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What Is (and Isn't) at Stake for Obamacare in the Hobby Lobby Case
the National Journal.com ^ | 6/24/2014 | Sam Baker

Posted on 06/28/2014 8:46:36 PM PDT by Beave Meister

The Supreme Court won't strike down Obamacare's contraception mandate, but a ruling for the law's challengers could still render the policy toothless for millions of women.

The justices are set to rule any day now in a challenge to the birth-control mandate, and any decision against the policy would have ripple effects far beyond the two companies that filed this lawsuit. Just how far, however, depends on how broadly the Court rules—and it has plenty of options.

No matter what happens, the Court won't strike down the entire mandate. The two companies that brought their challenge to the Supreme Court—Hobby Lobby and Conestoga Wood Specialties—haven't asked the justices to ax the entire policy.

The most sweeping option is a broad First Amendment proclamation that all corporations have a fundamental right to exercise religion, in this case by refusing to cover birth control in their employees' health care plans. This outcome would be almost a sequel to the Citizens United case on campaign finance laws and free speech. It would probably open the door for any company to challenge a slew of state or federal regulations, and would allow any corporation to avoid the contraception mandate—potentially affecting millions of women.

(Excerpt) Read more at nationaljournal.com ...


TOPICS: Chit/Chat
KEYWORDS: abortion; aca; birthcontrol; hobbylobby; johnroberts; liberals; obama; obamacare; pill; prolife; scotus; thepill
Drudge headline....."PILL: ROUND TWO FOR ROBERTS AND OBAMACARE"
1 posted on 06/28/2014 8:46:37 PM PDT by Beave Meister
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To: Beave Meister
There's a guy on yahoo who says the justices split up writing opinions each year so there is nearly an equal amount of opinions issued. He is saying that Alito has the fewest opinions this year and is due to write ONE of the opinions on Monday.

He claims to have tracked this for several years now and can ALWAYS identify one of the Majority opinion writer's on the LAST DAY of the Supreme Court session - stay tuned ...

2 posted on 06/28/2014 8:53:49 PM PDT by 11th_VA (Decriminalize Tax Evasion)
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To: Beave Meister

“The most sweeping option is a broad First Amendment proclamation that all corporations have a fundamental right to exercise religion”

Would pave the way for a striking down of ‘anti-discrimination’ (read: homosexual privilege) laws.

Alas, I expect Alito, Thomas, and Scalia will rule this way, but it will only be in concurrence with a more liberal accomodating majority, if we win at all.

And after Scalia called out the pro-babykiller bias on the court, I will not be holding my breath. This could be the definitive end to religious freedom in America when it should be the absolute affirmation. Sad day when only 3 of the justices are qualified for the bench.

I mean, Elena Kagan? Few people would be less qualified. Might as well appoint a zoo animal to the court.


3 posted on 06/28/2014 8:58:49 PM PDT by Viennacon (Rebuke the Repuke!)
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To: Beave Meister

the onlky reason this is before the courts is b/c liberals would not allow any health plans to exist that didn’t cover birth control and abortions. libs make zero exceptions for enemies - aka rules are rules - and as many exceptions as needed for themselves and their friends - aka we make the rules and we can break the rules.


4 posted on 06/28/2014 9:00:04 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man ( Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: Beave Meister; Lurking Libertarian; Perdogg; JDW11235; Clairity; Spacetrucker; Art in Idaho; ...

FReepmail me to subscribe to or unsubscribe from the SCOTUS ping list.

5 posted on 06/28/2014 9:01:36 PM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind. ~Steve Earle)
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To: Viennacon

I’m preparing myself for the usual last day disappointment with the SCOTUS.
Roberts has to prove me wrong when I say he will screw us.


6 posted on 06/28/2014 9:03:27 PM PDT by Clump ( the tree of liberty is withering like a stricken fig tree)
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To: 11th_VA
Yeah, SCOTUSblog says it'll be Roberts and Alito delivering  Burwell v. Hobby Lobby and Harris v. Quinn, but I can't remember who's on which. Er, who's on first?
7 posted on 06/28/2014 9:09:35 PM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind. ~Steve Earle)
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To: BuckeyeTexan

If Alito wrote Hobby Lobby then I’m ecstatic and we win.
If Roberts wrote it then I’m going to need some pepto very quickly.


8 posted on 06/28/2014 9:18:10 PM PDT by Clump ( the tree of liberty is withering like a stricken fig tree)
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To: Beave Meister

“.....but a ruling for the law’s challengers could still render the policy toothless for millions of women.”

Buy your own damn birth control pills ding bat!


9 posted on 06/28/2014 9:23:27 PM PDT by Jim from C-Town (The government is rarely benevolent, often malevolent and never benign!)
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To: Beave Meister
I'll make my predictions...

Hobby Lobby loses. While the court has affirmed the freedom of speech for companies, it will use the example of the establishment clause to state that companies can't impose their views on employees as well, and uphold the contraceptive mandate.

I think there will be a tiny win, that religious affiliated corporations must have an out, as employees are quite aware that they are working for Catholic Charities or whatever, and their viewpoints. They MIGHT go as far as tossing out the mandate until an exemption is in place.

The second opinion will be yet another blow for unions, as Alito tears them to pieces once again.

10 posted on 06/28/2014 9:39:06 PM PDT by kingu (Everything starts with slashing the size and scope of the federal government.)
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To: Beave Meister; All
Thank you for referencing that article Beave Meister. Please bear in mind that the following critique is directed at the article and not at you.
FR: Never Accept the Premise of Your Opponent’s Argument

As mentioned in related threads, as a consequence of parents not making sure that their children are being taught the federal government's constitutionally limited powers, activist justices have successfully misled low-information citizens about the constitutionality of Obamacare in the following way. Activist justices undoubtedly don't want people to know that the Supreme Court has historically clarified that the states have never delegated to Congress, via the Constitution, the specific power to regulate, tax and spend for public healthcare purposes.

And for those liberals who argue that the Constitution doesn’t say “no” to healthcare, please note the following. The Supreme Court has also officially clarified that powers not expressly delegated to the feds via the Constitution are prohibited.

”From the accepted doctrine that the United States is a government of delegated powers, it follows that those not expressly granted, or reasonably to be implied from such as are conferred, are reserved to the states, or to the people. To forestall any suggestion to the contrary, the Tenth Amendment was adopted. The same proposition, otherwise stated, is that powers not granted are prohibited [emphasis added].” —United States v. Butler, 1936.

If activist justices really want Obamacare to be constitutional, then they need to do the following. They need to uphold their oaths to protect and defend the Constitution by doing the following. They need to cheerlead Congress to propose a healthcare amendment to the Constitution to the states for ratification. And if the states choose to ratify the proposed healthcare amendment then Congress will have the specific power that it needs to actually get into the healthcare business and activist justices will be heroes.

11 posted on 06/28/2014 9:44:22 PM PDT by Amendment10
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To: 11th_VA

If the CJ is in the majority, usually he will write the opinion, but can designate to another justice. Don’t know what happens when he’s in the minority. But I don’t think there’s any even-steven equitable division of opinion writing.


12 posted on 06/28/2014 9:45:13 PM PDT by EDINVA
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To: kingu
While the court has affirmed the freedom of speech for companies, it will use the example of the establishment clause to state that companies can't impose their views on employees as well, and uphold the contraceptive mandate.

OTOH - can employees impose their views [ie: contraception coverage] on their employers?

13 posted on 06/28/2014 9:45:51 PM PDT by Lmo56 (If ya wanna run with the big dawgs - ya gotta learn to piss in the tall grass ...)
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To: Lmo56
OTOH - can employees impose their views [ie: contraception coverage] on their employers?

Employees aren't imposing ObamaCare (PelosiCare) coverage requirements, the federal government is. The religious views of the employees (and ultimately, the consumers of those plans) aren't in question here. Question is: Do YOU as a consumer of health care plans, have to accept any plan that includes contraceptive coverage? That's a battle the SCOTUS doesn't want to fight, and hence why I think the religious exemption will be encouraged by SCOTUS to handle such future questions.

14 posted on 06/28/2014 10:56:30 PM PDT by kingu (Everything starts with slashing the size and scope of the federal government.)
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To: Beave Meister

Nothing is at stake. Any ruling against democrat care will be ignored.


15 posted on 06/28/2014 11:40:11 PM PDT by Organic Panic
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To: BuckeyeTexan

How can the Amish and Muslims be exempt from the entire program and other faith/individuals be held to the complete?


16 posted on 06/29/2014 3:09:56 AM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then or now)
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To: Beave Meister
The most sweeping option is a broad First Amendment proclamation that all corporations have a fundamental right to exercise religion, in this case by refusing to cover birth control in their employees' health care plans

If the court has already ruled that corporations have First Amendment rights to free speech then how can they say they also don't have First Amendment rights to freedom of religion?

17 posted on 06/29/2014 3:35:42 AM PDT by DoodleDawg
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To: hoosiermama

Is that a rhetorical question since the POTUS is Barack Obama and his reasons are pretty clear or were you asking my opinion about the legal aspects?


18 posted on 06/29/2014 3:50:43 AM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind. ~Steve Earle)
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To: dsc

Here’s an example of where Roberts might be able to convince the liberals to join him in a “narrowly conservative” decision wherein we get the religious liberty exemption.

“A decision limited to closely held corporations could be a way to skirt the outcome liberals fear most—a broad and explicit expansion of corporate personhood. But it would still allow a significant number of employers to exclude birth control from their health plans, affecting an untold number of female workers and their dependents.”


19 posted on 06/29/2014 4:07:47 AM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind. ~Steve Earle)
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To: 11th_VA; Clump

From scotusblog June 26 2014 9:30 AM

This almost certainly means that Justice Alito, who has not yet written a decision from January, will be writing in Harris.


Harris is the public union case. So I’m guessing Roberts is writing Hobby Lobby. IDK.


20 posted on 06/29/2014 4:23:21 AM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind. ~Steve Earle)
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To: hoosiermama; All

SCOTUS for We The People, or AGAINST We The People, you can easily get OUT of 0bamacare by choosing one of the following options:

https://www.healthcare.gov/exemptions/

Hardship exemptions

If you have any of the circumstances below that affect your ability to purchase health insurance coverage, you may qualify for a “hardship” exemption:

You were homeless.

You were evicted in the past 6 months or were facing eviction or foreclosure.

You received a shut-off notice from a utility company.

You recently experienced domestic violence.

You recently experienced the death of a close family member.

You experienced a fire, flood, or other natural or human-caused disaster that caused substantial damage to your property.

You filed for bankruptcy in the last 6 months.

You had medical expenses you couldn’t pay in the last 24 months which resulted in substantial debt.

You experienced unexpected increases in necessary expenses due to caring for an ill, disabled, or aging family member.

You expect to claim a child as a tax dependent who’s been denied coverage in Medicaid and CHIP, and another person is required by court order to give medical support to the child. In this case, you do not have the pay the penalty for the child.

As a result of an eligibility appeals decision, you’re eligible for enrollment in a qualified health plan (QHP) through the Marketplace, lower costs on your monthly premiums, or cost-sharing reductions for a time period when you weren’t enrolled in a QHP through the Marketplace.

You were determined ineligible for Medicaid because your state didn’t expand eligibility for Medicaid under the Affordable Care Act.

Your individual insurance plan was cancelled and you believe other Marketplace plans are unaffordable.

You experienced another hardship in obtaining health insurance.

I guess I need to stop paying my bills or burn down my house and/or have Beau smack the cr@p out of me on a regular basis, and I’m free and clear!

SERIOUSLY? Am I the last remaining SANE PERSON in America? YEESH!


21 posted on 06/29/2014 5:36:15 AM PDT by Diana in Wisconsin (I don't have 'Hobbies.' I'm developing a robust Post-Apocalyptic skill set...)
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To: Beave Meister

Ping to #21.


22 posted on 06/29/2014 5:37:00 AM PDT by Diana in Wisconsin (I don't have 'Hobbies.' I'm developing a robust Post-Apocalyptic skill set...)
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To: Beave Meister
It would probably open the door for any company to challenge a slew of state or federal regulations, and would allow any corporation to avoid the contraception mandate—potentially affecting millions of women.

Contraception would still be available and it would still be legal for women to use it. If they choose to do so, they might have to pay for it themselves. Not exactly a death blow to freedom, is it?

23 posted on 06/29/2014 6:53:50 AM PDT by centurion316
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To: BuckeyeTexan

Legally


24 posted on 06/29/2014 9:59:23 AM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then or now)
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To: hoosiermama

First answer: The Amish are exempt through Obamacare itself and not by an Executive Order or an HHS waiver. The ACA exempts any denomination that runs its own mutual aid system to spread the cost of healthcare across their community, provided that the denomination existed prior to 1950. The Amish also do not pay into or collect from Social Security.


25 posted on 06/29/2014 10:43:26 AM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind. ~Steve Earle)
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To: hoosiermama
Second answer:

Muslims are not exempt from Obamacare by Executive Order or an HHS waiver.

They also do not appear to be exempt, as the Amish are, under the ACA law itself.

Islam has continuously existed since before 1950. So, theoretically, if a Muslim sect could demonstrate that it meets both of the requirements listed above, the sect would qualify for a religious exemption. We shall see if any Muslims file for such when the law goes into effect in 2014.
26 posted on 06/29/2014 12:34:55 PM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind. ~Steve Earle)
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To: Beave Meister

isn’t obamacare doomed under the origination clause? what is the current status of that challenge?


27 posted on 06/29/2014 2:37:54 PM PDT by SteveH (First they ignore you. Then they laugh at you. Then they fight you. Then you win.)
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To: BuckeyeTexan

Thank you very much. The term was new to me.


28 posted on 06/29/2014 2:55:13 PM PDT by dsc (Any attempt to move a government to the left is a crime against humanity.)
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To: dsc

That’s because we totally made it up. :)


29 posted on 06/29/2014 4:34:28 PM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind. ~Steve Earle)
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To: Viennacon

FLAHS ALERT:

HOBBY LOBBY WINS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


30 posted on 06/30/2014 7:20:11 AM PDT by KeyLargo
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To: Beave Meister

And my prediction was wrong. The corporate citizen continues to have rights! I’m shocked. Guess the next test will be the second.


31 posted on 06/30/2014 8:35:55 AM PDT by kingu (Everything starts with slashing the size and scope of the federal government.)
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To: KeyLargo

YES!


32 posted on 06/30/2014 12:12:42 PM PDT by Viennacon (Rebuke the Repuke!)
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