Skip to comments.Why Apple Can't Deny Google Maps On iPhone
Posted on 11/17/2012 5:58:20 AM PST by ExxonPatrolUs
Google has nearly completed work on a new version of Google Maps for the iPhone. Citing sources familiar with Google's plans, The Wall Street Journal reported that Google is now field testing the app outside of Google. It should soon be ready for Google to submit to Apple for approval.
Apple booted Google Maps from the iPhone, iPad and iPod Touch earlier this year with the introduction of iOS 6. Google Maps was a part of iOS from the very first iPhone through September of this year -- a partnership that lasted more than five years. But Apple has been divorcing itself from Google's goods and services ever since the two began battling head-to-head with competing smartphone platforms.
Apple replaced Google Maps with its own mapping product. Embarrassingly for Apple, Apple Maps has been a complete failure.
(Excerpt) Read more at mobile.informationweek.com ...
Apple is TOO proprietary, IMO. However, it is because of their hardware-specific programming that their products work so well.
That being said, they’re “pulling a Microsoft” by denying the world’s largest online cartographer on their own phones. I understand their reason for doing it: promotion of a competitor’s product, but the simple fact that their own product failed so miserably AND so many people in the world have come to rely on Google maps for wayfinding, it makes more sense for them to just suck it up and drop support for their own dreadful app while standing by their third-party app support model: don’t blame us if it doesn’t work!
I don't care for Apple because of this. But, I don't care for Google because of its insatiable appetite to track every thought and action a person has ever considered - including breaking into their WiFi network from their specially equipped vans that are taking pictures of every thing in sight - harvesting all of the personal information they can get their little Orwellian sniffer on (passwords, private emails, contact lists, programs installed, IP and MAC addresses)...
Then again, Gmail is good enough for our CIA Director - so what do I know?
I delayed upgrading to the new iOS because of the negative hype on the map application. Finally went ahead with the upgrade. So far, it’s been GREAT. The voice directions when driving are fantastic as a now free inclusion.
Failure? What, the iOS6 maps are great, way better than google.
These electronic platforms are useless without controlling the Apps and data that run on them. This is corporate warfare -- survival of the fitest. Who has the better hardware or software is often beside the point (though it is a factor).
Not true. The hardware/software discussion is the largest part of the equation.
Apple locks their users into specific hardware for use with their software. Their software works exceptionally well, because it is designed to function flawlessly on the hardware on which it ships. For instance, you can’t install iOS on an ASUS motherboard with nVIDIA graphics cards and expect the same performance or stability as with what they ship it now.
On the other side of the coin, Microsoft tries to be everything to everyone, and as a result, you have a security-hole-ridden, bloated set of software that’s expected to run on a dishwasher if you have enough disk space. Then when you want support for a fault, failure, or operating SNAFU, you spend hours or even days finding answers on the web, installing software, scanning, snooping, monitoring, and even if you find the problem, you often create new ones down the line.
Then you’ve got the middle ground with Linux. Linux can be installed on almost anything from a LiveCD (or USB disk), and generally only the necessary drivers, firmware, and software are installed based on the preferences of the user. There is, however, much less professional, paid support, and unless you’re doing the basic web, email, videos, pictures, and music thing, you’re likely going to spend a lot of time in a bash CLI.
I understand controlling interests for corporations, and I don’t fault Apple for their decision to do what they did. I do not believe, however, that they’re going to overtake Google in something that they’ve already perfected over the course of the last 10 years. Just like with YouTube, people are going to flock back to what they know if it’s taken away from them but still left out there as an option.
We used the maps application to get us to our honeymoon destination, and I agree, it was pretty neat and very accurate.
It’s more about market dominance. A temporary advantage in hardware or software can be very important to winning a battle in the overall war. If you can hem your opponent in to a small slice of the market even the best platform goes obsolete very quickly.
Apple maps suck. So do their iPhones for Bluetooth and voice commands. Neither work. We switched to Android phones this past month. The Bluetooth works perfectly and so does the voice commands. Motorola RAZR M phones. They work far better than the Apple iPone 4 trash that we had.
If you want on or off the Mac Ping List, Freepmail me.
Yeah, look where that secure email got him. LOL!
You might have an argument there if game consoles did not exist.
Yes, but consider the options in the market for these products. Apple products, while they work well, are obscenely priced over other big manufacturer options (i.e. HP or Dell) or even DIY-ers who build custom machines.
Do you actually own any Apple product?
I think they’re pretty pricey, but what you get is worth it. You have to buy into their closed world, but it’s a very good world. We only currently own a Ipad V1, but it’s been solid. Getting ready to outfit my wifey with a mini-mac. Personally, I’d LOVE to have one of those Mac Pro towers with the 12 core processing, dual GPUs, etc. But that’s dreaming. No can afford.
Not entirely true - you might want to look at "Hackintosh" and you will see that there are some clever boot-loaders that do precisely what you are suggesting. There are thousands (if not close to a million) assorted users who are booting into the Apple OSX environment without purchasing a single apple product. However, IMHO you would be best served procuring a Gigabyte motherboard for this exercise, as they seem to work very well without any hiccups at all. For some reason, Gigabyte motherboards "mysteriously" seem to support Apple configurations - and it is quite easy to build a better Mac, than what Apple sells in the Mac Pro market-space (at a fraction of the cost, btw).
Your point with MSFT is quite true, spent years doing regression testing when I worked R&D for both Intel and AMD. Although "Compatible" and "Compliant" may appear to by synonyms - there are subtle differences that make life absolute hell to the motherboard designers. MSFT works on literally tens, if not hundreds of thousands of potential combinations of components, processors, memory, peripherals - that is a HUGE undertaking.
However, the very strengths you list for Linus are equally legitimate with the OSX, as it is based off the Darwin kernel of Unix.
Might I make one small suggestion? Buy the minimum configuration ($599) and then hop over to Amazon.com and drop $58.99 on 16 Gig of RAM. It's super easy to install, and works like a champ! Or, you could pay Apple $200 to install them for you. I did, and shall we say that the performance of the i5 chipset on the Mac Mini absolutely screams when you go from 2 Gig to 16 Gig.
IMHO, best $60 upgrade you can buy.
Granted, some people reported “issues” with iOS 6 and finding destinations with the Apple maps. I do not dispute this, if they say that they had a problem, I believe them.
However, I live in the US, in a fairly low population state, with sporadic population areas (Utah) - I have not noticed the issues that everyone else is reporting. Wont’ say that there isn’t a problem, but I will say that these “Problems” haven’t affected me in the slightest. I actually prefer using the Apple maps to the old Google maps.
Why would I have a preference? Because the Apple maps use Vectored maps areas - as I zoom into them, I don’t need to “reload” new tiles - the street names appear when there is room for them to appear. Compared to Google, every pinch is a new download - which is inconvenient when you are navigating to a destination, and don’t know how close you are to a landmark. With poor service in my area (hello, AT&T) - the Apple vector mapping solution is a quite superior experience compared to the constant re-downloading you get with Google maps.
I have an iPhone 4s, an iPad, and an older iPod.
To date, the only thing I miss about the Google version of maps was that it was much easier to see their green/yellow/red traffic indicators than the new Maps’ dashed red line. Otherwise, the new version has been in all ways superior.
I worked in several design shops and architected numerous hardware solutions in my 20 years in IT, but none of them involved Apple products if for no other reason than the fact that we couldn’t get support for the OS once the system was running.
I wouldn’t use compatible or compliant interchangeably, as in my world, they mean two very different things.
That aside, I want to reiterate that I’m not bashing Apple. I’m simply stating that from a proprietary hardware/software matching standard, they’ve got the market cornered. Yes, while you can install OSX on “third-party” hardware, you make my point for me by showing that Gigabyte “mysteriously” works with their hardware. The point is that Apple only SUPPORTS hardware/software combinations that they design and develop. Like I said initially, you could install Windows 98 on a toaster if you had the motivation and drive to do so.
If you crack open an Apple product, most of the chips and mainboard components are either nebulously numbered or devoid of any manufacturer’s markings unless you know where to look. However, the same dozen or so PCB manufacturers in China make the overwhelming majority of hardware for today’s computing devices, so it stands to reason that there’s always going to be some particular brand that works better than others with Apple or even HP/Dell.
I think the crux of the matter is that Apple uses Intel design reference standards, like everyone else. However, whereas most Intel boards are still using some version of BIOS, Apple is using EFI. Many of the motherboards out now support EFI - however it doesn’t appear to have gathered much traction. Add to this the non NTFS format that Apple uses, and you have difficulties.
However, while Gigabyte appears to work seamlessly in booting OSX of various flavors; you can find guides to support practically any Intel/AMD motherboard out there.
Once you get it booted - they are pretty robust builds. The trouble, of course, is working around the various Unix subtlies that 95% of the techie population isn’t familiar with. I’ve done it, it wasn’t easy- in fact it was painful - but I’ve done it with a Core 2 Quad on an nVidia chipset board made by Asus.
All in all, we are pretty much in agreement. Apple has opted NOT to compete directly with MSFT, and thus make the “intentional” hiccup when it comes to booting the random Intel/AMD board. But, this approach seems to be working for them pretty well. Not too bad for a company that was started in a garage with just a few geeks and a lot of hope, sweat and dreams.
My biggest gripe with Apple is price point. I understand you’re buying a stable product with fewer inherent headaches, but I will never be able to justify spending the money they want for an Apple device when I could spend comparably on a custom PC with much more impressive specs and liquid cooling.
For the record, I LOVE EFI and have fully embraced it, but I don’t see it replacing BIOS quite yet. They have some bugs to work out.
Whose online instructions did you use for installing that ram on your mac mini (your model and link please)?
I tried a while ago on an older model mac mini and it was NOT simple.
“I worked in several design shops and architected numerous hardware solutions in my 20 years in IT, but none of them involved Apple products if for no other reason than the fact that we couldnt get support for the OS once the system was running.”
Exactly what kind of support for a running Apple OS system were you looking for that you didn’t get?
What about the game consoles? Those are extremely closed off.
Are you saying that's something new?
Garmin and Google have both had turn-by-turn voice directions (in country-appropriate voices) for years.
Welcome to the XXI Century ...
That is a very scary thought. GMAIL reads every email that passes through it's servers, and any attachments that are in those emails. It then uses an algorithm to direct marketing spam to people based on key words it finds.
It is entirely possible that within the gmail servers, there are proprietary documents that people don't even know about. What's more, there might be national security documents in there!
I should’ve qualified that by saying that the client had specific hardware needs that were not compatible with Apple’s proprietary configurations. That’s not to say that an Apple shop wouldn’t work, but we had to use Intel Xeon processors, nVidia GPUs and HP mainboards.
Even if we could’ve hacked the OS to work on the hardware, Apple wouldn’t have supported the OS configuration after the system was stood up, and in the enterprise world, that’s a big deal.
ifixit.com has good step-by-step instructions. I used them to upgrade RAM in my 2007-vintage Mini (not for the faint of heart), and to replace a hard drive in an old G3 iBook (not to be attempted by the sane). The older Minis are a pain, with putty knives to pry the case open and all that jazz; the recent ones, since mid-2010, it’s dead easy. There’s a panel on the bottom that screws off and the RAM is right there.
“The older Minis are a pain, with putty knives to pry the case open and all that jazz; the recent ones, since mid-2010, its dead easy. Theres a panel on the bottom that screws off and the RAM is right there.”
Thx, and never mind Hodar, ROE answered it (the one I tried was 2007-8).
Having done major support for hundreds of mac users (and helped out with support for hundreds more PC users dipping into a mac server) at a few fortune 500 clients years ago, all of whom had some fairly sophisticated (not retail) scanning, telecom and printing needs, I am curious as to exactly what HW and/or custom SW your client was using (the industry is fine, if not the actual name) that needed specific processors, GPU’s & HP mainboards.
WADR, it sounds like someone wrote some specs in an RPF that made it impossible to buy anything but a specific VAR’s config (that supported MS or UNIX only...).
Bzzzzzt. Apple Mac Pros shipped with top of the line Intel Xeon processors, usually faster than ones available at release to Dell and HP, and nVidia GPUs. Pricing usually came in lower than equivalent Dell and HP workstations with similar specs. According to numerous PC pundits who tested them as pure Windows PCs, the main Apple logic boards could run Windows faster and more consistently than any other reference board. . . So it's illogical to conclude that your company's application could not run on them unless something was specifically added to the HP boards or BIOS to make them somehow different, I doubt there is any reason the Macs could not run it.
Guys... don’t shoot the damn messenger here. You’re obviously either Apple fanboys or Apple engineers. I am neither. I work in the finance industry now and they use Apples quite a bit. In the example I provided, the vendor was GE, the product was for PACS imaging (high-resolution radiology). If you have a problem with their practices, feel free to voice your concerns to them, but I guarantee that it’ll fall on deaf ears.
Fact is that the healthcare industry is a massive consumer of electronics and high tech equipment, and trying to get them to switch to Apple would be like trying to talk my dachshund out of her food bowl: it just won’t happen. HP ProLiant-class rackmount servers are going to provide much higher ROI due to the flexibility of the platform. As an engineer, I can make myriad changes to the functional architecture of the system on my own, without an HP engineer. Apple products require that you have one of their people do the work. I know, because I spec’d their platforms in the past.
Again, you’re barking at the wrong person here. I’m tech agnostic, prefer Linux for my OS and use it quite extensively at home and at work. I just happen to know an extensive amount of minutiae about Microsoft’s platforms due to decades in the industry and am employed to provide engineering support for that.
I’m not anti-Apple. I just said I would never be able to fiscally justify spending the funds that they ask for one of their machines when I could build an architecturally superior system with Windows OS for the same price (i.e. liquid cooling).
What crappy product?
Not shooting, just asking! ( : >)
re “ In the example I provided, the vendor was GE, the product was for PACS imaging (high-resolution radiology).”
iirc, until some years ago that did require some tweaking on the scanner side that made the stations controlling the imaging PC/Windows dependent (i.e. there was no Mac s/s written for it.
(I NEVER worked on on PACS but shared an office at a major U.S. VAR in the 80’s with some engineering consultants who did).
As SM notes though, for a a few years now “Apple Mac Pros shipped with top of the line Intel Xeon processors, usually faster than ones available at release to Dell and HP, and nVidia GPUs.”
So it’s likely the GE guys wrote the spec reqs based on non-up-to-date knowledge/what they are comfortable with.
Like you say, whatever gets the job done.
The systems I designed and installed used HP ProLiant DL380s with 2 nVidia GTX460s, 196 GB RAM, 2 hex-core Xeon procs, and redundant 4Gb qLogic fiber HBAs. Apple didn’t even make a product that could match that at the time let alone support iOS on that platform if we could make it work. It comes down to ease of deployment and use. MOST radiology professionals know PACS, and it’s not supported on Apple hardware at this time.
Seriously? What part of “don’t shoot the messenger” wasn’t clear? I understand the value of Apple in the marketplace. I was simply relaying my own personal, professional engineering experience.
If you have a grudge over the engineering practices of GE, I suggest you email Jeffrey Immelt and air your grievances. I can’t go back in time to change what I did, and I don’t work in healthcare anymore.
What part of simply pasting two links did you find to be “shooting a messenger”?
I bent over backwards in previous replies to agree with you, based on my 2nd hand knowledge that Apple’s past history included a lack of PAC resources.
When you concluded your previous comment with:
“MOST radiology professionals know PACS, and its not supported on Apple hardware at this time.”
I was surprised to hear that was still true, and went and did a simple search. I posted only a few of the Apple PACS solutions I found, and simply noted there were many more listed on the WWW.
You seem to be confusing what you knew when you were active in engineering vs what is out there now, since, as you put it, you “dont work in healthcare anymore. “
As for Jeffrey Immelt, he can SIUHA for pushing Obama.
Sorry for the confusion, and good day to you.
I looked at the solutions from a “back of the house” engineering standpoint and wasn’t involved in the actual clinical distribution of equipment. It’s entirely possible that they use Apple hardware in the clinical environment, so I apologize for chomping at you.
I tend to get bashed by fan boys yet have no problem with Apple. I misread your intent, and for that, I apologize. Thank you for your very civil reply.
No problem, you’re more than welcome, and I love your tagline (: >)
In the early to late 1990's, a large radiology group here in Stockton was using Macs for remote diagnosis so their radiologists did not have to be in the office and could work from home. . . That was using ancient laptop G3 and G4 technology on the old Mac-OS 7 to 9. They did required top of the line monitors at that time. . . But the Mac laptops could drive them.
Its because they are looking at the maps upside down.
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