Skip to comments.The JFK-UFO Connection: Bogus Documents or Unanswered Questions?
Posted on 04/19/2011 7:45:15 AM PDT by Dengar01
Do you like a good UFO detective story? Well, here's one for you. And it's ongoing, so we don't yet know the ending. It involves President John F. Kennedy's interest in UFOs shortly before his death and an allegation that he may have angered officials in his administration when he asked for information on the subject.
Recently, the FBI opened a new website, "The Vault," that lets you view a variety of documents, including those regarding UFOs. I looked into one document that appears to include a phony UFO story and mentioned how important it is to be extremely careful when looking at UFO documents and how it's critical to know the background of this information. JFK Doc 5 Courtesy of Robert Wood / Earthfiles.com The cover of a lengthy 1954 MJ-12 special operations manual, which contains detailed information about "extraterrestrial entities and technology, recovery and disposal." Use the navigation bar to scan through the document or enlarge this 13-page document for a full reading.
While researching materials for his new book, "A Celebration of Freedom: JFK and the New Frontier" (Wasteland Press), Atlanta, Ga., history teacher William Lester used the Freedom of Information Act to get some previously classified documents.
Two of them were written by Kennedy on the same date, Nov. 12, 1963 -- 10 days before his assassination. One was to the CIA director, asking for UFO files (See JFK Doc 2); the other was to the NASA administrator, with Kennedy expressing a desire for cooperation with the former Soviet Union on mutual outer space activities (See JFK Doc 3).
(Excerpt) Read more at aolnews.com ...
Quix and Dave I know I am missing a ton of people I just threw in the FReepers that I am most familiar with on this topic.
Can you please ping the list?
And if someone could provide links to this FBI Vault I think that would be helpful!
This one goes to the back of the line. All anybody has wrt what happened to JFK is a choice of forty or fifty different conspiracy theories, all plausible and most more plausible than any ufo theory.
Recently the FBI has released a lot of documents related to UFOs and Extraterrestrials not only visiting Earth but crashing to Earth and the Government covering it up.
Now this is either:
B) Incompetence of the Holder DOJ
C) A Whistle Blower
Either way these documents can be real or fake. I personally witnessed a UFO making maneuvers at incredible speeds that would rip apart any human pilot. So I do believe that UFOs are Alien Crafts. There is a lot of evidence that people want to ignore, but these documents ad kindle to the fire.
Thanks for the ping!
About 15 years ago at my parents home in Southwest Virginia, I saw some weird lights flying fast at very low level below the mountain ridgeline at night with a Huey in hot pursuit. Being interested in aviation history and knowing quite a bit bout military aircraft and UAVs/drones, I can safely say that these lights were neither.
Good recent book on the subject:
>>"The first purely Vril disc - the Vril 1 Jager (Hunter) was constructed in 1941 and first flew in 1942.
It was 11.5 meters in diameter, had a single pilot, and could achieve 2,900 km/h - 12,000 km/h! It flew with a metal dome at first but subsequent test versions had a heavily reinforced glass dome and could seat two crew. Flight endurance was 5.5 hrs. It was planned to arm this craft with two MK-108 cannon plus 2 MG-17 machineguns. Seventeen of these craft were constructed and tested between 1942-44 with 84 test flights."<<
Can ping . . . too busy to do the other, for now.
A few thousand years ago there occurred a series of cosmic disasters which left our own planet as the only generally habitable place in our solar system. Prior to that other parts of our system had been inhabited by a space-faring civilization and we find evidence of that on Mars, Phobos, Iapetus, our own moon, and other places.
At present any visitor would have to come from the stars and that (travelling inter-stellar distances) is sufficiently difficult to do that we assume it doesn't happen. It would at least require vehicles of sufficient size that we would easily detect them.
Reports of UFOs began around 1946 - 1948 i.e. at the time when people flying around in piston-engined aircraft at 200 mph first started seeing jets go by them at 500 - 550. Those included US-made craft as well as advanced Nazi prototypes which had been captured.
The first person called to Roswell NM was Werner Von Braun, who was no more of an expert on alien technology than you or I would be, but who was THE expert on Nazi technology. His presence indicates that the question or problem to hand involved Nazi technology and not space alien technology.
Way to go out on a limb, there.
It all became clear it was revealed that both Fidel and Raul Castro are from the planet Theta Macaroni 4.
Back around 1990 or so i had a friend come up to me convinced he saw a UFO while cat fishing at night with another buddy.
A few days later another friend who did not know the first friend came up to me with the exact same story.
Same night, Same UFO, same shape, Both completely convinced it was not of this world.
Kind of freaked me out at the time.
Massive UFO Hoax planned on Sunday (22May2011).
The online group “Anonymous” is planning a worldwide hoax about UFO sightings, using members scattered in many countries. Starting on Sunday, May 22, at about 8 pm EST, you may start seeing reports on all sorts of websites about sightings of triangle-shaped UFOs, but these will all be bogus. The motivations of these hackers aren’t clear, and they may be mixed: Some may be into it for the fun, some because they favor UFO disclosure, and for others, it may be a form of conceptual art. We understand why people may sometimes make fun of UFOs, but WE take them seriously because we’ve met so many people who have memories of these strange encounters, including Whitley Strieber himself. That’s why we have a series of special interviews, just for subscribers, with “contactees” such as Diana and Kate, who tell their stories IN THEIR OWN WORDS
Read the original source: http://www.unknowncountry.com/news/massive-ufo-hoax-sunday#ixzz1MyuHDUy4
INTERESTING MUMMY FOUND IN PERU IN 1972
In all of the vast universe, it's hard to claim we're the only beings capable of space travel.
I’ve seen multiple objects I was never able to ID as conventional aircraft or spacecraft. One incident I observed a dim, pin point, star like object which appeared to move behind the lunar limb and did not appear to exit. Spooky did not begin to describe this incident, which lasted only about 5 seconds.
Proven hoax on ATS. Photoshopped.
Thanks for the ping!
What is the muzzle velocity of an MG-17 machinegun, out of say a 30 inch barrel? How fast does the velocity drop off to slower than the supposed disc craft.
>>Reports of UFOs began around 1946 - 1948><<
The First Recorded UFO Sighting - a Rock Carving!
The first recorded ufo sighting I have found so far dates all the way back to about 47,000 years ago. On an island in the Hunan province of China, there appear cylindrical objects (cigar-shaped spacecrafts) and their wierd, possibly extraterrestrial, occupants carved into a granite mountain and some rocks. I can’t find a picture of the carvings for the life of me. If somebody knows where I can find one, let me know.
The First Written UFO Account - Ancient Egypt
As mentioned before, there are several other candidates for the first written account which can probably be assigned to ancient Sumerian texts, but this one I find more along the lines of an unknown object in the sky. It was found on Egyptian papyrus during the reign of Thutmose III - 1504-1450 B.C.:
In the year 22, of the 3rd month of winter, sixth hour of the day...the scribes of the House of Life found it was a circle of fire that was coming in the sky.... It had no head, the breath of its mouth had a foul odor. Its body one rod long and one rod wide. It had no voice. Their hearts became confused through it; then they laid themselves on their bellies.... They went to the Pharaoh...to report it. His Majesty ordered...[an examination of] all which is written in the papyrus rolls of the House of Life. His Majesty was meditating upon what happened. Now after some days had passed, these things became more numerous in the skies than ever. They shone more in the sky than the brightness of the sun, and extended to the limits of the four supports of the heavens.... Powerful was the position of the fire circles. The army of the Pharaoh looked on with him in their midst. It was after supper. Thereupon, these fire circles ascended higher in the sky towards the south.... The Pharaoh caused incense to be brought to make peace on the hearth.... And what happened was ordered by the Pharaoh to be written in the annals of the House of Life...so that it be remembered for ever.
(Brinsley Le Poer Trench - The Flying Saucer Story, Reader’s Digest - Mysteries of the Unexplained)
I would imagine the supposed disc craft would be capable of various speeds, don’t you? From a stop to a cruse, to full speed to a stop.
The muzzle velocity of an MG-17 machinegun also varies according to the Ammo. Let’s say roughly 3000 fps.
>>Muzzle velocity: from 855 m/s (Phosphor “B” round ) to 905 m/s (Armor Piercing Tracer “SmK L’spur” round)<<
Back to your question, I don’t know but I’ll bet there’s lots of disinformation on the subject.
Do you have a site with details?
As a mamber of MUFON, I find it difficult to believe that a propulsion system as radical as would be required for that disc craft has remained secret and no one has come up with it ‘again’ in sixty years. I’m not active with MUFON currently, due to physical limitations. But I was a licensed field investigator with them and my skepticism radar is tingling real good over that supposed Nazi craft. It sells books to make up fantastic stuff, but I don’t think that one is real. Look at the history of ‘The Nazi Bell’ ... this supposed craft flew even before the Bell project was said to have made substantial breakthroughs. No, I can’t believe this one is a real craft. I have more ease believing Mars was a moon of a larger planet and had inhabitants who are now a remnant flying around in our stellar neighborhood. Tom Van Flandern may have had the exploding planet hypothesis figured out. Mars as an inhabitable moon now come planetary neighbor is more believable than these Nazi extreme advanced tech stories.
Phobos ( http://www.enterprisemission.com/Phobos.html )
As Hoagland notes, you can all but count the rivets. Phobos was known to be non solid as early on as the 1960s and ESA radar imaging apparently shows rectangular interior spaces. One full color view shows the thing to be clearly metallic:
Finally, we have the weirdest item of all. Given what we know about catastrophes within our system a few thousand years back, and given that people living in the system in past ages were space faring; you assume they would have seen the storm coming, and would not have had a way to know whether anything in the system would remain habitable or not. They would have tried to make it out to the near stars. That would have involved a large number of very large ships, and it's possible that one or two of them might not have made it out, and that we might find the remains of one such item sooner or later.
That is on the back side of our own moon apparently and google or youtube searches on 'apollo 20 alien ship' will turn up endless discussions on the subject. Supposedly, the video sequences arise from a reel of 9mm tape which one of the Apollo 20 astronauts released to the public on his death bed. If I had to bet it I would bet that the story is straight up and legit, the film sequence would be very difficult to fabricate, experts say the shots of the Apollo vehicle interior are for real, and there's no motive. People who make things up for youtube don't put that much effort into details.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hDI-uB6 ... 409BB68739
You can see where the guy with the camera sees the artificial object and zooms on it around 2/3 of the way through the video. And, as per the previous discussion, this thing, again assuming it to be real, would not fit in your garage easily; it's about a third the size of Manhatten.
A vehicle that size, in my opinion, could have but one purpose, i.e. escape. It would be a space-faring version of Noah's ark.
The possibility you have to consider is that we may actually have relatives out amongst the near stars, descendants of people who survived and made it out of our own system in vehicles like Steins or that thing above. That strikes me as the most major incentive for inter-stellar travel. The thing you saw in 'Avatar' doesn't really work from a money perspective, i.e. there's nothing you could hope to bring back from such a trip which could justify the cost.
Basic bottom lines: evidence of space faring which we have from the ancient world refers to space faring by people, not space aliens, from our own system, and not from other stars; the time frames involved are thousands or at most tens of thousands of years (prior to now), and not hundreds of thousands or millions.
There are a lot of good sleuths on there.
Anti-gravitational, anti-magnetic and/or nuclear or a combination of all three. I am not a physicist but I can envision systems where all three would be used for hovering, forward propulsion and making what we consider as
‘impossible to survive” maneuvers.
Imagine what some people think of the platypus? Photoshopped. Definitely!
Here is a site with the original picture:
Here is the Above Top Secret site that has the photoshopped picture and the link to the real one:
>>A vehicle that size, in my opinion, could have but one purpose, i.e. escape. It would be a space-faring version of Noah’s ark.<<
Have you considered that it could be simple a heavy cargo transport vehicle? Or perhaps a type of personnel transport vehicle? Consider how small our continental area is in relation to the land space on the entire planet and then study the number of aircraft we require to shuttle Americans and air cargo from one location to another every day of the week. Why can’t another society have similar requirements to ours?
Not at that kind of size and not for any purpose contained to our own system. Again there was a series of calamities back several thousand years ago and the people living in the system would have had no way to tell if anything at all was going to remain habitable here.
Interesting what some people will do, isn’t it? Did they really think they wouldn’t get caught?
Looks like my assertions about the Pope praising the fallen angels is correct:
Pope John XXIII Predictions
The following was e-mailed to JAY BROADGATE from Mary Ellen Gateley on Prodigy. She heard it on a local radio program, and was kind enough to type it in for those of us who listen strictly to the oldies station.
“Insight”, a religious magazine of some sort, reprinted from The Manila Bulletin where it originally appeared. Editors note: The following is from the diary of Pope John XXIII who reigned from 1958 - 1963. This copy was distributed by certain groups in several catholic churches in Metro Manila in the Philippines.
The world will suffer through a painful time of violent wars, deadly famine, and destructive natural disasters over the next 8 years. That nightmare will be followed by a lengthy stretch of love and harmony, a beautiful serene heaven on earth. The startling predictions come from the sensational lost diary of Pope John XXIII, beloved pontiff who died June 3, 1963. The dusty leather-bound diary containing handwritten predictions was found by a Vatican cleaning woman who was sorting through boxes stacked in a little-used storage room.
The entries clearly spell out the assassination of John F. Kennedy, America’s plunge into the Viet Nam war, unrest in the Middle East, and the fall of communism years before it took place. Later entries call for even more troubled times. Pope John had periodic visits from both Jesus and the Virgin Mary, said a reverend who’s pored over the wondrous tales. These sessions in the pope’s chambers resulted in fantastic glimpses into the future of mankind. The pope was saddened to learn that conditions will get much worse before they take a sudden, sensational turn in the year 2000 that will return the world to its pristine beauty that was here for Adam and Eve. Pope John writes of heavenly visitors arriving by June of 1995 in flaming chariots of steel. The special visitors will arrive at the height of despair and help man heal his wounds and work together to right all the horrible wrongs.
Father D’Angelo, now 73 years old, has agreed to release some of the diary entries made between February of 1959 and April of 1963. The scrawled messages reveal a frightened and excited pontiff who decided to keep his meetings with Christ and the Madonna a secret. The first appearance of Christ took place February 12, 1959. Pope John notes:
. . .
. . .
. . .
Transcripts from the Diary
APRIL 7, 1959. She is more beautiful that I had ever imagined. The Madonna is a joy to behold. I just wish her message was a more positive one. She says that in 4 years’ time the world will lose a great leader, and a powerful nation will find itself involved in a conflict it cannot win. The fighting will take its toll on the battlefield and from within as the population despises the loss of its young men. The Holy Mother sheds tears as she describes the heartbreaking vision.
. . .
. . .
. . .
MAY 19, 1962. From the heavens will appear the saviors. They will arrive on June 5, 1995 and begin their task of assisting the clearing and repair of the environment in the crippled countries. Many will fear these odd looking beings, but they come in peace and will, with God’s guidance, transform earth from a charred spinning rock to a lush oasis in space. The survivors will flourish in a world without war, disease or hatred. My heart is finally at peace with the knowledge that there is hope for humanity.
JULY 2, 1962. The Madonna tells me this will be her final visit. It is a joyous one, for she shares tremendous news. As the year 1998 arrives, our heavenly friends will have shared much of their advanced knowledge. Mankind will at last wipe out most of its diseases and our life spans will increase to the length of those listed in the Bible. The visitors will also share the remarkable power of resurrection, and throngs of the wrongly-dead will rise again. Finally, a wondrous miracle will take place in the sky above New York City on December 25, 2000, when millions will witness the sensational appearance of a messiah who’s going to announce the new beginning of a second paradise here on earth.
Pope John XXIII died a year later, before he ever
had a chance to release his predictions. Experts
say the diary is 100% authentic, and they urge
people to prepare themselves for even leaner
times before the new beginning, next century.
Thanks for the ping!
And yet, nothing happened, another 'Camping'.