Skip to comments.Papyrus Referring to Jesusí Wife Is More Likely Ancient Than Fake, Scientists Say
Posted on 04/10/2014 1:54:14 PM PDT by mojito
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After the temple was destroyed, yes. But He is called “Rabbi” and teacher in many versions of the New Testament, right?
I don't know anything about this Prof. King, but her bio doesn't reassure:
“Karen L. King is Hollis Professor of Divinity, Harvard Universitys oldest endowed professorship (1721), and is the first woman to hold this chair. Trained in comparative religions and historical studies, she pursues teaching and research specialties in the history of Christianity. Her particular theoretical interests are in discourses of normativity (orthodoxy and heresy), gender studies, and religion and violence.”
you are missing the point. If Jesus had a wife, there is no reason that it wouldn’t have been mentioned in the early gospels and traditions. There is no theological problem with a married Jesus. The theological problem is that it is trying to prove the Bible, the early church fathers, and the traditions of the church are wrong.
Jesus’ relatives helped run the church in Jerusalem, and were known, but there is no early mention of a wife or kids.
I have seen articles that imply that He was trained by rabbis and scholars. We know so little about His childhood and even adulthood until He started His ministry, don’t we?
I understand and agree. But it still leaves me with the conclusion that whatever implications this revelation (real or fiction) implies, it doesn’t really make any difference to me. I say this because if there was a ‘wife’ I don’t find it impossible to believe that it is a something unnatural, like much of today’s much hyped perversions masquerading as ‘normal.’ It only brings my perception of spirituality closer what is really ‘normal’.
“....it is something unnatural...” should be “isn’t” [tripped myself up there].. IOW, man/woman marriage is natural
Well, I can think of one reason he might have abstained from getting married while he was on earth. After all, he was already engaged.
Sure, maybe there was some philosopher named Jesus (Yeshu) who was advertising for students sometime around the year 100 A.D. or so, as Greek philosophy was popular in those days. We know that Jewish families back then liked to hire Athenian and Phoenecian expatriates as teachers.
This “Jesus” may have been bragging that women could study with him, as it was fairly unusual for women to study philosophy. Hypatia of Alexandria was a rare example of a famous female philosopher. I reckon that philosophy is just too manly for chicks. Or, sexism.
I would focus on the word ‘disciple’ and what it meant in Greek and in the local culture. It may mean ‘student,’ or something more profound.
Jesus The Christ (Yeshua Hamashiach) did not seem to have much respect for Greeks. See Mark 7:24, et seq.
Ancient forgery. Gnostic heresy. Something along that line.
Well, there is no definitive statement about him being trained, but, in the absence of that, I would assume that he wasn’t.
After all, we do know that, as a child, Jesus could stand up in the Temple and hold discourse on the Torah that impressed his elders. So, he apparently had all the knowledge one would expect the author of the Torah to have. Why would he need to be trained by a human with less understanding than he possessed?
His bride is the Church. He is her bridegroom.
“Ancient” as in “early Medieval” (600-900 A.D.), but “early Medieval” doesn’t have the cachet that “ancient” does. At any rate, it’s a very late document of extremely dubious pedigree.
I don’t have a problem with Jesus having a wife. The custom was to marry so perhaps he did.
You’re right. There were many outlier ‘gospels’ written by some unknown for some unknown reason. No reason to give it any credence.
These "historians" believe in man-made global warming BS and sell snake oil calling it "education". Trust them not!
**ancient, and not a modern forgery.**
But that doesn’t make it accurate, does it now?
All this demonstrates, if true, is that it was written many centuries ago. I just finished reading an anthology titled, The Lost Bible. It is amazing just how many books were written in the early years of Christianity that were full of nonsense about Jesus and his disciples.
I can’t imagine why they would leave out that option :)
Gnostic Blasphemy....But then again, those two words are redundant.
She must’ been otherwise engaged the day they nailed Him to a tree...
“Every known printed/written copy of the Bible was created by men with their own agendas and desires.”
The Author of Time Who could see every second of it and across all of it, Who SPOKE the world into existence, somehow failed to get the right words to those He wanted to reach?
Idiotic, nonsensical, ridiculous.
I believe portions of it were inspired by divine contact and intervention. I believe certain men throughout history earned divine knowledge.
However, I don't believe it was orally retold and transcribed by MEN 100% accurately and truthfully over the several millenia that passed.
I don't believe that He would want us to blindly accept a book written by men as His unfiltered word. ALL men are corrupt and fallen at some level.
it only confirms that such a document may have existed, and someone” possibly between A.D. 3XX and A.D. 7XX likely produced it
that does not identify who they were or who they might have been or what their beliefs or motivations were
and there were many different “Jesus gospels” written by many different people (all original authors of them unknown) over the centuries
what does the “scientific analysis” about the scrap of parchment CONFIRM, religiously? next to nothing
God, then, is a failure. He could see to the ‘several millenia’ as easily as anywhere else in Time. The Word is less than useless if it is not THE WORD
I agree with that but believe He is above the limitations of man-made words.
Words or books are all highly simplified interpretations by men who have seen glimpses of what lies beyond.
I do believe many of the core teachings of the Bible are true but it is all man-made interpretation to help us understand these teachings.
There can be no such thing as “God's Word” condensed into a book for He is beyond what can be written in words.
THE WORD simply exists all around us. The Universe itself and EVERYTHING in it is THE WORD. We can only comprehend a fraction of one drop in this ocean. God is NO FAILURE. We are the failure for thinking all the teachings of God's Universe can be condensed into a book.
“There can be no such thing as God’s Word condensed into a book for He is beyond what can be written in words.
THE WORD simply exists all around us. The Universe itself and EVERYTHING in it is THE WORD.”
You conflate what God wants us to know with His very being. This is pure sophistry that contains a great contradiction: That the Word of God is not true due to an apparent failure of all powerful God but is somehow intelligibly OBJECYIVELY contained in all of Creation; a sign of His Power.
The word of God is then subjective and WHATEVER you want it to be. Which leads me to the conclusion that there is something in the ACTUAL Word of God that you don’t like and wish to deny.
You state what I was thinking; i.e. Gnostic nonsense. False stories and doctrines began almost immediately both during and after Christ’s death. The Bible tells us that; i.e. calling Jesus a winebibber(SP?) etc.
“That the Word of God is not true due to an apparent failure of all powerful God but is somehow intelligibly OBJECYIVELY contained in all of Creation; a sign of His Power.”
No, I’m saying that the Word of God is true and is represented symbolically by everything we perceive to be the Universe. From the specs of dust circling the furthest galaxy all the way to each of us humans.
Each being that is conscious within our Universe has a limited perspective of the entire picture and can only learn/perceive so much in a lifetime. We each have a separated, timed and biased view of something that is actually singular, timeless and perfectly balanced.
We are limited by God’s imposition of time, space, energy and entropy within this Universe. Over time through language and writing, humans were able to condense knowledge gathered over many lifetimes.
The Bible is a fine example of this but it is still man’s imperfect, biased perception of the true Word of God: The Universe itself. God gave us imperfections and individual biases for a higher purpose than we may ever comprehend. The Bible itself is ultimately a human work and still subject to human imperfection.
We are still not done learning, far from it. With all the scientific breakthroughs coming together, we will hear from Him soon.
Note: this topic was posted 4/10/2014. Thanks mojito.