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Outbox vs. USPS: How the Post Office Killed Digital Mail
Inside Sources .com ^ | April 28, 2014 | Derek Khanna

Posted on 04/30/2014 5:27:15 PM PDT by Utilizer

Baehr and Will Davis, were summoned to Washington for a meeting with the Postmaster General. Evan and Will wondered what it could be, “They must have seen the recent coverage in CNBC, maybe they’ll help our company expand?” Or, “maybe they wanted the traditional photo opportunity and positive media buzz that political actors care so much about. Surely their company made the Post Office look good, right?” But when the Postmaster General came out to meet them, the stark reality became clear, they weren’t interested in a photo-op.

As Evan and Will describe it: “This 30-minute meeting was the end of our business model.”

...

When Evan and Will got called in to meet with the Postmaster General they were joined by the USPS’s General Counsel and Chief of Digital Strategy. But instead, Evan recounts that US Postmaster General Patrick Donahoe “looked at us” and said “we have a misunderstanding. ‘You disrupt my service and we will never work with you.’” Further, “‘You mentioned making the service better for our customers; but the American citizens aren’t our customers—about 400 junk mailers are our customers. Your service hurts our ability to serve those customers.”’

According to Evan, the Chief of Digital Strategy’s comments were even more stark, “[Your market model] will never work anyway. Digital is a fad. It will only work in Europe.”

(Excerpt) Read more at insidesources.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Computers/Internet
KEYWORDS: email; mail; regulation; usps
Yet another shining example of why governmental agencies serve We The People so well. (/sarc)

More info on the details at site, but the article was a bit long to post here. Essentially, if you manage to create something that challenges a governmental agency (or a union contributor to them) in any way, be prepared to have someone with deep pockets backing up your effort or you will not be allowed to proceed.

Kind of like MS and Lotus123, I think.

1 posted on 04/30/2014 5:27:15 PM PDT by Utilizer
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To: Utilizer

DOS isn’t done until Lotus won’t run!


2 posted on 04/30/2014 5:31:13 PM PDT by null and void ( They don't think think they are above the law. They think they are the law.)
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To: Utilizer

“Digital is a fad. It will only work in Europe.”

Anything I can say here, can only fail to express,,,,


3 posted on 04/30/2014 5:31:56 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: Utilizer

The article makes a good point that should be emphasized: the USPS is a wealth transfer from the public to a select group of bulk mailers.


4 posted on 04/30/2014 5:34:34 PM PDT by wideawake
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To: wideawake

Given the astounding number of catalogs we receive on a daily basis, I actually believe it might be possible to heat the house all winter long if we had a suitable combustion system.


5 posted on 04/30/2014 5:37:05 PM PDT by nascarnation (Toxic Baraq Syndrome: hopefully infecting a Dem candidate near you)
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To: null and void

*laugh* Lotus was far ahead of it’s time. MS bought them out, then sat on them while promoting their own product with far less capabilities and allowed the Lotus offering to die away.


6 posted on 04/30/2014 5:41:27 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: nascarnation

It’s already been done.


7 posted on 04/30/2014 5:41:59 PM PDT by meatloaf (Impeach Obama. That's my New Year's resolution.)
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To: nascarnation
Given the astounding number of catalogs we receive on a daily basis, I actually believe it might be possible to heat the house all winter long if we had a suitable combustion system.

Convert them to pellets and get a pellet burner.

8 posted on 04/30/2014 5:43:00 PM PDT by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: Utilizer

Article should have a time-line but I didn’t see one. US Postmaster General Donahoe took office on October 25, 2010 and is a 35 year veteran of the USPS. So our Crony Capitalism and Tech-savy Obama Administration prefers to allow business as usual with a dying model. Surprise!


9 posted on 04/30/2014 5:50:48 PM PDT by SES1066 (Quality, Speed or Economical - Any 2 of 3 except in government - 1 at best but never #3!)
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To: DesertRhino
No worries. I can add a couple of things. That comment could only come from someone totally clue-less about the state of technology as it stands (the "digital is a fad" remark), let alone how it is evolving more and more as time goes by. Using Europe as a bolstering point only stresses what an idiot the commentator is, since most of Europe is being Balkanized to the point of extinction in the name of Political Correctness and The Need To Not Offend Islam.

The Postal Service was created to provide for the citizenry of this country a necessary service, and the fact that they are failing to do so so badly is only magnified by the fact that persons such as this are the ones in charge at this point.

10 posted on 04/30/2014 5:52:59 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Utilizer

Flawed reasoning. The customers of the Post Office are those who pay the postage,not those who receive the letters. These two would have done better going after the revenue side.


11 posted on 04/30/2014 5:55:58 PM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: AdmSmith; AnonymousConservative; Berosus; bigheadfred; Bockscar; cardinal4; ColdOne; ...
Thanks Utilizer.
When Evan and Will got called in to meet with the Postmaster General they were joined by the USPS’s General Counsel and Chief of Digital Strategy. But instead, Evan recounts that US Postmaster General Patrick Donahoe “looked at us” and said “we have a misunderstanding. ‘You disrupt my service and we will never work with you.’” Further, “‘You mentioned making the service better for our customers; but the American citizens aren’t our customers—about 400 junk mailers are our customers. Your service hurts our ability to serve those customers.”’

12 posted on 04/30/2014 6:00:09 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: wideawake
Unfortunately, there currently exist no way to stamp a "return to sender" notice on junk mail to stop them from continually sending you their offerings, otherwise their own mailboxes would be overflowing beyond all reason as of years ago. How the Postal Service devolved from being the standard we could all rely upon to being nothing more than the money-losing means to stuffing immediately-trashed pieces of paper to countless individuals without let is something I have much difficulty understanding.

From the famous Pony Express, to this. *sigh*.

13 posted on 04/30/2014 6:05:11 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: null and void

That’s the funniest thing I’ve read this month...LOL!!


14 posted on 04/30/2014 6:05:24 PM PDT by ken5050 ("One useless man is a shame, two are a law firm, three or more are a Congress".. John Adams)
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To: nascarnation

Given the astounding number of catalogs we receive....

&&&
I have found that calling the companies will make them stop sending the catalogues. Well, for a time, anyway. Then you need to call again....


15 posted on 04/30/2014 6:10:40 PM PDT by Bigg Red (1 Pt 1: As he who called you is holy, be holy yourselves in every aspect of your conduct.)
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To: Utilizer

Watched a Postal Employee behind the desk argue for 15 minutes with a customer about a 90 cent issue. It was miserable and the employee was tacky. For 90 cents the employee made about 20 people into post office enemies. No customer service skills there.

I am a daily PO visitor and most of the employees are average to good in customer service, but they are hamstrung with rules and have no discretion.


16 posted on 04/30/2014 6:17:12 PM PDT by Chickensoup (Leftist totalitarian fascism is on the move.)
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To: nascarnation
Given the astounding number of catalogs we receive on a daily basis, I actually believe it might be possible to heat the house all winter long if we had a suitable combustion system.

Funny you should mention that. I live in a very tiny community, and there are roughly six very tall wastebaskets placed inside the local post-office location, which are always filled to the brim whenever I happen to chance by. Mind you, this is INCLUDING the fact that quite a few people I know go by on a regular basis just to grab as much of the tossed mailings as they can to use in their fireplaces and woodstoves, so I can only imagine what a relief it would be to the USPS if its employees never had to process all that wasted material in the first place.

And where are all the tree-huggers on this matter, now that it's so obvious?

17 posted on 04/30/2014 6:20:35 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Utilizer
*laugh* Lotus was far ahead of it’s time. MS bought them out, then sat on them while promoting their own product with far less capabilities and allowed the Lotus offering to die away.

Not quite. IBM bought them out for Lotus Notes, and just didn't know what to do with Lotus SmartSuite. Lotus was hurt more by Borland, Mosaic and Paperback Software up until Windows 3.1 and especially 95 came out.
18 posted on 04/30/2014 6:21:03 PM PDT by Dr. Sivana ("I'm a Contra" -- President Ronald Reagan)
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To: Utilizer
It’s likely news to the American people, but the Post Office apparently doesn’t consider you to be its customers.

If figured it out years ago when I found out that Federal Law requires property owners to have a mailbox on your property regardless if you receive your personal mail elsewhere or not.

Even though you must purchase and install the mailbox yourself the mailbox is the property of the US Mail Service. There are also a plethora of regulations on the placement, dimensions and materials required for a mailbox.

As to who the customers of the USPS are; one need only closely review who sends you a given weeks mail.

But I should mention two not so obvious USPS customers. That would be the the National Association of Letter Carriers and the National Rural Letter Carriers' Association. These two unions though not technically customers have a vested interest in the USPS status quo. And given that there is a feedback loop of money from congress to these unions’ members and back to congressional campaign funds I see them as customers.

19 posted on 04/30/2014 6:27:16 PM PDT by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: SES1066
Just makes My point. If you are not making a campaign contribution, or not a Union representative, then the USPS is not interested in your opinion(s).

This from an agency that was specifically created to benefit all of us, not merely the select few.

20 posted on 04/30/2014 6:35:12 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: redgolum
The customers of the Post Office are those who pay the postage,not those who receive the letters.

If the senders of all that junk mail would be forced to pay not only the postage of what they sent, but also the cost of having it all sent back to them, not only would the demands on the USPS be reduced dramatically but their overall operating costs and employee efforts would be diminished by a considerable factor. Then perhaps they would not be operating under a continual financial black hole year after year.

21 posted on 04/30/2014 6:39:12 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: SunkenCiv

No worries, mate. Glad to help out with info as always.


22 posted on 04/30/2014 6:40:08 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Utilizer

Be sure to send the business reply envelopes back stuffed with other junk somebody else sent you. They have to pay the postage on those.


23 posted on 04/30/2014 6:47:48 PM PDT by Lurkina.n.Learnin
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To: Utilizer

I don’t have home pickup paper recycling, but each week we deliver a full plastic tote full of catalogs and misc “junk” mail about 18 inches deep to our church recycling bin. It’s truly amazing to me the volume of bulk mail that arrives every day.


24 posted on 04/30/2014 6:52:25 PM PDT by nascarnation (Toxic Baraq Syndrome: hopefully infecting a Dem candidate near you)
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To: Chickensoup
Watched a Postal Employee behind the desk argue for 15 minutes with a customer about a 90 cent issue. It was miserable and the employee was tacky. For 90 cents the employee made about 20 people into post office enemies. No customer service skills there.

No surprise on this end. I have dealt with many government employees over the years and have found that far too many of them appear to regard their jobs as some form of Better-Than-Thou, since they get to decide how you will next proceed.

Whether it be the USPS, the DMV, or the slope-headed mouth-breathers who process your Passport paperwork, they most of them know that they have it within their power to Deny Your Request, simply because they can. Not all, granted, but this article serves to illustrate just how far that kind of mindset has pervaded our governmental agencies.

25 posted on 04/30/2014 6:54:49 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Utilizer
This from an agency that was specifically created to benefit all of us, not merely the select few.

Getting the facts is not really that hard.

It WAS created to benefit the worst possible group. Unequivocally.
Let the facts speak for themselves. Image and video hosting by TinyPic

26 posted on 04/30/2014 6:56:53 PM PDT by publius911 ( At least Nixon had the good g race to resign!)
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To: Dr. Sivana
Thank you for the reminder. Always glad to be helped to remember things I misremember. It's always the highlights that stand out it seems, like when little Billy Gates announced to his fellow coders that what he had produced was now proprietary and subject to licensing if anyone wanted to use it.

I know coders that still hate that jerk to this day.

27 posted on 04/30/2014 6:58:21 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Lurkina.n.Learnin
Be sure to send the business reply envelopes back stuffed with other junk somebody else sent you. They have to pay the postage on those.

What a great idea!
I have to waste time going through all email to segregate the "guaranteed offers" that have preprinted information about me, so I can shred those pages and prevent the identity thieves picking data from my "recycle garbage."

I'll just make sure I send back other companies' garbage that does not have my name and personal info on it.

28 posted on 04/30/2014 7:12:32 PM PDT by publius911 ( At least Nixon had the good g race to resign!)
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To: Pontiac
Well, technically there is a method by which you can remove your mailbox and receive all your mail at General Delivery, but it requires a lot of time and effort, not to mention resistance from your local post-office, and you need to educate yourself on things such as the difference between General Delivery and general-post-office, as well as how to distinguish yourself as being a postal patron instead of a post-office customer as is generally assumed.

Not easy, and take it from someone that is still fighting the occasional battles that it is not a step taken lightly.

29 posted on 04/30/2014 7:16:42 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Utilizer
Lotus was far ahead of it’s time. MS bought them out, then sat on them while promoting their own product with far less capabilities and allowed the Lotus offering to die away.

I'm guessing you were born long after those heady times. IBM bought Lotus in 1995 for $3.5B, mainly to obtain Lotus Notes.

30 posted on 04/30/2014 7:23:10 PM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom
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To: Lurkina.n.Learnin
Be sure to send the business reply envelopes back stuffed with other junk somebody else sent you. They have to pay the postage on those.

Yes, but then those persons know that there is a real individual behind that address and market out that information to other groups.

This is why, for example, I never directly answer the phone and let all calls go to the answering machine. If it is someone I know I will recognize them and answer, and if it is someone I do not, then eventually the lack of response will get the number deleted from the call list they are operating from as being a waste of effort. "No-Call" or "Do-Not-Call" lists are a waste of time.

31 posted on 04/30/2014 7:24:13 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Utilizer

The last thing I want is my mail being redirected, opened, scanned and digitally preserved by a third party working closely with a government agency.


32 posted on 04/30/2014 7:24:43 PM PDT by HapaxLegamenon
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To: publius911

Hmmm. I actually have some photocopies of a couple of small books that speak to the creation of the postal service, ‘The Founding of the Postal Service’ being one... However their exact titles escape Me at the moment and I need to go take some time to go and look up the copies I have set aside somewhere that speak more clearly as to the establishment of the agency we now know. You would be surprised at how much it has devolved from what it was originally intended to be and how much its own rules and regulations are unknown to its own employees -including the PostMasters.


33 posted on 04/30/2014 7:41:23 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: ProtectOurFreedom
Thank you as well for the reminder. I sometimes do not remember things as well as I should, although I should note to you that I was indeed present when these momentous events were occurring.

Always glad to have someone point out an inaccuracy, not the least reason being that it corrects something I posted previously and people need to know the facts.

Also, the fact that you posted the correction brings other minds to the post and makes more people aware of the events being discussed. To their benefits, I would hope. Stop learning, stop living, I always say.

34 posted on 04/30/2014 7:47:01 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: HapaxLegamenon

The “governmental agency” had nothing to do with it other than sending the mail to the specified address. Think of it as a “Re-Mailing” service, and that is the extent to which this company operated -NOT the USPS.


35 posted on 04/30/2014 7:49:32 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Utilizer

And last Feb. they “lost” a $100 Amazon order of auto parts (FedEx del. to local PO) , placed me on hold for over an hour without answering, when i did get thru they said it went to a city nearby, but never got here. Got thru a few days later and they tracked it came to my city, not the one nearby, but do not know why it never got delivered.

Said to contact Consumer Affairs, which i sent email to with order #, but they never got back to me.

Called national help, which gave me a case number and said they would contact me in 24hrs, but never did.

Plus i ordered forever stamps, 2-3 day priority mail it says, but took 2 weeks.

And i am just outside the capital of my state.


36 posted on 04/30/2014 7:56:29 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: Utilizer

The unaddressed mailings that look like newspapers get ceremoniously left in the parking lots of the local strip malls responsible for sending it. Let them pay to have the mess cleaned up. Much other junk mail (carefully separated from identifying data) is left in front of the post office.

No holds barred.


37 posted on 04/30/2014 8:20:48 PM PDT by Born to Conserve
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To: daniel1212

I well know what you mean, mate. I could tell you horror stories about how the USPS has time after time failed to live up to its stated reasons for existing. Suffice to say that a more customer-friendly option is long overdue!


38 posted on 04/30/2014 8:22:01 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Dr. Sivana
Oh, by the way: on an unrelated topic, what was the deal with Borland DBase 5.0? Wasn't there some sort of major problem with that? I ask because I happen to have come across a couple of CD's of that and I seem to remember there was a problem with it at the time...

Virus?

39 posted on 04/30/2014 8:58:26 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Utilizer
*laugh* Lotus was far ahead of it’s time. MS bought them out, then sat on them while promoting their own product with far less capabilities and allowed the Lotus offering to die away.

Visicalc was the original spreadsheet. Lotus 123 came along and stole the idea. Microsoft Excel had a more robust set of math functions than 123. The prize that came and went was Smartware by Informix. They had a firstclass spreadsheet module in their officeware.

40 posted on 04/30/2014 10:48:05 PM PDT by LoneRangerMassachusetts (The meek shall not inherit the Earth)
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To: LoneRangerMassachusetts
I remember Visicalc. Was not too impressed. But when Lotus 123 came on the scene with its advanced features all tied to its spreadsheet functions I was completely hooked.

I could do things in Lotus that I never even thought could be tied together at all. Nearest equivalent that came close to it was an offering by a company that I still have trouble remembering to this day. Started with a "P". Phoenix, Pythagorus, Pyramid... I dunno.

I just remember that the MS offering was MUCH less capable than what I had originally been working with that I was quite angry that I was forced to move to it instead of what I knew would most likely get the job done.

41 posted on 04/30/2014 11:23:11 PM PDT by Utilizer (Bacon A'kbar! - In world today are only peaceful people, and the mooslimbs trying to kill them-)
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To: Utilizer
what was the deal with Borland DBase 5.0? . . . virus

Back then, most viruses were spread on Macs by shared floppies! dBase 5 offered no significant upgrade over dBase 4. It was buggy, and I think a new, slightly diferent, file format was introduced. A lot of people had already moved over to the faster Foxbase by the time 5.0 came out. FoxBase was eventually bought by your pals at Microsoft and eventually left to wither (though you can still throw money at Microsoft if you want it, just as you can still buy Paradox from Corel).
42 posted on 05/01/2014 5:22:03 AM PDT by Dr. Sivana ("I'm a Contra" -- President Ronald Reagan)
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To: Utilizer

43 posted on 12/08/2015 6:38:24 AM PST by tang-soo (Prophecy of the Seventy Weeks - Read Daniel Chapter 9)
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