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Re-Examining the "Out of Africa" Theory and the Origin of Europeoids in Light of DNA Genealogy
scirp.org ^ | May 2012 | Anatole A. Klyosov, Igor L. Rozhanskii

Posted on 06/20/2012 2:19:55 PM PDT by Renfield

Seven thousand five hundred fifty-six (7556) haplotypes of 46 subclades in 17 major haplogroups were considered in terms of their base (ancestral) haplotypes and timespans to their common ancestors, for the purposes of designing of time-balanced haplogroup tree. It was found that African haplogroup A (originated 132,000 ± 12,000 years before present) is very remote time-wise from all other haplogroups, which have a separate common ancestor, named β-haplogroup, and originated 64,000 ± 6000 ybp. It includes a family of Europeoid (Caucasoid) haplogroups from F through T that originated 58,000 ± 5000 ybp. A downstream common ancestor for haplogroup A and β-haplogroup, coined the α-haplogroup emerged 160,000 ± 12,000 ybp. A territorial origin of haplogroups α- and β-remains unknown; however, the most likely origin for each of them is a vast triangle stretched from Central Europe in the west through the Russian Plain to the east and to Levant to the south. Haplogroup B is descended from β-haplogroup (and not from haplogroup A, from which it is very distant, and separated by as much as 123,000 years of “lateral” mutational evolution) likely migrated to Africa after 46,000 ybp. The finding that the Europeoid haplogroups did not descend from “African” haplogroups A or B is supported by the fact that bearers of the Europeoid haplogroups, as well as all non-African haplogroups do not carry either SNPs M91, P97, M31, P82, M23, M114, P262, M32, M59, P289, P291, P102, M13, M171, M118 (haplogroup A and its subclades SNPs) or M60, M181, P90 (haplogroup B), as it was shown recently in “Walk through Y” FTDNA Project (the reference is incorporated therein) on several hundred people from various haplogroups.


TOPICS: History; Science
KEYWORDS: africa; genetics; godsgravesglyphs; helixmakemineadouble
You can download the whole paper in .pdf format here:

http://www.scirp.org/journal/PaperDownload.aspx?FileName=AA20120200005_81998944.pdf&paperID=19566

1 posted on 06/20/2012 2:20:05 PM PDT by Renfield
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To: SunkenCiv; blam; Ernest_at_the_Beach

Ping


2 posted on 06/20/2012 2:21:53 PM PDT by Renfield (Turning apples into venison since 1999!)
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To: Renfield

ping


3 posted on 06/20/2012 2:25:25 PM PDT by CottShop (Scientific belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge)
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To: blam

Ping.


4 posted on 06/20/2012 2:27:59 PM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: Renfield
Professor Stephen Oppenheimer says that about 50% of Europeans can trace their DNA to a guy in northern Pakistan 46,000 years ago and this 50% made their way to Europe through Russia.

The other 50% of Europeans can trace their DNA to an off-spring of the same fellow that was born a couple thousand years later and that they eventually made their way to Europe through the Middle East.

I read this in his book titled: Origins Of The British

There is an Indian anthropologist (N. Narain) who says that the European homeland is Gansu, China

5 posted on 06/20/2012 2:38:32 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam

I read THE book and He said we all originated from that pair in the Garden of Eden.

I’ll take His word over some scientist who has a bias and lack of credibility.


6 posted on 06/20/2012 2:41:08 PM PDT by newfreep (Breitbart sent me...)
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To: Renfield
Interesting ~ the authors could have simply postulated that advances and retreats of the great ice sheets served to both distribute the white folks, but also to create some variability in them.

Then, having noted that they could have named the last interglacial (which ended about 114,000 years bp) ~ and the one before that which ended about 228,000 years bp).

The ancestor common to all of us is in that neighborhood, but it's the conditions of the interglacials and the glacial advances and interstdials to made us what we are ~ not just the Toba event ~ which may have been a fizzle anyway.

7 posted on 06/20/2012 2:42:54 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: blam

What about the 6 Eves?


8 posted on 06/20/2012 2:44:46 PM PDT by afraidfortherepublic
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To: Renfield
Interesting read.
This is all based on the Y chromosome that is passed only from male to male.
I'm looking forward to the day when they analyze the rest of our DNA, will it corroborate these findings or not.

9 posted on 06/20/2012 2:45:21 PM PDT by BitWielder1 (Corporate Profits are better than Government Waste)
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To: blam

Going back further, both those streams came out of Africa, according to track-back of Y-DNA mutations (passing from father to son).


10 posted on 06/20/2012 2:45:33 PM PDT by expat2
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To: newfreep

I read the same book you did and I agree with that Author as well.


11 posted on 06/20/2012 2:50:27 PM PDT by ruesrose (It's possible to be clueless without being blonde.)
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To: ruesrose

I read That book, twice, but still liked “Battlefield Earth” better.


12 posted on 06/20/2012 2:54:37 PM PDT by Paradox (I want Obama defeated. Period.)
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http://www.scirp.org/journal/PaperDownload.aspx?FileName=AA20120200005_81998944.pdf&paperID=19566


13 posted on 06/20/2012 2:57:23 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: blam
Any time somebody tells you there were people in China before about 10,000 ybp, just remind yourself of what a Siberian tiger looks like ~ now give him far bigger fangs and more bulk.

It is necessary for the Younger Dryas to kill them off first.

Even the Chinese are reporting their own origins to the West in the Mongolian plateau above 700 meters (where it's dryer).

With few exceptions there are huge gaps in the record of human occupancy in China ~ but the yangtze and huang ho estuaries were populated mostly by major predators until relatively recent times.

14 posted on 06/20/2012 2:59:10 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Renfield; blam; StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; decimon; 1010RD; 21twelve; 24Karet; ...

 GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother & Ernest_at_the_Beach
Thanks Renfield.
The Scars of Evolution:
What Our Bodies Tell Us
About Human Origins

by Elaine Morgan
"The most remarkable aspect of Todaro's discovery emerged when he examined Homo Sapiens for the 'baboon marker'. It was not there... Todaro drew one firm conclusion. 'The ancestors of man did not develop in a geographical area where they would have been in contact with the baboon. I would argue that the data we are presenting imply a non-African origin of man millions of years ago.'"
To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.


15 posted on 06/20/2012 2:59:57 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: ruesrose

Sorry to see you reject God’s Word on how & where we all began...


16 posted on 06/20/2012 3:01:13 PM PDT by newfreep (Breitbart sent me...)
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To: Renfield

Downloading the paper was easy, comprehending it is another matter.

Thanks for the post, very interesting. The point being made is that the “Out of Africa” theory is not data driven, but agenda driven.


17 posted on 06/20/2012 3:01:18 PM PDT by ThirdMate
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To: Renfield

No. So sorry. Oldest human bones founding in China, so wassa matta you?

<|;-)=-


18 posted on 06/20/2012 3:04:16 PM PDT by familyop ("Wanna cigarette? You're never too young to start." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: Renfield

Let’s settle this once and for all. Dress all of the liberal/left university instructors up as monkeys, and put them in the Congo. That way, they’ll serve a purpose.


19 posted on 06/20/2012 3:08:51 PM PDT by familyop ("Wanna cigarette? You're never too young to start." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: newfreep
Sorry to see you reject God’s Word on how & where we all began...

I personally believe the stories are a metaphor...not to be taken as the literal truth as to what happened. Kinda hard to explain DNA to camel humpers 3000 years ago...

20 posted on 06/20/2012 3:09:52 PM PDT by trailhkr1 (All you need to know about Zimmerman, innocent = riots, manslaughter = riots, guilty = riots)
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To: familyop

I thought that honor went to Australia, and he was a 7 footer too.


21 posted on 06/20/2012 3:13:09 PM PDT by RaisingCain
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To: BitWielder1

Sort of related here, but has anyone done the DNA testing to tell your ancestry? Is it legit, or something similar to naming a star after your kid/S


22 posted on 06/20/2012 3:36:01 PM PDT by 9422WMR (Life is not fair, just deal with it.)
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To: newfreep

I don’t reject God’s word! I agreed that I had read the book (the Bible) and agreed with the Author...capitalized so you would know it was God who I believe authored the Bible.


23 posted on 06/20/2012 3:41:44 PM PDT by ruesrose (It's possible to be clueless without being blonde.)
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To: Paradox

To a saved person there can be no more wonderful book than that which gives us the words of our Savior.
I will pray for you because you know, eternity happens and where you spend it is up to you.

So before anyone starts flaming away, don’t expect a reply from me. For the truths of the Bible have been written in blood.


24 posted on 06/20/2012 3:45:53 PM PDT by ruesrose (It's possible to be clueless without being blonde.)
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To: Renfield

Worthless speculation. These studies are founded on the assumption that there was a uniform genome derived from a common ancestor, and that all the descendants of that common ancestor experienced a constant rate of genetic mutation over time, resulting in the variations between haplotypes that we see today. I’m not sure what to call that, but it certainly isn’t science.


25 posted on 06/20/2012 4:11:29 PM PDT by Boogieman
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To: 9422WMR

>> has anyone done the DNA testing to tell your ancestry? Is it legit [?] <<

Very legit, although it should never be portrayed as a magic bullet to solve genealogical puzzles.

When it comes to the most common test, for the Y-chromosome (male only), potential participants need to be aware that some people never find matches. But for those who do — maybe 2/3 of tested men — it can be quite helpful, even powerful, if used wisely in conjunction with old-fashioned “paper” research.


26 posted on 06/20/2012 4:11:46 PM PDT by Hawthorn
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To: 9422WMR
I would recommend 23andMe.com; 300 bucks, but they give you disease risk as well as ancestry. Bonus: how much are you a Neanderthal? (I am 2.7%; whereas the average Northern European is 2.6%, the group they put me in).

Disclaimer: I have no relationship with them.

27 posted on 06/20/2012 4:47:56 PM PDT by Pharmboy (Democrats lie because they must.)
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To: Renfield
The finding that the Europeoid haplogroups did not descend from “African” haplogroups A or B is supported by the fact that bearers of the Europeoid haplogroups, as well as all non-African haplogroups do not carry either SNPs M91, P97, M31, P82, M23, M114, P262, M32, M59, P289, P291, P102, M13, M171, M118 (haplogroup A and its subclades SNPs) or M60, M181, P90 (haplogroup B), as it was shown recently in “Walk through Y” FTDNA Project (the reference is incorporated therein) on several hundred people from various haplogroups.

I call BS. How could they overlook the impact of SNP M70 pre-64(K)?

28 posted on 06/20/2012 4:49:01 PM PDT by 2nd Bn, 11th Mar (The "p" in Democrat stands for patriotism.)
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To: familyop
"Let’s settle this once and for all. Dress all of the liberal/left university instructors up as monkeys, and put them in the Congo. That way, they’ll serve a purpose."

With diligence and a little hard work in time they could become Branch Managers.
29 posted on 06/20/2012 4:54:30 PM PDT by shibumi (Cover it with gas and set it on fire.)
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To: trailhkr1

Well at least you’re honest enough to openly reject God’s absolute truth of His inspired word.

Good luck when you face God and his judgement


30 posted on 06/20/2012 5:06:03 PM PDT by newfreep (Breitbart sent me...)
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To: shibumi

Yep, if they weren’t served up on local plates first.


31 posted on 06/20/2012 5:07:59 PM PDT by familyop ("Wanna cigarette? You're never too young to start." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: ruesrose; newfreep

Thought you two might be interested to know.

When it comes to science threads there are many posters here who ignore and belittle true believers but...

There is much science in support of the Bible most of which I’ve also encountered here at FreeRepublic. From my FR links page.

101 Evidences for a Young Age of the Earth...And the Universe
http://creation.com/age-of-the-earth

Center for Scientific Creation - In the Beginning: Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood
http://www.creationscience.com/onlinebook/IntheBeginningTOC.html

Dinosaur Shocker - 68 million year old T Rex w/ red blood cells
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/10021606.html#ixzz0VZChRzSL

New Chromosome Research Undermines Human-Chimp Similarity Claims
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2565348/posts

Science in the Bible
http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science.shtml

Testimonies of Scientists Who Believe the Bible
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2761001/posts


32 posted on 06/20/2012 5:57:04 PM PDT by BrandtMichaels
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To: newfreep

YOU got it right!


33 posted on 06/21/2012 12:40:19 AM PDT by Shadowstrike (Be polite, Be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: Renfield

E=MC2


34 posted on 06/21/2012 5:24:58 AM PDT by ZULU (See: http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=D9vQt6IXXaM&hd)
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To: newfreep
Well at least you’re honest enough to openly reject God’s absolute truth of His inspired word. Good luck when you face God and his judgement

Well, I respect your opinion but I think when man wrote the Bible, scientific knowledge was obviously lacking back then...and the 7 day creation etc was what men could accept as reasonable back in those times.

35 posted on 06/21/2012 6:23:02 AM PDT by trailhkr1 (All you need to know about Zimmerman, innocent = riots, manslaughter = riots, guilty = riots)
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To: trailhkr1

Clearly you lack the ability to grasp the Bible is God’s inspired Word written THROUGH men - i.e. God wrote the Bible perfectly.

That is one of the cornerstones of the Jewish-Christian faith.

That you reject that foundation clearly indicates you reject God.

Good luck with that plan.....just be honest and admit your godless bias upfront.


36 posted on 06/21/2012 12:17:34 PM PDT by newfreep (Breitbart sent me...)
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To: newfreep
And you are why we are 25th in the world in science....and dropping.

You can believe in God and think the 7 day creation is nonsense. Show me where the original Bible was sent down by God...it was written by man.

37 posted on 06/21/2012 12:25:49 PM PDT by trailhkr1 (All you need to know about Zimmerman, innocent = riots, manslaughter = riots, guilty = riots)
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