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Rural vs Urban Survival
SHTF School ^ | 7/22/14 | Selco

Posted on 07/23/2014 3:54:37 PM PDT by Kartographer

What you have with you is what you gonna have for some time if you find yourself in urban survival scenario.

If you have stored food and water most probably you can count on that only for some time, before situation changes or you manage to find some more supplies.

There are ways to obtain resources at the beginning of SHTF in the chaos, but it is not like in the movies, and you can count on the fact that mostly you will be late for these events and more organized units such as local gangs control who gets what when looting. It is high risk, medium reward and most of us prepare to not have to risk anything in this chaos.

Some greedy prepper will still head out to get that bit of extra and if you know my story from my time in war, that we looted the alcohol factory was very helpful in the weeks and months after. But we were not prepared. Big difference.

Better organized groups will control looting so this is no real benefit for urban survival.

Count on the fact that being in a city when SHTF means too many folks and way too little resources, and when that happens you can expect bad things.

- See more at: http://shtfschool.com/basic-survival/rural-vs-urban-survival/#sthash.NmrAj3tl.dpuf

(Excerpt) Read more at shtfschool.com ...


TOPICS: Chit/Chat
KEYWORDS: preparedness; preppers
When Selco speaks wise preppers listen.
1 posted on 07/23/2014 3:54:37 PM PDT by Kartographer
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To: appalachian_dweller; OldPossum; DuncanWaring; VirginiaMom; CodeToad; goosie; kalee; ...

Preppers’ PING!!


2 posted on 07/23/2014 3:54:56 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer
If you planning ahead to be in rural setings when SHTF you should have your group of people that you can trust, family or friends and neighbours, together with plans how to defend yourself.

Yep, and a plan for area security with your neighbors. Lone wolves don't last long if they have to farm, forage, hunt, get water, and do security for themselves. There's this "sleep" thing. BTT

3 posted on 07/23/2014 4:02:56 PM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: Kartographer

I hear people taste like pork. Just sayin’.


4 posted on 07/23/2014 4:12:31 PM PDT by Hugin ("Do yourself a favor--first thing, get a firearm!")
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To: Kartographer

I thought you got all worked up about people looting. He looted an alcohol factory. What gives?


5 posted on 07/23/2014 4:25:09 PM PDT by Sawdring
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To: Kartographer

What about Suburban Survival?


6 posted on 07/23/2014 4:34:18 PM PDT by Jeff Chandler (Conservatism is the political disposition of grown-ups.)
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To: Sawdring; Kartographer

Ask Selco how many people he killed during the slcohol-factory loot-fest. His link is there, and I’m sure he’ll give you an honest answer.

Kart is merely sharing info to those who asked for it. They are free to do with it as they will.

Did you join the ping list for information, or just to be another dickhead?


7 posted on 07/23/2014 4:43:26 PM PDT by LadyBuck (Strangeways...here we come...)
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To: Kartographer

Selco is right. If you cannot get out of the urban area and get to a rural retreat you will be in a world of hurt.


8 posted on 07/23/2014 4:46:30 PM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose o f a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: Kartographer

I feel very happy to be rural. I have cattle, goats and chickens, I can grow a garden. If we have electricity we can grow crops.

There’s some rich guy that just moved here and he’s some kind of solar expert and he wants my son to do a little farming for him. We’re going to have him put all the domestic wells on solar for us.


9 posted on 07/23/2014 4:59:21 PM PDT by tiki
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To: Hugin

Right.... If the smell doesn’t kill you first, the aftertaste might....


10 posted on 07/23/2014 5:08:40 PM PDT by Roman_War_Criminal (Bible Summary in a few verses: John 14:6, John 6:29, Romans 10:9-10)
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To: Kartographer

No fuel, traffic stuffed, roadblocks, roads spiked, empty rural second homes looted and burned long before anyone could reach ‘em. That would truly be an ugly environment.


11 posted on 07/23/2014 5:20:11 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of corruption smelled around the planet.)
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To: Hugin

Why do you think they call it LONG PIG?


12 posted on 07/23/2014 5:28:40 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Sometimes you need more than seven rounds, Much more.)
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To: Billthedrill
Yep, and a plan for area security with your neighbors. Lone wolves don't last long if they have to farm, forage, hunt, get water, and do security for themselves. There's this "sleep" thing. BTT

Yeah, absolutely. Get with like minded neighbors and determine the viability for survival in place. Food, Water and Shelter come first. Weapons and Ammo should already be appropriated. An "in" with local law enforcement is always a bonus.

The will likely, probably definitely, be contact with "lone wolves". Determine usefulness and intentions. Skilled persons are always to be considered to join you, if they so desire. Just use care.
13 posted on 07/23/2014 5:36:16 PM PDT by 98ZJ USMC
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To: LadyBuck

If your going to throw out insults at least be clever with them. I was just looking for consistency LadyBuck.


14 posted on 07/23/2014 7:48:14 PM PDT by Sawdring
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To: Sawdring; LadyBuck; familyop; Georgia Girl 2; ansel12; JRandomFreeper; Old Sarge; metmom; ...

True Selco admits and talks about stealing from a nearby bombed out distillery. Just as true I have no use for those who take advantage of a situation and loot/steal for personal gain, greed and or just because they can.

Since Selco’s ‘crime’ was committed while trapped in a city under siege with artillery and mortars dropping shells right and left, while gangs raped, pillaged and killed at will and snipers filled the streets with dead men, women and children, I refuse to pass judgment as I have know idea what I would do or what I would be willing to do to keep my family alive within such a small section of Hell brought to earth. As Shakespeare said: A man with wife and child has given hostages to fate and I pray that I am never tested. That said I will not throw the first stone.

But I will say this I understand better a thief who’s motive is profit or great need more than one who as the Bible says:

“They sharpen their tongues like swords and aim cruel words like deadly arrows.” Psalms 64:3
or those:
“With perverted heart devises evil, continually sowing discord” Proverbs 6:14

For their acts of strife and discord profit them not and brings them no peace, but only stokes the fire of hate they have for those who have in truth done them no harm. Their need for vengeance and retribution is such that their words no mater how hateful can not sated their anger, but only causes it to grow and grow to a point where in the end it becomes so intense it burns them up. Such people I do not understand nor do I wish to, as the hate they carry is too ugly for for a man to contemplate.


15 posted on 07/23/2014 10:36:39 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer
And the robing. Don't forget the robing.

A Survival Q & A: Living Through SHTF In The Middle Of A War Zone
SHTF Plan ^ | 10-25-2011 | Chris Kitze
Excerpts:
...for 1 corned beef can you could have woman for couple of hours(sounds bad, but it was reality)...rifle ammo and of course food, we fight like animals for that...It is not important witch side had right in that war...there were normal people like you and me, fathers, granddads, decent folks, who robed and killed, there was not too much good and bad guys, most of us was gray, ready for everything...that was not Cristian vs Muslim war, it was civil war, with lot of switching between sides...i am not going into religious stories,...i am not belong to any dogma, Muslim or Christian...i am not here to discuss...religion or anything similar...my wife is different ethnicity, and she is also a Catholic, i am not, and to answer you : no i am not going to shoot her...


The U.S.A. is not the Balkans, although our contemporary, European-minded political leadership is doing its best to Balkanize.


16 posted on 07/23/2014 11:09:37 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of corruption smelled around the planet.)
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To: Sawdring; Kartographer
I thought you got all worked up about people looting. He looted an alcohol factory. What gives?

I don't see Kart justifying it.

All he's doing is posting the threads in which Selco admits to what he did. He's not accountable for Selco's actions from years ago.

17 posted on 07/24/2014 5:04:45 AM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: Kartographer; All

Man-powered Weapons and Ammunition: A review
July 24, 2014 | Author B.B. Pelletier+ | 18 Comments »

by Tom Gaylord, a.k.a. B.B. Pelletier

book cover
This is the softcover version of the book.

This report covers:

• When is 12 foot-pounds more than 12 foot-pounds?
• How long is long enough?
• Ka-boom!
• Hodges catapult gun
• Why do airguns lose so much power?
• What kind of power can I expect?

This is a brief book review of The Practical Guide to Man-powered Weapons and Ammunition by Richard Middleton, copyright ©2005, published by Skyhorse Publishing, New York. Dennis Quackenbush sent this book to me just because he thought I needed to read it. Well, I’ve read it and now I’m recommending it to all of you.

The subtitle is Experiments with Catapults, Musketballs, Stonebows, Blowpipes, Big Airguns, and Bullet Bows. That should give you an idea of what’s included. Mr. Middleton explains dozens of different experiments in which he advances his understanding of pneumatic and spring-operated projectile launchers. He calls them weapons, as is the custom in the UK and also Australia, where he’s from. Here in the U.S., we define weapons as things meant to injure or kill; and, while most of what is in his book will do exactly that, our American culture sets the word weapon apart as a term charged with emotion. Most of us don’t consider airguns to be weapons.

That aside, this is one of the most interesting nonfiction books I’ve read in years, and it may be the very best one on the subject of pneumatic guns. The author addresses several scientific subjects without referring to formulas and equations, and the way he backs into each new subject makes you think he is a normal guy — just like the rest of us. But it’s obvious that he’s spent a lot of time and devoted much thought to making these complex subjects seem simple.

When is 12 foot-pounds more than 12 foot-pounds?
I don’t know about you, but I rarely read an introduction to anything. But in this book, I found the first profound concept on page viii — you know, one of those odd-numbered pages you flip past when turning to the real book? The author tells us he is puzzled by something he’s seen. He has a ballistic pendulum hanging from the ceiling of his garage. The bob weighs 12 lbs. When he shoots the bob with a .22-caliber airgun pellet going 620 f.p.s., it swings one-half inch from the impact. When he shoots it with a .451-caliber lead ball launched from a slingshot at 196 f.p.s., the bob swings an inch and a half — three times as far! The interesting thing is that both projectiles develop an identical 12 foot-pounds! Does that make you stop and think?

How long is long enough?
This topic comes up all the time. We “know” that a longer barrel allows an airgun projectile to go faster when fired from a pneumatic gun, but where does it end? How long is long enough? I see endless discussions on this blog between two or more readers wondering what the optimum barrel length might be for a certain airgun, yet nobody seems to know how to figure it out. Well, Mr. Middleton knows, and he conducted several experiments to demonstrate it to the reader.

Ka-boom!
We recently introduced the Air Burst MegaBoom Supersonic Target System here at Pyramyd Air and several of you were enchanted by it. Mr. Middleton made one a decade ago and describes how it worked. He took his experiments to places the MegaBoom folks don’t want you going, and he tells you what happened. You really should read this.

Hodges catapult gun
You veteran readers may remember that I reported on the Hodges catapult gun a couple years ago. This book not only talks about Hodges guns, it gives ballistics for several of them and tells you what to expect if the ammo is changed. This is stuff you cannot find anywhere.

Why do airguns lose so much power?
Our blog readers ask these intriguing questions all the time, and this book has the answers. Why does the mainspring in a breakbarrel rifle that’s rated at 150 lbs. of energy only put 21 foot-pounds out the muzzle? What happens between the spring and pellet that wastes most of that energy? And why is a .22-caliber gun always more powerful than the same gun in .177? This book explores these themes and explains them through the results of several experiments.

What kind of power can I expect?
“If my rifle develops 20 foot-pounds in a .22, what sort of power can I expect from the same gun in a .177?” I get that question a lot. This book answers it and tells you how to figure it out for yourself.

I could go on, but I’m going to stop here. I see questions every day about airgun fundamentals from many blog readers. Here’s a book that answers a lot of them and suggests how you might answer others on your own. The writing is easy to follow and almost conversational — like this blog!

I have an extensive library about the shooting sports and those books have helped me write this daily blog for you. Questions we ask today were also asked 150 years ago and have often been answered more than once by some very creative people. You can now add Richard Middleton to that list.

Pyramyd Air doesn’t sell this book, but you can certainly find it on Amazon. It’s not expensive, but it’s worth many times the $12 price. If you really want to know more about airguns, this is a place to start looking and learning.


18 posted on 07/24/2014 5:39:55 AM PDT by TMSuchman (John 15;13 & Exodus 21:22-25 Pacem Bello Pastoribus Canes [shepard of peace,dogs of war])
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To: Kartographer

Now if we could just get back to theorizing about which big box store a pepper and his group would want to take over and defend, all would be right in the world. I’m still thinking Fleet Farm.


19 posted on 07/24/2014 7:33:54 AM PDT by Sawdring
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To: familyop

The Balkanization of American is fairly much complete, just one side finds itself short of warriors and so will do what has been done for thousands of years import them with promises of spoils and riches.

In fact the fragmentation and division of American is so complete you would have to be blind not to see it is here on the pages of FR.


20 posted on 07/24/2014 8:01:16 AM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Sawdring
"Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him"Proverbs 26:4
21 posted on 07/24/2014 8:09:43 AM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer

Good one, I love that quote.


22 posted on 07/24/2014 9:39:54 AM PDT by Sawdring
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To: Jeff Chandler

Check for GM recalls.


23 posted on 07/24/2014 10:10:17 AM PDT by tnlibertarian (Beat Lamar! And, if that doesn't work, let's defeat him in the primary.)
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To: Kartographer
That's exactly why some of us should be identifying ourselves as Americans, so that the Hessians will stand more in contrast.

;-)

Balkanizers pose and make noise. Real Americans develop ingenuity.


24 posted on 07/24/2014 1:53:14 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of corruption smelled around the planet.)
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To: familyop

It appears to me that you fail to grasp the meaning of Balkanization.

The US is now a hodgepodge of red and blue and purple in various shades and I don’t see that changing anytime soon. If anything I see the red getting redder and the blue getting bluer and soon or a later we will be repeating the Blue and Grey Ball.


25 posted on 07/24/2014 2:48:54 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer
"It appears to me that you fail to grasp the meaning of Balkanization."

Here's a definition.

2 definitions found for balkanize
From The Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48 : 

  balkanize \balkanize\ v.
     1. to divide a territory into small, hostile states.
        [WordNet 1.5]

From WordNet (r) 3.0 (2006) :

  Balkanize
      v 1: divide a territory into small, hostile states [syn:
           Balkanize, Balkanise]


We're not with the debt-gobbling, multipartisan political/regulator class (balkanizers). We're against onerous regulations and fees. We're for human beings becoming more self-sufficient, less dependent and more free. We build, experiment, teach and assimilate instead of balkanizing.

"The US is now a hodgepodge of red and blue and purple in various shades and I don’t see that changing anytime soon."

I see it changing, as the debt regime collapses and becomes more powerless. Many of those who are trimmed from the shrinking debt regime by their bosses--red, blue and purple--eventually learn from us to become more technically inclined and less balkanized. Arrive like a hipster, any color of ethnic fascist or even one from the Balkans, and if receptive, become a technically capable American (or in the U.K., a technically inclined Briton, or anywhere else).

We can build or fix just about everything, while most of us are licensed, accredited or approved for nothing. We have no organization while being quite cohesive.

The same process and trend toward self-sufficiency has also been ongoing in many other countries and has turned to steel. For each in various nations, their nationalism will be more properly based on good deeds, not fascism. The effete may show off their fine, Cavalier stockings and styles while huffing and puffing but have no great effect.

Pride goes before the fall.


26 posted on 07/24/2014 3:53:41 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of corruption smelled around the planet.)
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To: familyop

Sorry I look about me and don’t see it especially on the scale you are talking if it was it would be plain for anyone to see.

Yes there are small enclaves of hard work like minded people, but not the massive underground power you speak of. We are close to a junction much as the one this country came to 1861, a time of choosing comes, best if one is prepared for it.


27 posted on 07/24/2014 5:42:38 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer
"Sorry I look about me and don’t see it especially on the scale you are talking if it was it would be plain for anyone to see. Yes there are small enclaves of hard work like minded people, but not the massive underground power you speak of."

"Plain to see" not for everyone but only those who are in touch with them. Yep, most technically inclined people are somewhat scary in appearances to more sensitive folks. And given the trend toward slavery for about 40 years now, if ugly times come, labor for the incapable will be priceless indeed.

I'm not originally from the West here, you see, or from its people's Pappy, New York. I'm originally from the Midwest and a not so populated area of the South. Rednecks, lowriders, hillbilly motorheads, electricians, ranch hands (real ranches--not big corporate dude movie star ranches), and the like don't scare me. Matter of fact, they're quite sociable.

Invisible House - an Oehler structure
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3TZijmwZsQ

10 HP Chevy Diesel Car
http://www.utterpower.com/10hp_chevy.htm
(gobs of journals around the Net from motorcycle projects with those engines)

Permaculture articles by Paul Wheaton
http://www.richsoil.com/
(various projects done by other people, too)


28 posted on 07/24/2014 7:45:25 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of corruption smelled around the planet.)
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To: Kartographer

Put you pasta and noodles in the freezer for 48 hours then vacuum seal it. No bugs! Flour as well.


29 posted on 07/24/2014 7:49:28 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: familyop

Glad to hear it, but I doubt that your ‘group’ grew in the past year more than the number of takers that slipped across the border just last month alone. But to each man his right to pursue his dream even if the ‘Giants’ are not but windmills.


30 posted on 07/24/2014 7:53:22 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer

Hedgerows. During WWII, some American soldiers figured out how to get our Army through the hedgerows. A new Regiment was born. Those are keywords to a clue about the relevance of what I’ve been saying. There’s more to it than that, and there’s much more to it than putting on the garb of geardos, spraying, praying and sucking through sippy straws. I also trained others. Now older, I watch YouTube videos of tacticool civilians for laughs.


31 posted on 07/24/2014 9:08:42 PM PDT by familyop ("Dry land is not just our destination, ... --"Deacon," "Waterworld")
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To: familyop

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVSRm80WzZk


32 posted on 07/24/2014 9:23:01 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer
"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVSRm80WzZk"

There's no sense in disrespecting the knowledge of combat soldiers and skilled tradesmen while projecting your unrealistic fantasies about the Americans being equivalent to those of a nation in the Balkans.


33 posted on 07/25/2014 11:34:43 AM PDT by familyop ("Dry land is not just our destination, it is our destiny!" - -Deacon character, "Waterworld")
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To: Kartographer

About us Americans, that is.


34 posted on 07/25/2014 11:35:11 AM PDT by familyop ("Dry land is not just our destination, it is our destiny!" - -Deacon character, "Waterworld")
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To: Kartographer

Americans are not like Muslim Albanians or Serbs except in anti-American minds.


35 posted on 07/25/2014 11:37:08 AM PDT by familyop ("Dry land is not just our destination, it is our destiny!" - -Deacon character, "Waterworld")
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To: familyop
The U.S.A. is not the Balkans, although our contemporary, European-minded political leadership is doing its best to Balkanize.

Yeah, we are already Balkanized more than the former Yugo territories. Just last night, one fellow speculated that a breakdown here would look like Katrina coast to coast, with factions against factions; and even various factions of cops and government goons doing more than their fair share of misdeeds.

36 posted on 07/25/2014 11:47:54 AM PDT by meadsjn
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To: meadsjn

Correct there’s plenty of places here in the US that aren’t safe and will never be save for a member of another race to enter. So it will be the same for Christians and there will be whole states were they will be persecuted and hound out of.

Many blue areas on on their way to adopted Sharia Law so what happens then to non-Muslims?


37 posted on 07/25/2014 12:05:35 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: meadsjn
"Yeah, we are already Balkanized more than the former Yugo territories."

That's an insult coming in hysterical socialist propaganda from the various commie political sides, but the only controversy that I see in my area is the gossip created and perpetuated by a few old hens and supported by commie regulations from the handful of politicians and constituents in every political party.

And on survivability after a disaster, American ingenuity will prevail over displaced foreign inclinations focused solely on murder. Most of those posing as experts on the fictional "scenarios" are short on specialized training and long on unrealistic fantasies.

There won't be any successfull armed insurrection in the U.S.A. If and when austerity measures are implemented during a debt repudiation process, there will only be whimpers from the political socialists of all political parties laid off or receiving their haircuts in pay.


38 posted on 07/25/2014 1:31:14 PM PDT by familyop
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To: TMSuchman

Thanks for the info. Ordered it up.


39 posted on 07/25/2014 6:36:50 PM PDT by PA Engineer (Liberate America from the Occupation Media.)
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To: Kartographer

40 posted on 08/01/2014 10:51:18 AM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet (The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out for himself.)
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