Posted on 11/13/2012 2:54:29 PM PST by bayliving
Ok, I come here looking for help and advice.
We are looking at getting an 80 day supply of food from "Foodinsurance.com" (if there is a better source for emergency food please let me know) and using the rest of our funds to purchase silver.
We already have the firearms and ammo thing covered.
I just want to know if there is a better use of our limited funds other than food and silver?
I would much rather use that money in other (fun) ways if I can.
I think that 14 days to 30 days of food, water and medicine is fine for disaster preparation. I think that more is a waste of time, and I think that purchasing silver (which is historically expensive at the moment), is unnecessary and a poor investment.
If you think we’re on the brink of some sort of Depression or economic reset, my advice would be to spend the money acquiring some sort of recession-proof skill. Go to night school to learn skilled machining, or get your EMT or Paramedic certification. Skills are the best trade goods, and once you have them, no one can take them away.
If I knew what was going to happen with certainty, I would be a gazillionaire.
Remember NO GAS, NO HEAT, NO PLUMPING!
Also try http://www.efoodsdirect.com/
They are similar to Food Insurance.
Do you have a reliable, independent source of water?
I've got that stuff from Costco, because I'm a cheap barstid, and I use it, not for SHTF, even though it would be handy to have.
Toilet paper is another bulk purchase I like. It's never going to get cheaper, and you are always going to need it.
/johnny
In terms of food, I like my local grocery store for emergency food. We store what we normally eat - just buy one or more months in advance. Spaghetti is good for a long time, as is rice, canned food, and a long list of other foods that you already eat. It's also cheaper than "emergency food", and you know how to cook it. A pound of starch (whether pasta or rice) has about 1600 calories, almost enough to feed one person for a day. Thus two 20 pound sacks of rice will feed a family for a month (not really, but it's a month's worth of food if it's paired with an equal number of calories from canned tuna/chicken/spam, canned tomato sauce, canned soup, canned fruit, etc. All I would do is freeze the rice and pasta for three days to kill any bugs or eggs, and then store it in a plastic container. Otherwise, the shelf food from your local grocery is ready for your emergency pantry.
If you have a month of emergency food (or three months, or a year) and rotate it with new purchases, eating 1/12 of the stored food every month or two, your stored food is always in date and fresh.
Nobody knows for sure, but I think the precious metals are due for another rise soon, and I think that silver is probably a better bet than gold at this juncture.
Also, if you’re talking about survival, then I’m not sure how much good a gold bar would be, especially if you’re talking about moderate funds. Most likely silver coins would be a better bet, and nothing fancy at that, but just something you could exchange with real people in the neighborhood.
You might also want to give some thought to useful stuff that will keep, like toothpaste, aspirin, bandaids, toilet paper, soap, razor blades. If the S doesn’t HTF, then you can always use that kind of stuff, and it will probably keep going up in price, so the money’s not wasted. FWIW, I find that beer will keep in a cool place out of the sun for at least a year.
Advise to title threads with something like ‘Thinking of purchasing emergency food’, or ‘preparedness food’ and silver’.
It’s always a personal decision based on what you are preparing for. You build a matrix of what might happen and the impact of what happens vs. the likelihood then direct your resources accordingly.
1. 10 mile diameter asteroid impact is not very likely but devastation would be complete, so you’d have to get off the planet. If you had $4000 Billion dollars you could build a compound on Mars. But since it isn’t likely and you can’t afford to mitigate it, look to see what you can do for another item in the matrix.
2. Bank failures leading to a month of financial chaos, food shortages and urban riots. Given where we are, odds might be 20% that could happen. So extra money (silver), food, and protection (guns and ammo)could help you weather that.
3. SHTF - EOTWAWKI - maybe less than 1% chance, but part of mitigating it overlaps with #2 on your list, so makes sense to start with that prep anyway. You’d have to add some self sustainability, like being able to grow you own food, etc. in this scenario.
Bottom line, you have to eat, you don’t want to end up in the middle of a food riot to do that, or a FEMA camp, so I’d go with as much food as you can store if you are in a safe area, and as much as you can carry with the balance in silver if you are not in a safe area. Even if you have weapons and know how to use them, if you end up having to it will be a bad day.
In a serious collapse, silver would be hard to barter with. Generally, silver has value due to manufacturing needs (among others), and in a bad downturn, that would obviously be lacking.
Now gold, in small allotments such as coins, not bars, would have some value in bartering. But, generally you should think of it as a hedge against the devaluing of the currency, not necessarily a SHTF type situation.
But funny you post this, as I’m currently looking into buying gold finally, along with the assorted costs (safe deposit bank rental, insurance on same) which all have a price. But, I finally pulled everything out of the stock market (except for one stock that involves the WAMU bankruptcy, remember that?). Buying of gold is just a hedge, not a alternative to a total meltdown. In that case, yeah, food, water, ammo, medical supplies, although not necessarily in the order...
“...freeze the rice and pasta for three days to kill any bugs or eggs, and then store it in a plastic container.”
I’m with you on everything else - but have never heard of putting the starches in my deep freezer for 3 days - makes sense though.
I do think a small amount of silver coins would be a good thing - not an investment; just as recognizable currency (well) after SHTF.
Food is food. By more of what you already eat. If you want to really cover you butt, buy some filler in bulk. 40 lb. bags of rice are relatively cheap.
Make sure you have several firearms and plenty of ammunition. Silver is an iffy proposition. Supposing a real SHTF situation, I don’t care much about precious metals.
Google search: “About 2,060,000 results (0.37 seconds)”
It’s not supposed to be perfect, but it helps a whole lot, depending on how cold and how long you freeze it for. I have had bugs on rare occasions in rice/flour/pasta that had not been frozen, but never in something I froze, even when stored for over a year.
No. We have "city" water. However, I do live close to the bay and have a very low water table so I guess I could dig a hole and dip water out of it to sterilize.
Probably not a good idea though...
Good luck and God Speed!
Before you go blow a bunch of money, read through some online lists/advice like http://www.survivalblog.com/
You’re not the first, so borrow other people’s knowledge.
For my own 2 cents, I’d avoid buying “survival foods” and having them shipped to me. Those companies are good outfits and decent people, but you can do much better economically stocking up in local big stores/discount stores. Just think about it, why would you pay a premium and shipping charges to have a #10 can of rice mailed to you? For MRE’s and the like online it’s fine, but for survival basics just go to the dang store and load up on staples that last. Your study of survival blogs will tell you what to get and how to store it. And as always, integrate basics into your diet before the crunch, so you don’t go directly from McDonald’s to beans and rice with the not too fun digestive consequences. And start gardening!
As for metals, again just my 2 cents, instead of buying some online outfits silver bars or micro mint pieces, just start a silver coin collection if you have that hankering. Pre 1964, let’s say. It’s recognized and likely to be honored everywhere. If the SHTF scenario doesn’t come, you have a nice little investment. If it does, US coins with recognized silver content will be easier to trade than some dubious hunks of metal from Joe’s Website.
JMHO, best of luck to ya!
Don't allow yourself to get overwhelmed by all of the essentials. I, myself, have spent ten years prepping. If I had tries to acquire all that I have now instantaneously back then, I would have sat down and cried and just given up. Plan your purchases, do it briskly but within your means and keep your eye on the objective.
Food Insurance is a decent line, but you can save quite a bit of money by purchasing individual essentials from Emergency Essentials. They are now my ONLY source.
I went to LDS purchased cans lids and oxygen absorbers.
they lent me the canner.
i then bought 50 pound bags of milk flour sugar rice beans and oatmwal. canned them up in a few hours. costs 400.
i have several months of food. most cans last up to 20-30 years..
do not use ox absorbers in sugar.
bought 275 gallon water cistern for 100.00.
bought rain diversion kits for 80 at amazon.
invested in 10 bags of calcium hypoclorite(pool shock 78%) for water treatment. Cost 40.00 . does 100,000 gallons.
BJ’s, Costco or Sam’s Club. Pallets of canned ham, canned beef, canned pasta, canned soup, canned vegetables that are at least one year away from expiration. It is cheap. It doesn’t look weird to buy large flats of cans. They are easy to stack for storage. You save money over freeze dried while building up stores. It is easy to rotate by using up each layer of the flat. Buy what you’ll eat, then eat some while putting the rest back in a storage location. Canned items also overwhelmingly save effort, since much of it can be eaten without cooking or requiring additional water, a major issue if utilities are shut down.
Lighters, and smokes.
www.providentmetals.com
And Chew! Here in my part of the Redneck Redoubt a gift of chewing tobacco can earn you a friend for life, if he is out! It stores fairly well and it’s 1/3 the costs of pre-rolled cigs. While not a dipper myself, I can see chewing tobacco as something pretty useful in a crunch type situation for trade or to help those unfortunate souls who are suffering nicotine fits. Now a serious prepper would order some tobacco seeds, but I’m not that serious ;)
I have a lot to look over and some very good approaches to "prepping" for what I see as some very bad times ahead...
Food before silver if your budget is limited.
My fave is www.waltonfeed.com
They sell grains, powdered milk, etc. in #10 cans and 6 gal. pails. Some of the stuff will keep for several decades unless you open it.
I bought a grain mill and make my own 8 grain flour with grain mix from them. Along with a bread machine that means top quality, very healthy bread. Keep your flour in the fridge to prevent spoilage (no preservatives).
I also eat a lot of their organic brown rice which I keep in the freezer.
You will save enough money in a year to pay for a pallet of food from them. A few hundred dollars will provide enough basics to feed a family for a year.
I am with the others. If $4000 is all you have, then buy food. Everyone has to eat and food will be the ultimate barter good. Buy bulk bags of rice, pasta and lots of cans of tomato sauce, and don’t forget multivitamins.
An ounce of gold is very compact and has tremendous purchasing power but would be useless in a barter situation as how would anyone make change for a $1700 bar of gold?
Coins, preferably of US mint of pre-1964 vintage, are 90% silver. They are easy to recognize, come in small enough increments which makes it reasonable to barter, and are easy to acquire (APMEX for one) any amount from one at a time to sacks of a specified face value, priced at current spot price for silver content.
If your looking for a hedge against hyperinflation either gold or silver bullion is preferred over junk coins. Know your dealer, fake bullion (loaded with tungsten) is out there.
Regards,
GtG
Gold and silver make you a target (especially for the ruling elite). Seeds, fertilizer, sprayers, garden tools, and food storage equipment are a much better investment. Put in a chicken coop if you have room.
The best investment is to insure that you live among trustworthy people. I moved a few years ago from Suburban DC, to that small community in Kentucky where I grew up. Not much going on here, but I’m surrounded by people I’ve known all my life, and can trust in a crisis.
For an 80 day supply why not buy stuff you normally eat at the grocery. Set up a spreadsheet noting when the item was bought, what box it is in, and what the expiration date is. After you get to the point where you have six months worth then look at foods that have a shelf life of at least a decade. There are lots of foods in buckets that are not too price. Look at Emergency Essentials, the Survival Mom, efoods, and Capt Daves. Don’t just compare prices, compare calories per day. BTW, for $4,000 you can buy more than a year’s worth of regular food.
google selco bosina shtf. Guy has a survival blog from living in Serbia during the war. One of his comments was how even cash money quickly becomes worthless. If he had spent his money on candles, toilet paper, etc. BEFORE the crisis he would have been in great shape to trade. Although he did mention how early on in the crisis he payed $50 for a loaf of bread.
I recall one of his blogs where he talked about how the women would prostitute themselves for a tin of spam.
note: some people don’t think he is real. However, all of the accounts seem VERY believable, and probably have/do occur in such extreme situations.
Focus on water first. Food grade buckets to collect water from a nearby source, garbage cans for rain water, water for washing. Water filter, like a Berkey for purification. Water storage such as 55 gallon food grade barrels. If you have your own well, try to get an independent power source to run the well.
Oh, one other thing, if you are going to spend 4 grand on “survival”, set aside a few hundred for books/library fines. Why? Knowledge beats gadgets/stuff in the long term.
Get the old reader’s digest Back to Basics, Country Living, etc., browse survival blogs for other good books. Books on gardening, canning, a few simple trades/repair books. Then PRACTICE!
Most people in America today couldn’t sprout a seed to save their lives. Even if they got lucky and somehow grew a garden after SHTF, could they preserve their harvest?
The fact that you are even thinking about the future puts you ahead of most, so best of luck and hope to see ya on the other side!
I had a question on canned food expiration dates, my Spaghettio’s are “Best by 10-21-10”, can I still eat them? (I didn’t ever consider having to rotate stock, but never considered some voters were really continually that stupid and the fraud.)
Here’s my search result;
http://www.foodreference.com/html/tcannedfoodshelflife.html
Canned food has a shelf life of at least two years from the date of processing. Canned food retains its safety and nutritional value well beyond two years, but it may have some variation in quality, such as a change of color and texture. Canning is a high-heat process that renders the food commercially sterile. Food safety is not an issue in products kept on the shelf or in the pantry for long periods of time. In fact, canned food has an almost indefinite shelf life at moderate temperatures (75° F and below). Canned food as old as 100 years has been found in sunken ships and it is still microbiologically safe! We don’t recommend keeping canned food for 100 years, but if the can is intact, not dented or bulging, it is edible.
In a well-run supermarket, foods on the shelf will be rotated on a regular basis, so there is continuous turnover. Each canned food manufacturer has a unique coding system. Some manufacturers list day, month and year of production, while other companies reference only the year. These codes are usually imprinted on the top or bottom of the can. Other numbers may appear and reference the specific plant manufacturing or product information and are not useful to consumers.
Laterday saints are stocking 2 yrs food....good instructions there..http://lds.about.com/od/preparednessfoodstorage/p/foodstorage.htm.
Silver is historically 15 to 1 with gold so it should be at 114.98 today..if it were following historical trends...
If it is truly a SHTF event, Banks will be locked up tight in the first few hours making "safe" deposit boxes of little value. Insurance companies will probably be swamped with claims as well and I would have doubts as to any help from that avenue.
Invest in a good safe, bolt it to the basement floor, and keep your own council as to what you do or do not have on hand. You might consider building a false wall in front of the "stash".
Regards,
GtG
There is also http://ferfal.blogspot.com/
He documents events during the economic meltdown in Argentina, coming soon to a nation near you!
Wrote a book on how it went down and how people are trying to survive now, but his blog is free with some interesting observations. You don’t have to agree with everything, but it is interesting. Pretty horrific economic collapse tale. Could it happen here? I am beginning to think that the econ collapse scenarios is by far the most likely SHTF event we will face in the next five years.
But I ain’t ruling out mutant zombies.
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One thing I would highly recommend is don’t tell anyone what your doing ever - even immediate family members outside of your spouse and kids and sometimes not even them. I have seen them turn crazy abscessed when I showed them some precious metals (only a small amount) and they told everyone. Keep things to your self.
Ditto for alcoholic beverages. A good supply of whisky and wine might help you in bartering in a crisis. Keep it well-hidden.
I defy you to tell the differece, once mixed and cooled overnight, from regular milk.
Bob’w also has dried whey powder, powdered buttermilk, lots of gluten-free mixes (GREAT pancake mix), buttermilk biscuit mix, corn grits, on and on.
theses are things you can eat regularly, no waste.And they are delicious.
Aslo, you can OVEN CAN them and they will last 20-30 years. Super simple way to store dry goods. Only needs canning jars and an oven.
I would avoid buyng online. There will be record - and if TSHTF, you can get a knock on the door. You are now a ‘hoarder’ not a storer. That makes you a felon - and they will take your food.
Stay under the radar.
I plan by the way I grew up - I’m a great grandmother - on a little farm on a ridge road with no electricity. We lived well.
If you can sell without being ‘under’, you may want to think about moving to where you have your own well for water and a spot for gardening. Or take half your money and make a deal for a piece of land - land is mostly sold through owner finance. If you have a piece of land, even if only a couple acres, with wood and garden space - near some source of water and/or can hand dig a shallow well, put on a pump...put up a shelter, put in a wood stove: shelter, waer, food, heat.
Learn the edible wild foods in the area. Learn how to fish, if you don’t know. Raise chickens for meat/eggs and rabbits for meat. I.e. foods that ‘reproduce” themselves...and good for bartering.
And for G’ds aake, don’t buy MRE’s!
I defy you to tell the differece, once mixed and cooled overnight, from regular milk.
Bob’w also has dried whey powder, powdered buttermilk, lots of gluten-free mixes (GREAT pancake mix), buttermilk biscuit mix, corn grits, on and on.
theses are things you can eat regularly, no waste.And they are delicious.
Aslo, you can OVEN CAN them and they will last 20-30 years. Super simple way to store dry goods. Only needs canning jars and an oven.
I would avoid buyng online. There will be record - and if TSHTF, you can get a knock on the door. You are now a ‘hoarder’ not a storer. That makes you a felon - and they will take your food.
Stay under the radar.
I plan by the way I grew up - I’m a great grandmother - on a little farm on a ridge road with no electricity. We lived well.
If you can sell without being ‘under’, you may want to think about moving to where you have your own well for water and a spot for gardening. Or take half your money and make a deal for a piece of land - land is mostly sold through owner finance. If you have a piece of land, even if only a couple acres, with wood and garden space - near some source of water and/or can hand dig a shallow well, put on a pump...put up a shelter, put in a wood stove: shelter, waer, food, heat.
Learn the edible wild foods in the area. Learn how to fish, if you don’t know. Raise chickens for meat/eggs and rabbits for meat. I.e. foods that ‘reproduce” themselves...and good for bartering.
And for G’ds aake, don’t buy MRE’s!
If the TSHTF, the real ‘silver/gold’ will be bartering goods, especially food.
a bag of dried vegetables makes a better soup than a silver dollar.
a bar of soap, a box of matches, a candle - a kerosene lamp would worth it’s weight in silver.
Don’t be an idiot.
Just buy 6 or 10 times what you normally buy of dried and canned goods.
If TSdoes’tHTF you’re saving money on future food bills, if it does you’re ready (food-wise).
So spend the four grand to save.
Check out this guy. He runs the SHTF ping list and has a preparedness manual (free I believe?).
My advice is make sure you have a few firearms of common caliber and a good deal of ammo before the prices go up.
From there, I recommend adding to your food stores at each shopping trip; I try to use one, buy two (or three) and sometimes more so when there are sales. Buy what you eat and eat what you buy.
It is nice to have MREs for emergency, but you'll want "normal" food too; trust me on that one.
One thing with prepping, it is a marathon, not a sprint. You can always ALWAYS ALWAYS use more; just don't go for broke all in one go.
Lastly, I saw a few folks recommend bulk food....if you go the freeze dried route, be careful of some companies (WISE) that claim a 25 year shelf life, but would be lucky to get 3-5 years.
Yep, completely agree, which is why I pointed out to him he should not be worrying about that.
I’m only looking into in case SHTF does NOT happen, but our currency sill gets devalued.
Hands down for silver- Gainesville Coin at gainesvillcoin.com. Best deal online.
Food- Emergency Essentials at beprepared.com. Shipping will usually eat you alive for food. Not here. Good Luck.
Oh and one other valuable thing to hoard: feminine hygiene products. Most people won’t think of hoarding these, but women will want them in a crisis.
Instead of silver I would buy Liquor and matches- Easy to store and I could sell these items or barter with them.
I drink scotch but am stockpiling quarts of Jim Beam.
It’s quality generic, holds its value, doesn’t go bad and since drunks often seem to be the only ones carted away alive from the catastrophic car wrecks they cause, I’m banking the same for apocalyptic conditions.
Liquid gold, series. But keep your shootin’ iron handy.
(And if things really go south, you’re covered there too.)
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