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Why I Froze My Eggs [Heinlein Fans, Remember "Podkayne of Mars"?]
Wall Street Journal ^ | 05/04/2013 | SARAH ELIZABETH RICHARDS

Posted on 05/04/2013 5:23:26 AM PDT by SES1066

Between the ages of 36 and 38, I spent nearly $50,000 to freeze 70 eggs in the hope that they would help me have a family in my mid-40s, when my natural fertility is gone. For this baby insurance, I obliterated my savings and used up the money my parents had set aside for a wedding. It was the best investment I ever made.

In RAH's 1963 Novel "Podkayne of Mars", the common ability of a woman to "Freeze" embryos in order to delay childbirth is the starting plot generator.

(Excerpt) Read more at online.wsj.com ...


TOPICS: Books/Literature; Health/Medicine; Science
KEYWORDS: baby; bravenewworld; cryogenics; heinlein; ivf; realsciencefiction; reproduction
Yes, there is a significant difference between eggs and embryos but in concept, I am smiling at the 50 year lead time shown by my favorite author, Robert A Heinlein.
1 posted on 05/04/2013 5:23:26 AM PDT by SES1066
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To: SES1066

RH provided the template for my political outlook. I’m still waiting patiently for someone to bring GLORY ROAD to the big screen.


2 posted on 05/04/2013 5:32:25 AM PDT by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: SES1066

As a woman who had a baby “the old-fashioned way” at 45, I have to ask, who makes it her Plan A to be manufacturing one at that age?


3 posted on 05/04/2013 5:32:30 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Sarah is right.)
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To: SES1066
Why I Froze My Eggs

Well, I suppose you could, but the shells crack and you can't fry em sunny side-up.

4 posted on 05/04/2013 5:39:59 AM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Celebrate: Republicans Freed the Slaves Month)
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To: SES1066

Ok no age jokes here but... last month I put my eggs in the freezer. Yes I later defrosted them and the scrambled eggs tasted just fine. I will be paying more attention when putting stuff in the fridge.


5 posted on 05/04/2013 5:40:37 AM PDT by corkoman (Release the Palin!)
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To: SES1066
In fact, they said that egg freezing motivated them to take charge of their lives. They relaxed. They dated, married and thawed. They became ready to be mothers.

Science is again catching up with Heinlein. But many men would not consider for marriage women who put family last in their lives.

6 posted on 05/04/2013 5:43:23 AM PDT by DakotaGator (Weep for the lost Republic! And keep your powder dry!!)
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To: SES1066

The lady should have just gotten married and had a baby, but she’s probably a lesbian atheist


7 posted on 05/04/2013 5:43:44 AM PDT by GeronL (http://asspos.blogspot.com)
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To: SES1066

Do you have a RH ping list? If so please add me....Thank You!


8 posted on 05/04/2013 5:45:22 AM PDT by The SISU kid (I think they taste like Barbie dolls smell.)
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To: SES1066

Here’s an interesting video of a comtemporary human child discovering the wisdom of the ancients. Particularly notable: His hat.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5rZC6fNg0I


9 posted on 05/04/2013 5:46:11 AM PDT by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: DakotaGator

I would prefer a woman who simply didn’t want children at all to a woman with a strictly scripted life that only includes children at a specific point in the script.


10 posted on 05/04/2013 5:47:29 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: cripplecreek

Is she willing to have 70 children? Chances are slim. So what she’s saying is that she’s willing to kill 69 children for her convenience.


11 posted on 05/04/2013 5:54:13 AM PDT by JCBreckenridge (Texas is a state of mind - Steinbeck)
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To: cripplecreek

Indeed!

And though this medical technology is wonderful, it seems to be more appropriate for assisting with conception difficulties than to be used as a convenience.


12 posted on 05/04/2013 5:57:22 AM PDT by DakotaGator (Weep for the lost Republic! And keep your powder dry!!)
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To: SES1066

Count me in for a Heinlein ping list (have you been volunteered?) ;)


13 posted on 05/04/2013 6:10:47 AM PDT by MV=PY (The Magic Question: Who's paying for it)
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To: JCBreckenridge

You understand the difference between eggs and embryos I hope.


14 posted on 05/04/2013 6:26:49 AM PDT by agere_contra (I once saw a movie where only the police and military had guns. It was called 'Schindler's List'.)
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To: Tax-chick

The problem is even if you have a “good egg” there are so many other things that can go wrong with you during those years.


15 posted on 05/04/2013 6:29:53 AM PDT by Harmless Teddy Bear (Join AAAA : Americans Against Acronym Abuse)
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To: SES1066; Old Sarge; NorthernCrunchyCon; UMCRevMom@aol.com; Finatic; fellowpatriot; MarineMom613; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

16 posted on 05/04/2013 6:31:35 AM PDT by narses
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To: Tax-chick
who makes it her Plan A to be manufacturing one at that age?

Good question.

frittering away my 20s with a man I didn't plan to have children with, and wasting more years in my thirties with a man who wasn't sure he even wanted children. It took away the punishing pressure to find a mate and helped me find love at 42.

I'm reminded of an NPR piece (probably "All Things Considered") I listened to years back. They were interviewing a single woman in her low 40s who had adopted a child. She described how she had wanted a child but "none of her relationships worked out blah blah blah.*" All the while listening I was struck by how self-centered that woman sounded.

Reading this woman's story I get the same impression.

*(See also http://www.despair.com/dysfunction.html.)

17 posted on 05/04/2013 6:39:05 AM PDT by Lee N. Field ("You keep using that verse, but I do not think it means what you think it means." --I. Montoya)
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To: HMS Surprise
RH provided the template for my political outlook. I’m still waiting patiently for someone to bring GLORY ROAD to the big screen.

This is the cover of the copy that I have.

Rufo is the sanest of all the characters.

18 posted on 05/04/2013 6:40:32 AM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: SES1066
Fertility anxiety isn't exactly helpful when you're trying to snag the locker next to Sheryl Sandberg in the executive gym.

Uh, trying to snag the locker next to Sheryl Sandberg in the executive gym is an entirely unworthy goal for a woman of child-bearing age, and not exactly helpful to her fertility - let alone her future happiness.

Feminist overvaluing of places on the corporate ladder has done incalculable societal harm. Those careers were designed for aggressive, territorial males, and trying to reprogram women to play the game the way men do has been disastrous.

19 posted on 05/04/2013 6:40:54 AM PDT by Mr. Jeeves (CTRL-GALT-DELETE)
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear

I don’t think the quest for control of life is going to succeed, no matter how much technology we throw into it.


20 posted on 05/04/2013 6:41:09 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Sarah is right.)
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear
Veruca Salt was a bad egg.


21 posted on 05/04/2013 6:43:47 AM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: Lee N. Field
I'm reminded of an NPR piece (probably "All Things Considered") I listened to years back. They were interviewing a single woman in her low 40s who had adopted a child. She described how she had wanted a child but "none of her relationships worked out blah blah blah.*" All the while listening I was struck by how self-centered that woman sounded.

I think that you have hit the nail right on the thumb.

22 posted on 05/04/2013 6:45:19 AM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: MarkBsnr

I heard she kept her Golden Ticket and that one sold for $50,000 in 2010


23 posted on 05/04/2013 6:45:31 AM PDT by GeronL (http://asspos.blogspot.com)
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To: SES1066

I loved Poddy Fries. My old paperback copy is upstairs.


24 posted on 05/04/2013 6:46:57 AM PDT by Steely Tom (If the Constitution can be a living document, I guess a corporation can be a person.)
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To: Lee N. Field

I often recall that graphic!

I’m happy that the author found love at 42, but is she prepared for the effort it’s going to take to keep love through having her hormones trashed by (probably) multiple trials and failures of IVF during perimenopause, as well as aging, and perhaps never having a living child?

Or the trials of late-life parenthood? It’s not easy, even when you have a houseful of other children to help retrieve Pink Pet from her triumphant perch on top of the refrigerator? Or what if you get the one (like my 9th, when I was “only” 42), who wakes up every two hours?

Maybe her real life will fit her dream from this point on. I suppose it does for someone ...


25 posted on 05/04/2013 6:48:48 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Sarah is right.)
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To: Tax-chick; Mrs. Don-o; Lee N. Field
The whole article is even creepier than the first part; I hadn't realized it went on past some ads.

For example: If your own frozen eggs don't survive thawing or fertilization or fail to grow into robust embryos, you can go online to one of the many commercial egg banks popping up across the country and order a batch of frozen eggs donated by a woman who looks like you. After they are injected with your partner's sperm, the resulting embryos can be transferred to your womb, and you deliver and nurse the baby.

The author and those she describes don't seem to realize that the baby is not an object, but a human being who (1) is totally "NOT-YOU" and has his own agenda, unrelated to your Mommy-dreams; and (2) is quickly going to grow out of being a baby into the rest of his life, which will not go according to your plans.

26 posted on 05/04/2013 7:01:44 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Sarah is right.)
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To: GeronL
I heard she kept her Golden Ticket and that one sold for $50,000 in 2010

Probably to the US State Department, by the individuals who would have us believe that Benghazi was the result of Muslims indignant over a movie that nobody ever heard of.

27 posted on 05/04/2013 7:08:41 AM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: Tax-chick
Or the trials of late-life parenthood? It’s not easy,

Parenthood isn't easy, late life or not.

but is she prepared for the effort it’s going to take to keep love through having her hormones trashed by (probably) multiple trials and failures of IVF during perimenopause,

Host mother. There, see? Easy. (Kidding, of course.)

1) is totally "NOT-YOU" and has his own agenda, unrelated to your Mommy-dreams; and (2) is quickly going to grow out of being a baby into the rest of his life, which will not go according to your plans.

Her precious (expensive) rugrat will probably get raised by one or a series of nannies (Mummy and Daddy have high powered careers, you know) and end up a bitter & messed up borderline insane urban Devilcrat activist.

you can go online to one of the many commercial egg banks popping up across the country and order a batch of frozen eggs donated by a woman who looks like you.

I've heard about those. Donation is pitched to college girls, but the donation process can mess them up physically and render them infertile.

Where is it, flip flip flip.....

"As a newly married Christian woman, I had to confront this dual point of view, this insider/outsider identity. I also had to confront sonething that may seem so obvious it is not worthy to mention: I had to confront my age. I was 39 years old when I married Kent. I was too old to have children (without fertility treatments). This was startling to me. I had spent my childbearing years fighting windmills and now I was, yet again, waking up to my life. There is a biblical principle that lies behind my confusion: people whose lives are riddled with unrestrained sin act like rebellious children. Sin, when unrestrained, infantalizes a person. Here I thought I was so mature, so capable, so "important" in the world, and the truth remains that I didn't even know how to act my age! After conversion,I was surprised to discover how old I really was." --Rosaria Butterfield

28 posted on 05/04/2013 7:28:09 AM PDT by Lee N. Field ("You keep using that verse, but I do not think it means what you think it means." --I. Montoya)
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To: SES1066

I think this women illustrates the results of the radical feminist “careerist” agenda. While I don’t see anything inherently wrong when saving some of your eggs for the future the reasons this women cites for doing it and the expressed “peace of mind” are indicators that it is not an overall good thing. It also feeds the control freak hyper managed social rot that is the highlight of our modern age. How long before govt forces insurance companies to cover this process and tax payers are expected to pay for it in order to further radically transform society? How many young women waste their youth with risky behavior and bad relationships thinking they have their eggs in a freezer some where? There are always unintended circumstances the biggest one in encouraging the continued late birthing of children that are even more likely to be left orphans.

I love Robert A Heinlein but I see this kind of idea being warped into yet another way to further weaken family structures and encourage the selfish ego driven nature of man to an extreme.


29 posted on 05/04/2013 7:44:31 AM PDT by Maelstorm (This country wasn't founded with the battle cry "Give me liberty or give me a govt check!")
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To: Lee N. Field
Sin, when unrestrained, infantalizes a person.

Great insight.

30 posted on 05/04/2013 7:46:01 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Sarah is right.)
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To: SES1066
How about freezing your "seed" for later?

On a related note: It's a really good idea to invest the extra money and get a high-volume top-loading deep freezer, as well as a gasoline-fuelled generator - in case of a power outage.

Otherwise, you're just asking for a messy clean-up job in the event of an extended power failure.

Regards,

31 posted on 05/04/2013 7:59:02 AM PDT by alexander_busek (Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.)
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To: Lee N. Field

Yes and it is because she was self centered and date men of the same type that she ended up alone and childless forced to adopt. Only a foolish man or an equally ego driven man would marry many of these professional women who are so “intelligent” that they couldn’t find time to do the one thing that according to their secular God Darwin indicates a successful life, reproduce. They are brainwashed filled with so much feminist man hating crap that even if there are redeeming qualities a man is likely to find himself “neutered” by such a woman.

I feel badly for women who fell prey to the ideology of the angry old maid. They were deceived over and over again and at the end of their lives they may be rich but are they really? How capable are they going to be at 70 to truly enjoy their children and to participate in their lives? How well grounded are their children going to be having been given everything and having never experienced the natural struggle and path of life and seen their parents overcoming those struggles to make a life for them?

I may be wrong but I see this feeding the selfish shallow hyper managed society that is dehumanizing humanity and turning them into automatons of the powerful.


32 posted on 05/04/2013 8:02:39 AM PDT by Maelstorm (This country wasn't founded with the battle cry "Give me liberty or give me a govt check!")
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To: JCBreckenridge

>>>Is she willing to have 70 children? Chances are slim. So what she’s saying is that she’s willing to kill 69 children for her convenience.>>>

Finally, someone makes sense.


33 posted on 05/04/2013 8:11:25 AM PDT by kitkat (STORM THE HEAVENS WITH PRAYERS FOR OUR COUNTRY)
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To: JCBreckenridge; cripplecreek; agere_contra; Tax-chick
There's nothing inherently, intrinsically wrong with extracting and freezing egg cells per se, since there are imaginable good reasons for dosing so (e.g. detecting mitochondrial disease in the woman.) But it really is objectionable to freeze them for the purpose of using them later, and here's why: After you give birth, this baby has a strong tendency to be seen, NOT as "a gift of God to be gratefully received and unconditionally loved, come what may." but rather, as "Something That's Supposed To Make Me Happy" If Little Sophia or Baby Aiden is insufficiently cute, insufficiently smart, or fails to satisfy in some way, the parent is very likely to feel cheated, even angry.

I read a number of years ago (when visiting my brother in Howard County, MD), that Howard County, MD, one of the highest-income and highest-education counties in the USA, also had one of the highest rates of child abuse. Why? The parents were far more likely than average to have their hearts set on planned, perfect, privileged lives. When the kid doesn't turn out, (despite the meticulous, hyper-controlling planning), to be perfect, the kid tends to bear the brunt of bitter parental disappointment. I'm talking about emotional abandonment, verbal abuse, and even physical abuse.

IVF: A GOOD IDEA?

No.

Not even close.

34 posted on 05/04/2013 8:26:14 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o (Quantus tremor est futurus,Quando iudex est venturus,Cuncta stricte discussurus!)
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To: Maelstorm
Your thoughts?

#34

35 posted on 05/04/2013 9:31:08 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o (Quantus tremor est futurus,Quando iudex est venturus,Cuncta stricte discussurus!)
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To: Mrs. Don-o

True. I missed that she was freezing the eggs only.


36 posted on 05/04/2013 10:10:28 AM PDT by JCBreckenridge (Texas is a state of mind - Steinbeck)
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To: Mrs. Don-o

I agree. :-)


37 posted on 05/04/2013 11:50:36 AM PDT by Maelstorm (This country wasn't founded with the battle cry "Give me liberty or give me a govt check!")
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To: Tax-chick

why bother to carry a baby when you are 55? Just pay a poor lady in India to do it for you.

And yes, Heinlein had that as a subplot in The Moon is a harsh mistress....


38 posted on 05/04/2013 12:39:02 PM PDT by LadyDoc
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To: SES1066

My favorite author, and the best sci-fi author ever hands down don’t bother arguing.
Yes, Podkayne of Mars was another Heinlein masterpiece, but it has been a few decades since I read it.


39 posted on 05/04/2013 12:43:39 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: LadyDoc

I remember - “rental womb” was the heroine’s profession until she became a full-time revolutionary.


40 posted on 05/04/2013 2:03:38 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Sarah is right.)
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To: Lee N. Field
Reading this woman's story I get the same impression.

I read the original article when it was published, and I had the same reaction. Why did she waste her time with the wrong guys? Also, does she realize she'll be ready for Social Security before her children are out of high school?

41 posted on 05/06/2013 10:30:36 AM PDT by JoeFromSidney ( New book: RESISTANCE TO TYRANNY. Buy from Amazon.)
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