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Gabby Giffords falsely implies that her shooter evaded a background check
Twitchy ^ | 04/07/2013 | Twitchy staff

Posted on 04/07/2013 10:54:56 AM PDT by Rusty0604

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To: Las Vegas Ron
I was reviewing the thread and noticed I failed to answer most of your post. Sorry...

If a community college can issue a report that someone is a threat, then that person should lose a God given right because someone says he's crazy?

You have a God-given right to self-defense, but not to murder. Dangerous instruments need to be kept away from people proved insane enough to murder by their own actions. It's like keeping the Bic lighter out of reach of a three-year-old. I wouldn't have trusted this guy with a metal fork. A firearm is a very lethal version of a fork.

Consider this, in the late sixties it was promoted and excepted by many that felons should not be able to by a gun, I mean after all that sounds so reasonable , right?

The fact of the matter is you are stripping the right away from a class of person simply because it is societally acceptable, Constitution be damned....with the support of many here.

The case of a felon, that's not the only right that's stripped...in most states he can't vote either. The idea here is a felon proved, by either beyond the reasonable doubt of 12 jurors or his own confession, his ability to commit a serious crime. I wouldn't call that a fashion statement but reasonable prudence for fear of recidivism. But, it's not for life, depending on the felony. In many cases, after a period of time (like 10 years), the felon can petition a Judge to have the Felony expunged and his civil rights restored. He'd probably also have to sue NICS.

Now it has progressed to persons under restraining orders, Misdemeanor "domestic violence" (yell at your spouse in some states and it's considered domestic violence) and on and on.....

I really hate that. Judges and Commissioners hand those ROs out like candy to any woman who asks, regardless of the circumstances. Men, of course, don't need restraining orders, so it's one-way. And those go against you at NICS, too. Even if you appeal them and win.

Now, with Obama care being instituted, digital medical records, massive data storage facilities being built, technology that allows the government to accumulate data on your every web post and activity couple with every word you uttered to your doctor, well you get my point.

Yes, I certainly do.

When we get to the point of "someone" deciding who is mentally "fit" to own a firearm, well I think that is a very dangerous road to go down....an I think it is a trap just like the argument in the 60's..."who could support a felon buying a firearm"?

I would want some sort of due process in the machine. You are correct to be suspicious of any situation when a single person can decide the ability of another single person to exercise a God-given right. Even Judges can be appealed, but with the NICS, how can you appeal something you aren't even allowed to see? There is a legal process in place to determine if a person can be involuntarily committed, it should be just as difficult to put someone on the NICS hit-list for mental reasons.

The person should at least know what they're doing, and the system right now is secret. A situation ripe for the raping. And your concerns are well-placed, sorry if I implied they were not.

51 posted on 04/07/2013 2:38:50 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (I am a dissident. Will you join me? My name is John....)
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To: Las Vegas Ron

“If you can by law strip individuals of their God given rights at the whim of a frenzied public, what good is the Constitution? “

I’m gonna steal that, if you don’t mind.


52 posted on 04/07/2013 2:54:48 PM PDT by PLMerite (Shut the Beyotch Down! Burn, baby, burn!)
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To: Cyber Liberty
Oh boy, this will be a long conversation and I'm tot sure I have the time right now to address this and continue it....but here goes...

You have a God-given right to self-defense, but not to murder

I agree 100% But self defense, even if you have to KILL to do it, in and of it self is not murder, yes?

Dangerous instruments need to be kept away from people proved insane enough to murder by their own actions.

I don't disagree with you at all but my problem is how do you set the criteria of who is "insane"

I agree that to you and me could decide because you and me would use "common sense" The problem is what you and I consider "common sense" is subjective. Both of us know that "common sense" is not so common these days. Yeah, I know, It can go round and round, but that is kind of the point. What used to be common sense before is now promoted as extreme.

The case of a felon, that's not the only right that's stripped...in most states he can't vote either.

Actually that is not true. In most States a felon cannot vote if he/she is under the constrains of parole or other obligations of said conviction. Denial of 2nd Amendment right is for all intents and purpose for life time....same with misdemeanor convictions of "domestic violence". Does that lifetime punishment not violate the 5th and 6th Amendments?

In many cases, after a period of time (like 10 years), the felon can petition a Judge to have the Felony expunged and his civil rights restored.

Never happen in a million years unless you have tons of money and the proper connection. What politician would ever take the chance of restoring a felons rights lest it go bad...without the proper payout/payment/connection that is.

I really hate that. Judges and Commissioners hand those ROs out like candy to any woman who asks, regardless of the circumstances.

I do too, but it really cuts to the heart of the matter. We can see how easy it is to abuse these law that are put in effect for "common sense" Grrrrr, it is either a right or it is not.

My answer is to amend the Constitution within the provisions that are put in place to do so.

In my view if it is not done that way then the Constitution is meaningless.

53 posted on 04/07/2013 3:43:14 PM PDT by Las Vegas Ron (Medicine is the keystone in the arch of socialism)
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To: PLMerite
I’m gonna steal that, if you don’t mind.

I'd be honored, thank you ;)

54 posted on 04/07/2013 3:44:31 PM PDT by Las Vegas Ron (Medicine is the keystone in the arch of socialism)
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To: Las Vegas Ron

I can’t disagree with you.


55 posted on 04/07/2013 3:47:26 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (I am a dissident. Will you join me? My name is John....)
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To: Rusty0604
I always liked Gabby Giffords. I didn't always agree with her politics but she was far more conservative then most Republicans in office today.

That being said, I hate that this happened to her and I hope Jerrod loughner never again sees the light of day but I also hate to see her used as a political puppet like Jim Brady was.

Sarah Brady spend 25 years going after “assault rifles” and high capacity magazines after her husband was shot with a small revolver. She would wheel her disabled husband out in front of a crowd like a piece of meat for all to see and then use him to push for guns laws that for ten years restricted guns that had NOTHING to do with her husbands shooting.

Gabby Giffords is being used in the same way and I doubt very seriously the poor lady even knows whats going on around her.

Mark Kelly has already proven himself to be a hypocrite and a liar when he purchased a 1911 model .45 and AR-15 and then when he got caught, he lied and said he was just showing the country how easy it was to buy a gun and he intended on turning them over to the police. Anyone dumb enough to buy that line? Even Gabby could see through that load of bull.

The left has never been honest or straight forward in the gun control debate and I don't see them developing the scruples to be honest about ANY issue anytime soon.

56 posted on 04/07/2013 3:54:04 PM PDT by Carbonsteel
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To: Rusty0604
Gabby Giffords falsely implies that her shooter evaded a background check

Gabby has significant brain damage, and is therefore ripe for getting fed lies to repeat and otherwise manipulated. The rats, of course, have no shame, and since they couldn't use her funeral for one of their typical campaign rallies they'll just use her while she's alive. (shrug) It's a shame Gabby has no family members who will stand up to the rats and tell them to go play in the street.


57 posted on 04/07/2013 3:54:53 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: Cyber Liberty

Great conversation, thank you for having it with me.

It is a reaffirmation of how FR should be, minus the infection of trolls.


58 posted on 04/07/2013 4:00:31 PM PDT by Las Vegas Ron (Medicine is the keystone in the arch of socialism)
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To: Lancey Howard; Cyber Liberty; dead
Say, who has that pick with Laughner as the targets face?

Hehe, found it:

Hat tip Freeper dead

Ref FR thread: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2996983/posts?page=20#20

59 posted on 04/07/2013 4:09:47 PM PDT by Las Vegas Ron (Medicine is the keystone in the arch of socialism)
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To: Rusty0604
Too bad Mrs Giffords,or someone around her,wasn't armed at that fateful moment.Maybe the outcome would have been different.
60 posted on 04/07/2013 5:23:50 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Leno Was Right,They *Are* Undocumented Democrats!)
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To: Fresh Wind

I doubt any of the democrats could pass them.


61 posted on 04/07/2013 5:57:15 PM PDT by 3Fingas (Sons and Daughters of Freedom, Committee of Correspondence)
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To: RedMDer

Mispell


62 posted on 04/08/2013 1:18:58 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Sherman Logan

Maybe the cartoonist did that on purpose.


63 posted on 04/08/2013 5:31:02 AM PDT by RedMDer (May we always be happy and may our enemies always know it. - Sarah Palin, 10-18-2010)
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