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How scientists recreated Neanderthal man
BBC ^ | 10-23-2012

Posted on 10/23/2012 10:06:27 AM PDT by Renfield

A team of scientists has created what it believes is the first really accurate reconstruction of Neanderthal man, from a skeleton that was discovered in France over a century ago.

In 1909, excavations at La Ferrassie cave in the Dordogne unearthed the remains of a group of Neanderthals. One of the skeletons in that group was that of an adult male, given the name La Ferrassie 1.

These remains have helped scientists create a detailed reconstruction of our closest prehistoric relative for a new BBC series, Prehistoric Autopsy.

La Ferrassie 1 is one of the most important discoveries made in the field of Neanderthal research.

His skull is the largest and most complete ever found. The discovery of his leg and foot bones was hugely significant, revealing to scientists that Neanderthals walked upright, contradicting previous research....

(Excerpt) Read more at bbc.co.uk ...


TOPICS: History; Science
KEYWORDS: godsgravesglyphs; helixmakemineadouble; neandertal; neandertals; neanderthal; neanderthals; paleoanthropology

Mr. Neanderthal needs a fig leaf. (If this fellow was clothed, he'd look like some of the dudes I used to party with in college.)

1 posted on 10/23/2012 10:06:27 AM PDT by Renfield
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To: SunkenCiv

Pingy!


2 posted on 10/23/2012 10:07:33 AM PDT by Renfield (Turning apples into venison since 1999!)
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To: All

I note that they’ve depicted him with ginger hair, which should please the redheads on FR.


3 posted on 10/23/2012 10:08:37 AM PDT by Renfield (Turning apples into venison since 1999!)
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To: Renfield

Looks like Chuck Norris!


4 posted on 10/23/2012 10:10:11 AM PDT by 2nd Amendment (Vote Obama for national suicide)
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To: Renfield

It’s looking more and more like Neanderthal was just another race of Man. Give that guy a haircut and shave, give him clothing, and most people would not give him a second look if they passed him on the street.


5 posted on 10/23/2012 10:16:38 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (political correctness is communist thought control, disguised as good manners)
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To: Renfield
Charley Coleman! That's his name ~ then there were these other two guys from around Marion IN who were his cousins ~ they are ALIVE!

And barely hidden amongst us.

6 posted on 10/23/2012 10:20:53 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Renfield
Humanity has only two colors ~ a red/yellow pigment and a black/brown pigment.

We are half of humanity's opportunity for life in the Sun!

7 posted on 10/23/2012 10:22:26 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Renfield

Were they all union members too?


8 posted on 10/23/2012 10:48:15 AM PDT by Average Al
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To: Renfield
some of the dudes I used to party with in college

My reaction exactly. "Dude, we need a new screen for the bong"

9 posted on 10/23/2012 11:23:00 AM PDT by katana (Just my opinions)
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To: PapaBear3625

...or in Blair House.


10 posted on 10/23/2012 11:41:55 AM PDT by DPMD
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To: 2nd Amendment

Agree,the resemblance is striking.


11 posted on 10/23/2012 11:51:38 AM PDT by Thombo2
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To: Renfield

He looks like my ex-business partner.


12 posted on 10/23/2012 11:53:26 AM PDT by donhunt (Certified and proud "Son of a Bitch".)
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To: Renfield

They went to France?


13 posted on 10/23/2012 12:20:17 PM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: Renfield

I knew Chuck Norris was tough!


14 posted on 10/23/2012 12:26:49 PM PDT by Defiant (If there are infinite parallel universes, why Lord, am I living in the one with Obama as President?)
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To: 2nd Amendment

You beat me to it!


15 posted on 10/23/2012 12:27:32 PM PDT by Defiant (If there are infinite parallel universes, why Lord, am I living in the one with Obama as President?)
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To: Renfield

OMG, it’s my ex-husband!


16 posted on 10/23/2012 1:14:26 PM PDT by ottbmare (The OTTB Mare)
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To: PapaBear3625

Or they would stop him and ask if they’d seen him in a GEICO commercial.


17 posted on 10/23/2012 2:26:43 PM PDT by Erasmus (Zwischen des Teufels und des tiefen, blauen Meers)
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To: Renfield

Neanderthal upper arms are longer then their forearms. Weird...


18 posted on 10/23/2012 3:08:49 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Renfield; StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; decimon; 1010RD; 21twelve; 24Karet; ...

 GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother & Ernest_at_the_Beach
Thanks Renfield.

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.


19 posted on 10/24/2012 6:36:34 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: Renfield

Well that’s a darn sight nicer to look at than that freaky red-eyed, black skinned thing that always pops up on these threads!


20 posted on 10/24/2012 8:59:27 PM PDT by To Hell With Poverty (Ephesians 6:12 becomes more real to me with each news cycle.)
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To: 2nd Amendment

It does! I thought so befoire I saw your post and I asked my son who it reminded him of and he also said Norris


21 posted on 10/24/2012 10:11:23 PM PDT by marsh2
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To: PapaBear3625
It’s looking more and more like Neanderthal was just another race of Man

Believe me he wasn't just another race of man; his DNA was almost exactly halfway between ours and that of a chimpanzee and this is what he actually looked like, images courtesy www.themandus.org, some images with fur removed for illustration:

neanderprofile, hairy ape with fur

Photobucket

Neanderthal 3

n7

I don't buy Vendramini's vision of SQ hominids evolving into Cro Magnon people, but his reconstructions of Neandrthals are totally believable and this "new(TM)" reconstruction noted in this thread is not. The real version:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZbmywzGAVs

22 posted on 10/25/2012 3:52:34 AM PDT by varmintman (November Sixth || Obunga is Through || Bork Obunga || Before He Borks You || Burma Shave)
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To: varmintman
I don't buy Vendramini's vision of SQ hominids evolving into Cro Magnon people,

I don't buy Vendramini's vision, period.

You keep bringing up this guy. He's a director and scriptwriter with no science training or credentials. You make yourself look stupid every time you post this.

23 posted on 10/25/2012 3:58:30 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (political correctness is communist thought control, disguised as good manners)
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To: varmintman
Believe me he wasn't just another race of man; his DNA was almost exactly halfway between ours and that of a chimpanzee

From National Geographic (my bolding):

The genetic study team reached their conclusion after comparing the genomes of five living humans—from China, France, Papua New Guinea, southern Africa, and western Africa—against the available "rough draft" of the Neanderthal genome. (Get the basics on genetics.)

The results showed that Neanderthal DNA is 99.7 percent identical to modern human DNA, versus, for example, 98.8 percent for modern humans and chimps, according to the study. (Related: "Neanderthals Had Same 'Language Gene' as Modern Humans.")

In addition, all modern ethnic groups, other than Africans, carry traces of Neanderthal DNA in their genomes, the study says—which at first puzzled the scientists. Though no fossil evidence has been found for Neanderthals and modern humans coexisting in Africa, Neanderthals, like modern humans, are thought to have arisen on the continent.


24 posted on 10/25/2012 4:45:39 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (political correctness is communist thought control, disguised as good manners)
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To: To Hell With Poverty

Ask and ye shall receive. lol


25 posted on 10/25/2012 4:58:08 AM PDT by eartrumpet
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To: All
There is zero actual archaeological evidence on the planet of humans cross-breeding with Neanderthal, e.g.

http://discovermagazine.com/1995/sep/theneanderthalpe558/

Quote
Humans love to mate. They mate all the time, by night and by day, through all the phases of the female’s reproductive cycle. Given the opportunity, humans throughout the world will mate with any other human. The barriers between races and cultures, so cruelly evident in other respects, melt away when sex is at stake. Cortés began the systematic annihilation of the Aztec people--but that did not stop him from taking an Aztec princess for his wife. Blacks have been treated with contempt by whites in America since they were first forced into slavery, but some 20 percent of the genes in a typical African American are white. Consider James Cook’s voyages in the Pacific in the eighteenth century. Cook’s men would come to some distant land, and lining the shore were all these very bizarre-looking human beings with spears, long jaws, browridges, archeologist Clive Gamble of Southampton University in England told me. God, how odd it must have seemed to them. But that didn’t stop the Cook crew from making a lot of little Cooklets.

Project this universal human behavior back into the Middle Paleolithic. When Neanderthals and modern humans came into contact in the Levant, they would have interbred, no matter how strange they might initially have seemed to each other. If their cohabitation stretched over tens of thousands of years, the fossils should show a convergence through time toward a single morphological pattern, or at least some swapping of traits back and forth.

But the evidence just isn’t there, not if the TL and ESR dates are correct. Instead the Neanderthals stay staunchly themselves. In fact, according to some recent ESR dates, the least Neanderthalish among them is also the oldest. The full Neanderthal pattern is carved deep at the Kebara cave, around 60,000 years ago. The moderns, meanwhile, arrive very early at Qafzeh and Skhul and never lose their modern aspect. Certainly, it is possible that at any moment new fossils will be revealed that conclusively demonstrate the emergence of a Neandermod lineage. From the evidence in hand, however, the most likely conclusion is that Neanderthals and modern humans were not interbreeding in the Levant.


Shreve mentions that humans and Neanderthals may have occupied the Levant at different time periods (thus dealing with the lack of evidence of cross-breeding) but I believe that Vendramini's more recent study eliminates that possibility pretty thoroughly.

Next is the fact of the first modern humans appearing suddenly in the archaeological record:

 Vendramini ("Them and us") notes:

Quote
The speed of the Upper Palaeolithic revolution in the Levant was also breathtaking. Anthropologists Ofer Bar-Yosef and Bernard Vandermeersch:

Between 40,000 and 45,000 years ago the material culture of western Eurasia changed more than it had during the previous million years. This efflorescence of technological and artistic creativity signifies the emergence of the first culture that observers today would recognise as distinctly human, marked as it was by unceasing invention and variety. During that brief period of 5,000 or so years, the stone tool kit, unchanged in its essential form for ages, suddenly began to differentiate wildly from century to century and from region to region. Why it happened and why it happened when it did constitute two of the greatest outstanding problems in paleoanthropology.


Likewise Dwardu Cardona ("Flare Star"):

Quote
"Where and how the Cro Magnons first arose remains unknown.  Their appearance, however, coincided with the most bitter phase of the ice age.  There is, however, no doubt that they were more advanced, more sophisticated, than the Neanderthals with whom they shared the land.  Living in larger and more organized groups than had earlier humans, Cro Magnon peoples spread out until they populated most of the world.  Their tools, made of bone, stone, and even wood, were carved into harpoons, awls, and fish hooks.  They were presumably able hunters although, as with the Neanderthals, they would also have foraged to gather edible plants, roots, and wild vegetables.  The only problem here is that, as far as can be told, the Cro Magnons seem to have arrived on the scene without leaving a single trace of their evolutionary ancestors.  'When the first Cro Magnons arrived in Europe some 40,000 years ago', Ian Tattersall observed, 'they evidently brought with them more or less the entire panoply of behaviors that distinguishes modern humans from every other species that has ever existed.'"


We read a claim that we and the Neanderthal have a "common ancestor(TM)".  The Neanderthal has been abandoned as a plausible evolutionary antecedent for modern man precisely because the genetic gap is too large (DNA halfway between ours and that of a chimpanzee). Anything 300K - 500K years back which anybody could try to claim was a "common ancestor(TM)" to both us and the Neanderthal (Usually given as homo Heidelbergensis)", would be much more remote from us THAN the Neanderthal.  Too-genetically-remote-to-be-ancestral-to is a transitive relationship and the nature of such relationships doesn't require graduate level math;  you'd think the people making this particular claim would figure the problem out sooner or later but they don't seem to.

There is a new claim (Paabo and the Max Planck Institute) of 1 - 4% Neanderthal genes in everybody other than Africans.  That one is at odds with the undisputed knowledge of a recent severe population bottleneck (probably < 100 individuals on the planet) amongst modern humans.  As Vendramini's reconstructions show, the Neanderthal was a glorified ape.  Any crossbreeding with a glorified ape PRIOR to the bottleneck and Africans would not get left out.  Any crossing AFTER the bottleneck and not involving Africans as claimed, and the genetic gap between Africans and everyody else would be gigantic, rather than minuscule as it actually is.  Paabo and others making this claim need to go back to school for some sort of a basic logic course.

Not that the genetic evidence Paabo cites is fictitious mind you, just that it does not indicate actual cross breeding.  What it does indicate is the existence of a few low-level genetic components in different creatures.  Similarly, you'd find a few of the same low-level C language math functions in both banking software and rocket telemetry programs.  That does not mean that rocket control software is hacked from banking software.

Then there is the case of Wikipedia and the US Museum of Natural History:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neanderthal_anatomy

Wherein we observe a totally reconstructed skeleton with feet (bones at least) just like yours and mine courtesy of the US NatHist Museum and then a bit lower on the page from the Museum of Natural History in Prague, a real footprint which is very clearly that of an ape.  One guy in the talk section has tried to alert them to the fact that they have a problem, but it doen't seem to have taken.  Either the museum people really are that stupid, or they think we're that stupid.

Finally there is the problem of thinking that a Neanderthal male could/would rape a woman and, rather than cooking and eating her afterwards as usual, somehow or other keep her alive long enough to bear a cross-species child, raise that child to reproductive age, and have him/her breed back into human populations without anybody catching on.....

In real life:


Cro Magnons hated Neanderthals and other hominids enough to extirpate them root and branch from this planet.  There is zero way that they would have allowed any cross-breed to survive, even if such a cross-breed were possible which it clearly was not.  The basic, cold, hard reality is that no living human has any Neanderthal or other hominid blood in him/her whatsoever, or is descended from Neanderthals or any hominid in any way whatsoever.
26 posted on 10/25/2012 6:59:41 AM PDT by varmintman (November Sixth || Obunga is Through || Bork Obunga || Before He Borks You || Burma Shave)
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To: All
Another thing (aside from real evidence of cross breeding) which is missing from the arhaeological record for Neanderthals is needles. Cro Magnon needles are common but a creature with a six inch long fur coat, which you had to have to be the apex predator of the European ice age, clearly had no need for needles or clothing.

The person in the idiotic picture which appears at the top of this thread on the other hand would freeze to death in the first two minutes, bone needles and stitched furs or no.

27 posted on 10/25/2012 7:03:27 AM PDT by varmintman (November Sixth || Obunga is Through || Bork Obunga || Before He Borks You || Burma Shave)
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To: Renfield

Do they show him eating bushes?


28 posted on 10/25/2012 7:05:04 AM PDT by william clark (Ecclesiastes 10:2)
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To: eartrumpet

Oy.


29 posted on 10/25/2012 10:47:54 AM PDT by To Hell With Poverty (Ephesians 6:12 becomes more real to me with each news cycle.)
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To: william clark

Cosby...


30 posted on 10/26/2012 10:03:19 AM PDT by null and void (Day 1375 of our ObamaVacation from reality - Obama, a queer and present danger)
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