Skip to comments.We can't secede, we are Americans
Posted on 11/14/2012 4:25:19 PM PST by West Texas Chuck
Even, or maybe especially, here in Texas.
If it made any sense at all I would follow what my bumper sticker says. But we cannot separate from The Union. Our country is at risk and I say we have to stay and fight.
The average American today doesn’t have the fortitude to secede from their Home Owners Association.
No states are leaving the union.
The secession talk is just a fantasy being kicked around by some very disappointed voters.
This country as it was founded began to end in the late 19th century with the decline accelerating since 1913. The union, as was founded, is now dead. When this asshole Obama states that government is “the one thing we all belong to” (he has it exactly backwards, as usual), and people vote for him, it’s over.
” I plan on becoming a teacher and goodness knows that they dont get paid crap.”
Nothing personal, but the above line is simply false. Considering the salaries of teachers, and the abysmal competence of the graduates of programs under the “expert educators”, a case can be made that teachers are overpaid.
Indeed, they and their UNIONS could be considered to be engaging in i proper enrichment.
Addendum to post 43:
“engaging in i proper enrichment” should be
“engaging in improper enrichment”.
Texas would be the 14th largest economy in the world the day it seceded before it started keeping the 80 cents of every dollar that gets sent to Washington. And I seriously doubt Texas would put up with unfettered illegal immigration, massive entitlement programs and inner city poverty pimps busing ineligible voters to the polls.
There would be no cohesiveness and the remaining states would tax the crap out of the separatists.
I'm thinking your not understanding the concept. Taxing across national boundaries is pretty hard to pull off.
Whether or not we need an external enemy to hate and organize against to be united, I suspect we need the United States to be American. What I'm saying is that a lot of people espouse "American values" because we are American citizens. We've been brought up to believe those values and have seen how successful freedom and responsibility have made our country.
Somebody will doubtless say that truth is truth, freedom is freedom, and that if the country we live in allows us freedom it could be as small as Liechtenstein or Monaco. I'm making an empirical argument, though, not a moral or abstractly rationalistic one. For a lot of people, if they see the country break up, it changes something for them, it weakens their commitment to older values.
Break up the country and there's bound to be a feeling that in some sense the country -- and its ideals -- have failed. One could argue against that and say it shouldn't be so, but I suspect that the feeling of defeat will be a lot stronger than any rationalizations about how much better things will be in the former United States once we've gotten rid of Washington DC's power over us.
Some people will say that they are Texans or Southerners or Californians or Vermonters rather than Americans, but a lot of those distinctions make sense in the context of the United States. You may be a Texan against New Yorkers or a Californian against Mississippi, but if we were in different countries and you or I couldn't vote in every election against some other part of the country, those convictions wouldn't be as strong. Politics would reorganize itself around differences within states and regions rather than differences between states and regions. It might be hard to recognize today's political and ideological landscape after the dissolution of the union.
If we were a half dozen countries in a world of about 200 other countries, if we weren't part of a large and powerful country that could hold out against foreign trends, the tendency would probably be to assimilate to international norms. Once different parts of the country become independent they'll all start to flow in the same direction that European countries do, some faster, some slower, some sooner some later, but the bulwark against those changes will be gone.
It's hard for me to express all this, but I'd caution against thinking that everybody is like the most ideologically committed among us or that if you rope off the right people in the right area you can resist what we see going on around us every day. Real people are a part of that world that we see around us and reflect the behavior that they see in life and on television. Changing borders isn't going to change any of that and make people different from what they are. It could even make people worse, by doing away with an important cornerstone of people's convictions.
Exactly the point.
Seceding is how America came to be; it seceded from that tyranny that was English rule. Now that our present Government has become that same tyranny we left perhaps it is time to ‘Renew The Tree Of Liberty’.
And the ‘house divided’? Those who choose to break off from the beast would surely join together to reform - much as the 13 States did in the 19th century - but this time the greater weight of strength and resources would be to a new Republic, obedient to the will of the people.
Tis a shame it isn't going to happen.
I was speaking of tariffs to take things across borders. It would be insane, the seceded states would have higher tariffs than China to take items across.
“The withdrawal of a State from a league has no revolutionary or insurrectionary characteristic. The government of the State remains unchanged as to all internal affairs. It is only its external or confederate relations that are altered. To term this action of a Sovereign a ‘rebellion’ is a gross abuse of language.” — President Davis
I should have been more specific. I’m planning on majoring in early childhood education, meaning that I’ll probably end up working at almost minimum wage depending on which preschool or daycare I get hired at. As for teachers being overpaid, even though I agree with what you say about the unions, it makes me angry that many GOOD teachers in small school districts get paid a fraction of what some horrible teachers in large school districts get paid. Yet at the same time we have politicians, actors, musicians, etc. who are paid millions to shove their liberal agenda down our throats and “entertain” us. If you ask me, that’s pretty sad.
Had I been alive at the time, I would hope that I would have left MA and gone south to fight for the real principles that founded this nation.
The libs on my Facebook site are up in arms over this protest and want to see citizenship stripped for those who have signed the petitions. LOL. As far as I’m concerned, the petition to seccude is a valid protest that is very, very vocal. It’s the strongest way possible a private citizen has at this point to voice his or her outrage.
If they offer a petition for Kansas, I’ll sign it, knowing full well nothing will come of it.
What however it interesting, is the fact that this many people are outraged to the point of actually signing a petition.
In my humble opinion we’re all screwed, so hubs and I are protecting our assests, and our family, to the best of our ability.
Maybe the Myans had something with that calendar.
Why do you think the founders made each state a mini country in political structure? It is like we are all blind, the solution to Fed tyranny is right in front of us, big as day.
I plan on becoming a teacher and goodness knows that they dont get paid crap.
Nothing personal, but the above line is simply false. Considering the salaries of teachers, and the abysmal competence of the graduates of programs under the expert educators, a case can be made that teachers are overpaid.
Indeed, they and their UNIONS could be considered to be engaging in i proper enrichment.
As an “old” person in the field of public education -for 30 + years, I beg to differ. Having an MS degree and years of experience, I am paid not much more than 50,000 per year. Granted, I have good medical insurance benefits, and I have a retirement plan -that will soon change under Obumbo. However, I work MORE than 40 hours per week during the school calendar. I know, you are thinking of the holidays and summer vacation. Well, you are misinformed/you have a misperception. (I AM NOT a member of the NEA.)
YOU cannot fathom what public school teachers deal with on a daily basis. PLEASE, come spend a week with me...
I try to teach 7th grade math. Many days class is a “joke” to the students I am trying to teach - NEVER to me.
At this point in my diatribe, I could ramble on and on... Won’t do any good anyway...
...Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, ...
When elected officials and bureaucracies act outside the law they are simply lawbreakers. When the majority of the people vote in favor of the lawlessness that has greatly manifested itself in the highest offices they have withdrawn their consent to be governed by a constitutional government. By what legitimate basis does the United States of America, as a Constitutional republic, still exist?
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
'The People' no longer support that. They voted in support of lawlessness from the highest office on down. They voted against the rule of law. By referendum we now have a banana republic. The USAINO.
Why? Because you say so? Just because you can conjure a worst case scenario doesn't mean it has any connection to reality.
It is likely that if one state were to go, more would follow. They would probably form some sort of federation and may simply adopt the US constitution with some modifications to prevent the current mess we find ourselves in (forbid entitlements, place limits on commerce and general welfare clauses and restrict voting).
We have a successful model, it isn't like someone needs to invent fusion reactors to make it work.
The hard part is the secession itself, and that is simply an agreement/treaty to be forged. That too has been successfully done by far less capable nations.
We must secede, we are Americans
What, pray tell, is your successful model? Worse case scenarios have to be considered FIRST not last. Isn’t that what we do to prepare anything?
No, it’s not because “I say so.” Just thinking out loud.
The US constitution.
No need to secede. Simply stop supporting the parasites, who suck large incomes from the beast without being real producers. They only talk as though they’re producing more than socially pathological propaganda (government schools), regulatory obstacles against real production, destruction of other people’s families, etc. Avoid buying anything that you don’t really need. Become more self-sufficient each month. Learn to manufacture something useful as a hobby for now, to become a real producer in the near future.
In other words, starve the B. Have fun. Enjoy the slide.