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Company selling targets with images of Americans to DHS for firearms training
examiner.com ^ | Feb 19, 2013 | BY: RYAN KELLER

Posted on 02/21/2013 10:12:36 PM PST by Jet Jaguar

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To: Alaska Wolf

Yea.... I guess that’s why the company has the following text up in a box on the left side of their home page:

“We apologize for the offensive nature of our “No More Hesitation” products. These products have been taken offline due to the opinions expressed by so many, including members of the law enforcement community.

This product line was originally requested and designed by the law enforcement community to train police officers for unusually complex situations where split-second decisions could lead to unnecessary loss of life.

Consistent with our company mission as a training supplier (not a training methods company), we will continue to see input from law enforcement professionals to better serve their training objectives and qualifications needs. We sincerely appreciate law enforcement professionals for the risks they take in providing safety and defending freedom.”

Here’s where that frame leads on their web site:

https://www.letshooting.com/let/spotlight_image.php

So: Please explain to me why they’d be apologizing for something made from “whole cloth?”

If it was made from ‘whole cloth’, why can I still find it in the Google cache for the pages on letargets.com? Or, more specifically, why can I find it sourced on their server, just not with a linkage you can find from their index page?

http://www.letargets.com/estylez_ps.aspx?searchmode=category&searchcatcontext=~010000~010100~010101.2


51 posted on 02/22/2013 3:05:08 AM PST by NVDave
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To: papertyger
The cop-suckers

As opposed to the spineless, CT freaks, Alex Jones/PJW acolytes and Infowars rump rangers?

52 posted on 02/22/2013 3:05:41 AM PST by Alaska Wolf (I)
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To: Alaska Wolf
Not very lifelike.

How big do you expect otherwise helpless individuals to be?

53 posted on 02/22/2013 3:06:17 AM PST by papertyger
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Comment #54 Removed by Moderator

To: NVDave
If it was made from ‘whole cloth’, why can I still find it in the Google cache for the pages on letargets.com?

So what law enforcement agency has purchased and used the targets? Why are the targets the same size as nearly all of the targets the company has listed on line, 23"x35"? There are few adults that size.

55 posted on 02/22/2013 3:11:39 AM PST by Alaska Wolf (I)
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To: papertyger
I think

No, you emote.

56 posted on 02/22/2013 3:13:22 AM PST by Alaska Wolf (I)
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To: Alaska Wolf
Why are the targets the same size as nearly all of the targets the company has listed on line, 23"x35"? There are few adults that size.

That's the new and improved "Victim" size.

57 posted on 02/22/2013 3:14:52 AM PST by papertyger
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To: papertyger
How big do you expect otherwise helpless individuals to be?

As an example, are you less than 3 feet tall?

58 posted on 02/22/2013 3:15:25 AM PST by Alaska Wolf (I)
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To: Alaska Wolf
No, you emote.

And you prevaricate.

Next.

59 posted on 02/22/2013 3:17:45 AM PST by papertyger
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To: Jet Jaguar

Where da black peoples at?


60 posted on 02/22/2013 3:18:23 AM PST by Palio di Siena
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To: papertyger

Yes, apparently so.

I’ve taken a screen cap of their home page with the apology frame on it, just in case the holster-sniffers later claim it was never there. Or that some conspiracy theorist put it there.

Did a traceroute to their server. The ISP’s near their server are in the Minnie area of MN, so that appears legit. The whois for their domain appears legit.

Their products are sold on other cop-supply web sites, starting with “lapolicegear.com” which has a CEO named “Sean” (no last name given) who likes to pose in full SWAT ninja get-up. Their “about” page says that LA Police Gear, Inc, was “founded by Los Angeles area Police Officers.” Their snail-mail address is 28022 Industry Drive, Valencia, CA, 91355. As I mentioned before, I found the page for the NMH target class in the Google cache of the web site:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:JyPqbpCZfmAJ:www.letargets.com/estylez_ps.aspx%3Fsearchmode%3Dcategory%26searchcatcontext%3D~010000~010100~010101.2+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

The cache indicates that Google pulled the page on Feb 19th, 2013 at 23:30:31 GMT.


61 posted on 02/22/2013 3:22:05 AM PST by NVDave
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To: Alaska Wolf
As an example, are you less than 3 feet tall?

They're not making a target for me. They're making a target for helpless victims.

62 posted on 02/22/2013 3:22:25 AM PST by papertyger
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To: papertyger
That's the new and improved "Victim" size.

So are you afraid there is an inevitable war on little people brewing?

63 posted on 02/22/2013 3:23:03 AM PST by Alaska Wolf (I)
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To: Jet Jaguar

At the Ben Avery Shooting Facility, a LARGE range complex north of Phoenix, you’re not allowed to shoot at “human silhouette” targets if the silhouettes have “ears”.


64 posted on 02/22/2013 3:25:09 AM PST by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: papertyger
you prevaricate.

Evidence supporting your mindless allegation?

65 posted on 02/22/2013 3:25:59 AM PST by Alaska Wolf (I)
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To: NVDave

No doubt you will be accused of abetting the hoax with your “proof.”


66 posted on 02/22/2013 3:26:22 AM PST by papertyger
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To: Alaska Wolf
Evidence supporting your mindless allegation?

Your hyperbole.....

67 posted on 02/22/2013 3:28:37 AM PST by papertyger
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To: DuncanWaring
you’re not allowed to shoot at “human silhouette” targets if the silhouettes have “ears”.

That's understandable. I'm sure the facility doesn't need the SS shutting them down.

68 posted on 02/22/2013 3:30:15 AM PST by Alaska Wolf (I)
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To: papertyger
hyperbole As I knew, no evidence. Typical of Infowar acolytes and conspiracy theorists.
69 posted on 02/22/2013 3:34:08 AM PST by Alaska Wolf (I)
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To: JD91

Those steel targets are so pre 2009. Not hip at all.


70 posted on 02/22/2013 3:37:59 AM PST by Conspiracy Guy (I voted Republican, no Conservative was on the ballot.)
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To: null and void

OK, so which ethnic groups are lacking representation in this otherwise absurd lineup?


71 posted on 02/22/2013 3:39:53 AM PST by Timber Rattler (Just say NO! to RINOS and the GOP-E)
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To: Alaska Wolf

OK...we get it. Could you two take your tit-for-tat to another room before it becomes the majority of posts in this thread...


72 posted on 02/22/2013 3:40:01 AM PST by deks ("...the battle...liberty against the overreach of the federal government" Ken Cuccinelli)
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To: Alaska Wolf
hyperbole As I knew, no evidence. Typical of Infowar acolytes and conspiracy theorists.

You have previously proven yourself utterly immune to "evidence," so why not cut to the chase and just trade barbs with you?

73 posted on 02/22/2013 3:47:37 AM PST by papertyger
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To: deks
OK...we get it. Could you two take your tit-for-tat to another room before it becomes the majority of posts in this thread...

But that's why he's here.

74 posted on 02/22/2013 3:48:51 AM PST by papertyger
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To: Alaska Wolf

What, now I’m responsible for answering questions about their product marketing? I don’t know if you’ve figured this out or not, but allow me to clear up your misconception: I don’t work for them.

As for the target size: an old-fashioned B-27-PR NRA Police Silhouette is 23x45 inches The B-27E and B-27M are reduced in size to simulate longer distances and they’re 23x35. So I’m going to guess that the company LETargets sizes their targets to fit into the frames that accept the old standard targets for cop qualification. Since some agencies have significant investment in turning frames, moving frames, reversing frames, etc, I’m going to guess that the smart target manufacture will keep making targets to fit those frame sizes, because replacing the frames in LEO training ranges would be more expensive and time-consuming.

If my memory serves, I think the international LEO training qual targets that are shaped sorta like bowling pins are also 23x35 paper targets and the FBI “bowling pin” style target (I think the designation was “Q” or “Q-something”) is also about 23x35.

In other words, I think they picked 23x35 because it’s a pretty standard size for LEO training/qualification targets.


75 posted on 02/22/2013 3:50:27 AM PST by NVDave
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To: papertyger

Yea. I’m sure.


76 posted on 02/22/2013 3:52:28 AM PST by NVDave
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To: NVDave

You’re falling for the “rope-a-dope,” Dave.

But your ability to quickly research is a REAL useful skill.


77 posted on 02/22/2013 3:53:43 AM PST by papertyger
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To: Alaska Wolf

“Why are the targets the same size as nearly all of the targets the company has listed on line, 23”x35”? There are few adults that size.”

Because they’re for indoor ranges. It’s rather interesting that you wouldn’t know that.


78 posted on 02/22/2013 4:01:54 AM PST by Justa
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To: onyx; null and void
I'm the monthly, second from left.

Please Support Free Republic

Free Republic's back up! Woo Hoo!!

Thanks for the Ping, Nulls.

79 posted on 02/22/2013 4:12:44 AM PST by Flotsam_Jetsome ("Obama": His entire life is Photoshopped.)
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To: null and void

Well they got me! They know what I look like now, only thing they have to figure out is which one is me!!!


80 posted on 02/22/2013 4:55:46 AM PST by Ian Hawk
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To: Revolting cat!

Rep. Keith Ellison (D-MN)


81 posted on 02/22/2013 4:55:49 AM PST by DaBeerfreak
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To: Jet Jaguar

Does this mean we need to start buying targets featuring police, state troopers, swat teams, and Homehand security agents? How about targets featuring certain politicians?


82 posted on 02/22/2013 5:02:57 AM PST by Brooklyn Attitude (Obama being re-elected is the political equivalent of OJ being found not guilty.)
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To: DaBeerfreak

No wonder.


83 posted on 02/22/2013 5:02:57 AM PST by who knows what evil? (G-d saved more animals than people on the ark...www.siameserescue.org.)
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To: null and void; Jet Jaguar; GeronL; DesertRhino; onyx; NVDave; George Varnum; SWAMPSNIPER

Folks, I direct your attention to one thing.

As George Varnum pointed out, this needed vetting before it went viral. But few looked at the targets themselves.

The word “depicting” is wrong, and the phrase “highlighting and highlighting” is incorrect as well. And those two errors are cut-and-paste on every target.

Also add to that, all the targets are of Caucasian actors.

First, would a professional company, who had just scored a lucrative government contract, allow such glaring adolescent errors on not only their merchandise, but also their advertising?

Second, would said company knowingly commit such a politically correct mistake?

My first call was and is, this is a hoax. Just the kind of thing Leftists would create to launch, then sit back and watch the howls of non-fact-checking outrage just as we’ve seen.

I lurked over at the DUmp, to see if anyone pops up on the radar claiming to have created the targets. Nothing yet, but we still watch.


84 posted on 02/22/2013 5:08:43 AM PST by Old Sarge (We are officially over the precipice, we just havent struck the ground yet...)
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To: Old Sarge

Uh, the company admitted to the line of targets during a phone call interview which is posted on Youtube, on their Facebook page and on their website after they pulled the NMH target page. Their apology is also posted on their website and Facebook page.

Please consider vetting these citations before questioning others.

Or do you believe you are the only person on the internet who researches before drawing conclusions and posting an opinion?


85 posted on 02/22/2013 5:23:48 AM PST by Justa
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To: onyx

Evil humans are in charge of American government and they have been killing innocent people all over the globe in the name of war against terror and drugs.

Now we have to pay the piper and reap what we have sown. All those weapons of war will soon be turned against the citizens who reside in the USA when they try to topple the tyrants in charge of the federal guv.


86 posted on 02/22/2013 5:35:17 AM PST by winodog (Thank you Jesus for the calm in my life)
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To: Alaska Wolf

This started years before anyone had ever heard of The Won.


87 posted on 02/22/2013 6:03:16 AM PST by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: Old Sarge; All

Law Enforcement Targets
15 hours ago
We apologize for the offensive nature of our “No More Hesitation” products. These products have been taken offline due to the opinions expressed by so many, including members of the law enforcement community.

This product line was originally requested and designed by the law enforcement community to train police officers for unusually complex situations where split-second decisions could lead to unnecessary loss of life.

Consistent with our company mission as a training supplier (not a training methods company), we will continue to seek input from law enforcement professionals to better serve their training objectives and qualification needs. We sincerely appreciate law enforcement professionals for the risks they take in providing safety and defending freedom.

https://www.facebook.com/LawEnforcementTargets?ref=ts&fref=ts


88 posted on 02/22/2013 6:15:26 AM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: deks

sure looks like it is real to me since they are trying to apologize for it


89 posted on 02/22/2013 6:35:26 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: George Varnum

you are apparently dead wrong


90 posted on 02/22/2013 6:37:22 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: deks

sales@letargets.com

I just emailed them to tell them I was disgusted with their all Caucasian women, children and old people targets and asked them whose twisted idea it was

where is the occupy wall street target, the homeless man target, the man in a burqua target, rapper target, Russian mafia target, Mexican drug lord target, steroid cop target,


91 posted on 02/22/2013 6:48:45 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: Old Sarge; Justa

apparently made to DHS specifications


92 posted on 02/22/2013 6:56:52 AM PST by GeronL (http://asspos.blogspot.com)
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To: Palio di Siena

Perhaps it is such a common occurrance, no additional training is required.


93 posted on 02/22/2013 7:16:28 AM PST by Microbubba
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To: yldstrk

Re#90: Wouldn’t be the first time.

As near as I can tell at this point, however, the jury is still out - and I don’t seem to be the only one in here to suspect that there might be substance to this whole uppity-Sheeple target brouhaha.

BTW; Surely the DHS and Komrades are aware of the significant public attitude towards and suspicions of them; however;...

Are any of you aware of any PR attempt by these agencies to dispel such “Right wing conspiracy rumors” and assure we the little people / subjects that they have no intention of violating our Constitution, forcibly disarming us, rounding us up, torturing and/or selectively mowing us down by the bloody dump-truck loads?

Did I miss something somewhere?


94 posted on 02/22/2013 7:21:45 AM PST by George Varnum (Liberty, like our Forefather's Flintlock Musket, must be kept clean, oiled, and READY!)
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To: George Varnum

I think they have every intention of tightening their grip at any cost


95 posted on 02/22/2013 7:30:43 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: Timber Rattler

Re your #71; I don’t know, really, but I get this distinct impression that Jews are pretty well represented here...(?)


96 posted on 02/22/2013 7:34:10 AM PST by George Varnum (Liberty, like our Forefather's Flintlock Musket, must be kept clean, oiled, and READY!)
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To: yldstrk

Better than that, they have every intention of making us into a bar of soap or a lampshade.


97 posted on 02/22/2013 7:34:57 AM PST by sport
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To: Alaska Wolf

AW, if you are who you say you are, you should spend a little time in the lower 48 and you will clearly understand why we “little people” those out of power at the moment, resent being dictated to by people who are seemingly corrupt and have not one shred of common sense. Since you are apparently an outdoor person in a state with a low population, you have not a clue what the rest of us are dealing with.


98 posted on 02/22/2013 7:35:04 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: winodog
You're exactly right.





"Never retreat!! Never surrender!! Never give up your guns!!"
~Jim


99 posted on 02/22/2013 7:48:07 AM PST by onyx (FREE REPUBLIC IS HERE TO STAY! DONATE MONTHLY! IF YOU WANT ON SARAH PALIN''S PING LIST, LET ME KNOW)
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To: Old Sarge; SWAMPSNIPER

Good Morning Old Sarge!

I see that SWAMPSNIPER answered your concerns.


100 posted on 02/22/2013 7:49:49 AM PST by onyx (FREE REPUBLIC IS HERE TO STAY! DONATE MONTHLY! IF YOU WANT ON SARAH PALIN''S PING LIST, LET ME KNOW)
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