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Free Trade and the Steel Industry
YouTube ^ | 1978 | Milton Friedman

Posted on 10/09/2011 1:37:52 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot

Milton Friedman shows the stupidity of tariffs.


TOPICS: Business/Economy
KEYWORDS: economy; global; tariffs; world
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To: Toddsterpatriot

In 2010 the USA produced 80.6 million tonnes of steel.


101 posted on 10/09/2011 4:47:20 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va; driftdiver
The USA is forth in steel production behind China, Japan and the EU.

Quick, tell driftdiver we still make steel.

102 posted on 10/09/2011 4:49:11 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Only imported oil.

No tax on Texas oil. None on Alaska oil. None for Oklahoma. California. North Dakota Bakken.

None on Gulf of Mexico oil.

See also: Buy American.


103 posted on 10/09/2011 4:50:13 PM PDT by Cringing Negativism Network (Santorum: Plan B to a certain Grizzly.)
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To: central_va
In 2010 the USA produced 80.6 million tonnes of steel.

That's a lot of steel. How much do we use for defense?

104 posted on 10/09/2011 4:50:14 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

It probably makes Free Traitors made that any steel is produced by inefficient US workers. All of those guys should retrain as biophysicists. I mean get real.


105 posted on 10/09/2011 4:51:23 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Let me ask you a question, how much steel does China produce every year?


106 posted on 10/09/2011 4:52:46 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network; Mase; 1rudeboy
Only imported oil.

No tax on Texas oil. None on Alaska oil. None for Oklahoma. California. North Dakota Bakken.

None on Gulf of Mexico oil.

Awesome. So when imported oil goes from $83 to $166 a barrel, domestic producers will charge how much for a barrel?

107 posted on 10/09/2011 4:52:46 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: central_va

Cool - so your approach is to tax ourselves into prosperity. As long as you know what you’re actually supporting...


108 posted on 10/09/2011 4:54:08 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: central_va

I don’t know, how much?


109 posted on 10/09/2011 4:54:19 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot
domestic producers will charge how much for a barrel?

Domestic producers wold be highly motivated to produce more then.

110 posted on 10/09/2011 4:54:28 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Might be interesting to compare that 2010 steel production volume, with say... 1944.

As a starting point for what might someday be needed in a pinch.


111 posted on 10/09/2011 4:55:03 PM PDT by Cringing Negativism Network (Santorum: Plan B to a certain Grizzly.)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

I’m just curious why you think we can tax ourselves into prosperity. How raising taxes on US consumers will help our economy.

Of course, you also thought tariffs on imported goods weren’t taxes on US consumers, so maybe you’re not quite sure of what you’re saying...


112 posted on 10/09/2011 4:55:13 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: Toddsterpatriot
I don’t know, how much?

China produces 8 times as much steel as the USA.

113 posted on 10/09/2011 4:56:26 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Yes, China and India love free trade deals. its helped them build their countries. They aren’t our friends.


114 posted on 10/09/2011 4:56:51 PM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: central_va

First off, we do NOT have free trade; in fact, we haven’t had free trade ever. We have highly managed trade, we have the tariffs and quotas and restrictions you protectionists want - and it hasn’t worked too well, has it?

Now, about the loss of manufacturing jobs and unions. Is it any surprise that many of those union jobs went overseas? It was simply economically unfeasible to keep them here. It’s either close down altogether and let everything in the chain die, or move some of the production overseas and keep a good portion of the chain.

Of course, you’d rather see the whole system torn down and burn rather than reformed, right?

How do you think we can tax ourselves into prosperity?


115 posted on 10/09/2011 4:57:49 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: FromTheSidelines

Oh. You’re back.

Out buying imported stuff, I’m guessing?


116 posted on 10/09/2011 4:58:32 PM PDT by Cringing Negativism Network (Santorum: Plan B to a certain Grizzly.)
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To: central_va
It probably makes Free Traitors made that any steel is produced by inefficient US workers.

I'll bet US steelworkers are a lot more efficient than they were 30 years ago. More than 20 years ago.

As long as they produce without taxpayer subsidies, more power to them.

You don't think the government should buy US Steel and start cranking up production, regardless of cost, do you?

117 posted on 10/09/2011 4:59:54 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: FromTheSidelines

Just so you know we are Free Traitoring ourselves into economic oblivion and the world is laughing at us.


118 posted on 10/09/2011 5:00:12 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

No more than you, I bet... What brand computer or cell phone do you have?

And you never want to talk about how your plan is to tax ourselves into prosperity. How giving the Federal Government even more revenue and even more control over our lives is the way to gain liberty and prosperity.

So how are we going to tax ourselves into prosperity? What new business are you going to set up to meet US demand?


119 posted on 10/09/2011 5:01:05 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: central_va
Domestic producers wold be highly motivated to produce more then.

You bet. So answer the question.

120 posted on 10/09/2011 5:01:05 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

I’m pretty sure we don’t need fleets of B-17s to launch nukes today.

Did you ever find how much we use for defense today?
Or are you still using feelings instead of actual data?


121 posted on 10/09/2011 5:03:11 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: central_va

We are? We have free trade?

Tell me, what do you think free trade is?


122 posted on 10/09/2011 5:03:11 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: central_va

Wow, that’s a lot of steel.
How much do they use for defense?


123 posted on 10/09/2011 5:04:38 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: FromTheSidelines

I already explained it to you.

You’re not exactly the brightest led in the flashlight, are you?

Import tariffs ... tax our competition.

Benefiting American manufacturers. Which provide American jobs, for American workers, who deposit their direct deposit into US banks.

Sorry to tell you, but it looks like your bulb is burned out...


124 posted on 10/09/2011 5:05:15 PM PDT by Cringing Negativism Network (Santorum: Plan B to a certain Grizzly.)
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To: driftdiver
Yes, China and India love free trade deals. its helped them build their countries.

We have free trade deals with China and India?

When did that happen? You have a link?

125 posted on 10/09/2011 5:05:48 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network
Import tariffs ... tax our competition.

Sorry, you're flat out wrong. If you want to make up your own fantasyland, you're on your own. Really, you need to learn something. Ignorance can be fixed, if you really want to quit being a dolt.

126 posted on 10/09/2011 5:08:26 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

He’s probably referring to “most favored nation” status.

You know. Where we open our markets but still can’t sell to them?


127 posted on 10/09/2011 5:09:13 PM PDT by Cringing Negativism Network (Santorum: Plan B to a certain Grizzly.)
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To: FromTheSidelines
US Tariff Duties on Top Imports from China

Among the top 10 Chinese exported products to America, only LCD television screens from China (HTS code 8528.72.72.50) is charged with tariff duties. The duty rate is 5%. Based on that 5% rate, the U.S. government collected $219.2 million in tariff duties ($4.4 billion times 5%) on that one product category. All other top 9 exports from China are duty free.

128 posted on 10/09/2011 5:09:40 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: FromTheSidelines

Am not.

(about as substantial as your post)


129 posted on 10/09/2011 5:10:20 PM PDT by Cringing Negativism Network (Santorum: Plan B to a certain Grizzly.)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

Tell us again how a US tariff on imported goods isn’t a tax on US consumers. Please.

You’re being stubborn, or you’re purposefully staying ignorant. Either way shows you’re not conservative...


130 posted on 10/09/2011 5:14:42 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: central_va

So you want to increase the taxes US consumers pay on imported goods.

How are we going to tax ourselves into prosperity? It’s a simple question, and directly addresses what you want to do.


131 posted on 10/09/2011 5:16:17 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: FromTheSidelines

No need, you just did.

Nicely said. Now go buy something American.


132 posted on 10/09/2011 5:16:57 PM PDT by Cringing Negativism Network (Santorum: Plan B to a certain Grizzly.)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

Obviously $166 oil is better for our economy than $83 oil.


133 posted on 10/09/2011 5:18:39 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Presently only about 30% of all import goods are subject to tariffs in the United States, the rest are on the free list. The “average” tariffs now charged by the United States are at a historic low. The list of negotiated tariffs are listed on the Harmonized Tariff Schedule as put out by the United States International Trade Commission.[13]


134 posted on 10/09/2011 5:20:11 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

the famous comeback ‘do you have a link’.

great debate style there


135 posted on 10/09/2011 5:20:18 PM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network
Go educate yourself. If you dare, that is...
136 posted on 10/09/2011 5:22:14 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: FromTheSidelines

Sorry globalist, I’m not registered in your class.


137 posted on 10/09/2011 5:23:26 PM PDT by Cringing Negativism Network (Santorum: Plan B to a certain Grizzly.)
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To: FromTheSidelines
How are we going to tax ourselves into prosperity?

Consumption taxes are good, as a matter of fact the USA lived on them for the first 80 years of its existence. If the tariffs collected off set the comparative advantage of using third world labor, around 10%, I would say that would be taxing our way to sanity. China can't retaliate because their tariffs are already sky high.

138 posted on 10/09/2011 5:25:56 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: driftdiver
the famous comeback ‘do you have a link’.

great debate style there

When I see a stupid claim with no backup, asking for a link is nicer than telling the other poster what an utter moron they are.

139 posted on 10/09/2011 5:27:29 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: central_va
Interestingly, we're close to the 10%. Tariffs brought in $132 billion. And we had about $1.3 trillion in imports. So we're at about 10% right now...
140 posted on 10/09/2011 5:34:28 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: FromTheSidelines
Tariffs look closer to $28 billion, not $132 billion.
Thanks for the link.
141 posted on 10/09/2011 5:43:33 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

you’re just here for argument, you have no desire for anything else.

even the blind can see whats happening to our country.


142 posted on 10/09/2011 5:50:48 PM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: driftdiver
you’re just here for argument, you have no desire for anything else.

Don't make stupid claims and I won't have any reason to argue.

even the blind can see whats happening to our country.

And some think the solution is even bigger government.

I happen to disagree.

143 posted on 10/09/2011 6:03:29 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: central_va
Future generations are going to curse the Free Traitors of today. The greediest generation gave away the store and ate the seed corn.

All true but future generations will be brainwashed multiCulti style and wont have have enough brain cells left to understand your remark. We are shoveling shit against the tide

144 posted on 10/09/2011 6:06:53 PM PDT by dennisw (nzt - works better if you're already smart)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

No you think the solution is to give foreign countries all our jobs, money and technology.


145 posted on 10/09/2011 6:10:07 PM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: driftdiver

I don’t think we should do any of those things.
I also don’t think the solution to big government’s problems is to give government more power.


146 posted on 10/09/2011 6:16:56 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: dennisw

On your tombstone it will read -—

“He was a big government lover until the end even though it impoverished his sons and daughters and ruined his community and shut down half the factories. He was a man of principles. Idiotic principles and Obama proved this”


147 posted on 10/09/2011 6:19:37 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: central_va
I believe in free trade amongst the 50 states. I believe in protectionism when countries use unfair trade practices or are COMMUNIST. Perhaps you forgot that part.

Free trade libertarian style between our 50 states where we have rule of law   As far as other nations protectionism and we look out for ourselves USA

148 posted on 10/09/2011 6:26:31 PM PDT by dennisw (nzt - works better if you're already smart)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

See the chart about 2/3rds the way down the page - it’s about $132 billion for ad valorem taxes (tariffs).


149 posted on 10/09/2011 6:50:50 PM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
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To: FromTheSidelines

I saw that. Dig deeper.


150 posted on 10/09/2011 6:52:21 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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