave dose of kool aid there for you. As a matter of fat can you name one major old line corporation that does not donate to whomever is in power.

I already named Dell. I agree that corporations tend to make political donations to the powers that be.

Having someone like Al Gore sitting on your Board of Directors is a different proposition, IMHO. You're free to disagree, and even to argue that he's a wonderful guy and you love having him there, if you wish.

37 posted on 08/25/2010 12:28:24 PM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic

I’ll just stick with the hardware/software in front of me on a daily basis (Dell-Windows/Apple-OSx), and say I’d rather have the Apple any day. I’m not going to buy crap, for something as essential to my every day life as a computer, just because the guy who runs the company gives to one party or another.


38 posted on 08/25/2010 1:31:21 PM PDT by Chipper (You can't kill an Obamazombie by destroying the brain...they didn't have one to begin with.)
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To: Chipper
I’ll just stick with the hardware/software in front of me on a daily basis (Dell-Windows/Apple-OSx), and say I’d rather have the Apple any day. I’m not going to buy crap, for something as essential to my every day life as a computer, just because the guy who runs the company gives to one party or another.

You can do that. I've seen some people swear they'd never buy another GM vehicle after UAW took them over, and others not so much. If I saw a report that GM was suddenly selling lots of cars to the government I'd still suspect there's some mutual back-washing going on because that's the way this administration operates.

39 posted on 08/25/2010 1:42:53 PM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: Swordmaker

Apple makes PC makers look silly


40 posted on 08/25/2010 5:54:03 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Anyone pushing Romney must love socialism...Piss on Romney and his enablers!!" ~ Jim Robinson)
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To: tacticalogic

RE: Given the political leanings of Apple’s executives and directors..

As opposed to Microsoft which is a tool of every liberal agenda including UN population control. GMAFB!


41 posted on 08/25/2010 5:56:56 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Anyone pushing Romney must love socialism...Piss on Romney and his enablers!!" ~ Jim Robinson)
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To: big'ol_freeper
As opposed to Microsoft which is a tool of every liberal agenda including UN population control. GMAFB!

As opposed to somebody like Dell. Microsoft doesn't sell computers. If you want a FB then quit hoarding them.

42 posted on 08/25/2010 6:33:12 PM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic

Diffusional.

Buy a Dill and you are buying Microsoft and its liberal anti-life liberal agenda.

Piss off nimrod.


43 posted on 08/25/2010 6:52:27 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Anyone pushing Romney must love socialism...Piss on Romney and his enablers!!" ~ Jim Robinson)
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To: big'ol_freeper
Buy a Mac, and you buy Al Gore and his agenda. And there's a good chance those computers the government's buying are going to end up having to run Windows in a VM to be compatible with the existing systems. So instead of buying the hardware from Dell and the OS from Microsoft for the steep discount MS gives OEMs, you're buying a computer from Apple and then your're buying a full copy of Windows to run in the VM.

You can give somebody like Michael Dell a bunch of money and MS a little bit of it, or you can give Apple a bunch of money and then give MS a bunch of money, too.

Choose, nimrod.

44 posted on 08/25/2010 8:13:33 PM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic

All computer company CEOs are Liberals.

The rest of your rant is pure speculation ... as usual.


45 posted on 08/25/2010 8:17:20 PM PDT by BunnySlippers (I love BULL MARKETS . . .)
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To: BunnySlippers

See post 24, then do your homework. I’ll wait for the apology.


46 posted on 08/25/2010 8:19:27 PM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic

It’ll be a cold day in hell when you get an apology from me as I see you as an Apple troll. Let’s just say 99% are Liberals ... can we say Bill Gates.

You post is pure SPECULATION. Or perhaps you would like to prove it.


47 posted on 08/25/2010 8:25:43 PM PDT by BunnySlippers (I love BULL MARKETS . . .)
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To: BunnySlippers

It’s just a box of switches. It’s not going to love you back.


48 posted on 08/25/2010 8:30:21 PM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic

Mindless chatter again ...


49 posted on 08/25/2010 8:34:50 PM PDT by BunnySlippers (I love BULL MARKETS . . .)
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To: tacticalogic
From what I've read, Dell has consistently supported conservative political causes and candidates.

The Dell, inc. Political Action Committee (FEC link)

Boxer, Feinstein, Murray, Reid, Rangel, Leahy, Schumer and the Blue Dog PAC are among the recipients.

50 posted on 08/25/2010 10:39:23 PM PDT by ReignOfError
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