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The mysterious coywolf, a mixture of western coyote and eastern wolf
PBS ^

Posted on 03/09/2014 2:01:08 PM PDT by DBCJR

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I saw one of these in my subdivision when we first built here around 1997. I couldn't decide if it was a wolf (which we are not supposed to have here) or a coyote. Looked to big and furry to be a coyote but had a coyote snout. Haven't seen one since.This solves the mystery.
1 posted on 03/09/2014 2:01:09 PM PDT by DBCJR
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To: DBCJR

"..they made puppywhoop somewhere around St Louis"

2 posted on 03/09/2014 2:03:27 PM PDT by Doogle (( USAF.68-73..8th TFW Ubon Thailand..never store a threat you should have eliminated))
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To: DBCJR

We have them in Greentree PA just south of Pittsburgh. I have seen them several times over the past few years. Greentree even had a warning on their webpage about coyotes but they are Eastern Coyotes, Coywolves.


3 posted on 03/09/2014 2:07:01 PM PDT by prisoner6 (FREEDOM)
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To: DBCJR

There is an excellent tv show on the Coywolves.

Video: Meet the Coywolf | Watch Nature Online | PBS Video http://video.pbs.org/video/2365159966 - 43k - Cached - Similar pages Jan 22, 2014 ... The coywolf, a mixture of western coyote and eastern wolf, is a ... Watch videos


4 posted on 03/09/2014 2:11:58 PM PDT by Grampa Dave ( Obozo Care is a Trinity of Lies! Obozo Care is probably a serious Black Swan event.)
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To: DBCJR

They live wild in my neighborhood in CT. I’m way out in the woods but if you like your dog, you don’t let him roam. Lost cat posters are a thing of the past; cars don’t get lost, they get eaten.

I’ve crossed paths with them several times and they give you a good once over. I never hike unarmed and don’t walk the dogs unarmed either. They’re big and not the least bit afraid of you.


5 posted on 03/09/2014 2:12:32 PM PDT by muir_redwoods (When I first read it, " Atlas Shrugged" was fiction)
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To: DBCJR
I`ve seen Coydogs around the Cuyahoga Valley Towpath trail. They tend to look kinda like a Coyote with a long snout but have floppier ears and their fur`s coloration and appearance is more like a dogs. Sure look like they could give you a hard time if they want to, that's why I always carry my Bersa when I hike now.

Besides, the two legged animals around here can be rough looking too.

6 posted on 03/09/2014 2:13:58 PM PDT by nomad
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To: DBCJR
the story of how it came to be is an extraordinary tale of how quickly adaptation and evolution can occur, especially when humans interfere.

Evolution? This is a crossbreed.

7 posted on 03/09/2014 2:14:50 PM PDT by eartrumpet
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To: muir_redwoods

They eat cars!!! I`d better start looking for a .45 instead!


8 posted on 03/09/2014 2:16:08 PM PDT by nomad
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To: DBCJR

At least one human death by these hybrids. A young Canadian singer was killed by them while hiking. DNA tests confirmed they were wolf-coyote hybrids. I have them here on my farm in Loudoun County Virginia. I’ve found the remains of adult deer that were pulled down by them. They hunt in packs like wolves. Animal Control told me to be aware of the packs. I never go outside without a firearm.


9 posted on 03/09/2014 2:17:13 PM PDT by W.Lee (After the first one, the rest are free.)
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To: DBCJR
the dogs here in WNY are NOTHING like the scrawny mutt's out west... a pack of them is NOT to be taken lightly

and let me tell you, when you are in the woods at dusk/dark and hear them go off, it WILL send a chill up your spine!!!

Pistol, NEVER leave home without it.

10 posted on 03/09/2014 2:18:03 PM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -vvv- NO Pity for the LAZY - 86-44)
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To: nomad

“I`ve seen Coydogs around the Cuyahoga Valley Towpath trail.”

I bike down there! So that’s what I saw? Used to lease a 110 acre fallow farm on the edge of the Valley Park. But the Park took over 100 of the acres, and I moved into town. Miss that place!


11 posted on 03/09/2014 2:23:05 PM PDT by Dr. Bogus Pachysandra ( Ya can't pick up a turd by the clean end!)
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To: nomad; DBCJR
cars don’t get lost, they get eaten.

Just imagine the scat.

12 posted on 03/09/2014 2:27:31 PM PDT by no-s (when democracy is displaced by tyranny, the armed citizen still gets to vote)
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To: no-s

Imagine the poor animal passing it!


13 posted on 03/09/2014 2:29:41 PM PDT by nomad
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To: nomad
nom nom nom...
14 posted on 03/09/2014 2:34:10 PM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -vvv- NO Pity for the LAZY - 86-44)
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To: DBCJR

The DNR won’t admit they brought them here “to control deer”.


15 posted on 03/09/2014 2:34:47 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: Dr. Bogus Pachysandra

Maybe they are coyote-wolves but I`ve always heard they are dog-coyote hybrids. They have some dog-like ears and that fur is not at all like a wolf or coyote`s. They are truly weird canines! Although I`ve only seen a few, I`m not too proud to say they give me the willies, freaky and mean looking dogs!


16 posted on 03/09/2014 2:37:04 PM PDT by nomad
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To: Chode

I sure hope we don`t have any of those running around the Towpath!


17 posted on 03/09/2014 2:42:09 PM PDT by nomad
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To: nomad

That’s where a cooper scooper comes in handy.


18 posted on 03/09/2014 2:42:30 PM PDT by RedMDer (May we always be happy and may our enemies always know it. - Sarah Palin, 10-18-2010)
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To: nomad

They have never identified dog DNA in wild coyotes.

Only wolf.


19 posted on 03/09/2014 2:45:22 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: AnAmericanMother; Titan Magroyne; Badeye; SandRat; arbooz; potlatch; afraidfortherepublic; ...
WOOOF!

Computer Hope

The Doggie Ping list is for FReepers who would like to be notified of threads relating to all things canid. If you would like to join the Doggie Ping Pack (or be unleashed from it), FReemail me.

20 posted on 03/09/2014 2:46:51 PM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Qui me amat, amat et canem meum.)
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To: Grampa Dave
VERY interesting video.

Coyotes are SUPER smart. Wolves are big, ferocious and fearless. WHAT a mixture. The hyrid coy wolves are, of course, doomed.

THANK GOD the Clintons only had one child.

21 posted on 03/09/2014 2:51:07 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: nomad
COYWOLVES:Although I`ve only seen a few, I`m not too proud to say they give me the willies, freaky and mean looking dogs!

It must have been a mating of two very horny canines for that to occur. Remimds me of some of the Hollyweird marriages couplings.

They will eventually and probably breed themselves BACK to ordinary wolves and coyotes, but it will take many generations.

22 posted on 03/09/2014 2:54:50 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: DBCJR

We used to have animals on our Texas Gulf Coast property called Red Wolves. They were probably wolf/coyote crosses and said to be endangered. Now what we have appears to be Coyotes. We have Coyotes in the heart of Houston too. I have seen them myself.


23 posted on 03/09/2014 2:57:30 PM PDT by Ditter
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To: Dr. Bogus Pachysandra
I worked with a guy who still lives along the edge of that park, he lost some of his land to them as well.

I believe he`s on Black Road, near that corn stand along Rt. 303, just down from the Brecksville Station by the bridge those Occupy Wall Street @$$holes tried to blow up.

That's a beautiful area to hike, those hills make for challenging climbs. I also love the ride from there to lock 3 in Akron, virtually all forest except for Peninsula, the Valley, and that final stretch into Akron.

24 posted on 03/09/2014 2:59:53 PM PDT by nomad
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To: Salamander

There have been packs of coydogs roaming the woods and riverbank here for years, the product of lost or abandoned pets and coyotes-they are mostly big, and totally unafraid of humans, like domestic dogs, and clever and forest-smart as a coyote-they are a lot more dangerous than the resident cougars. I do not take my Husky walking outside the fence, ever-if you leave your cat or dog unattended, it will eventually be a meal for these animals.

I hike in the woods most days, but not without bear spray, or even a sidearm.


25 posted on 03/09/2014 3:00:23 PM PDT by Texan5 (" You've got to saddle up your boys, you've got to draw a hard line"...)
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To: nomad

I told you they were big


26 posted on 03/09/2014 3:01:40 PM PDT by muir_redwoods (When I first read it, " Atlas Shrugged" was fiction)
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To: nomad
Maybe they are coyote-wolves but I`ve always heard they are dog-coyote hybrids.

That's what they thought about these creatures when they showed up in rural areas north and west of New York City around 15-20 years ago, but apparently they did some DNA testing and found that they are cross-bred between coyotes and wolves, not dogs.

That explains why they demonstrate one of the characteristics that are rarely common between wolves and coyotes: wolves live in packs, while coyotes are usually solitary animals. So when these coyote-like animals began showing up in packs in these rural areas, it was pretty much assumed that they were not your typical western coyotes.

27 posted on 03/09/2014 3:06:55 PM PDT by Alberta's Child ("I've never seen such a conclave of minstrels in my life.")
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To: DBCJR
"Many eastern coyotes (Canis latrans "var.") are coywolves, which despite having a majority of coyote (Canis latrans) ancestry, also descend from either the gray wolf (Canis lupus) or the red wolf (Canis lupus rufus, formerly Canis rufus). They come from a constantly evolving gene pool, and are viewed by some scientists as an emerging coywolf species.

The genetic composition and classification of the eastern coyote is debated among scientists.

A study showed that of 100 coyotes collected in Maine, 22 had half or more gray wolf ancestry, and one was 89 percent gray wolf.[6] A theory has been proposed that the large eastern "coyotes" in Canada are actually hybrids of the smaller western coyotes and gray wolves that mated decades ago as the coyotes moved toward New England from their earlier western ranges."

Source: Wikipedia

***

We have a den about 1/8 of a mile from our house. These animals come in packs through our property, and I estimate that one was as much as 60 pounds. They attacked and almost killed a small dog next door.

28 posted on 03/09/2014 3:07:05 PM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: cloudmountain
All I know is I`ve seen them around that area, whether dog-coyote or wolf-coyote, they are definitely NOT pure bred coyotes. I have seen live coyotes up close and handled their carcases, these are NOT coyotes.
29 posted on 03/09/2014 3:10:03 PM PDT by nomad
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To: Salamander

Yes they have.

Widespread occurrence of a domestic dog mitochondrial DNA haplotype in southeastern US coyotes.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12535104


30 posted on 03/09/2014 3:12:08 PM PDT by Valpal1 (If the police can t solve a problem with violence, they ll find a way to fix it with brute force)
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To: nomad

The old farm I leased was on North Boyden. 1830 white farmhouse on the top of the hill. As manager, I didn’t need a deer tag, wrote my own. Used to come home from work, strap on my Redhawk 44 mag, and walk out the back door to my own hunting grounds. In rainy weather, the geese would fly low over the old fence line. I’d sit on the back porch and wait for them! Ah,,,,those were the days, my friend, I thought they’d never end. But they did. Why the govt needed that proper is ridiculous!


31 posted on 03/09/2014 3:16:07 PM PDT by Dr. Bogus Pachysandra ( Ya can't pick up a turd by the clean end!)
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To: Texan5

Coyotes would eat dogs before they’d mate with them.

http://perambulations.wordpress.com/2012/03/25/so-which-is-it-coyote-coywolf-or-coydog/

Unless you have seen _drop-eared_ “coyotes” running around, they’re not going to be “coydogs”.

Drop ears are genetically dominant and would prevail in a coyote/dog mating *unless* the dog were naturally prick-eared.

Sorry.


32 posted on 03/09/2014 3:19:26 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: DBCJR

Looks worthwhile, thanks. I’d have taken it for a dog, at first glance at least. Looks well fed.


33 posted on 03/09/2014 3:19:41 PM PDT by bigbob (The best way to get a bad law repealed is to enforce it strictly. Abraham Lincoln)
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To: trisham

And exactly 0% had “dog” genes.


34 posted on 03/09/2014 3:20:18 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: Joe 6-pack

One needs a Colt to protect Dog from Coywolf!


35 posted on 03/09/2014 3:21:20 PM PDT by left that other site
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To: W.Lee
I have them here on my farm in Loudoun County Virginia. I’ve found the remains of adult deer that were pulled down by them. They hunt in packs like wolves. Animal Control told me to be aware of the packs. I never go outside without a firearm.

I am just across the river from you in Monky County, and we have them here, too. I have been stalked in broad daylight while riding a 17.2 Irish horse, and as big as he is, he did not appreciate it. In the woods near my house, which is at the edge of the suburbs, I found a deer who had been brought down by something large. The creature who broke her pelvis had jaws big enough to reach all the way across her hips from ilium to ilium, but a very well-informed park ranger I brought in for his opinion agreed with me that those were not cat teeth-marks. I cannot imagine an ordinary domestic dog who had jaws like that. We agreed it was a coy-dog.

I wish I too could wear a gun when riding or when out in the woods on foot, but I live in the Freak State.

36 posted on 03/09/2014 3:21:42 PM PDT by ottbmare (the OTTB mare, now a proud Marine Mom)
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To: Salamander

Correct.


37 posted on 03/09/2014 3:21:55 PM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: Salamander
Drop ears are genetically dominant and would prevail in a coyote/dog mating *unless* the dog were naturally prick-eared.

You're so right. Remember that ongoing experiment in Russia on the domestication of foxes? As Russian scientists bred foxes for more compliant personalities, they acquired floppy ears.

38 posted on 03/09/2014 3:25:15 PM PDT by ottbmare (the OTTB mare, now a proud Marine Mom)
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To: StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; decimon; 1010RD; 21twelve; 24Karet; 2ndDivisionVet; ...
Interesting cryptobiology topic. Thanks DBCJR.

39 posted on 03/09/2014 3:26:38 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: Alberta's Child; trisham

So is Akron, Ohio far enough east to have Coywolves? But the ones I`ve seen had floppier ears and more doglike coloration with very long snouts.


40 posted on 03/09/2014 3:26:40 PM PDT by nomad
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To: Valpal1

*But*:

“The widespread distribution of this haplotype from Florida to West Virginia suggests that the hybridization event occurred long ago before the southeastern USA was colonized by coyotes.

However, it could have occurred in the southeastern USA before the main front of coyotes arrived in the area _between male coyotes released for sport_ and _a local domestic dog_.”

There *are* morons intentionally breeding ‘coydogs’ for pets.

The article also says “closely related to” domestic dogs.

That’s a pretty big genetic spread in a very old study.

They’re just now admitting the wolf ancestry, after denying it for decades,


41 posted on 03/09/2014 3:27:04 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: ottbmare

Yes I do.

Something about domestication cause dogs to revert to a perpetual state of puppyhood, displaying “puppy traits”.

Domestic dogs are eternally infantilized wolves.


42 posted on 03/09/2014 3:29:22 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: trisham

You might want to don your asbestos undies.

:)


43 posted on 03/09/2014 3:29:59 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: blam

Maybe there’s more than one mystery here.

http://www.carolinadogs.com/


44 posted on 03/09/2014 3:31:25 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: ottbmare

Carry anyway.

Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

For decades, I’ve gotten around it by carrying a long rifle into the woods.

I know people who carry lighter all the time.

You gotta do what you gotta do.


45 posted on 03/09/2014 3:32:03 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: Dr. Bogus Pachysandra

The US Wildlands Project! The predecessor of UN agenda 21, look them up.


46 posted on 03/09/2014 3:32:24 PM PDT by nomad
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To: Grampa Dave

Great video.

Thanks!

Had to turn the sound down when they were howling as that set the Dobes off into a blood-eyed rage.

:)


47 posted on 03/09/2014 3:33:31 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: nomad

It seems questionable at this time:

http://northernwoodlands.org/outside_story/article/canis-soupus-the-eastern-coy-wolf/


48 posted on 03/09/2014 3:34:53 PM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: SunkenCiv

Dogs, left to breed amongst themselves will eventually revert to “primitive type”.

Some breeds still retain that type, such as Dingos, Ibizan Hounds, Pharoah Hounds, *all* of the Podengo/Podenco types and Spitz types.

When you strip away all of man’s genetic “interference”, those dogs are what original dogs looked like.


49 posted on 03/09/2014 3:37:13 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: trisham; nomad

They are more likely just feral mutts.


50 posted on 03/09/2014 3:38:35 PM PDT by Salamander (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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