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Many seriously ill get too much care: docs, nurses
Yahoo Health/ ^ | 12/27/11

Posted on 12/27/2011 7:06:37 PM PST by EBH

The most common problem was "too much care," followed by the sense that other patients would have benefited more from intensive care, according to Dr. Ruth Piers of Ghent University Hospital in Belgium and colleagues.

The researchers note in the Journal of the American Medical Association that other studies have found ICU physicians often feel they are treating patients whose chances of survival are slim to nothing.

While it's unclear if the new findings apply in the U.S., one recent survey showed nearly half of American primary care physicians believe their patients are getting too much medical care (see Reuters Health story of September 26, 2011 at http://reut.rs/qxdQRm).

In the latest survey, providers were less likely to feel bad about their care when nurses were involved in treatment and end-of-life decisions.

"Integrating the perspectives of nurses and the physicians may lead not only to greater mutual understanding with fewer conflicts, but also to better end-of-life decision making and care for the patients and their families," Piers and her colleagues write.

(Excerpt) Read more at health.yahoo.net ...


TOPICS: Conspiracy; Health/Medicine
KEYWORDS: deathcare; deathpanels; endoflifedecisions; euthanasia; healthcarerationing; obamaare; rationing; ruthpiers; socializedmedicine
Studies on this stuff...worried yet?
1 posted on 12/27/2011 7:06:43 PM PST by EBH
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To: EBH
Christian Scientists are not always wrong.

Strong is the Force of the placebo effect.

2 posted on 12/27/2011 7:09:55 PM PST by Paladin2
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To: EBH; All

‘Things I learned from my patients’

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=257985&page=3

(oldest posts, page 1. estimate the costs to you, the taxpayer, after reading a few pages)

“If you feel “down” call 911 and come on in at 5 am... especially if you have been seen in EDs over 100 times this year, been blacklisted at EVERY single psyciatric hospital in the area and even the probate judge refuses to listen to your whining and commit you any more... when discharged walk to the EMS station up the road and ask to be taken to another hospital for eval, then when they walk you back down the street act shocked and leave. “


3 posted on 12/27/2011 7:19:58 PM PST by dynachrome ("Our forefathers didn't bury their guns. They buried those that tried to take them.")
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To: EBH
Pareto's 80/20 principle???
4 posted on 12/27/2011 7:22:42 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: EBH
"Too much care" eh? I remember when a nurse thought that my husband was getting "too much care". When I asked her a second time for a blanket, (he was going into shock) I was informed by Ms paper pusher that she "had other patients".

She was rather shocked when I leaned over the counter and snapped, "Look here Barbie, I'm not married to any of your other patients. Where are the blankets?"

She turned red, the lady behind her laughed and said, "I'll show you where the warmer is hon."

5 posted on 12/27/2011 7:23:28 PM PST by Harmless Teddy Bear (*Philosophy lesson 117-22b: Anyone who demands to be respected is undeserving of it.*)
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To: EBH
Further mental preparation for ObamaCare.

You can group this one with the story that women don't need mammograms as often as previously recommended.

Conditioning the masses to believe that they are getting the best care necessary while rationing and cutting back services.

6 posted on 12/27/2011 7:28:05 PM PST by Washi (Surviving the Zombie Apocalypse, one head-shot at a time.)
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To: EBH

Let the complainers tell us at what age they will decline which care.
Then put it in a signed contract and leave me alone.


7 posted on 12/27/2011 7:38:30 PM PST by G Larry ("I dream of a day when a man is judged by the content of his Character.")
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To: dynachrome
LOL about that ER site. I've seen all of those patients at one time or another.

A real conversation:

Patient:" I'm having trouble pooping, and I'm losing weight over the past 2 months.

Me: "When is the last time you saw a doctor?"

Patient: "27 years ago".

8 posted on 12/27/2011 7:39:09 PM PST by boop (I hate hippies and dopeheads. Just hate them. ...Ernest Borgnine)
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To: EBH
One of the reasons to change our immigration laws to prohibit medical personnel from Nederland, Belgium and Switzerland from coming to this country is their attitude toward their patients.

The cult of euthanasia is deeply in-bedded in those countries to a degree that their medical researchers, primary care physicians and nurses, and others in that industry can't think outside of having their patients simply die and get out the way.

I'm sure it's the same with the crowd in Oregon. We need to keep these people OUT of our local medical resource community.

9 posted on 12/27/2011 7:39:49 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: EBH
RE: Studies on this snuff...worried yet?

You darn tootin'

The researchers note in the Journal of the American Medical Association that other studies have found ICU physicians often feel they are treating patients whose chances of survival are slim to nothing . . . nearly half of American primary care physicians believe their patients are getting too much medical care

I knew that Pelosi was behind this, Palliative End of Life Optimum Serenity Initiative (PELOSI).

An ode to Daschle-Obama-Hillary! (DOH!) healthkare

Poem inspired by prominent Democrats Tom "We need to be more like European healthcare" Daschle, former governor of Colorado Richard "Die and get out of the way" Lamm, and Hillary!

Health care for all the world's humanity
but none for thee
seriously ill American elderly.
Die already!

Very few Baby Boomers will survive long under DOH! Washington expects this will solve the Social Security funding problem. That's the plan.

10 posted on 12/27/2011 7:44:16 PM PST by WilliamofCarmichael (If modern America's Man on Horseback is out there, Get on the damn horse already!)
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To: EBH
half of American primary care physicians believe their patients are getting too much medical care

...but like collecting the pay for it.

11 posted on 12/27/2011 8:05:36 PM PST by ApplegateRanch (Islam: A Satanically Transmitted Disease spread by unprotected intimate contact with the Koranus)
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear
Most hospitals have them in the room. Look around next time. Those high paid nurses have to spend extra time typing everything into a computer. Besides they have to work 12 hours for three days so they can work at another hospital for 36 more hours. Have some compassion for these bastards.
12 posted on 12/27/2011 8:11:44 PM PST by Domangart
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear

It took me >24 hr to convince the ER that my appendix needed to be removed. The surgeons asked why I waited so long....


13 posted on 12/27/2011 8:34:21 PM PST by Paladin2
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To: EBH

And these people, who use excessive amounts of care, are the reason the rest of us have to pay so much even if we require very little.


14 posted on 12/27/2011 8:44:39 PM PST by COgamer
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To: Domangart
They didn't have them in the ER cubicle. I did look around. She was not typing things into a computer.

In the 16 days my husband spent in the hospital every other nurse we met was great. Yeah, he was that sick. Sorry, Barbie was not doing her job that night and is lucky that all she got was a minor jab from me. The other nurse know it and told me to come to her if he needed anything else.

As to the rest they work 12 hour days by choice so they can have four days off and I have yet to meet one that worked at two hospitals for a total of 72 hours. In most places that would violate union rules. Maybe your area is different.

15 posted on 12/27/2011 8:49:29 PM PST by Harmless Teddy Bear (*Philosophy lesson 117-22b: Anyone who demands to be respected is undeserving of it.*)
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To: Paladin2
This was his second time back in the ER in 24 hours. Yep appendix as well but couldn't get them to believe it until they reluctantly did a CAT scan. After all the pain was not in the right place!

Darn thing burst as they were taking it out. Abscess, cellulitis, CDC, ain't we got fun?

Surgeons know the most interesting cuss words.

16 posted on 12/27/2011 9:01:18 PM PST by Harmless Teddy Bear (*Philosophy lesson 117-22b: Anyone who demands to be respected is undeserving of it.*)
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear

Quite similar. I went home around midnight to get some sleep and had Mrs. P2 drop me off again in the morning. Finally I talked to the ER head and we agreed to get a CAT to exclude the appendix possibility. Around 5pm, things finally got going. This was at a tertiary, teaching hospital.


17 posted on 12/27/2011 9:22:51 PM PST by Paladin2
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If you are past 65, do everything you can to stay away from hospitals. Even now. But it is about to become much worse. Obama talked about it during the 2008 campaign. The daughter of a woman in her nineties asked Obama if the state of the health of the very elderly would be taken into account in deciding whether to provide the full standard of care. Almost pleading, she said her mother was fully alert. Obama, clearly enjoying the prospect of the president playing God, did little to comfort the woman, saying that tough decisions will have to be made. This tape exists. McCain should have used it. It was chilling and ghoulish. The democrats cut 500 dollars from Medicare. They endorse stabbing fully formed babies through the head even as they leave the womb. Do you think they will hesitate to kill off the elderly to make room for the illegals who will vote for them?.
18 posted on 12/27/2011 9:37:14 PM PST by Godwin1
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear
****She was rather shocked when I leaned over the counter and snapped, "Look here Barbie, I'm not married to any of your other patients. Where are the blankets?"*****

As an old retired nurse, I just fell in love with you...people need to speak up when such dumb things are said....The only thing is it should be followed up with a letter of compaliant to the Director of Nursing...I have knows some bitches that have no business working with patients...they were few but like any other business, their are jerks everywhere,

19 posted on 12/27/2011 11:34:45 PM PST by goat granny
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear
****She was rather shocked when I leaned over the counter and snapped, "Look here Barbie, I'm not married to any of your other patients. Where are the blankets?"*****

As an old retired nurse, I just fell in love with you...people need to speak up when such dumb things are said....The only thing is it should be followed up with a letter of compaliant to the Director of Nursing...I have knows some bitches that have no business working with patients...they were few but like any other business, their are jerks everywhere,

Just got error in posting this hope it doesn't post twice..

20 posted on 12/27/2011 11:36:35 PM PST by goat granny
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To: EBH

I just had a spinal fusion and spent 4 days in the hospital. Wow..the care I received was great! The staff provided whatever I wanted and it didn’t take long to get it. As a matter of fact, I wrote a letter to the hospital praising the employees I came in contact with.


21 posted on 12/28/2011 1:12:21 AM PST by AnneDB (mark levin radio show; neurosurgeon calls radio show; obama health care)
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To: AnneDB

Lucky you. Either you are young or have great insurance.

Soon, a lot of things are going to change. It will be interesting say around 2015-2016 and 0bamacare is in full swing. Let’s see what they define as elderly?


22 posted on 12/28/2011 6:22:29 AM PST by EBH (God Humbles Nations, Leaders, and Peoples before He uses them for His Purpose)
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To: Washi

Yep!

But also note the article claims 50% of American doctors think their patients get too much care...

As doctors leave the medical field due to 0bamacare, expect that disgruntlement percentage to increase.


23 posted on 12/28/2011 6:24:41 AM PST by EBH (God Humbles Nations, Leaders, and Peoples before He uses them for His Purpose)
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To: COgamer

Is it the one’s needing excessive amounts of care or that they are demanding it, receiving it, and not paying for it?

I do believe there are two sides to this coin.

So what constitutes a waste of resources and doctor’s services?


24 posted on 12/28/2011 6:29:47 AM PST by EBH (God Humbles Nations, Leaders, and Peoples before He uses them for His Purpose)
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To: ApplegateRanch; WilliamofCarmichael
half of American primary care physicians believe their patients are getting too much medical care

That statement should scare the hell out us. The 50% level would equate out to how many left to die, left to go untreated etc? I am sure there is a static that can be extrapolated from that tidbit of information.

If half your physicians client base were declined care because what they wanted was considered excessive...what happens to the overall health of the client base?

25 posted on 12/28/2011 6:35:22 AM PST by EBH (God Humbles Nations, Leaders, and Peoples before He uses them for His Purpose)
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To: EBH

From the time I first heard that the government wanted to take over healthcare I thought to myself, we are screwed. It won’t be long and you will need to be an expert at self treatment because there will be no assurance you would be able to actually see a doctor. Decades later, I have not changed my mind one bit.


26 posted on 12/28/2011 7:09:50 AM PST by Dutch Boy
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To: EBH

If I were an energetic writer, I would pen a story where doctors and nurses who denied care, medicine or benefit of their oath, were each and every one afflicted with the ailments of those they let die. I’d call it “First, Do No Harm.”


27 posted on 12/28/2011 7:13:43 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: EBH

Liberals have absolutely no trouble lying on the results of expert opinion surveys to give them the results (political cover) they want as they exert government power to take over our bodies when we are sick to decide who to kill and who to keep alive.

They will turn medicine up-side-down and “doctors” will all agree with them on every survey. Nurses, too.


28 posted on 12/28/2011 10:23:09 AM PST by SaraJohnson
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To: Paladin2
Of all the things that require a long hospital stay a ruptured appendix should not be anywhere on the list in this day and age. But after it happened to us I was astounded by how many people had the same thing happened.

Always with the same, “your systems were atypical” reason given. If there are so many people running around with atypical systems maybe they should change what they are looking for when it comes to appendicitis

29 posted on 12/28/2011 11:40:19 AM PST by Harmless Teddy Bear (*Philosophy lesson 117-22b: Anyone who demands to be respected is undeserving of it.*)
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To: EBH

If they’re including facelifts, breast implants, Viagra for 20 year olds; and ‘treatment’ for colds, mild flu, drippy sinuses, and sideways farts, etc. as “medical care”, it may not be quite so dire.


30 posted on 12/28/2011 11:48:27 AM PST by ApplegateRanch (Islam: A Satanically Transmitted Disease spread by unprotected intimate contact with the Koranus)
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To: goat granny
I try to be nice to people even dumb ones but when it comes to safety of my family the fangs come out.
31 posted on 12/28/2011 7:38:50 PM PST by Harmless Teddy Bear (*Philosophy lesson 117-22b: Anyone who demands to be respected is undeserving of it.*)
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