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Are Valve And AMD About To Ruin PC Gaming?
HardOCP ^ | Monday October 14, 2013 | Posted by Steve 10:55 AM (DST

Posted on 10/14/2013 11:22:00 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach

The Tech Report crew seems to think that SteamOS and Mantle could ruin PC gaming. I'm not sure how they came to that conclusion but I'm sure you guys will have plenty to say on the topic.

Now, all of a sudden, next year's gaming landscape looks to be shaping up very differently. Instead of three major platforms based on a common hardware architecture, game developers will face two monolithic platforms and a fragmented one—the PC—that will have two starkly different operating systems and three different APIs—Direct3D, OpenGL, and Mantle.



TOPICS: Business/Economy; Computers/Internet
KEYWORDS: counting; direct3d; gameconsoles; gaming; graphics; hightech; linux; mantle; opengl; three; valve; windows

1 posted on 10/14/2013 11:22:00 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

I have yet to feel a need to move on from my “Command and Conquer, the first decade” disks.

I’ve beat pretty much every skirmish with maximum enemies and difficulty, but it’s always fun to try new strategies and see what happens.


2 posted on 10/14/2013 11:24:24 AM PDT by cuban leaf
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach; GraceG


3 posted on 10/14/2013 11:28:06 AM PDT by KC_Lion (Build the America you want to live in at your address, and keep looking up.-Sarah Palin)
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To: cuban leaf
I get bored very quickly by single player games. There is only so much satisfaction to be had when you defeat the computer. When you know there is another person raging and fuming at the other end when you pull off a win -- now that's fun!

Maybe that's just me.

4 posted on 10/14/2013 11:30:27 AM PDT by Wyrd bi ful ard (Gone Galt, 11/07/12----No king but Christ! Don't tread on me!)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

“Now, all of a sudden, next year’s gaming landscape looks to be shaping up very differently. Instead of three major platforms based on a common hardware architecture, game developers will face two monolithic platforms and a fragmented one—the PC—that will have two starkly different operating systems and three different APIs—Direct3D, OpenGL, and Mantle.”

That is pretty much a load of BS.

Everything besides Windows will use OpenGL (in fact some Windows titles use OpenGL). Playstation, SteamOS (Linux) and Mac are all extremely similar. Xbox and Windows are extremely similar. The reference Steam machines were all specified with Nvidia graphics cards (so no Mantle), and it entirely remains to be seen how uptake will be with Mantle. I expect any performance gains over OpenGL will be minimal.


5 posted on 10/14/2013 11:31:21 AM PDT by PreciousLiberty
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

A little bit of hyperbole here.

It’s hard to predict what is going to happen here. The last time we had major API wars between 3dfx and Nvidia, Nvidia chose to abandon proprietary standards and supported MS DirectX, which in spite of being a favorite whipping post has been a very good thing for gamers.

If we go back to API wars between Nvidia and AMD, gamers won’t win.

SteamOS is a good idea. I’m no Linux fan specifically, but if MS continues down the path of making their OS more and more cloud based and less localized it will only get consistently harder for a gaming PC to be an island unto itself that runs our games.

So in short, I vote for unification behind an open OS platform with SteamOS = good in the long run. Separate APIs right at this time in Windows = bad in the short and long run.


6 posted on 10/14/2013 11:31:26 AM PDT by Advil000
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

One of the things at the top of my spare time list is learning Valve’s movie making software.


7 posted on 10/14/2013 11:33:19 AM PDT by Vince Ferrer
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To: cuban leaf

Back when I had XP, and I still miss it, I played a game called USNF ‘97 that I was thoroughly addicted to. It allowed me to set up pretty elaborate air battles and bombing missions with a variety of aircraft.


8 posted on 10/14/2013 11:33:41 AM PDT by GeronL
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To: Advil000

competition is a good thing

My the better product win


9 posted on 10/14/2013 11:35:15 AM PDT by GeronL
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

Quality, cost and content thrive in a competitive market. Sure, you’re still going to have companies making buggy whips who complain and file lawsuit after lawsuit trying to stop tech advances that make them obsolete.


10 posted on 10/14/2013 11:35:20 AM PDT by Usagi_yo
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To: Wyrd bið ful aræd

I get bored very quickly by single player games. There is only so much satisfaction to be had when you defeat the computer. When you know there is another person raging and fuming at the other end when you pull off a win — now that’s fun!

Maybe that’s just me.


It is limited, I admit. Around the turn of the century I was hooked on Aces high (I think that was the name). I did way too many all nighters in WWII planes taking on guys all over the world. It was simply too adictive. I got rid of the joystick. I still miss it, though.

But this offers a hint at why I don’t plan on ever buying a game unit, unless I become bed-ridden.


11 posted on 10/14/2013 11:40:44 AM PDT by cuban leaf
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To: Vince Ferrer
I thought they were stickily games,....interesting!
12 posted on 10/14/2013 11:45:01 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
I see two big problems for PC gaming:

1) DLC. Many game makers are going to a free-to-play-must buy-additional-content type gaming. The problem is the cost of the DLC: the trend is to nickel-and-dime players to death.
I play race simulations. The problem here is if you don't have a certain car or track, you can't join that race, even if you have all the other cars and tracks on the server. I would much rather pay all the money up front for a complete game. If the game maker offers an expansion pack at some later time, fine.

2) Consoles. Consoles are getting better and better and FPS's are, to me, actually better with a gamepad than the old KB-and-mouse control. Also, upgrades. With each new iteration of a PC game, it requires more power, more RAM, faster CPU and a better GPU.
Buy a console, and it will last the life of around three generations of a PC without having to upgrade a major component or even OS. No worries about what DirectX you have (as MS sees fit to not upgrade it for older OS's - to get you to buy their newer OS).

Get a cheap USB KB and mouse and you can use the console to surf the web, visit forums, watch blu-ray (PS3 or 4) and play the latest games without having to worry if your CPU or GPU or RAM are enough to handle it. Besides the fact that most games now days are written specifically for consoles and then (usually badly) ported over to the PC to make a few extra bucks.

end rant.

13 posted on 10/14/2013 11:45:53 AM PDT by jeffc (The U.S. media are our enemy)
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To: jeffc

Oh, and Steam sucks big time!


14 posted on 10/14/2013 11:46:35 AM PDT by jeffc (The U.S. media are our enemy)
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To: Wyrd bið ful aræd

I liked to play the pawn sacrifice.
I know I am not going to kill anyone and won’t live long,
but it’s fun to sucker the guy who actually does get pissed into a trap.


15 posted on 10/14/2013 11:51:58 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper
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To: Berlin_Freeper

It’s also a lot easier on the fingers and wrist.


16 posted on 10/14/2013 11:53:23 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

As a developer I can say the only thing this does is to make AMD graphics cards the option for PC gamers. And this means nothing. The Video cards you get now are mainly AMD cause they are cheaper and most PC are AMD cpu anyway. PC’s future will be a console anyway since Windows 8 is a App driven OS.

The future will be having a console be your work, game, and media entrance. That is what your smartphone is anyway.


17 posted on 10/14/2013 12:02:35 PM PDT by Baseballguy (If we knew what we know now in Oct would we do anything different?)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

Yes. Next question.

When I buy a computer game, I just want to play the game. I should not have to go through something like Valve or Steam to play the game I bought. I should not have to get permission to play a game that I paid $60 for.


18 posted on 10/14/2013 12:09:00 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults)
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To: jeffc

Free to play with pay to win or pay DLC drives me nuts! I’d rather just pay once for everything. That’s why I hate my cell phone games.

I disagree about Steam. I love it, I’ve been with it since it started (even though I did disliked it at first). It has grown on me ever since and I think PC gaming was saved because of steam. Because of their holiday sales I have thousands of dollars in games in my library lol.


19 posted on 10/14/2013 12:11:46 PM PDT by miliantnutcase
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To: All

Do we have a lot of steam users here on FR? If we do we should make a steam group for us.


20 posted on 10/14/2013 12:15:14 PM PDT by miliantnutcase
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To: miliantnutcase

I’ve only purchased on game on Steam (Fallout: New Vegas) and the DLC. Haven’t had a problem with it.


21 posted on 10/14/2013 12:30:31 PM PDT by perez24 (Dirty deeds, done dirt cheap.)
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To: jeffc

Steam does anything BUT suck. They’ve been the best thing for PC games in a decade.

I own over 100 games through Steam. I never need to find my discs. I can install or uninstall whenever I want.

And best of all, they run REAL sales several times a year. I pick up anywhere up to a couple dozen games a year and only spend around $100-150 tops.

As much as I have fond memories of the old days of going to a local software store and buying a boxed game, how many of us play games that are 15 years old? I like being able to get titles that are over a year old for $15.


22 posted on 10/14/2013 12:35:00 PM PDT by Advil000
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To: Advil000
Your opinion is noted. I felt the same for years, until I had a billing issue with them. Do NOT ever have a billing problem with them. They still show me as having a -$41 balance, preventing me from purchasing anymore games from them.

They also toss out updates that they obviously never test. It's all up to the owners of the games they screw up to find and fix the problems they create.

Everyone has their own story to tell about Steam, but a quick check of the Steam Users Forum will show a multitude of complaints. Granted, Steam is way better than that POS from EA, but they could very easily do a lot better on their customer service.

23 posted on 10/14/2013 1:05:48 PM PDT by jeffc (The U.S. media are our enemy)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

I present to Freepers this product, developed by a disabled vet, and possibly the coolest steam box product to come to market in the next few months:

http://www.roundsdownrange.com/?p=1438


24 posted on 10/14/2013 1:11:39 PM PDT by JerseyHighlander
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To: JerseyHighlander

I love Steam. It’s a great service and it’s made it so that I don’t have to hoarde discs anymore and then manually apply patches for the games as they come out.

I think that PC gaming will be alive and well for a good long time.

I enjoy strategy games and I agree that the best games come from competing against other people compared to beating a predicatable AI.

Huge fan of Hearts Of Iron 3, War of the Roses, Crusader Kings 2. PM me if you enjoy any of these and would like to play sometime!


25 posted on 10/14/2013 1:45:16 PM PDT by Ueriah
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To: perez24

Fallout New Vegas was an Amazing Game.

But One of the most Glitchiest games I have ever played.

At Least on the Xbox 360, Maybe it was better on P.C.

26 posted on 10/14/2013 2:37:59 PM PDT by KC_Lion (Build the America you want to live in at your address, and keep looking up.-Sarah Palin)
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To: KC_Lion

I didn’t get it until there were a couple of patches out. The nice thing about the game, at least on PC, is that there is a TON of free mods so you can continuously do new things.


27 posted on 10/14/2013 4:31:54 PM PDT by perez24 (Dirty deeds, done dirt cheap.)
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To: perez24
I got New Vegas for Free when I.....Liberated it from a friend of friend who was helping them remove trash from their literally trashed house. (long story)

I am SO glad I did, it was just the basic game, not even a case, but worked just fine, When I played New Vegas I love it so much I even downloaded it's DLC, something that I almost never do.

I have never had too many bugs on consoles though until New Vegas.

It was still an Amazing Game, Hands Down the Best Game I played in 2012, so made up for Mass Effect 3.

I wanted more so I got Fallout 3 and Skyrim, and they are still in progress.

28 posted on 10/14/2013 7:38:53 PM PDT by KC_Lion (Build the America you want to live in at your address, and keep looking up.-Sarah Palin)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
Well, the Source Filmmaker filmmaking engine is the game engine itself, with a different interface to take advantage of all its features. When you make a "film," you are setting up characters, lights and cameras in a game space, and letting action happen in 3d, while recording. The cameras record and create the film. All 3d environments basically do this, but Steam has put a movie making engine onto their game engine. Here are some of the movies they have made with the engine:

Meet the Spy a game trailer for one of their games

Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Trailer Another trailer

29 posted on 10/14/2013 7:53:07 PM PDT by Vince Ferrer
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

As far as I’m concerned computer gaming was ruined when EA changed the Command and Conquer games to the Generals platform.


30 posted on 10/14/2013 8:16:05 PM PDT by Rebelbase (Tagline: (optional, printed after your name on post))
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To: jeffc
Oh, and Steam sucks big time!

It bugs me that Steam creates files that can't be defragged on my wife's Windows XP computer, and I use Auslogic, which I think is a better defragging tool than the Microsoft version.

31 posted on 10/14/2013 11:46:19 PM PDT by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: Windflier

Hey, I use Auslogic defragger, too! Awesome tool, and yes, better than MS’s defragger. I don’t understand MS’s defrag graphic. What’s with the vertical lines? Not that I actually watch a defrag, but you can’t really tell how much is defragged, you have to “trust” MS on that, LOL!


32 posted on 10/15/2013 11:47:30 AM PDT by jeffc (The U.S. media are our enemy)
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To: jeffc
Hey, I use Auslogic defragger, too! Awesome tool, and yes, better than MS’s defragger.

I love it. Like most new things I adopt, I found out about it through a post on FR. This place is priceless!

33 posted on 10/15/2013 12:11:53 PM PDT by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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