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Study Sinks 'Women and Children First' Tradition
ABC Science ^ | 31 July 2012 | Stephen Pincock, sourced from Mikael Elinder and Oscar Erixson

Posted on 07/30/2012 7:13:07 PM PDT by rjbemsha

In shipwrecks, children turn out to have the lowest survival rate, followed by women at 30% and men at around 40%, according to s Swedish study. In the Titanic shipwreck in contrast, more than 70% of female passengers survived, compared to less than 20% of men, with children in between.


TOPICS: History; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: bravery; humanbehavior; manhood; psychology; selfsacrifice; shipwreck; survivors
"The most stunning finding from the other [other 18] shipwrecks [studied] is of course the low survival rate of women and children, but also the relatively high survival rate of crew members and captains," says one of the authors.
1 posted on 07/30/2012 7:13:16 PM PDT by rjbemsha
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To: rjbemsha

... and Teddy Kennedy says “Think we have time?”


2 posted on 07/30/2012 7:16:34 PM PDT by Slump Tester (What if I'm pregnant Teddy? Errr-ahh -Calm down Mary Jo, we'll cross that bridge when we come to it)
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To: rjbemsha

How much did they take into account factors like men simply being more sturdy than women and kids or that sailors are going to be more fit for survival than nonsailors.

I think also that it depends how compassionate a particular society is. If compassion is deeply taught, people will likely be more willing to act on it, even if they are in a panicked state of mind.


3 posted on 07/30/2012 7:29:51 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults.)
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To: rjbemsha
Easy explanation for survival rate of women and children on the Titanic.

a) It took a long time to sink and b) Anglo-Saxon society of the Edwardian age marked a high point in human civilization.

Those two factors combined are the reason.

4 posted on 07/30/2012 7:31:00 PM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: rjbemsha

Duh, professional seaman surviving better in the open ocean than landlubbers?


5 posted on 07/30/2012 7:33:41 PM PDT by AU72
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To: rjbemsha

I really hate cynical crap like this masquerading as “science”. It serves no earthly purpose other than to denigrate the compassion and Christ-like self-sacrifice of those brave men who DID lay down their lives so women and children, the weakest among them, could be saved.

Mrs. AV


6 posted on 07/30/2012 7:35:54 PM PDT by Atomic Vomit (http://www.cafepress.com/aroostookbeauty/358829)
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To: rjbemsha

That guy in Aurora, CO who abandoned his injured wife and children in the movie theater supports this study.


7 posted on 07/30/2012 7:57:55 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Never believe anything in politics until it has been officially denied.)
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To: rjbemsha

I would like to see the study broken down by the nationality of each ship’s captain.


8 posted on 07/30/2012 7:59:24 PM PDT by vbmoneyspender
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To: BenLurkin

Good points, plus the precedent established in the popular mind by the “Birkenhead Drill”.


9 posted on 07/30/2012 8:06:03 PM PDT by Tijeras_Slim
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To: BenLurkin

You NAILED it. How many ship sinkings in this study include ships with, oh say, African registry and crews in the 21st century, vs. what we saw with the Titanic?


10 posted on 07/30/2012 8:11:14 PM PDT by Doctor 2Brains (If the government were Paris Hilton, it could not score a free drink in a bar full of lonely sailors)
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To: Tijeras_Slim

Just looked up the Birkenhead Drill... very interesting.


11 posted on 07/30/2012 8:16:01 PM PDT by Doctor 2Brains (If the government were Paris Hilton, it could not score a free drink in a bar full of lonely sailors)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

It was his girlfriend, but now she wants to marry him.


12 posted on 07/30/2012 8:21:18 PM PDT by ansel12 (Massachusetts Governors,,, where the GOP goes for it's "conservative" Presidential candidates.)
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To: ansel12

Right. Just shows you just how poor her selection of mates is.


13 posted on 07/30/2012 8:31:44 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Never believe anything in politics until it has been officially denied.)
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To: BenLurkin

Also there were quite a few children in 3rd class, no?
If they had been on the upper decks the survival rate would have been higher.


14 posted on 07/30/2012 8:39:31 PM PDT by scrabblehack
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To: BenLurkin

Yep. And not to forget that with Titanic, a number of the “evil rich wealthy” faced their death with dignity. Won’t find much of that nowadays.


15 posted on 07/30/2012 9:19:16 PM PDT by Clock King
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To: rjbemsha; BenLurkin; Tijeras_Slim; Doctor 2Brains; ansel12; Clock King; scrabblehack
"The most stunning finding from the other [other 18] shipwrecks [studied] is of course the low survival rate of women and children, but also the relatively high survival rate of crew members and captains," says one of the authors.

What I see here is the modern denigration and total lack of teaching the traditional code of the Honor of Manhood.

Outside of movies (mostly old movies) there is rarely heard these days any mention of honorable men. I can not recall the last time it came up in a conversation I had or I overheard.

Even where honorable behavior is ensconced in law it is often ignored.

Recall the recent grounding of a cruise ship in the Mediterranean where the ships captain abandoned ship and was told by the coast guard that he had to return to his ship and he deliberately ignored the command.

Honorable behavior has become an archaic concept to the modern man. Get a girlfriend pregnant; marry her you have got to be kidding! Too busy playing video games to study; cheating is an easy A.

Honor used to be worth dying for (as in giving your seat in a life boat to a lady) today it is not worth giving up your seat on the bus.

16 posted on 07/31/2012 12:10:21 AM PDT by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: rjbemsha
"The most stunning finding from the other [other 18] shipwrecks [studied] is of course the low survival rate of women and children, but also the relatively high survival rate of crew members and captains," says one of the authors.

The most stunning finding is the stupidity of the authors. Women and children, generally speaking, are weaker and have less stamina than men, which is why they are given preferential treatment during evacuations.

Imagine the survival rate of women and children if they weren't "first?"

17 posted on 07/31/2012 4:13:45 AM PDT by Yo-Yo
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To: rjbemsha

There must be equal numbers amongst the survivors along racial/gender lines.


18 posted on 07/31/2012 4:54:49 AM PDT by The_Media_never_lie
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To: Doctor 2Brains; All

Two modern cases where the Captin was among the FIRST to abandon ship:

MTS Oceanos
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MTS_Oceanos

Costa Concordia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Costa_Concordia


19 posted on 07/31/2012 6:52:24 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: AU72

i daresay 60% of cruise ship crews are not professional sailors, just hotel and restaurant and resort employees on a big boat.


20 posted on 07/31/2012 8:44:04 AM PDT by bravo whiskey
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To: Blood of Tyrants

“That guy in Aurora, CO who abandoned his injured wife and children in the movie theater supports this study.”

That really happened? I missed that.


21 posted on 07/31/2012 10:15:12 AM PDT by Morgana (This space for rent. Cheap.)
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To: Morgana

Well, it was his live in girlfriend and their children, but yes, it happened.


22 posted on 07/31/2012 10:31:33 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Never believe anything in politics until it has been officially denied.)
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To: Pontiac
Recall the recent grounding of a cruise ship in the Mediterranean where the ships captain abandoned ship and was told by the coast guard that he had to return to his ship and he deliberately ignored the command.

One of the only good stories about that incident is that the captain of a sister ship, who happened be on his own vacation, saw that the situation was getting out of control and just took command. Even though it wasn't his ship, he started evacuating people 15 minutes before the crew sounded the alarm. Nice to know there are some people left who take their honor and positions seriously.

23 posted on 07/31/2012 1:05:17 PM PDT by Clock King
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To: rjbemsha

Article leave a lot out.. Like the cultures involved.

Women and children first is largely a concept of Western Culture.

Muslim cultures value children and women only above their last deposit in the privy.


24 posted on 07/31/2012 1:49:56 PM PDT by TASMANIANRED (Viva Christo Rey)
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