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Is Socialism's True Father - Satan?
Canada Free Press ^ | Kelly O'Connell

Posted on 11/06/2011 1:07:59 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman

Could Karl Marx and other foundational socialists, like Proudhon and Bakunin, have had a soft-spot for Lucifer? Would it even make sense to suggest anti-religious, godless persons could still salute Satan? This article is a brief investigation into whether socialism has any claim to fame as an ideology of not just atheists, but even diabolically minded people ...

(Excerpt) Read more at canadafreepress.com ...


TOPICS: Books/Literature; History; Society
KEYWORDS: karlmarx; marx; satan; socialism
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1 posted on 11/06/2011 1:08:02 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman
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To: Olympiad Fisherman
All right, I'll bite.


2 posted on 11/06/2011 1:10:50 PM PST by NohSpinZone (First thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Socialism = idolatry. The government is the idol.

When you look to a government to provide your needs, rather than God, you violate the very first commandment, “Thou shalt have none other Gods before Me.”


3 posted on 11/06/2011 1:11:27 PM PST by justsaynomore (Pray for Herman Cain)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman
I was listening to Coast to Coast one time and the guest was some Lucifer worshiping Satanist. He went on to say how we need massive government micromanaging us. Of course he could be just another bitter atheist, but still the combo is there
4 posted on 11/06/2011 1:15:48 PM PST by nerdwithagun (I'd rather go gun to gun then knife to knife.)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman
Could Karl Marx and other foundational socialists, like Proudhon and Bakunin, have had a soft-spot for Lucifer? Would it even make sense to suggest anti-religious, godless persons could still salute Satan? This article is a brief investigation into whether socialism has any claim to fame as an ideology of not just atheists, but even diabolically minded people ...
Despite what one might think, economics is not morally or theologically neutral. Every business action supports a certain economic paradigm and in doing so, supports a certain and specific theology. Every businessperson needs to understand that taking a specific economic position gives insight into your view of theology, morality and God. These insights must be addressed because it will affect how you run your business....For a business owner, it could be whether you maximize your profits or how you compensate your employees, issues like that....Economics is certainly not morally or theologically neutral. To take a stance as a Marxist, Keynesian, or an Adam Smith Capitalist reveals insight into your view of man, God and redemption....
....These truths are not the same as capitalism. Yet capitalism is the one economic paradigm that is most congruent with Calvin’s teachings and the Biblical economic “truths” I mentioned....Calvin believed wealth cannot be evil because God chooses to bless some with wealth. But, whether wealthy or poor, Calvin and the Bible exhort us to be content with our economic positions in life and to live a life following his word, not chasing after wealth....People who think of Calvin as equating material prosperity with eternal destiny are misreading him. But if someone is in difficulty, then maybe that is where that person needs to be in this life for the sake of his eternal life. That may be an expression of God’s will.
-- from the thread How theology ties into economics

5 posted on 11/06/2011 1:17:00 PM PST by Alex Murphy (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2703506/posts?page=518#518)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman
There is no doubt.

The great sin is Pride. Satan can get to us through many means, but Pride seems to be where we are usually most vulnerable.

Socialism is all about creating a perfect human society on earth. God, in his infinite wisdom, did not give us that -- but the Socialists will!! They know best, and they have the wisdom to make it happen!

Voegelin called it Immanentizing the eschaton.

6 posted on 11/06/2011 1:17:49 PM PST by ClearCase_guy (I won't vote for Romney. I won't vote for Perry.)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

yes.


7 posted on 11/06/2011 1:18:58 PM PST by ken21
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To: Olympiad Fisherman
You can't understand socialism, 0bama, Islam, or other phenomena of modern life simply in terms of economics. Read Marx & Satan by Richard Wurmbrand and you will realize that Marx's goal was not peaceful utopia, but violence and death (nihilism), which is in fact what Marxism has brought everywhere it has reigned. Socialism & Islam seem very different, but are allied because of one overwhelming common goal: both seek the destruction of Western Christian civilization.

That's why dopes who, like G.W. Bush and Rick Perry, think Islam is an honorable, peaceful "faith," have led us to disaster.

8 posted on 11/06/2011 1:22:45 PM PST by hellbender
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Oh yes.


9 posted on 11/06/2011 1:24:52 PM PST by DeoVindiceSicSemperTyrannis (Want to make $$$? It's easy! Pimp your blog for hits on Free Republic!)
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To: Alex Murphy
If we go with what the Bible favors in economics we'll go with a leveling wealth redistribution every fifty years as described in Leviticus 25:8-17 where in the year of Jubilee, accumulated land reverted to the original owners. The Bible certainly doesn't support godless Marxism, but it's not exactly an advocate for unlimited wealth accumulation through the market either.
10 posted on 11/06/2011 1:26:24 PM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Hell yes!


11 posted on 11/06/2011 1:28:33 PM PST by TexasRepublic (Socialism is the gospel of envy and the religion of thieves)
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To: ClearCase_guy; Olympiad Fisherman
"The great sin is Pride. Satan can get to us through many means, but Pride seems to be where we are usually most vulnerable."

I believe Envy is tied with Pride. Just look at the OWS'ers. They have NO pride, but are full of Envy, which makes them violent.

12 posted on 11/06/2011 1:29:43 PM PST by NoGrayZone (Stay involved..because stupid people are running America! - Herman Cain - Amen!!!)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

Actually, you are wrong. If wealth reverted to the original owners, that would mean that people who made money initially and had the land could get it back. There is no way that could work today. Meanwhile, my many-times-great grandfather was left millions of acres of land by the Indians. Wish that reverted to me now!


13 posted on 11/06/2011 1:31:18 PM PST by Paved Paradise
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

The father of socialism is altruism. The term altruism was coined by Auguste Compte, a french philosopher who was a socialist and a statist.


14 posted on 11/06/2011 1:31:30 PM PST by albionin
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To: NoGrayZone

I suppose that a better theologian than I, might argue that all sins are equally bad.


15 posted on 11/06/2011 1:32:52 PM PST by ClearCase_guy (I won't vote for Romney. I won't vote for Perry.)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Easy question.

All socialists (communists) are satanists!

They believe in government instead of God. Washington is full of atheists who traded God for power.


16 posted on 11/06/2011 1:33:53 PM PST by IbJensen (The best thing you can do for the poor is not be one of them.)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
If we go with what the Bible favors in economics we'll go with a leveling wealth redistribution every fifty years as described in Leviticus 25:8-17 where in the year of Jubilee, accumulated land reverted to the original owners.

More specifically, original ownership of one of the original plots of land within Israel's borders. There was no "wealth redistribution" per se. How many "original owners" do you think could have showed up to claim their chunk of land in the second Jubilee? At best, a claimant would have to prove lineage back to the original owner of said plot, and after several generations of dividing it amongst the heirs, the amount of land someone could legitimately (re)claim would end up as a token amount.

17 posted on 11/06/2011 1:34:30 PM PST by Alex Murphy (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2703506/posts?page=518#518)
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To: Paved Paradise

Ping to post #17


18 posted on 11/06/2011 1:35:13 PM PST by Alex Murphy (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2703506/posts?page=518#518)
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To: Paved Paradise

The land in Israel was originally distributed by families. Therefore, the Jubilee meant a levelling every fifty years per person. We should note that there was no prohibition against income inequality during the fifty years as long as the widows, the poor and the stranger were taken care of and God received his due, but in the long run, God’s ideal was that there be no perpetual rich or poor class.


19 posted on 11/06/2011 1:37:56 PM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Thanks for posting this, it’s very informative.

I knew the Commies were godless, I never knew they were devil worshipers.

Good to know.

Their twisted beliefs are certainly manifest at the OWS nonsense.

But, of course, it is not nonsense. And I shouldn’t say it is. It is a war and we are their enemies.

The left will NEVER stop, not until they are crushed totally beneath the boot heel of history.


20 posted on 11/06/2011 1:38:25 PM PST by jocon307
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
GK Chesterton and Hillaire Belloc (and others) promoted Distributism which is neither socialism nor capitalism but is based on Christian thinking.

I don't know enough to be either for it or against it, but I know that socialism has certainly failed and (frankly) when I look at America as we approach a truly global economy, I wonder if capitalism might also be a failure. Our workers are trying to compete with Chinese peasants who earn $5 a day and who expect no benefits and who are willing to die at 50 and live alongside polluted rivers. Under a capitalist system, American workers will not succeed against competition like that. We will simply have no jobs and/or no decent standard of living.

At the very least, Distributism is worth a look.

21 posted on 11/06/2011 1:38:30 PM PST by ClearCase_guy (I won't vote for Romney. I won't vote for Perry.)
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To: Alex Murphy

>>At best, a claimant would have to prove lineage back to the original owner of said plot, and after several generations of dividing it amongst the heirs, the amount of land someone could legitimately (re)claim would end up as a token amount.

I don’t think it would have been divided amongst the heirs. They tended to give all to the firstborn son.


22 posted on 11/06/2011 1:39:21 PM PST by Bryanw92 (The solution to fix Congress: Nuke em from orbit. It's the only way to be sure!)
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To: Alex Murphy
Land was the major component of wealth in a pre-industrial society. The message is clear, God's ideal was that there be no perpetual rich or poor class, not that there be a forced income leveling within the fifty years.
23 posted on 11/06/2011 1:42:07 PM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: ClearCase_guy

No, you’re correct. They are all equally bad. I think things just happen to get worse when people start combining them.


24 posted on 11/06/2011 1:48:03 PM PST by NoGrayZone (Stay involved..because stupid people are running America! - Herman Cain - Amen!!!)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman
Not so much Lucifer as Prometheus, the Titan who stole fire from Zeus and gave it to mortals.

Check out Marx's doctoral dissertation with its draft preface that closes:

Philosophy, as long as a drop of blood shall pulse in its world-subduing and absolutely free heart, will never grow tired of answering its adversaries with the cry of Epicurus:

"Not the man who denies the gods worshipped by the multitude, but he who affirms of the gods what the multitude believes about them, is truly impious."

Philosophy makes no secret of it. The confession of Prometheus:

"In simple words, I hate the pack of gods"
[Aeschylus, Prometheus Bound]

is its own confession, its own aphorism against all heavenly and earthly gods who do not acknowledge human self-consciousness as the highest divinity. It will have none other beside.

But to those poor March hares who rejoice over the apparently worsened civil position of philosophy, it responds again, as Prometheus replied to the servant of the gods, Hermes:

"Be sure of this, I would not change my state
Of evil fortune for your servitude.
Better to be the servant of this rock
Than to be faithful boy to Father Zeus."
[Ibid.]

Prometheus is the most eminent saint and martyr in the philosophical calendar.

Alinsky's dedication of Rules for Radicals to Lucifer is in the same tradition.

Whether you want to take Alinsky literally or translate Marx's Prometheus as Lucifer is something people will argue about for a long time without coming to any certain resolution.

25 posted on 11/06/2011 1:49:26 PM PST by x
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Of the total number of people murdered in the 20th century, both civilian and military, by far the largest percentage were victims of the communist/socialist ideology.


26 posted on 11/06/2011 1:54:33 PM PST by 353FMG (Liberalism is Satan's handiwork.)
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To: ClearCase_guy
I think a great danger to our long-term prosperity and even freedom is a tendency for capitialism to degenerate into a crony capitialism which will destroy our early American ideal of equality of opportunity. The presence of the dangers of "crony capitialism" suggests that there may be a tradeoff between the benefits of unlimited property rights and equality of opportunity.

It's hard to compete against slave labor. But long run, I have some big doubts over the ability of the Chinese to forever keep their people so under the thumb.

27 posted on 11/06/2011 1:57:50 PM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: Olympiad Fisherman; All

Very interesting/informative article. Thanks for posting.

Very interesting/informative thread. Thanks to all posters.

From “The Law” Frederic Bastiat 1801-1850...

“Above all, if you wish to be strong, begin by rooting out every particle of socialism that may have crept into your legislation. This will be no light task.”

DEFUND socialist collectives, foreign and domestic.

DEPOPULATE socialists and RINOS (Republicans Implementing Nuances Of Socialism) from Congress.

http://cpc.grijalva.house.gov/index.cfm?sectionid=71&sectiontree=2,71


28 posted on 11/06/2011 1:59:28 PM PST by PGalt
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To: ClearCase_guy
At the very least, Distributism is worth a look.

Take a good hard look at it. It would take tyranny to establish it, and tyranny to maintain it. It doesn't just say no one should be rich, it would actively prevent anyone from becoming rich.

29 posted on 11/06/2011 2:01:09 PM PST by JoeFromSidney (New book: RESISTANCE TO TYRANNY. A primer on armed revolt. Available form Amazon.)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Quick answer is YES!

Great read on Liberalism, which speaks about faith, real world, and Satan’s involvement in Liberalism. written over a century ago yet sounds just like today’s conversations in so many ways. Check out pages 86-92 for quick definitions on the Symptoms of Liberalism.

http://catholicharboroffaithandmorals.com/What%20is%20Liberalism%20New.html


30 posted on 11/06/2011 2:21:33 PM PST by jafojeffsurf (Return to the Constitution)
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To: Alex Murphy

Thanks Alex,

There is no question that Calvinism provided the theological framework for progress and economic development that the west has taken for granted and distorted. Calvinism set aside both pagan hesitations and even some Catholic backwardness that kept an artificial religious order not subscribed by the Bible. Furthermore, not all of God’s blessings are heaven related.


31 posted on 11/06/2011 2:22:56 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman (Olympiad Fisherman)
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To: ClearCase_guy

Read Ezekiel 28:12-17 and Isaiah 14:12-14. Is Ezekiel talking about the king of Tyre or of Satan? Is Isaiah talking about the king of Babylon or Satan? How about Genesis 3 - are we talking about the serpent or Satan?


32 posted on 11/06/2011 2:24:52 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman (Olympiad Fisherman)
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To: hellbender

Thanks - yes - take a look at this particular article from Gulagbound written a few months back - http://gulagbound.com/17741/the-absurdity-of-karl-marxs-dialectical-fundamentalism/. Another good article written by the same author can be found here - http://www.theignorantfishermen.com/2010/06/secular-fundamentalism-profane-prophecy.html.


33 posted on 11/06/2011 2:27:46 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman (Olympiad Fisherman)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

He is according to Bill Ayres.


34 posted on 11/06/2011 2:28:55 PM PST by madison10
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

Nature’s Economy in the Old Testament

• God is Creator/Owner of Nature (Gen 1; Ps 50)
• Polytheism & Idolatry & Nature Worship were Forbidden (Ex 20:1-5; Deut 4:15-19; 2 Hos 4:12-13; Jer 2:20; Ezk 6:13)
• Nature was Made for Man to Rule, Guard & Cultivate (Gen 1:26-28; 2:15; 9:3; Ps 8)
• The World is Designed to be Filled with Population (Gen 1:26-28; 9:1)
• Animals are to be Cared for (Gen 6; Ex 23:19; Prov 27:23)
• Freedom Under the Rule of Law is Assumed (Exodus; Deuteronomy)
• The Natural World is to be Farmed & Mined for Human Development (Deut 8:1-20)
• Agricultural & Financial Blessing Based on Disciplined Obedience to God (Deut 28; Proverbs)
• Private Property is to be Protected by Redemption Rights (Lev 25:23-34; Prov 23:10-11; Deut 23:24-25)
• Mosaic Economy Extolled the Virtues of Small Business & International Trade (Proverbs 31:10-31)
• Making Wealth Provides Opportunity for Generosity (Prov 31:20)
• Diversify Portfolio Portion for your Protection (Eccl 11:2)
• Credit Economy & Debt was Frowned upon – but Not Illegal (Lev 25:1-22; 35-38; Deut 23:19-23)
• Charging Interest was Illegal for Hebrews – but not for Aliens (Ex 22:25; Deut 23:19-20)
• Aliens Living in the Promised Land are to be Treated Well (Lev 19:34)
• Hebrews were Forbidden to Develop Idolatrous Practices of the Multicultural World around them inside the Promised Land (Deut 12:1-4; 2 Kings 17:7-18; )
• Oppression was Forbidden (Deut 24:14)
• Biblical Wisdom is Better than Riches (Prov 20:15; 23:4-5)
• Being Generous to the Poor was not Government Welfare – but was Expected of Private Individuals – Poor People had to Work (Lev 19:10; 23:22; Isa 58:7-12)
• Government Welfare was Frowned upon (Num 11:1-6)
• Do not be Partial to the Poor Simply Because they are Poor (Ex 23:3)
• Poverty is an Unfortunate Fact of Life (Deut 15:1-11)
• Thorns & Thistles Result from Farming as Pollution is also a Natural By-Product of Making Wealth (Gen 3:17-19; Prov 14:4)
• The Election of Kings Invites Oppression (1 Sam 8:1-22)
• Kings are Subject to the Mosaic Law just as any other Citizen (Deut 17:14-20)
• Division of Powers Between King, Priest and Prophet was assumed (2 Sam 12:1-15; 2 Chron 26:16-23)


35 posted on 11/06/2011 2:29:44 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman (Olympiad Fisherman)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

“Blessed is the nation whose God is the LORD” (Psalm 33:12)

I wonder, is the LORD still the God of America? or has he been forgotten?

Does conservatism stand true to biblical truth? If not, is politics enough to save our country?


36 posted on 11/06/2011 2:30:30 PM PST by Pilgrim's Progress (http://www.baptistbiblebelievers.com/BYTOPICS/tabid/335/Default.aspx)
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To: Alex Murphy

See post 35!


37 posted on 11/06/2011 2:30:56 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman (Olympiad Fisherman)
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To: ClearCase_guy

See post 35!


38 posted on 11/06/2011 2:31:32 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman (Olympiad Fisherman)
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To: albionin

See post 33 and the good articles posted there. Comte was also a progressive.


39 posted on 11/06/2011 2:36:34 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman (Olympiad Fisherman)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman
Could Karl Marx and other foundational socialists, like Proudhon and Bakunin, have had a soft-spot for Lucifer

Karl watched most of his kids die from disease and malnutrition while he drank, smoked cigars, and plotted in a windowless tenement with his fellow imps. No devil there....

40 posted on 11/06/2011 2:37:30 PM PST by King Moonracer (Bad lighting and cheap fabric, that's how you sell clothing.....)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

50 years is an awfully long time to wait to have all the debts paid back! Many, if not most people would have died before receiving the benefits of it.


41 posted on 11/06/2011 2:38:07 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman (Olympiad Fisherman)
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To: King Moonracer

Amen!


42 posted on 11/06/2011 2:38:53 PM PST by Olympiad Fisherman (Olympiad Fisherman)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Richard Wurmbrand, a pastor who had been persecuted by the Communists while in Eastern Europe, has written extensively about the ties between Karl Marx and Satanism.


43 posted on 11/06/2011 2:41:10 PM PST by Fred Hayek (FUBO, the No Talent Pop Star pResident.)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Thanks. I will be sure to read them.


44 posted on 11/06/2011 2:52:26 PM PST by albionin
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

Any political philosophy that results in the enslavement of the citizens is supported and fostered by Satan.I would have no qualms referring to Carl Marx, Van Jones, Valerie Jarret, Obama ET AL as servants of or minions of Satan.


45 posted on 11/06/2011 2:54:24 PM PST by W. W. SMITH (Obama is an instrument of enslavement)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

By his own twisted logic everything he touches must fail or he will have written his own reason for being out of existence, by creating a success for man.
Involving him in anything is a ticket to doom.
So it has been with all forms of socialism.

Regards.


46 posted on 11/06/2011 2:57:35 PM PST by moose07 (Warped humour alert!)
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To: NoGrayZone

Envy and pride are both contained in the 10 commandments.


47 posted on 11/06/2011 2:57:48 PM PST by mc5cents
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To: ClearCase_guy

I don’t know what Distributionism is, but I think that some of the roots of socialism are found in Catholic social teaching.


48 posted on 11/06/2011 3:06:36 PM PST by maro (One term is enough)
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To: justsaynomore

“Socialism = idolatry. The government is the idol.

When you look to a government to provide your needs, rather than God, you violate the very first commandment, “Thou shalt have none other Gods before Me.”

Jehovah Jireh my Provider


49 posted on 11/06/2011 3:08:17 PM PST by vanilla swirl (We are the Patrick Henry we have been waiting for!)
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To: Olympiad Fisherman

of course not


50 posted on 11/06/2011 3:15:28 PM PST by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 ..... Crucifixion is coming)
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