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Public School Teachers Are Highest Paid State Workers; Pay Doubles the Average in Private Industry
CNSNews.com ^ | December 14, 2011 | Terence P. Jeffrey

Posted on 12/15/2011 6:38:51 AM PST by Zakeet

Full Headline: Dept. of Labor: Public School Teachers Are Highest Paid State Workers; Compensation Doubles the Average in Private Industry

Public school teachers receive greater average hourly compensation in wages and benefits than any other group of state and local government workers and receive more than twice as much in average hourly wages and benefits as workers in private industry, according to a new report from the Bureau of Labor Statistics.

Public primary, secondary and special education teachers are paid an average of $56.59 per hour in combined wages and benefits, BLS said in the report released last week.

That is slightly more than twice the $28.24 in average hourly wages and benefits paid to workers in private industry.

In fact, according the BLS, the $28.24 in average hourly wages and benefits that private-industry workers now earn in the United States is less than the overall national average for hourly wages and benefits of $30.11.

That is because the overall national average compensation is dragged upwards from the private-industry average by the much higher wages and benefits paid to state and local government workers—who take in an average of $40.76 per hour, according to BLS.

The BLS report only calculated and published the average hourly wages and benefits for workers in nonfarm private industry and state and local governments. It did not include federal government workers.

(Excerpt) Read more at cnsnews.com ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: nea; pay; teachers; unions
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The BLS report means nothing ... we are still grossly underpaid ... you stupid Freepers!

1 posted on 12/15/2011 6:38:58 AM PST by Zakeet
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To: Zakeet

I have an MBA and the average teacher in this county makes more than I do.


2 posted on 12/15/2011 6:43:30 AM PST by RockinRight (If you're waiting to drink until you find pure water, you're going to die of dehydration.)
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To: Zakeet

“”Public School Teachers Are Highest Paid State Workers””

Why are teachers considered state workers? Their salaries certainly aren’t paid by the state, are they? Aren’t all school districts the ones who pay the salaries?

A lot of questions, I know but I’m confused!!


3 posted on 12/15/2011 6:47:23 AM PST by Thank You Rush
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To: Zakeet

Not so in Texas.


4 posted on 12/15/2011 6:50:11 AM PST by no dems (Why do you never see "Obama" bumper stickers on cars going to work in the morning?)
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To: Zakeet

Of course teachers will say they do ‘so much!’ work for class at home and after school that they don’t get paid for....

You can talk to them until you are blue in the face that most salaries private sector employees do too - but they just don’t hear you.

They always compare themselves to factory shift-work (punch the clock) employees that get paid over-time if they do anything extra - that’s the wrong comparison. There are millions of people working salaried jobs that take their work home and work before and after ‘hours’ that make half their wage.(If they are lucky)


5 posted on 12/15/2011 6:50:38 AM PST by libertarian27 (Check my profile page for the FReeper Online Cookbook 2011)
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To: Thank You Rush

“”Public school teachers receive greater average hourly compensation in wages and benefits than any other group of state and local government workers””

Missed the “local” government part - SORRY!


6 posted on 12/15/2011 6:51:18 AM PST by Thank You Rush
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To: Thank You Rush

This is a blatant lie!!!!!! Every “educator” I have ever known gripes that they are underpaid, overworked and need more time off. Obviously this article is dishonest and hating all teachers.


7 posted on 12/15/2011 6:56:48 AM PST by hal ogen (First Amendment or Reeducation Camp?)
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To: no dems
Not so in Texas.

Nor in Missouri, where my daughter teaches. She has a Master's and 12 years experience and has a salary of $44,000 per year.

8 posted on 12/15/2011 6:56:58 AM PST by Graybeard58 (Of course Obama loves his country but I want a President who loves mine.)
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To: libertarian27

‘They always compare themselves to factory shift-work (punch the clock) employees that get paid over-time if they do anything extra’

Agreed.

Many of us hourlies ,especially over the last 3 years have taken not only pay-cuts(20% myself), but work additional hours and have been given extra tasks done by others who quit/laid-off, in order NOT only to keep our jobs but to keep companies we work for,afloat.

I haven’t seen a raise since 2007 and vacation time is a half a day here or half a day there.

I am sure many folks are in the same predicament.


9 posted on 12/15/2011 6:59:43 AM PST by Le Chien Rouge
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To: Graybeard58

“She has a Master’s and 12 years experience and has a salary of $44,000 per year.”

Granted that’s low compared to a lot of other places.

But divide that by the number of hours worked, then add in the cost of benefits.

And then compare it to private sector Missouri jobs.


10 posted on 12/15/2011 7:06:41 AM PST by Pessimist
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To: RockinRight

I’m a retired teacher with Masters + 65. Made a lot of $$ and am now enjoying it . YOU are totally responsible for choosing your college major and the vocation you want to succeed in.

That is the problem with the Occupy Wall Street crowd. Liberal arts and a basket weaving degree that cost thousands to achieve is not the ticket to a financially sound future.

BTW. I am a registered Republican, lean toward Libertarian , and a member of the NRA to boot.


11 posted on 12/15/2011 7:10:46 AM PST by Renegade
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To: no dems; Allegra; big'ol_freeper; Lil'freeper; TrueKnightGalahad; blackie; Cincinatus' Wife; ...
Re: Not so in Texas.

We have been told for years that we do not pay our public school teachers enough... especially from their teachers unions.

I have two cousins, both public school teachers, that just retired this year... and they were pulling in better than 100K a year from the Dallas Independent School District.

That's a lot of green for reading... 'riting and 'rithmetic!

12 posted on 12/15/2011 7:16:02 AM PST by Bender2 ("I've got a twisted sense of humor, and everything amuses me." RAH Beyond this Horizon)
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To: Thank You Rush

I believe it’s a state retirement system and the state sends money to each district.


13 posted on 12/15/2011 7:19:08 AM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: Le Chien Rouge

Even contracting crowds have gotten really weird and bad in some cases.

The past few months working for a crowd based in Florida (I will never do that again) has found more and more excuses to skimp and cheap out.

Yesterday I called these yo-yos for the first time with a situation where I actually needed their assistance regarding their rental van. The old battleaxe in charge of money gave me different flavors of no, no, it costs too much, we won’t reimburse you, we will dock you, etc, etc. After about 10 minutes of that, I admit I lost it with her.

I called my next to useless supervisor and talked to him. He wasn’t surprised and he said he would try. Eventually it was agreed to express mail me a check.

Apparently they have no contigency plan of any kind and would rather take a chance that nothing happens. Today is my last day for a couple of weeks and I am not going back.

If I can’t find something else, worst case I will liquidate several years of state gov retirement.

Beware the Roelker Group. Beware HP. Beware Bank Of America.


14 posted on 12/15/2011 7:19:18 AM PST by wally_bert (It's sheer elegance in its simplicity! - The Middleman)
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To: Graybeard58

“Nor in Missouri, where my daughter teaches. She has a Master’s and 12 years experience and has a salary of $44,000 per year.”

A Masters in what..Math, Science, or 2nd grade milk-N-cookies?

Not knocking your Daughter, but the vast majority of teaching degrees are ‘phone it in’ classes. Also the total hours in the classroom for most teachers is barely over a part time job.

That is still on the low side. In MI she would be well over 70K.


15 posted on 12/15/2011 7:19:41 AM PST by Beagle8U (Free Republic -- One stop shopping ....... It's the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
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To: Bender2

Guess I’ve been teaching all these years in the wrong School District. My salary is still under 50K.


16 posted on 12/15/2011 7:22:49 AM PST by no dems (Why do you never see "Obama" bumper stickers on cars going to work in the morning?)
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To: Graybeard58

I don’t know where is Missouri she is, but where I am in Springfield, she would be doing very well.

According to 2009 statistics, the median household income in Springfield was $30,831.

If fact, at $44,000 she wouldn’t be doing too bad in all of Missouri since the State median household income was $45,229.

I find that teachers don’t like to talk about their pay when you point out what others make.


17 posted on 12/15/2011 7:25:18 AM PST by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: no dems
No knocking teachers, I want them to get paid as much as they can for quality performance but I am knocking their unions and educators as they are what is wrong with today's school systems.
18 posted on 12/15/2011 7:33:06 AM PST by Bender2 ("I've got a twisted sense of humor, and everything amuses me." RAH Beyond this Horizon)
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To: Zakeet

Since teachers aren’t paid hourly, and since most government workers are salaried, it’s hard to compare with manufacturing hourly workers.

Nonetheless, American manufacturing has been seriously injured by cheap labor in China, Thailand, and the serf-ocracies. We allow their anti-free market products into our country so that American goods are non-competitive price-wise.

The only response of companies is to pay the lowest wages possible to compete with overseas workers making slave wages. That drives those wages down.

Are there some teachers not worth their pay? I’m sure there are. I’m sure there are hourly workers not worth their pay.

I know a local high school calculus teacher, though, who is among the best of the best. Former students in college and in engineering firms still call with tough problems.

How many can do what this teacher can do?

Very damn few can compete with brilliant.


19 posted on 12/15/2011 7:35:44 AM PST by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True Supporters of our Troops PRAY for their VICTORY!)
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To: Graybeard58
and has a salary of $44,000 per year.

What is her benefits package, pension, etc worth?

20 posted on 12/15/2011 7:43:03 AM PST by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: Zakeet

There is a GREAT dissimilarity between the pay that UNION TEACHERS receive (I.E. Northern/Blue states) and NON-UNION TEACHERS receive.

Non-union is pretty much on scale with the private sector. I, in fact, was dropped $500 in pay and have not received my scheduled pay increase for 3 years due to state cuts. I love my job so I don’t think too much about it.

Union teachers make a truck load of money and they are thoroughly protected after their third year.


21 posted on 12/15/2011 7:44:56 AM PST by struggle
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
I can only wish I made what they quote. There is a vast discrepancy in amounts teachers make. I am in the deep South and make 35K after 10 years. My degree is in the subject I teach not a basket weaving education degree. I agree a degree in education means nothing. I was in the private sector making 40k 15 years ago. My wife makes a very good private sector income so I could go into teaching.
No union. Pay for all benefits.
22 posted on 12/15/2011 7:57:54 AM PST by prof.h.mandingo (Buck v. Bell (1927) An idea whose time has come (for extreme liberalism))
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To: Graybeard58

You should see what they make in Oregon.
The guy across the street from me (when I lived there) made almost as much as me, lived in a bigger house, and gets a pension of 70k/year.

The guy was a gym teacher.

I’ve been 22 years at Intel and didn’t get the benefits he did.


23 posted on 12/15/2011 7:59:09 AM PST by Zathras
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To: Graybeard58
She has a Master's and 12 years experience and has a salary of $44,000 per year

This study added in benefits and compared hourly numbers.

24 posted on 12/15/2011 8:05:20 AM PST by TankerKC (Welcome to the age of "I Meant to Do That" Diplomacy)
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To: Graybeard58; Pessimist; Beagle8U; Anitius Severinus Boethius
Nor in Missouri, where my daughter teaches. She has a Master's and 12 years experience and has a salary of $44,000 per year.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Add in the pension and retirement health benefits, current benefits, and divide by the hours worked over their careers, and teachers are paid better than nearly any professional. Teachers would like to paid like the most successful neurosurgeons at the **peak** of their relatively **short** careers. Unlike professionals who require many more years of schooling and many more years to build their practices, teachers have the opportunity to work 30 or 40 or more years.

Also...teaching is not an academically competitive career. Low SAT scores, community college followed by a local state university with **minimally** demanding courses and no science and math courses ( or grossly diluted courses) is all that is needed. And...Sadly, too many masters degrees in education are a joke.

It is possible to qualify for a teaching position with minimal student loan debt, while in their early 20s. My local dentist, however, started his career with a quarter of million in school debt and another $400,000 to buy the practice. ( Really!) How many teachers are willing to take on **that** financial risk in this economy?

The truth is that if government schools were to close tomorrow, most teachers ( yes, “most”!) would barely be qualified to be a shift manager of the local carry out. They would struggle over fractions, decimals, and percentages.

I am sure that there are socialist school teachers who work very hard, and are very dedicated to helping the children in their socialist school's godless classroom, but the above is the truth. I am certain that some teachers are very very smart, too. I know a few myself, but since on **average** teachers have low SAT scores what does that say about the really dumb teachers who are averaging out those who are smart?

Oh....And someone is bound to get in a snit because I called government owned and run schools socialist and godless. Well?...If anyone knows of a government owned and run school that is not godless in their worldview and not a socialist and single payer entitlement, please send me a link.

25 posted on 12/15/2011 8:09:17 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: Graybeard58

How much are her bennies worth, and what does she contribute toward them?


26 posted on 12/15/2011 8:11:57 AM PST by mewzilla (Santelli 2012)
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To: Lurker
What is her benefits package, pension, etc worth?

Ah, there's the rub. How many private sector workers even have defined benefit retirement plans anymore? Here where I live (People's Republic of Illinois) I run into a LOT of retired teachers still in their 50s.

27 posted on 12/15/2011 8:14:39 AM PST by Marathoner ("Government is not reason. Government is not eloquence. It is force." George Washington)
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To: Graybeard58

Reason I ask is because we have a 101 year old, God bless her, retired teacher in the family. And she’s been drawing a pension and health bennies for over 30 years. My guess is that those retirement bennies have cost far more than her lifetime salary.


28 posted on 12/15/2011 8:16:04 AM PST by mewzilla (Santelli 2012)
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To: Marathoner

I too am a resident of the PRoI and I’m sick of the whining from these public sector leeches. If you’re not satisfied with the pay package quit and do something else.


29 posted on 12/15/2011 8:39:36 AM PST by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: wintertime
..And someone is bound to get in a snit because I called government owned and run schools socialist and godless. Well?...If anyone knows of a government owned and run school that is not godless in their worldview and not a socialist and single payer entitlement, please send me a link.

What you said. I know there are a lot of fine people in the system, but the system is inherently rotten and Marxist to the core(Anyone remember the school kids somewhere singing a praise song to Barak Hussein Obama, mmm mmm mmm).

30 posted on 12/15/2011 8:45:20 AM PST by Marathoner ("Government is not reason. Government is not eloquence. It is force." George Washington)
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To: xzins
I know a local high school calculus teacher, though, who is among the best of the best. Former students in college and in engineering firms still call with tough problems.How many can do what this teacher can do?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Let's examine this above statement.

Socialist school teachers have the lowest SAT scores on campus. They have the lowest GRE scores, too. This is an average.

So...If this calculus teacher is brilliant, then somewhere out there in “The Land of Socialist Entitlement Schooling” is a really **DUMB** teacher, or several less than average teachers, who is leveling out this brilliant man's IQ, SAT, and GRE scores.

By the way, SAT, ACT, and GRE scores correlate well with basic IQ.

31 posted on 12/15/2011 10:26:10 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: Marathoner
I know there are a lot of fine people in the system,
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I know a good number of them, too. Very sweet, Very dedicated. A few very smart. All of them Democrats.

Lenin had a name for them: Useful Idiot.

32 posted on 12/15/2011 10:31:41 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: wintertime

Brilliant And also an extremely staunch conservative.


33 posted on 12/15/2011 10:40:52 AM PST by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True Supporters of our Troops PRAY for their VICTORY!)
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To: Zakeet

I am a former private school teacher and I can tell you that public school teachers (in Texas) make at least twice as much as private school teachers. With a master’s degree and 12 years teaching experience, I still didn’t make even close to what public school, first year teachers, no graduate degree made... None of our teachers did.


34 posted on 12/15/2011 10:42:18 AM PST by DrewsMum
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To: Thank You Rush
Why are teachers considered state workers? Their salaries certainly aren’t paid by the state, are they?

In California, fully one half of the budget, 50%, goes to Education. Yes, all of those teachers are paid for out of the California State Budget.

35 posted on 12/15/2011 10:55:05 AM PST by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (We be fooked.)
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To: xzins
Brilliant And also an extremely staunch conservative.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Government schools are godless in their worldview. Just to cooperate in the classroom and with assignments the child must think and reason godlessly. How can anyone who supports, upholds, and willingly establishes **that** be conservative or brilliant?

Godless government K-12 schools are a socialist, single payer, entitlement. Merely by attending children risk learning to be comfortable with their socialist, tuition-free, single payer, entitlement. Well?...If government can take money from a neighbor for tuition-free school, why not use that power to get **lots** of socialist goodies from their neighbor? So?...How can anyone who willingly supports, upholds, and establishes that lifelong lesson be conservative or brilliant?

Government socialist entitlement K-12 schools trash every First Amendment Right. Simply by attending children risk learning to be comfortable little prisoners of the state and compliant and obedient serfs to government overseers. How can **that** be conservative or brilliant?

You might argue that he sneaks in a little conservatism or Christian belief into his socialist classroom. If he is then he is teaching an important lesson: Conservatives and Christians are **SNEAKY**!

It is now plainly **evident** that government socialist entitlement schooling is leading our nation down into the hell of tyranny. I doubt that our nation will survive another generation of this indoctrination.

Personally, I will not have a K-12 socialist school teacher for a friend.

36 posted on 12/15/2011 12:00:20 PM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: wintertime
Personally, I will not have a K-12 socialist school teacher for a friend.

Would you have a K-12 Conservative school teacher as a friend?

37 posted on 12/15/2011 12:03:11 PM PST by Osage Orange (HE HATE ME)
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To: Osage Orange
Would you have a K-12 Conservative school teacher as a friend?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

No! If they haven't been fired yet, then they are Useful Idiots.

Unless they are willing to be promptly fired, they are **WILLINGLY** establishing, upholding, and supporting the following:

**teaching children to think and reason godlessly
**teaching children to be comfortable with taking their neighbor's money for socialist tuition-free schooling, ( Hey! Why not lots of “free” goodies?)
** teaching children to be comfortable with government trashing their First Amendment Rights
** teaching chidlren to be compliant and servile toadies to government functionaries.

If they attempting to sneak in a little Judeo Christian belief or conservatism, they are teaching the children that conservatives and God-fearing people are SNEAKY!

One more thing:

When sweet little Teacher Honey Bun ( who loves her cat) teaches in the government school, naive parents may wrongly believe that their child's socialist K-12 school can't be **that** bad. Hey! sweet, little Teacher Honey Bun works there.

One more generation of future voters indoctrinated in our nation's socialist and godless schools and this nation is **done**! The frog will be boiled. Stick a fork in it an offer it up with salt and butter that costs more than $400 a pound.

38 posted on 12/15/2011 12:15:53 PM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: wintertime
No! If they haven't been fired yet, then they are Useful Idiots.

Okay.....noted.

39 posted on 12/15/2011 12:19:58 PM PST by Osage Orange (HE HATE ME)
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To: wintertime
**teaching children to think and reason godlessly

Gee, teaching them Latin Hymns and the first 3 verses of "Silent Night" for the annual Christmas Chorus Concert is "godless?" WOW, I never knew.

**teaching children to be comfortable with taking their neighbor's money for socialist tuition-free schooling, ( Hey! Why not lots of “free” goodies?)

Teaching them that government can only acquire funding through taxation, and what that is, and explaining which taxes are "supposed" to go for certain things such as property taxes for education is teaching them about getting "free goodies?" I never knew.

There is much you and I have actually agreed on over the years, but one thing I will never agree with is the absolute broad brush you use in your crusade to have everyone conform to your way of thinking. Your extremism will be your downfall. You do more damage than good with it, just like all extremists.

40 posted on 12/15/2011 1:36:57 PM PST by Gabz (Democrats for Voldemort.)
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To: Gabz
Re: Christmas carols in Latin and “Silent Night”

Gabz....Send me a link.

Also....When did it become a conservative or Christian principle or value to **force** Christianity on other people's children and to **force** taxpayers to pay for it? That's conservative? That's Christian?

Also...It isn't religiously neutral for the Christian children! A few sprinkles of Christmas cheer does not make a godless school into a God-centered one. Chalk one up to “diversity” ( cultures being equal, you see. /s ) Unfortunately, the children risk learning to be casual and lukewarm in their relationship to God. Do you know what Christ does with the lukewarm? He spits them out of His mouth! When did it become a conservative or Christian principle to **force** children into a situation where they risk learning to be lukewarm and casual about their faith, or to **force** taxpayers to pay for this religious abomination?

Socialist K-12 schooling is a tuition-free, entitlement, and socialist goody. Why not use that government power to acquire LOTS of free entitlement goodies? That is the lesson children risk learning when they attend their local socialist school. FDR was not an accident. He was the result of one to three generations of voters learning to be comfortable with socialism by attending compulsory socialist schools.

As for my “extremism”, I have been richly rewarded in personal satisfaction to see my ideas, even my exact wording and phrasing, picked up by the mainstream conservative media. Why? Because it is true.

Personally....I think it is time that our nation's socialist K-12 teachers explain themselves. They need to come up with justifications for why they would support teaching in schools where children must think and reason godlessly just to cooperate in the classroom. How could it possibly be otherwise? Maybe you could explain this to me? Why would they hand out textbooks and assignments that support and uphold a godless worldview? Who in their right mind would do that to another parent's child and force taxpayers to pay for it? When did this become conservative or Christian?

Personally...I am at the point that I will not have a teacher from one of our nation's K-12 socialist schools as a friend. Period! Simple! I am done!

But...Gee! Thanks for concern about my downfall. I trust that your concern is genuine.

And...If I am painting with a broad brush send me links to government owned and run K-12 schools that are God-centered (that means every minute of every school day, because that is the very definition of God-centered!). Send me a link to a government owned and run K-12 school that isn't a socialist entitlement tuition-free goody. I have asked these questions many time. No one has ever sent a link.

41 posted on 12/15/2011 2:15:11 PM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: wintertime

The teacher does upper level math. If it’s anything like the classes I had, we didn’t discuss anything else. I was always working hard just to get the math down. No time for politics.

It makes no more sense to assume a teacher is a sell-out liberal because they receive a taxpayer funded check, than it does to assume a soldier is a sell-out liberal because he receives a taxpayer funded check.


42 posted on 12/15/2011 3:32:43 PM PST by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True Supporters of our Troops PRAY for their VICTORY!)
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To: xzins
It makes no more sense to assume a teacher is a sell-out liberal because they receive a taxpayer funded check, than it does to assume a soldier is a sell-out liberal because he receives a taxpayer funded check.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Am I to asume that you are a graduate of a college of education? Is **this** what they are teaching in the nation's colleges of education? Huh?

A fundamental responsibility of government is to provide for the national defense. It is one of the major reasons we have government and that government is necessary.

Education is not a fundamental responsibility of government.

43 posted on 12/15/2011 3:40:32 PM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: wintertime
Re: Christmas carols in Latin and “Silent Night”

Gabz....Send me a link.

First off, I did not say Christmas Carols in Latin, I said one Latin hymn. Is your reading comprehension failing that badly?

Secondly, how, pray tell am I supposed to send you a link to a concert held in the school last week? You are being utterly ridiculous. Either you believe me it occurred or you don't. If you don't, that is your problem, not mine, but I was there and you weren't and my daughter is in that chorus.

Also....When did it become a conservative or Christian principle or value to **force** Christianity on other people's children and to **force** taxpayers to pay for it? That's conservative? That's Christian?

What force? No one is forced to be in chorus, and no one is forced to attend the concerts. As to the taxpayers, well if the standing room only crowd is any judgement, I would venture to say no one had much problem with it. It is well known about this class and there is always a waiting list to get into it. I don't think it would even be offered if there was a problem with it. Do you?

Guess what? Not everyone has your God centered look on life. You have become so fanatical that you are not even paying attention. People are capable of having varying different circles in which they interact that may or may not overlap which have no bearing on their faith in God. I have one circle made up of the parents of many of my daughter's school friends, another circle are from my church, and yet another is from my leisure time. There are overlaps and all are enjoyable and have no bearing on any of us when it comes to our faith. You give our children far too little credit, but that is your personal problem.

Socialist K-12 schooling is a tuition-free, entitlement, and socialist goody.

No, it is not tuition free because it is paid for with tax dollars. What part of children being taught that did you not understand?

I really don't know why I bother saying anything to you because you refuse to consider everything is not as you see it in your extremist tunnel vision view.

Personally...I am at the point that I will not have a teacher from one of our nation's K-12 socialist schools as a friend. Period! Simple! I am done!

EEK - what a horrid attitude. I'm shuddering at that. What a thing to teach children. I would never do such a thing, deciding someone is unworthy of your "friendship" because of their job? How elitist of you.

But...Gee! Thanks for concern about my downfall. I trust that your concern is genuine.

What is genuine is my belief your extremism will be your downfall. You have your followers and psychofants(spelling intentional,) but your extremist attacks will not bring about any changes.

44 posted on 12/15/2011 3:42:09 PM PST by Gabz (Democrats for Voldemort.)
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To: wintertime

It does not matter that defense is a legitimate role of national government and that education is a questionable role of national government. (Since powers not specifically assigned to the fed are left to the state or to the people, that makes education an issue that locals can enact if they so desire.)

A person who works in either should not be assumed to be a sell-out just because they receive a government check.


45 posted on 12/15/2011 3:44:19 PM PST by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True Supporters of our Troops PRAY for their VICTORY!)
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To: xzins
The teacher does upper level math. If it’s anything like the classes I had, we didn’t discuss anything else. I was always working hard just to get the math down. No time for politics.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

By upper level math do you mean Calculus for science and math majors? This is the first time that I have heard that Calculus for science and math majors was required for education majors. Calculus, by the way, is a fundamental gateway course to upper levels of science and math. Personally I don't consider Calculus to be “advanced”.

Personally, I think all teachers in our socialist K-12 schools should be required to take the **same** calculus I course as science and math majors ( sitting side by side with them). No, most teachers do not need calculus for the subjects they teach but it will assure two things: 1) they are smart enough to be worthy of the job, 2) they won't communicate their math phobia to their students.

46 posted on 12/15/2011 3:55:48 PM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: xzins
Well?.....Since you use the military example then I suppose you support drafting teachers to work in the government schools, imprisoning them, and/or shooting them if they are deserters.

Does that help you understand the difference between being a soldier and a government teacher in our nation's socialist schools?

47 posted on 12/15/2011 4:19:55 PM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: xzins
A person who works in either should not be assumed to be a sell-out just because they receive a government check.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

By the way, I have never used the expression “sell out”. I merely state that working in a government owned and run socialist K-12 school is in complete conflict with conservative and Christian values and principles.

Do I need to restate the reasons again?

48 posted on 12/15/2011 4:22:11 PM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: Gabz
How elitist of you.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Tsk! Tsk! You are name calling and being personal in your posts. This remark is direct at me **personally**. However...I do not report these to the moderator is it much better for them to remain for all to see.

But....Actually, I take your comment as a compliment. Those who have sound principles are elitist. Think about it. If a person doesn't have principles they might as well roll around in the mud with the pigs.

49 posted on 12/15/2011 4:29:57 PM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: wintertime

Name calling? No, I leave that up to you. I made reference to something you said, which is not a personal attack no matter what you choose to think.

I do find it rather amusing that is the only comment you could make about anything I stated. Interesting.


50 posted on 12/15/2011 4:36:10 PM PST by Gabz (Democrats for Voldemort.)
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