Skip to comments.Obama sending to Congress bill to triple TRICARE premiums
Posted on 02/29/2012 10:09:18 AM PST by pabianice
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1st off, the retirement “pay” and “benefits” are a retainer. Once you “retire”, a stroke of the pen and your back active duty just like what happened immediately after 9/11. The rest of your life your eligible to be activated and must report for active duty. They provide healthcare to offer incentive to stay ready for such an event. I do. At 58 I can do more physically than when I retired 20 years ago because it is a responsibility I take seriously until the last day when I’m called up by my true Commander in Chief.
“I retired in 1982 and am by no means a millionaire. My retirement pay at that time was $600/mo. On that I also had to pay income taxes.”
If you make $10,000 per year in benefits, at 1% interest in a bank, you would have to have $1,000,000 to earn that interest.
You can adjust from there if you make more, or if you can earn more interest, but the point is clear.....to get the benefits that you have now, you would need to have well north of $1M today.
I don’t understand your point. What does a bank have to do with the benefits that I earned? If I had invested in a 401K or other civilian retirement plan, how much would I draw? On the pay I received, I couldn’t afford to invest in anything except food and clothing. During my 20 years, I qualified for welfare, but got second jobs instead. Now, I’me being told that I don’t deserve the benefits that I worked for. I just don’t understand your reasoning.
If it's available at the base Pharmacy, then yes. Typically generic although there are rare instances where generics aren't as effective as name brand (Synthroid e.g.) and one is sent to a local pharma.
That being said, I don't believe it's too high a price to pay for someone who did much to guarantee your right to bellyache about it. Do you?
Btw, I'm a retired USAF E-7 and we pay deductibles and co-pays quite consistently as we're constantly being referred to off-base physicians.
I went into a public-'ouse to get a pint o'beer, The publican 'e up an' sez, "We serve no red-coats here." The girls be'ind the bar they laughed an' giggled fit to die, I outs into the street again an' to myself sez I:
O it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, go away"; But it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins," when the band begins to play, The band begins to play, my boys, the band begins to play, O it's "Thank you, Mr. Atkins," when the band begins to play.
I went into a theatre as sober as could be, They gave a drunk civilian room, but 'adn't none for me; They sent me to the gallery or round the music-'alls, But when it comes to fightin', Lord! they'll shove me in the stalls!
For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, wait outside"; But it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide, The troopship's on the tide, my boys, the troopship's on the tide, O it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide.
Yes, makin' mock o' uniforms that guard you while you sleep Is cheaper than them uniforms, an' they're starvation cheap; An' hustlin' drunken soldiers when they're goin' large a bit Is five times better business than paradin' in full kit.
Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy how's yer soul?" But it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll, The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll, O it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll.
We aren't no thin red 'eroes, nor we aren't no blackguards too, But single men in barricks, most remarkable like you; An' if sometimes our conduck isn't all your fancy paints: Why, single men in barricks don't grow into plaster saints;
While it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, fall be'ind," But it's "Please to walk in front, sir," when there's trouble in the wind, There's trouble in the wind, my boys, there's trouble in the wind, O it's "Please to walk in front, sir," when there's trouble in the wind.
You talk o' better food for us, an' schools, an' fires an' all: We'll wait for extry rations if you treat us rational. Don't mess about the cook-room slops, but prove it to our face The Widow's Uniform is not the soldier-man's disgrace.
For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Chuck him out, the brute!" But it's "Saviour of 'is country," when the guns begin to shoot; An' it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please; But Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool - you bet that Tommy sees!
“Now, Ime being told that I dont deserve the benefits that I worked for. I just dont understand your reasoning.”
I’m telling you that in order to earn in interest what you get in military benefits, you would have to have a very large sum of money today. It exceeds $1M.
What I am saying is that no matter where you stand on the issue, a compensation package that includes comprehensive medical coverage, plus a monthly stipend that can be a little or a lot, depending on your rank requires a multi-decade taxpayer commitment from taxpayers who often cannot afford their own basic medical care.
The bottom line is that we’re broke and can’t pay what everyone thinks they are going to get for government, state, municipal, and military benefits. When will it stop? When we can no longer borrow to finance it all - whenever that happens - which could technically happen any time, given the size of deficits around the globe.
Do you have the numbers to prove that out, cause I'd like to see them.
I'm a retired E-7, make about $1400 a month before taxes, SBP, etc. I don't qualify for the GI Bill (long story).
I agree in principle that the system has become unsustainable, but it isn't because of the benefit packages that are offered as incentive to fill the ranks.
The douchebags in DC are responsible for squandering this country's wealth and they are pulling a typical liberal tactic, take away pay and benefits from those that actually contribute to our society vs. those leeches who suck at the teat.
I don't believe that our society is placing the military member "above" anyone, I see where people appreciate that there are still rough men and women willing to exercise violence on our behalf to keep us safe and work to ensure our freedom.
I think I see where you’re coming from, but not in full agreement about the $1M premise.
The USA, by virtue of the Constitution, accepted that there would be costs to “provide for the common defense”.
I don’t see the rest of the spending this country engages in anywhere in there.
That being said, should there be a revisit to the amount retirees pay? Probably, but this tactic is nothing more than spitting in the face of those who are “locked in”. All so that they are ultimately forced into 0bamacare since they would have no other option. Which is the ultimate goal here.
So in other words, as it relates to spending, what’s the diff? The gov’t pays either way.
The present value of $1400 per month, assuming 1.2% interest per year is achievable for 40 years is $658,710 if you got no COLA ever again in those 40 years. (sinking fund balance = 0 at the end)
If you add in $750 per month for insurance for you and spouse (it can cost more it can cost less, but we’re picking a figure here) then we’re talking about:
1400+750, which after 40 years is $1,011,591 at 1.2% interest rates in a bank - assuming no COLA, and no increase in insurance premium.
All US military personnel are by far more deserving of FREE medical benefits than any DC elected or appointed POS official.
“I think I see where youre coming from, but not in full agreement about the $1M premise.”
I just posted the numbers for you. You can argue either way, but you are substantially on your way to $1M if not over it.
Again, I do not know what the answer is. But there is no argument over the basic premise - even if you vary the assumptions either way (higher interest will reduce the amount, COLA’s will increase the amount, medical inflation will increase the amount)
I think that the political will to do anything is non-existent - so your benefits will be eroded slowly, or quickly, until they are no longer what you expected them to be.
How many men and women walked into a recruiter’s office and thought: “Hot dam*! These lifetime medical benefits are sa-weet!”
Next to none. Joining the Military is a big “what did I just do?” to many enlistees. I served and was honorably discharged, and married a Soldier. My Soldier still serves. He is 42 year old and has a hearing aid from explosions. He is a combat engineer. He needs a hearing aid on the other ear, but doesn’t want two. The meniscus (spelled wrong, I am sure) in his knee has been torn and repaired 2 times, as he was Airborne (hooah) for many years. He has had Lyme disease, from being out in the woods and field for weeks months years, and having ticks on him. The Military docs thought his swollen knee, at one point, was another knee injury, but it was hot and swollen from Lyme disease.
Korea, Iraq, Afghanistan, Bosnia, Sardina, Norway, Germany x2, Drill Sgt for 3 years. Route Clearance, which was in Afghanistan. He has disarmed (don’t know the “real” word) IEDs without protective gear. He got one of his ranks pinned/frocked, replacing another Soldier, who got his eyes and face severely injured in garrison while disposing of ordanance. The Soldier lost his eyes. My husband took his place.
Our daughter will graduate with honors this year, and we will have to let her enroll in college and be hundreds, if not thousands of miles from her, as we can and will be moved anywhere in the world. We don’t want to be that far from her, she is our beloved daughter. Yet we have no choice.
And we have been relatively lucky. When I gave birth to our sons in a German hospital, it was free. Of course I was alone for the birth of our middle son, as my husband was clearing mines, minefields,etc, for Bill Clinton in Bosnia.
I know most women would crawl on their hands and knees through broken glass to give birth alone in a German hospital while their husband was clearing mines, as it was free...oh, wait a minute! The average female illegal alien, teen mom, single mom with no husband because she likes to be a hoe, they get it for free, all their medical care. Why on earth would anyone think my husband and our family deserve the benefits we were TOLD WERE OURS FOR SERVICE to America? We were really damn stupid to go thru all this to have anal intercourse with no lubrication from a nasty, ignorant, Kenyan m.f. and all the jerks who say “Sorry! No money left! Guess you pay now.”
My husband runs 6 miles a day most days, and has to be fit and trim. He’s not a fatty riding the Iraq cannon fodder train. When is the last time you ran 6 miles? He does it to remain a Soldier, because it is a privilege to serve, and they can and will take his job from him for being overweight. And still, after getting up very early, and pushing himself to run after punishing his body for 20 plus years, he still doesn’t deserve his bennies? And he’s going to be a multi-millionaire? I have lived in and around Military communities, and I have never met a retired enlisted Soldier who remotely resembled a millionaire, much less a multi- millionaire.
And please don’t think I am complaining. I am so proud of my husband, and our Soldiers, Sailors, Marines, and Airmen all deserve the benefits they were promised when they enlisted or were commissioned.
I swear people who served and got out before retirement and mad because they don’t get the medical benefits retirees do, and want to see our retirees stripped of these benefits out of jealousy.
Im telling you that in order to earn in interest what you get in military benefits, you would have to have a very large sum of money today. It exceeds $1M.
And just how would you suggest that a enlisted person in the military get the money to invest in order to get that $1M?
When I retired as a E-6, I was earning $1200/mo before taxes. I had a wife and 2 children. A civilian doing the same job (FBI Special Agent) earned twice as much and didn’t live or work under the same conditions. My cost for Tricare is zero because I am over 65 and was required to sign up for Medicare which costs 3 times as much as I was paying for Tricare before I turned 65. Tricare now only pays for what Medicare doesn’t cover. I’m sorry if you can’t understand that military benefits is not available to everyone, however everyone has the choice of going in the the military or now (except for certain persons).
We’re talking lifetime with a lot of assumptions (reasonable).
But one of the main points is that the military retirees are being singled out here by this administration. Note that they aren’t going after the civil service or other gov’t folks.
I harbor little hope (lord I have come to loathe that word) about what my future or our son’s future holds any longer. SS, military retirement, etc. I’m working to not have to count on them.
“I swear people who served and got out before retirement and mad because they dont get the medical benefits retirees do, and want to see our retirees stripped of these benefits out of jealousy.”
This may be part of it. It may also be that we can’t afford it.
“SS, military retirement, etc. Im working to not have to count on them.”
If they are going to be there, we have to radically reduce our government size and spending immediately.
I don’t think that is going to happen. You are wise to work to not count on promises from government.
This is an education process. More people have to understand that whatever they expect from government, they will have to make do with a lot less - because not doing so will mean they get nothing.
Nobody, not the GOP, not democrats, not any politician will discuss what you and I just discussed rationally.
Somebody needs to start explaining how we get out of this mess - or start rationalizing how we simply collapse everything and start over.
“And just how would you suggest that a enlisted person in the military get the money to invest in order to get that $1M?
When I retired as a E-6, I was earning $1200/mo before taxes.”
Excellent question. They have to take the $1M from the taxpayer. The taxpayer also has to be willing to give it to you.
Rather than tell the military retiree, the federal retiree, or anyone else who gets a government benefit check “No, you can’t have it” and also to avoid having the taxpayer tell the government “No, you can’t have it” the government elected to borrow $15 Trillion over the past 30 years or so.
Soon “No you can’t have it” will be the refrain heard from the folks who used to loan us money.
Then the government will simply print the money it wants to spend - and we will all soon have nothing.
Nobody, not the GOP, not democrats, not any politician will discuss what you and I just discussed rationally.
Somebody needs to start explaining how we get out of this mess - or start rationalizing how we simply collapse everything and start over."
The "conditioning" of the sheeple has been pretty damn thorough.
FRiend, I am sorry you cannot afford your insurance. I really wish America had not elected Obama. I feel he is trying to kill us all, in one way or another.
But my husband and I have no rich parents. We have no college degrees. We have only the little we have scraped out together for the last 24 years, raising 3 kids on one paycheck. I homeschool our youngest, who has autism.
If they take our benefits away, which they are, and will, we wasted alot of time. We have had to PCS in our daughter’s 9th and 11th grade years. It was very hard for her. We do it and did it to serve America, but also to maintain my husband’s career and what benefits he has earned.
Again, I am sorry you cannot afford insurance. We gave up alot to keep our insurance. We had to weigh our options, and we always chose to stay Active Duty, b/c we at least could have a steady benefit package. We are slaves to the whim of Congress and the jacka** in the White House, but we have medical.
Well, we will have medical until retirement. Then we will be with the rest of the retirees, paying the gov for the benefits the Soldier has already earned.
“FRiend, I am sorry you cannot afford your insurance. I really wish America had not elected Obama. I feel he is trying to kill us all, in one way or another.”
Ma’am, I’m not the issue. I’ll get by one way or the other, it is the folks that are less fortunate than me that I am concerned about, and I’m fairly fortunate.
But you encapsulate the problem nicely “He is trying to kill us all, in one way or another” - which is another way of saying we are all in the same boat.
We all have to accept less from our government and re-learn the God given freedoms our founders recognized.
Every dollar spent by government has to be taken by government from someone who worked very hard for it. Now it’s gotten to the point where we have to take from those who are not even born and working yet.
The USA promised that it would provide free health care to it's honorably retired service members and their dependents.
They have already walked that one back.
I have no doubt that they will soon decide that they don't want to pay retirement either and cut them off. After all contracts don't mean anything. Unless you are member of a union. Then you must receive the best of everything. After all you endured air conditioned offices and the horrible threat of paper cuts while in service for your country.
Those military slackers just spent 27 out of 30 days in the field, were on call 24/7, jumped out of airplanes and slept in the mud for 20 years. One can hardly compare the two.
You don't see lines at the recruiting office. If you want to cut some benefits look at medicaid and welfare. But stay the hell off our back
“If you want to cut some benefits look at medicaid and welfare. But stay the hell off our back “
Who exactly is “our” in “our back”?
Have any actual numbers to back this up?
I don't know of any retired military who is a "defacto millionaire". Especially Enlisted who make up the majority of the military.
I'd like to add: being forced to take anthrax shots and take PB pills (daily) back when nobody knew what the dangers were... we STILL don't. Being exposed to chemical weapons that were being destroyed, and breathing smoke from oil well fires for DAYS. Living on a diet of MRE's, Slim Jims, and Kool Aid for weeks at a time. Zero personal hygiene facilities. Sleep deprivation to the point that soldiers were eating the instant coffee to stay alert.
Those are a few of my experiences, I'm sure many others endured worse. Most people wouldn't volunteer to endure those conditions for a million bucks, even without getting shot at.
Unlike the guys who did one enlistment and got out, the promises were made over and over and over again. At every reenlistment "interview", the promises were repeated so that the service member was reminded of just what he was giving up if he chose to ETS.
Yeah, we retirees are "multimillionaires" living our lifestyles of the rich and famous. We are not asking for an unearned entitlement, we ARE expecting payment for services rendered, as promised.
I see we have our 99%ers here, coming after us "rich folks", too.
Numbers posted in thread.
So, you should’ve volunteered also when you had the chance! Like me, I bet he deployed and really never got to be in one place for long during his 20 years, and in harms way. And all the holidays missed, special moments with kids, etc.....It was a promise that shouldn’t be taken away. Especially now for the guys that have done MULTIPLE deployements into the campaigns worldwide.
Every piece of $%#^ that hasn’t earned a cent for a “grateful nation” should have benefits cut before ANY military retiree benefits are cut. And whatever is cut should equally apply to every civilian/union/congress person.
Screw the moronic numbers game you’re spouting.
Cut off the rest of the freeloaders and entitlement whores before touching the benefits our veterans wholly deserve.
Whether or not we can afford that should not be questioned. It is a primary duty of our freaking government.
Start the cutting where it belongs and leave the military benefits alone. There is your “answer”.
“Screw the moronic numbers game youre spouting”
Still, the numbers are correct, so there you go.
And they’re pointless and useful only to those who are criminally insane, IMO.
Getting tired of the constant bad rap and ignorance about Federal employees.
That's a good deal.
We have to buy our own.
Almost $500 a month each with a $2k deductible.
It's the best deal available if you aren't in a employee group plan.
A family plan is in the same range. I’m an individual plan, not family.
Oh, look. He's now the Legislature too. Isn't that cute? He not only is the Executive Branch of the Government, he's writing the bills. Soon, we won't need judges either.
The present system gives things to some for free, at some cost to others, at great cost to many, and denies it on cost to many who must pay for others to get what they cannot afford for themselves.
It’s not pure communism, its not pure socialism. Perhaps its factional or front socialism, but when folks who pay for it all cannot afford it for themselves, they are going to vote for socialism.
Democrats are counting on that, and will probably get it or something close to it.
I agree its unfair, but it is even more unfair to force someone to pay for your insurance through oppressive taxation. We used to be able to borrow the money. That time is ending. The crony socialist war will leave nobody happy or well cared for. I have no easy answers, but neither do politicians or anyone else.
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