Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Women Beat Men on IQ Tests for First Time... But Why??
American Thinker ^ | August 4, 2012 | Bruce Deitrick Price

Posted on 10/05/2012 3:11:56 PM PDT by BruceDeitrickPrice

American media are excitedly reporting that women are smarter than men, according to IQ tests. Not equal to men, supposedly the goal of feminism, but superior to men.

That is quite a jump, all in a matter of decades. How could such a thing happen? After all, biology tells us that genes tend to be stable over generations.

An ABC News blog reported: “James Flynn, a New Zealand-based researcher known as an IQ testing expert, said...that women have closed the gap and even inched ahead in this battle of the intelligent sexes...Deciding which is the smarter sex is an ever-controversial topic of conversation and scientific research.”

But one major aspect of this puzzle is completely clear. Virtually every teacher agrees that boys have greater trouble with one skill in particular: literacy. You can find dozens of articles with titles such as: “Research Says Boys More Likely To Have Problems Reading.”

About.com continues: “The Journal of the American Medical Association reports that boys are more prone to having trouble reading than girls...Researchers found that in all studies, about 20 percent of the boys had reading disabilities compared with 11 percent of the girls.”

Scienceblog.com summed up: “The research implies that reading disabilities are genetic. Boys are more likely to have a range of developmental difficulties.”

These researchers are eager to make sweeping (and sexist) generalizations. But nobody seems to want to notice the 800-pound joker in the room, that is, how reading is taught. The method of instruction could be a critical variable. But we are supposed to ignore that while accepting without reservation all the outlandish claims that researchers want to make. It’s time to back up.

Let’s approach this problem with the fewest possible preconceptions. It is probably safe to assume that boys are a bit more physical and restless...

(Excerpt) Read more at americanthinker.com ...


TOPICS: Conspiracy; Education; History; Science
KEYWORDS: feminazis; misanthopy; phonics; reading; savethemales; sexism; wholeword
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051 next last

1 posted on 10/05/2012 3:12:03 PM PDT by BruceDeitrickPrice
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

Was the test conducted in Denver? Maybe the women got there first and acclimated.


2 posted on 10/05/2012 3:13:12 PM PDT by Michael.SF. (Ambassador Stevens is dead and the Chevy Volt is alive!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

The reading disparity has a LOT to do with the fact that the PC croud has neutered all of the books in the ciriculum. Boys will read what interests them and Little House on the Prarie wont do it for most boys. My son is currently going through my old stash of Shadowrun books and loves them.


3 posted on 10/05/2012 3:16:20 PM PDT by taxcontrol
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice; Revolting cat!; Slings and Arrows
Are the numbers going up or are men just testing dumber now?


4 posted on 10/05/2012 3:20:00 PM PDT by a fool in paradise (Obama likes to claim credit for getting Osama. Why hasn't he tried Khalid Sheikh Mohammed yet?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

Back in the 60s I took a course in testing which included IQ tests.

One thing which stuck in my mind was that boys and girls both scored nearly the same with girls just barely doing better.

On the other hand, People with exceptionally high IQs favored males by a huge number.


5 posted on 10/05/2012 3:20:12 PM PDT by yarddog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

Saw projections that women will earn 60% of college degrees in ten years.


6 posted on 10/05/2012 3:20:13 PM PDT by TigerClaws
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: TigerClaws

“Saw projections that women will earn 60% of college degrees in ten years.”

Ha! I earned mine in four.


7 posted on 10/05/2012 3:22:23 PM PDT by rightwingcrazy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

Hmm. Okay.

Next.


8 posted on 10/05/2012 3:23:42 PM PDT by Tuanedge (Warriors victorious in a hundred battles, flee when a tiger enters their tent.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice
Women Beat Men on IQ Tests for First Time... But Why??

Becasue the test was based on memory and the question was what did your husband do wrong 10 years ago.

9 posted on 10/05/2012 3:27:55 PM PDT by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

Because we like beer and Internet porn better. :)


10 posted on 10/05/2012 3:29:47 PM PDT by Mr. Jeeves (CTRL-GALT-DELETE)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

Because boys are ignored in the schools? Because emasculated boys grow up confused? Because men have been beaten into submission in the workplace? Because television and commercials portray men as idiots? Because men are denied by society the right to exercise their proper role in society? By the way, if men were smarter what would that get them? Hired? Probably not in today’s workplace. Okay, fire away with ‘baggage’ ‘poor baby’ and other various poison arrows everyone!


11 posted on 10/05/2012 3:37:42 PM PDT by Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice
because it's THEIR TURN...
12 posted on 10/05/2012 3:42:29 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America

Men survive, so the survivors can be resources for women. F. Scott Fitzgerald and calculus are rarely prerequisites.


13 posted on 10/05/2012 3:44:35 PM PDT by Tuanedge (Warriors victorious in a hundred battles, flee when a tiger enters their tent.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice; GeronL
Because girls pay attention in class while boys misbehave. Girls want to “please the teacher” while boys are being boys.

In the old days when boys were being boys they got whacked with the board of education, now they are drugged into oblivion. With their brains fried how do you expect them to learn?

14 posted on 10/05/2012 3:46:18 PM PDT by Morgana (Time to play cowboys and muslims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

Without knowing the precise nature of the test and the composition of the sample population, it’s difficult to determine why the results came out as they did, and what the results signal or don’t signal.

Was the test reading-based? (I’ve had IQ tests that were symbolic rather than verbal.) Were the subjects of the same age? What age? Were the results compared against those of a similar population over time? What about the same people tested over time?

All sorts of interesting information could be gathered, if people really wanted it.


15 posted on 10/05/2012 3:48:01 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Optimism is much shallower than hope.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Morgana

Affirmative Action

*ducks*

just kidding


16 posted on 10/05/2012 3:48:20 PM PDT by GeronL (http://asspos.blogspot.com)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: yarddog

That’s actually well known and well documented. The mean on IQ scores for both sexes is about the same, but the variance is much larger for men: there are more “average” women, and more men who are both very intelligent and very stupid.


17 posted on 10/05/2012 3:50:01 PM PDT by FredZarguna (And that's the end of our show! Doink.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: GeronL

I’m serious!

More boys are on ADD and ADHD pills than girls. What does this tell you?

It tells you the teacher needs to control her classroom and since she is not allowed to use the “board of education” or even have them sit in the corner, little Johnny has to be drugged up to behave. What do you think those drugs are doing to little Johnny’s developing brain?
Meanwhile little Mary is sitting beside Johnny, not on drugs, behaving, and learning.

Who do you think will pass the test for college?


18 posted on 10/05/2012 3:55:33 PM PDT by Morgana (Time to play cowboys and muslims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: yarddog

Women are clustered, when it comes to IQ. They have less mentally challenged, as well as less geniuses. Men, however, are more widespread in their distribution of intelligence.


19 posted on 10/05/2012 4:01:40 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: Jonty30
Women are clustered, when it comes to IQ. They have less mentally challenged, as well as less geniuses. Men, however, are more widespread in their distribution of intelligence.

Wot??

You just solved the question.

20 posted on 10/05/2012 4:05:12 PM PDT by Jane Long (Soli Deo Gloria!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice
(In the book Why Johnny Still Can't Read, Rudolf Flesch tells the astonishing story of a woman who graduated from Barnard College able to read novels for pleasure in French and other European languages. When she read novels in English, her native language, she got headaches and eye strain. Almost all sight-word readers report similar ailments. Remarkably, this woman actually reached the age of 36 without realizing that what she did with French words, she could do with English words. That is, read them phonetically. The horrific point is, Whole Word can hide the true nature of reading from even the smartest people.)
From my experience at the turn of the millennium, Barnard girls were hardly the "smartest people"
Whole word is a joke. I have an IQ of 145. I was needed extra help with "whole word" reading. The tutor threw out the whole word crap, and taught be phonics in two hours. I was getting gold stars in no time. Math was another issue. I was bored silly and got punished for wanting to use class time in a subject I knew to do my Hebrew homework, which I found harder. Even private schools are not above this silliness.
21 posted on 10/05/2012 4:08:21 PM PDT by rmlew ("Mosques are our barracks, minarets our bayonets, domes our helmets, the believers our soldiers.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Jane Long; Jonty30

But Jonty30 didn’t blame anyone for this outcome, so the information is worthless.


22 posted on 10/05/2012 4:08:33 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Optimism is much shallower than hope.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: Tax-chick

I think the simple answer, which has been alluded to here, is that boys require a more active education than girls. Girls are fine with the passive method of teaching that is used today, whereas boys need a more active method. For boys, running contests or being able to jump up and yell out the answer, or have to defend themselves in a debate, etc, is needed for them to be engaged.

That’s why many of them are checking out, a lack of interest.


23 posted on 10/05/2012 4:15:29 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: yarddog
People with exceptionally high IQs favored males by a huge number.

I believe I read somewhere that males dominate on both ends of the IQ test.

24 posted on 10/05/2012 4:19:42 PM PDT by LibertarianLiz
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

I’m not surprised. While I’m sure the majority of replies is going to center around the so-called “war against boys” and other nonsense, my experience raising children gives me an insight into this issue.

Since the early 90’s, I’ve seen video games literally consume the lives of young boys, while young girls have not been drawn into that culture to nearly the degree that boys are.

Girls today are more driven than they ever were, whereas boys might as well be wearing neon signs that read, “Entertain me.”


25 posted on 10/05/2012 4:21:50 PM PDT by Melas (u)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America
Because boys are ignored in the schools? Because emasculated boys grow up confused? Because men have been beaten into submission in the workplace? Because television and commercials portray men as idiots? Because men are denied by society the right to exercise their proper role in society? By the way, if men were smarter what would that get them? Hired? Probably not in today’s workplace. Okay, fire away with ‘baggage’ ‘poor baby’ and other various poison arrows everyone!

OK. Do you have any idea how pathetic this sounds. Assuming this was true, why aren't men fighting back, especially for their sons. One MRA has this answer. If you don't agree, then what is it? You know women would never stand for this if the roles were reversed, so what's stopping men?

Meanwhile, when we have boys beating each other up over nothing and doing stupid crap like this to each other, is it any wonder they're falling behind?

26 posted on 10/05/2012 4:23:03 PM PDT by TwelveOfTwenty (Ho, ho, hey, hey, I'm BUYcotting Chick-Fil-A)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: Jonty30

I agree. That certainly affects the school performance of boys and girls respectively. However, I believe they’re still finding that boys in the aggregate do better than girls on the math sections of the SAT, which suggests that the schooling process isn’t particularly affecting overall intelligence.

It would be interesting to see the study population, and also to see another study (or several more) of a similar population, to see whether other studies would be the same, or show a slightly higher average for the male participants.


27 posted on 10/05/2012 4:23:21 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Optimism is much shallower than hope.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: gunsequalfreedom

“Women Beat Men on IQ Tests for First Time... But Why??

Becasue the test was based on memory and the question was what did your husband do wrong 10 years ago.”

LOL


28 posted on 10/05/2012 4:24:40 PM PDT by The Antiyuppie ("When small men cast long shadows, then it is very late in the day.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice
I'd bet dollars to doughnut holes that they changed what the test measures.
29 posted on 10/05/2012 4:35:53 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Government is the religion of the psychopath.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice
Any research that reaches a conclusion so thrilling to the left should be viewed with suspicion. I suspect random isn't so much as far as the males here, and I suspect other factors are at play as well.

It has long been confirmed that females tend to the middle of the curve, with males being more broadly represented. This means far more geniuses are male, but it also means more idiots are as well.

The question should be, just what would lop off the higher end of male scores yet be subtle enough that biased researchers felt secure in publishing this?

Skew in the direction of a desired, a priori conclusion could have been introduced by choosing a methodology that (oops) unintentionally excluded certain identifiable groups with a better than average likelihood of higher IQ.

That's one way to get from point A to point B.

30 posted on 10/05/2012 4:36:20 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Tax-chick

The difference would likely be explainable by the accumulative differences between constant stimulation and not being stimulated.

If you took two people, say twins, who were largely identical in every meaningful way, and gave them a differing level of challenges, over many years, the person who led a more challenging life will probably have a measurable higher IQ difference than the person who wasn’t challenged sufficiently.

When we send our kids to school, based on the current curriculum and method of teachings, you are sending boys to check out out for 5 hours a day and girls to check in for 5 hours a day. That has to create a difference over time.


31 posted on 10/05/2012 4:38:20 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Tax-chick

Ding! Ding! Ding! You win. Best post of the day.


32 posted on 10/05/2012 4:41:30 PM PDT by coop71 (Being a redhead means never having to say you're sorry...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America
Because boys are ignored in the schools? Because emasculated boys grow up confused? Because men have been beaten into submission in the workplace? Because . . .

With excuses like that you should be working for the Obama campaign. Repeat after me, "It's women's . . . er, Bush's fault."


33 posted on 10/05/2012 4:45:37 PM PDT by Cinnamontea
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: TwelveOfTwenty

I don’t think it’s necessary to just dump on Young men, when they are living in a society where the incentive to succeed where has become so costly, in one form or another, that it’s not unreasonable to question the worthwhileness of it.

I think it’s far better to ask how men can be motivated to start engaging again, instead of simply blaming them for not.


34 posted on 10/05/2012 4:49:54 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

Women outscoring men on IQ tests by 1/2 or 1 point = important. It explains all kinds of things that are going on in the world.

Whites outscoring blacks by 15+ points, and Jews outscoring gentiles by roughly the same number, steady over five decades = not important, explains nothing about how the world works, and who succeeds and who doesn’t.


35 posted on 10/05/2012 5:37:04 PM PDT by Sherman Logan (Perception wins all the battles. Reality wins all the wars.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Cinnamontea

I choose to uphold God’s plan for man AND woman in society. Unfortunately, mankind isn’t.


36 posted on 10/05/2012 5:54:19 PM PDT by Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: TwelveOfTwenty
The 'punching of testicles' is self-deprecation. Applauded by girls and school administrators as welcomed and funny.. Even encouraged. NOT ONCE did I ever see that as a fad growing up. That was off-limits and not even thought about. Both sexes are selling out to each other and neither benefits from it. Shirking God's plan is a failure across the board.

By the way, there are many, MANY more instances of girls beating each other up lately; A new kind of charm school, if you will..

37 posted on 10/05/2012 6:04:03 PM PDT by Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Jonty30

I don’t disagree with what you’re saying, but the concept that environment, including educational environment, significantly affects IQ scores is contrary to the notion, popular with some FReepers, that IQ is set in stone at birth and that large swathes of the population are inherently incapable of learning to read and do basic math.

Someone ... maybe the Thernstroms, or Thomas Sowell ... wrote about a study which showed that IQ in elementary-school age correlates closely with the child’s aural vocabulary - the number of spoke words he understands - at age 5. The writer pointed out that talking to and reading to a young child is a very low-cost, high-return intervention.


38 posted on 10/05/2012 6:17:39 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Optimism is much shallower than hope.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice
Men share their major blood flow with two thought processing centers of the body, right? And when women are around, well, we lose upper IQ.

I know I can certainly attest to this, as many times the sun rose and I realized the sad ignorance caused by the unequal dispersion of said blood.

But I still bragged to my buddies...

39 posted on 10/05/2012 6:26:01 PM PDT by IrishPennant (Are you behind a "Blade of Grass?")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: coop71

Thank you!

It would be very interesting to know if there is a biological explanation for the difference in the distribution of intelligence between the sexes. Could it have something to do with the higher prenatal death rate of males? Are there suggestions of a similar difference between the sexes of other mammals?

However, I can’t imagine anyone would fund a study unless there was a political agenda, so we’re unlikely to learn anything.


40 posted on 10/05/2012 6:28:45 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Optimism is much shallower than hope.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: Tax-chick

It’s well known that IQ can change throughout one’s life, dependent upon diet, environment, stimulation. There was one case in New York where an accused murderer, a young black male, had a measured IQ in the high 60’s. Fortunately for him, New York will not apply a death penalty if an accused’s IQ has measured below 75 because of the issue of competence. However, over time, the accused was spending time with his lawyers, and hearing big words and complex explanations. When they retested him later on, before the trial, his time with his lawyers pushed his IQ above the threshold, allowing the prosecution to make it a death penalty case.

Whoops. :)


41 posted on 10/05/2012 6:29:00 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: Jonty30

If only he’d been watching MTV instead ...


42 posted on 10/05/2012 6:30:55 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Optimism is much shallower than hope.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: Jonty30

White men are corporately, publicly and less privately shunned. Women, ethic groups, behavior groups encouraged sponsored funded, endorsed, promoted and applauded. Meanwhile, where is the white man club? Most colleges students are majority women. The office of diversity functions like Gestapo. Try criticizing them in your work or school communities! Women are today’s aggressors in the mating game, easy pickings.

So young men of America, why should you excel? Get used to it. All fruit of Godless society


43 posted on 10/05/2012 6:47:38 PM PDT by Broker (November... VICTORY or DEATH!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

We continually hear talk about the “dumbing down” of America, but this has not just been a concerted effort by the left to hamper learning and introduce liberal indoctrination into the education system. It’s also a lack of strong fatherly figures and lowered testosterone levels... No joke and sad but true... The neutering of America...


44 posted on 10/05/2012 7:01:26 PM PDT by hope_dies_last
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Jonty30
or have to defend themselves in a debate, etc, is needed for them to be engaged.

That’s why many of them are checking out, a lack of interest.

In view of Obama's debate performance I must ask if this was intentional. ;)

45 posted on 10/05/2012 7:40:45 PM PDT by 17th Miss Regt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: Morgana

Who do you think will pass the test for college?
**************************************************
They all pass the college entrance exams now ,, College is just a repeat of the already dumbed down high school we have now.


46 posted on 10/05/2012 8:07:28 PM PDT by Neidermeyer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America
The 'punching of testicles' is self-deprecation. Applauded by girls and school administrators as welcomed and funny..

It's not just boys who are doing it to each other. Girls are doing it to boys. Google "sack tapping girls" if you have the stomach for it. As you said, the school administrators think it's funny and won't do anything about it.

And that brings up another point. Where are the fathers in this? Father's have tolerated and even supported a school system that allows girls to assault their own sons for decades now. Dads won't even let their sons in on the fact that it's a crime for girls to attack them. If something as bad as this isn't enough to get fathers to fight for their sons' rights, what is?

By the way, there are many, MANY more instances of girls beating each other up lately; A new kind of charm school, if you will..

The subject is about how boys are falling behind. Pointing this out isn't going to help the boys.

47 posted on 10/06/2012 7:14:44 AM PDT by TwelveOfTwenty (Ho, ho, hey, hey, I'm BUYcotting Chick-Fil-A)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: Jonty30
I don’t think it’s necessary to just dump on Young men, when they are living in a society where the incentive to succeed where has become so costly, in one form or another, that it’s not unreasonable to question the worthwhileness of it.

Oh come on. Young men beating each other up, doing drugs, killing and eating each other, buying hookers, etc is the fault of society for not providing them with an easy way to success?

I think it’s far better to ask how men can be motivated to start engaging again, instead of simply blaming them for not.

Changing the behavior described above would be a great start.

48 posted on 10/06/2012 7:14:44 AM PDT by TwelveOfTwenty (Ho, ho, hey, hey, I'm BUYcotting Chick-Fil-A)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: BruceDeitrickPrice

Maybe it is because as more women gain higher authority they have changed what they consider important, like liberal PC ideas?


49 posted on 10/06/2012 8:15:41 AM PDT by CodeToad (Padme: "So this is how liberty dies... with thunderous applause.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: rmlew

Smartest people, in this case is not just the kid. Her parents were smart professionals and they were right there the whole way, making the girl do what the school instructed, never realizing what was unfolding.


50 posted on 10/06/2012 11:31:32 AM PDT by BruceDeitrickPrice (education reform)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson