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Even Freeh Group member realizes NCAA wrongly punished Penn St.
NBC Sports ^ | 7-27-12 | Ben Kercheval

Posted on 07/27/2012 12:47:44 PM PDT by FlJoePa

Gotham City (wrongly) believed in Harvey Dent.

Likewise, there are people who (wrongly) believed in NCAA president Mark Emmert.

The heavy sanctions levied by Emmert against Penn State in the aftermath of the Freeh report was a result of public pressure, the justification to satisfy our culture’s bloodlust and demand for instant gratification. Someone needed to get clobbered at Penn State; it didn’t matter who.

The report, a multi-million dollar project spanning eight months investigating Penn State’s (in)action into the Jerry Sandusky allegations, was designed to unearth exactly when and where university officials went wrong, as well as act as a recommendation for new university policy to prevent further malfeasance.

Instead, it became the basis for Emmert’s unprecedented ultimatum to interim PSU president Rodney Erickson: accept a $60 million fine, four-year postseason ban, scholarship reduction and five-year probation — not to mention vacated 111 vacated wins — or get the Death penalty. The whole process bypassed traditional NCAA investigative protocol so fast, it had SEC speed.

In this case, that was too fast. And that’s not just, like, my opinion, man. A member of the Freeh Group told The Chronicle of Higher Education that Emmert misused the Freeh report as a substitute for normal NCAA investigative steps. Below are just some of the quotes to the Chronicle:

“That document was not meant to be used as the sole piece, or the large piece, of the NCAA’s decision-making… It was meant to be a mechanism to help Penn State move forward. To be used otherwise creates an obstacle to the institution changing.” “The Freeh team reviewed how Penn State operated, not how they worked within the NCAA’s system… The NCAA’s job is to investigate whether Penn State broke its rules and whether it gained a competitive advantage in doing so.” “The NCAA took this report and ran with it without further exploration.”

Evidence of the NCAA’s rush to judgement is already tangible. While some coaches are claiming to take the high road of not actively recruiting Penn State players now free to transfer wherever they choose, others are much more open about it. Tennessee, USC, Illinois, Arizona and Kansas are among them.

That’s not a slight against any program pursuing a transfer — they’re doing exactly what they’re allowed to do — but in punishing Penn State officials’ criminal acts with athletic sanctions, the NCAA didn’t reprimanded the “football-first” culture in Happy Valley.

It pushed it elsewhere.

Would that have been avoided if the NCAA had gone through its traditional routine with a Notice of Inquiry, Notice of Allegations and Committee on Infractions hearing? Maybe not. The NCAA can only punish a program in so many ways because it lacks subpoena power. But at least there would have been another review, one the NCAA can directly point to as its own work rather than rely on another’s.

I’ve never been a fan of NCAA involvement with Penn State in this context, but I also realize it’s the governing body of over 300 Division 1 athletic departments. Something was inevitably going to be done.

Besides, the Sandusky story is one filled with missed opportunities and baffling dead ends to investigations that should have gone further. In an ironic twist, though, the NCAA dealt with a program that improperly shifted power to one individual by inflicting punishment in a similar fashion.

Now, anything’s possible with the NCAA outside its normal authority.

Believe it.


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; Sports
KEYWORDS: molestation; paterno; paweare; pedophilia; pennstate
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Emmert oversaw the corrupt athletic department of the University of Washington - where they covered up two rapes involving a football and a basketball player.

He oversaw the academic progress of the LSU athletes (while at LSU) where the football team failed in the classroom much more than they succeeded on the field.

And he's going to lecture me about my "culture"? GFY emmert and freeh

1 posted on 07/27/2012 12:47:56 PM PDT by FlJoePa
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To: FlJoePa
a $60 million fine

Actually $12 million a year for five years, for a school with an endowment of $1.7 billion.

four-year postseason ban

So they don't go to the Poulan Weedeater Bowl, which is probably the only kind of bowl they would have gone to, anyway.

2 posted on 07/27/2012 12:51:26 PM PDT by dfwgator (FUJR (not you, Jim))
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To: FlJoePa

The NCAA went waaaaaay overboard on this one.

Punishment much too severe.


3 posted on 07/27/2012 12:52:08 PM PDT by Venturer
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To: FlJoePa
PSU actively covered up child rape for 14 years. Over those 14 years, the football program made hundreds of millions of dollars.

If Paterno and others had reported Sandusky as soon as they heard the allegations the program wouldn't have been hurt, Paterno would be a hero, and Sandusky's victims throughout the years would have been spared.

PSU will still have a filled football stadium over the next four years. People will spend plenty of money there and everyone will still have a job. They got off easy, IMHO. Paterno got off easy, too, by dying.

4 posted on 07/27/2012 12:54:23 PM PDT by thefactor (yes, as a matter of fact, i DID only read the excerpt)
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To: Venturer

Wonder if you’d feel the same way if your son was raped in the shower, the administration knew about it, and the rapist was allowed to keep an office on campus and make tons of money.


5 posted on 07/27/2012 12:56:20 PM PDT by thefactor (yes, as a matter of fact, i DID only read the excerpt)
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To: FlJoePa; Venturer

Nuke it (PSU) from orbit - that’s the only way to be sure.


6 posted on 07/27/2012 12:58:07 PM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: FlJoePa

What they really did was eliminate any chance that Penn State could tout JoePa’s legacy in the future.

Imagine Alabama not being to tout The Bear’s legacy, I guarantee they would not have won those three Post-Bear titles, had that happened.


7 posted on 07/27/2012 12:58:21 PM PDT by dfwgator (FUJR (not you, Jim))
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To: thefactor

There are appropriate criminal and civil penalties. The NCAA violated due process, excess punishment, standing, and relevance principles all over the place. This is an abomination bigtime.


8 posted on 07/27/2012 1:00:43 PM PDT by jimfree (In Nov 2012 my 12 y/o granddaughter will have more relevant executive experience than Barack Obama)
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To: jimfree

So you don’t think Penn State gained an advantage on the field by covering up Sandusky, over what would have happened if they did the right thing? If the truth about Sandusky got out, how many recruits would they have lost?


9 posted on 07/27/2012 1:03:26 PM PDT by dfwgator (FUJR (not you, Jim))
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To: FlJoePa
My heart pumps piss for Penn State.

They should have gotten worse.

10 posted on 07/27/2012 1:04:44 PM PDT by gdani
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To: Venturer

I don’t think the punishment itself was too severe. But now I am starting to wonder if the NCAA had any legal standing to serve up this punishment. I don’t know the legal ins-and-outs of this.


11 posted on 07/27/2012 1:05:36 PM PDT by GSWarrior
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To: FlJoePa
Joe Pedterno was absolute scum who thought football was more important than child rape; which he actively covered up for fourteen years.

You have now sunk to the ‘everyone is doing it’ defense.

Thus we see the quality of the men who stand up to defend Pedterno and Sandusky. The men from the Penn State athletic department who testified in Sandusky’s defense that there was nothing unusual about a grown man showering with young boys. The students who rioted when Paterno was fired, Paterno who wanted to be “humane” to Sandusky by making sure that real authorities were never notified.

You named yourself online after a child rape enabling scumbag who allowed it to go on FOURTEEN years, with nothing to his credit than that he could coach football!

Pitiful. Your hero was scum. Now he is dead scum.

12 posted on 07/27/2012 1:07:15 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: FlJoePa

13 posted on 07/27/2012 1:08:24 PM PDT by EEGator
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To: jimfree

Due process? We’re not talking about a court of law. This was unprecedented punishment due to the unprecedented nature of PSU’s actions. Would the death penalty have been preferable? They gave that to a school who simply paid it’s players.


14 posted on 07/27/2012 1:08:40 PM PDT by thefactor (yes, as a matter of fact, i DID only read the excerpt)
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To: jimfree
If Pedd State wants to ignore the NCAA ruling they are free to do so.

Do you wonder why they do not?

Because they got off easy.

And a decision to ignore the NCAA would make them a pariah that nobody who was NCAA sanctioned would play.

15 posted on 07/27/2012 1:11:17 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: thefactor

“PSU” did not cover up rape anymore that corpoartions pay taxes

PSU is not a person
PSU is tens of thousands of students and thousands of faculty at multiple campuses- mutiplied over a 11 year period is hundreds of thousands of students

a number of MEN on and off the coaching staff and adminstration and the local POLICE covered up rape-
So punish THEM


16 posted on 07/27/2012 1:11:41 PM PDT by silverleaf (Every human spent about half an hour as a single cell)
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To: FlJoePa

PSU should have received the four year “death sentence” that would have been levied had the university not signed this agreement. This is by far the most shameful thing that has ever happened in an American university, all for the sake of a football program.


17 posted on 07/27/2012 1:14:44 PM PDT by txrefugee
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To: jimfree

Don’t kid yourselves. That whole damned community was aware of what was going on! The NCAA is sending a message that ought to be heard loudly and clearly by all. I don’t have any sympathy for people who are so immoral that they would sacrifice a child for a footbal program. Screw ‘em!


18 posted on 07/27/2012 1:18:53 PM PDT by old school
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To: txrefugee

I’m becoming more convinced that it had less to do with football and more to do with covering up a HUGE pedophile ring. That Sandusky was associasted with the football team, was tangential to the activities of The Second Mile. I wonder whose names were on the “donor” lists from 2000 to 2003 that seem to have gone missing fron TSM files.


19 posted on 07/27/2012 1:22:29 PM PDT by PA BOOKENDS
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To: Venturer
Way back in the 1960s some football players took payoffs from some alumni at Indiana University. NCAA caught the deal and penalized the school with FOUR YEARS PROBATION for every team.

To start with football wasn't really an interesting contest at IU ~ they usually lost. Basketball was big time, and that cut them out of all post season play and with that their recruiting for the next 8 years turned to garbage.

Eventually NCAA relented when it came to the IU Swim team going to the Olympics or America losing every swimming event.

So, Penn State had one of its coaches diddling little kids and the other coaches covering it up, and even board members and other administrators seeming to cover up for this and they what?

Oh, this wasn't about a handful of really bad football players getting payoffs ~

I don't think the penalty against Penn was at all consistent with the earlier penalty against Indiana. They got off too easy.

20 posted on 07/27/2012 1:23:28 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: old school

What a cowardly, insensate lot! Had it been me instead of that turd McQueary, who witnessed Sandusky with that little boy in the shower, I’d have beat that son-of-bitch into hair and snot!


21 posted on 07/27/2012 1:37:10 PM PDT by old school
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To: FlJoePa

They wanted Paterno out of the record book. But they couldn’t see the navigational path to just expunge a bunch of his wins without hitting the school. In the end this will be bad for the NCAA, because now every time anybody involved in college athletics gets caught breaking a law people will expect something from the NCAA. They have too many rules to enforce already, now they get to enforce all the laws of the land too.


22 posted on 07/27/2012 1:42:11 PM PDT by discostu (Welcome back my friends to the show that never ends.)
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To: discostu

This was not a simple breaking of the law as you say. What happened there was overwhelmingly evil and they didn’t rise against it. Trading a sports record for the soul of a child is low-down, dirty and evil!


23 posted on 07/27/2012 1:49:06 PM PDT by old school
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To: FlJoePa

Go ahead. Make fun of me all of you freepers. If the NCAA has power over this they have power over curriculum, they have power over political opinions, they have power over absolutely everything. And absolute power always leads to absolute corruption.

(Oh, and “freepers” fails the Free Republic spell checker. LOL)


24 posted on 07/27/2012 1:57:25 PM PDT by jimfree (In Nov 2012 my 12 y/o granddaughter will have more relevant executive experience than Barack Obama)
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To: jimfree
The NCAA violated due process, excess punishment, standing, and relevance principles all over the place.

Nobody should assume that what the NCAA has done bears anything but a passing resemblence to a legal procedure. Don't be fooled. PSU agreed to this punshment. They consented. Oh yes, you could say that the NCAA may have threatened. But those threats could have been challenged by PSU in a court. Stays could have been applied for and this would have dragged on for years. In the end both PSU & the NCAA saw the need to cut a deal.

I'd have prefered a multi-year suspension of the program with all players having the right to transfer out without penalty. But PSU wouldn't go for that and would have fought it.

25 posted on 07/27/2012 1:57:39 PM PDT by Tallguy (It's all 'Fun and Games' until somebody loses an eye!)
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To: old school

I didn’t say it was a simple breaking of the law. I’m pointing out that once you establish you will punish the institution over and above legal ramifications it’s hard to get off that path. Now people will want them to punish FOR simple law breaking.


26 posted on 07/27/2012 2:05:35 PM PDT by discostu (Welcome back my friends to the show that never ends.)
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To: silverleaf
a number of MEN on and off the coaching staff and adminstration and the local POLICE covered up rape- So punish THEM

Yes, but that will take TIME. The courts grind slowly and Sandusky himself has only just gone to prison.

Meanwhile there is a (justifiably) angry lynch-mob screaming for justice. This is a huge PR problem both for the NCAA & PSU. The NCAA rules never contemplated anything like this. So a back-room deal got cut. Publically the NCAA is saying that harsher penalties were contemplated, and PSU says that they were threatened with "The Death Penalty". Hogwash. It's all kabuki. They both cut a deal.

True Justice will have to wait for Graham Spanier's imprisonment. Oh, by the way, did you hear he got a federal job today? The other two in the dock, Curley & Schultz, are still only charged with perjury. So right now we're in the middle-innings and Justice is trailing by 3 runs.

27 posted on 07/27/2012 2:05:40 PM PDT by Tallguy (It's all 'Fun and Games' until somebody loses an eye!)
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To: allmendream

I assume you read the freeh report? Can you show me where there is proof that Joe Paterno did anything wrong?

Not in the summary - the actual report.

Also, you do know that the PA AG praised Joe for his testimony and was perplexed that the University would fire him.

Show me that proof tough guy. Or shut your mouth.


28 posted on 07/27/2012 2:05:58 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: dfwgator

If Bear had been an accessory to cover up and allow child rape by a predator homosexual, then he too wouldn’t deserve a legacy.

What Paterno did was despicable.


29 posted on 07/27/2012 2:10:26 PM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: discostu
It's equally likely that the NCAA will utterly collapse in a few years. Look at all the money that college football & basketball bring in to the universities and the "super" conferences. The NCAA is losing control (if they ever had it). So yes, this might be establishing a new level of authority, but consent can be given (as PSU did) and it can also be withdrawn.
30 posted on 07/27/2012 2:12:53 PM PDT by Tallguy (It's all 'Fun and Games' until somebody loses an eye!)
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To: FlJoePa

According to the NCAA, it’s worse if you pay your players for a few years than it is if you cover up the rapes of kids for over a dozen years.

PSU should thank it’s lucky stars for their “punishment”.

PSU should have gotten the death penalty for a minimum of 5 years.


31 posted on 07/27/2012 2:13:27 PM PDT by Sporke (USS Iowa BB-61)
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To: silverleaf

Now, now, logic is not permitted when discussing this story.

The mass hysteria and abandonment of all reason must prevail!

After all, they are doing this “for the children.” /retch


32 posted on 07/27/2012 2:14:49 PM PDT by sauropod (You can elect your very own tyranny - Mark Levin)
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To: Tallguy

Yeah, in the long run this adds more incentives for the super conferences (one of which includes PSU) to tell the NCAA to jump in a lake.


33 posted on 07/27/2012 2:19:03 PM PDT by discostu (Welcome back my friends to the show that never ends.)
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To: FlJoePa

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8164487/legal-experts-say-joe-paterno-faced-charges-freeh-report

“Duquesne law professor Wes Oliver said the report by former FBI director Louis Freeh reads like a prosecution case for a child endangerment charge against Paterno, then-president Graham Spanier, athletic director Tim Curley and now-retired vice president Gary Schultz. Oliver noted that a former top official in the Philadelphia Archdiocese was convicted of that very charge in June for allowing a suspected pedophile priest to be around children.

“If you look at what happened here, it’s very clear that they were aware that they had a pedophile on their campus,” Oliver said.”

Stick your head in the sand all you want, but you are defending a man who failed miserably. I don’t wish that he would burn in hell, but I think that it is pretty obvious that Paterno did something awful.


34 posted on 07/27/2012 2:19:18 PM PDT by Arkansas Toothpick
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To: dfwgator
Actually $12 million a year for five years, for a school with an endowment of $1.7 billion.

The lawsuits will bankrupt Pedo State and they will have to close the gates forever. Maybe the Catholic church will purchase Pedo State and turn it into a nunnery.

35 posted on 07/27/2012 2:22:30 PM PDT by SVTCobra03 (You can never have enough friends, horsepower or ammunition.)
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To: thefactor
PSU actively covered up child rape for 14 years.

"PSU" did that? Actually a handful of despicable cowards covered up, and they're either dead, in prison, or soon will be.

I thought conservatives were against guilt by association...

36 posted on 07/27/2012 2:22:39 PM PDT by NittanyLion
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To: NittanyLion

Bulldoze Pedo State into the ground and then nuke it from orbit just to be sure. And take that abomination of a statue to the Fort Sill artillery range and use it for target practice.


37 posted on 07/27/2012 2:24:27 PM PDT by SVTCobra03 (You can never have enough friends, horsepower or ammunition.)
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To: FlJoePa
Oh sure, Joe Paterno didn't do ANYTHING wrong

- other than to ignore at least two credible reports of weird goings on in his showers involving Sandusky.

- other than advising Penn State officials to be “humane” to Sandusky and not take it to real authorities.

- other than telling Sandusky that he was observed by McQueary, giving Sandusky the opportunity to apply additional pressure to keep his victim silent.

- other than giving McQueary a job for the next decade plus so as to ensure HIS silence.

- other than observing Sandusky parading boy after boy around Penn State and at banquets without saying or doing anything.

- other than that - yeah - the guy was a f*cking hero.

The Penn State apologists show what a sick culture was there. Success without honor.

38 posted on 07/27/2012 2:26:45 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: SVTCobra03
Bulldoze Pedo State into the ground and then nuke it from orbit just to be sure. And take that abomination of a statue to the Fort Sill artillery range and use it for target practice.

Very insightful and persuasive commentary. And so well researched!

39 posted on 07/27/2012 2:30:02 PM PDT by NittanyLion
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To: Arkansas Toothpick

But the NCAA did punish Paterno. They punished the students and the football team members. It’s too late to punish Paterno. Taking down his stature was a good thing, though.

The NCAA made the Penn State football team victims of the child abuse scandal, itself. It would have been more appropriate to fire every single member of the administration who was in a position of power at the time of the cover up.

Last night, HBO ran a story on Bryan Gumble’s show about the hazing in bands at Black colleges. It was absolutely horrendous, worse than anything that we have seen at fraternities. The real story, though, is the fact that the school administrations continue to turn a blind eye to the violence, even after kids have died, suffered kidney failure and other severe injuries do the beating. They brought up the comparison to what Penn State is doing.

At least Penn State is making an effort to reform the culture of football first. I’m afraid that this is just going to add fuel to the fire to kill off football. Frankly, I wouldn’t miss it, but my husband would and so would a whole lot of other men.


40 posted on 07/27/2012 2:30:49 PM PDT by Eva
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To: Eva

In the real world it’s very difficult to punish the guilty without also hurting some innocents. If my father were to injure somebody while driving drunk and he were to go to prison, then where would my family be?

I regret that the players are being made to suffer, but I can’t think of a way for the point to get across to a major institution like PSU without hitting them where it hurts.


41 posted on 07/27/2012 2:36:00 PM PDT by Tallguy (It's all 'Fun and Games' until somebody loses an eye!)
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To: FlJoePa

tell it to those kids


42 posted on 07/27/2012 2:37:23 PM PDT by camle (keep an open mind and someone will fill it full of something for you)
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To: Eva
The NCAA made the Penn State football team victims of the child abuse scandal, itself.

That's only a small part of it. It will be the non-revenue sports that really suffer (as football funds the athletic department budget). Support staff will be reduced, travel will be restricted, investments in new equipment and facilities will be sacrificed, etc.

The reality here is, the NCAA punished 1000+ athletes who were watching cartoons when this disgusting cover-up occurred. Good work Mark Emmert.

43 posted on 07/27/2012 2:40:33 PM PDT by NittanyLion
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To: Eva
No, the NCAA didn't make “victims” of anything. Penn State made victims of little boys by assenting to the depravity of one of their former, assistant football coaches on Penn State property. Joe Paterno was Penn State and vice versa. What happened there is indefensible, period!
44 posted on 07/27/2012 2:43:11 PM PDT by old school
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To: allmendream

So what you’re saying is that you have no proof. I at least expected some testimony or something from the factfreeh report. You came with espn headlines. Any 8th grader could do that.

Once again, I asked you if you read the freeh report and you didn’t respond (which immediately tells me you didn’t). Then I asked you to provide me with proof that Joe Paterno covered up the js scandal.

You did neither. You just called me names and recited the media. You fall easily to the narrative, and shouldn’t be proud of it.


45 posted on 07/27/2012 2:52:22 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: FlJoePa

Just because ESPN says it doesn’t make it untrue. Everything I said was well supported by the facts. I know facts count for little to a FANatic. Your namesake is a piece of sh*t. Enjoy the permanent stench of failure without honor.


46 posted on 07/27/2012 3:04:55 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: Tallguy
Oh, by the way, did you hear he got a federal job today?

Here is how it was reported:

In an email written to the paper, Spanier said: “For the next several months, as I transition to my post-presidential plans, I will be working on a special project for the U.S. government relating (to) national security. This builds on my prior positions working with federal agencies to foster improved cooperation between our nation’s national security agencies and other entities.”

Is it possible that this federal job is a figment of his imagination??? Is he getting ready to pull a Gricar???

47 posted on 07/27/2012 3:19:26 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: allmendream
"Just because ESPN says it doesn’t make it untrue. Everything I said was well supported by the facts. I know facts count for little to a FANatic. Your namesake is a piece of sh*t. Enjoy the permanent stench of failure without honor." I asked you for proof - even a scintilla of proof - that Joe Paterno was involved in a coverup of the js scandal at Penn State. You have a bevy of information at your disposal. You have testimony, quotes from AG's, freeh report, espn, etc. yet you come back with that? Maybe you don't understand me. I'm asking you to prove that Joe Paterno covered up a pedophile, or stfu.
48 posted on 07/27/2012 3:23:16 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: FlJoePa
Maybe you don't understand me. I don't need to, nor do I think I could, prove anything to a FANatic zealot who STILL thinks PEDterno didn't do anything wrong.

The facts are pretty damning. The facts are that Paterno had personal knowledge of at least TWO reports of Sandusky in the shower with boys. One of them was made by someone he gave a job to for over a decade.

Either McQueary was a credible witness and Paterno believed what he said he saw in that shower - in which case he was a disgusting piece of feces for doing NOTHING for the next decade plus.

OR McQueary was not a credible witness and Paterno didn't believe what he said he saw in that shower - in which case he was an idiot for hiring a weirdo who makes up bizarre stories of pedophilia in the Penn State showers.

That was how it stood BEFORE the Freeh report. The Freeh report was even more damning because it made clear that this was the SECOND time Pedterno knew that Sandusky was showering with young boys in the Penn State athletic facilities. AND that he actively discouraged going to real authorities because it wouldn't be “humane”.

You did a good job fooling yourself - and you sure sound like a fool and a FANatic. But you ain't fooling anyone who isn't drunk on Penn State Kool Aide.

49 posted on 07/27/2012 3:35:02 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: allmendream

So you have no proof?


50 posted on 07/27/2012 4:01:12 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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