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While Penn State recovers, NCAA could help by lifting bowl ban
cbs sports ^ | 7-29-14 | Dennis Dodd

Posted on 07/29/2014 2:14:16 PM PDT by FlJoePa

CHICAGO -- There's a statement to be made, a huge one at Penn State.

A nation's outrage may not have diminished over the Jerry Sandusky scandal but the story is certainly off the front page. It was two years ago this month that the NCAA overreached into a sordid criminal matter, forever changing history.

So much upheaval, so much collateral damage. The group of innocents from that day two years ago are still being punished. They don't talk about it much anymore, but they live it each day.

"I think we've done everything right," Penn State linebacker Mike Hull said. "I don't think we did anything wrong in the first place."

But those Nittany Lions players are still suffering the same penalties that were handed down in 2012. Among them, a four-year bowl ban that affected young adults who had nothing to do with the scandal. That alone may have turned up the current heat on the NCAA and president Mark Emmert.

It's one thing to take four years to penalize Southern California or to take Jim Tressel out at the knees. It's another to tell those innocent Penn State players in a tangential way that they're going to be paying for the criminal sins of a predator.

"It was basically the worst thing you can do to the program," Hull said Tuesday at Big Ten media days, "aside from the death penalty."

They came to Penn State to play football. They will leave better men. Contrary to some predictions, Penn State football did not burn to the ground. Far from it. Bill O'Brien kept the program afloat, winning eight and seven games despite having no postseason to sell to his players or recruits.

That's 15 wins, the same amount as a fully loaded Michigan had in the same two seasons.

The NCAA healed some wounds by giving Penn State back some scholarships last year. This year would have been the beginning of a four-year span during which Penn State would be reduced to 65 scholarships per year. That's basically down to the FCS (Division I-AA) level.

That won't be the case. It looks like NCAA's attempted arson of the program will be doused. There's a future for Penn State football, something that couldn't be assured two years ago. In that sense, the ongoing lesson is that the NCAA never should have punished the innocents in the locker rom.

It's time, then, for that statement.

Penn State integrity monitor George Mitchell is close to issuing another update on the school's compliance progress. The NCAA assigned a lengthy list of targets for the school to adhere to in the wake of Sandusky (Athletics Integrity Agreement).

Last year's Mitchell report (see above) was encouraging, as was a December update. A similar favorable report must lead the NCAA to rescind the remaining two years of the bowl ban.

"It would obviously be big," coach James Franklin said. "We don't even talk about it but I do think it would be a shot of enthusiasm and excitement."

There are no bad outcomes to rescinding the ban. We all know the NCAA could use a huge PR bump. Big 12 commissioner Bob Bowlsby said in criticizing the NCAA eight days ago that "cheating pays." Emmert fired back with a Monday letter stating criticisms of enforcement are "inaccurate."

Why even go there when positive perception of the association may be at an all-time low? Ending this Penn State affair is not only common sense, it's good business sense for the NCAA. A group of five congressmen wrote Emmert recently asking that all the Penn State penalties be dropped.

"Continuing these unprecedented sanctions harms innocent student athletes and further erodes the increasingly specious credibility of the organization," the letter said.

Thankfully, Franklin's bombastic arrival has put the happy back in Happy Valley. It has overshadowed the dark times. No matter what the situation, there will be no excuses for one of the most vibrant coaches in the country.

"It's very black and white, we live by that," Franklin said of the penalties. "If someone tells us something different down the road -- [it's] gravy, icing on the cake, bonus."

Penn State is in the process of proving what was evident all along. It is one of the five or 10 schools in the country that could survive such sanctions. It happened at USC. It's happening in State College. Penn State was picked fourth in the Big Ten East by the media. The Nittany Lions finished second and third in their division in the first two years post-Sandusky. That's not football Armageddon.

What's amazing now is the players are all out there for the thrill of it. That's the way it's supposed to be, right? Franklin can't sell his players or recruits on a postseason rainbow.

Out of an ugly past has come some purity.

"You play for more than just going to a bowl," Hull said. "You prove yourself every single Saturday out there. You play because you love the game."

Every day that goes by, all of them at Penn State are able to talk more football. O'Brien told reporters last spring he had 67 scholarship players. Then he went out and beat Michigan and Wisconsin while winning those seven games.

Franklin goes into this season with 72 scholarship players, 13 less than the maximum. There will be no excuses from a football program on the mend. Let's hope there is common sense from the organization overseeing it.


TOPICS: Sports
KEYWORDS: football; ncaa; psu
Mike Hull (Sr. Canonsburg): "I think we've done everything right, I don't think we did anything wrong in the first place."

Damn straight Mike.


1 posted on 07/29/2014 2:14:16 PM PDT by FlJoePa
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To: FlJoePa
I said from the beginning that the only reason everybody piled on Joe Paterno and Penn State football was to take the heat off former PSU President Graham Spanier, who was the architect of the gay friendly atmosphere at PSU which led to the abuse.

The NCAA is a willing co-architect in that atmosphere and seeks to do the same thing by mindlessly piling on rather than addressing the root of the problem.

2 posted on 07/29/2014 2:31:15 PM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: Vigilanteman

Penn State got rid of the closet homosexual Spanier only to go and hire a lesbian Athletic Director. They never learn.


3 posted on 07/29/2014 2:35:03 PM PDT by Flavious_Maximus
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To: Flavious_Maximus
Spanier was probably bi rather than homo, but I get your point. They've learned nothing.

The next Jerry Sandusky may very will be a dyke abusing little girls.

Meanwhile, the NCAA plays along with this Kabuki show by punishing PSU football.

4 posted on 07/29/2014 2:39:09 PM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: Vigilanteman

Vig - Ziegler explains this best. People didn’t react to a 5 alarm fire because they weren’t TOLD about a 5 alarm fire.

I dislike Spanier as much as any conservative alumnus, but you’re barking up the wrong tree here (imo). Over thinking, when Occam’s Razor really answers a lot of the questions.

Ziegler claims to have spoken to Spanier for dozens of hours on the phone in the past 2 years. JZ considers him the most slam dunk/innocent guy in the whole mess - above Joe even.


5 posted on 07/29/2014 2:44:38 PM PDT by FlJoePa
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To: FlJoePa
It was two years ago this month that the NCAA overreached into a sordid criminal matter, forever changing history.

I don't agree that it was overreach at all - Sandusky had access to a Nittany Lions office and team facilities long after he stopped working for Penn State, and the program covered up for him after an assistant coach apparently heard Sandusky raping a small boy in the team showers. That's a football program which has lost all perspective on what really matters - their conduct deserved far more severe sanctions than the slap on the wrist they ended up with.
6 posted on 07/29/2014 2:46:54 PM PDT by AnotherUnixGeek
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To: AnotherUnixGeek

Other than there being 1) no coverup and 2) no rape in the shower, you make a very compelling argument.


7 posted on 07/29/2014 2:54:56 PM PDT by FlJoePa
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To: AnotherUnixGeek

I don’t think it was overreach either.


8 posted on 07/29/2014 3:40:24 PM PDT by MamaB
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To: FlJoePa

First I’ve heard that Sandusky was cleared of the sex (Source?) with a minor in the shower. Or are you telling us the minor was asking for it?


9 posted on 07/29/2014 4:44:26 PM PDT by Go_Raiders (Freedom doesn't give you the right to take from others, no matter how innocent your program sounds.)
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To: Go_Raiders

Well, first of all Victim 2 (the McQueary shower victim) didn’t testify. The prosecution didn’t want to call him.

It’s common knowledge who he is - a former Marine now living the good life courtesy of PSU and the ATM machine they set up.

In the trial, w/ no victim #2 (and no evidence other than McQueary’s testimony), js was somehow still convicted on a bunch of fondling type charges (w/ regard to V2), but acquitted of the rape charge.

You know - the rape charge that espn used to turn rational people into people like you?


10 posted on 07/29/2014 4:56:32 PM PDT by FlJoePa
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To: FlJoePa; Jim Robinson

It seems that the showers were involved with multiple victims, Source: http://www.cnn.com/2012/06/22/justice/pennsylvania-sandusky-trial/ and even his adopted son was prepared to testify against him. But you imply that because the shower victim in the most highly publicized episode didn’t testify that none of the shower abuse happened.

It’s not my website, but if it were, someone who is as dismissive of child rape as you comport yourself to be would be banned and all traces of you erased from any server I had access to. Not my call, but you are disgusting beyond words.


11 posted on 07/29/2014 5:29:36 PM PDT by Go_Raiders (Freedom doesn't give you the right to take from others, no matter how innocent your program sounds.)
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To: Go_Raiders

You seriously linked a poorly written CNN blanket article about the convictions, and asked Jim Rob to kick me off this site?

Your level of ignorance about this case can not possibly be measured or fixed. Just go about your happy way.


12 posted on 07/29/2014 5:38:08 PM PDT by FlJoePa
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To: FlJoePa

13 posted on 07/29/2014 5:49:33 PM PDT by COBOL2Java (I'm a Christian, pro-life, pro-gun, Reaganite. The GOP hates me. Why should I vote for them?)
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To: COBOL2Java

Every single item in your little cartoon is factually incorrect, but carry on, media sycophant.

This thread was about the ncaa dropping sanctions against PSU. If you have something to say about the topic at hand, then chime in.


14 posted on 07/29/2014 6:00:01 PM PDT by FlJoePa
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To: FlJoePa

15 posted on 07/29/2014 6:03:26 PM PDT by COBOL2Java (I'm a Christian, pro-life, pro-gun, Reaganite. The GOP hates me. Why should I vote for them?)
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To: COBOL2Java

I’m done with you. Joe was never accused of, or charged with a crime. What you are participating in is character assassination. Seems to fit you well. Piss off.


16 posted on 07/29/2014 6:10:21 PM PDT by FlJoePa
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To: FlJoePa

17 posted on 07/29/2014 6:12:03 PM PDT by COBOL2Java (I'm a Christian, pro-life, pro-gun, Reaganite. The GOP hates me. Why should I vote for them?)
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To: FlJoePa

Scoreboard:

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/sandusky-son-takes-part-penn-st-sex-abuse-documentary-article-1.1586788

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2013/10/superior_court_finds_no_errors.html

http://www.statecollege.com/news/local-news/state-supreme-court-turns-down-jerry-sandusky-appeal,1458597/

I guess the ignorance of the superior court and the state supreme court cannot be measured or fixed, either. When your viewpoint conflicts with reality, it’s pretty unlikely that Reality is wearing the dunce cap. But then again, your handle indicates no possibility of bias, so I guess you must have read all the evidence and interviewed all the witnesses and come to such a contrary conclusion using your super intellect in a way that law enforcement and the courts never could.

I hear OJ still needs help looking for the real killer. Give him a call, genius.


18 posted on 07/29/2014 6:12:46 PM PDT by Go_Raiders (Freedom doesn't give you the right to take from others, no matter how innocent your program sounds.)
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To: Vigilanteman
The next Jerry Sandusky may very will be a dyke abusing little girls.

If anything you will find that in any government school where clamlickers are left in charge of kids that they take their hatred of men out on the little boys.

19 posted on 07/29/2014 9:07:54 PM PDT by Rodamala
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To: COBOL2Java
The natural disposition is always to believe. It is acquired wisdom and experience only that teach incredulity, and they very seldom teach it enough. The wisest and most cautious of us all frequently gives credit to stories which he himself is afterwards both ashamed and astonished that he could possibly think of believing. - Adam Smith, Theory of Moral Sentiments

20 posted on 07/30/2014 2:19:48 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion ("Liberalism” is a conspiracy against the public by wire-service journalism.)
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To: Go_Raiders

First I’ve heard that Sandusky was cleared of the sex (Source?) with a minor in the shower.

...the context of Sandusky involved in anal raping of a child in the showers (McQueary’s testimony) is quite untenable in any court of law, and Sandusky was acquitted of this charge, as no evidence existed to corroborate...but once this whole mess is boiled down to its essence, we see it revolves around Schultz and Curley testifying that McQueary’s testimony to them conveyed horseplay, rather than sexual fondling...a lame rationalization, considering that McQueary made his point clearly to Paterno, of their calculated decision to keep the Sandusky matter in house...

...and this decision was calculated with the belief that none of this stuff would ever see the light of day in the general public...it can be argued that they believed they acted in the best interest of the school, and that by privately sanctioning Sandusky’s priveleges they’d done their duty, but it would be a weak argument indeed...

...as for lifting the bowl ban, I suspect that in two weeks or so we will see that, or at worst, only one more season...


21 posted on 07/30/2014 10:28:35 AM PDT by IrishBrigade (')
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To: FlJoePa

...in one of your responses to me on this issue, you called me stupid for buying into thieves and liars when I mentioned the evidence laid out in Victim 1’s book... and some of your later postings seem to indicate that you believe that the preponderance of testimony against Sandusky is false...I’m just curious...do you still believe that to be true...? And if so, upon what basis do you claim that...?

...and what I’d really like to find out is how you know Victim 1 and his mother are liars and cheats...


22 posted on 07/30/2014 10:43:06 AM PDT by IrishBrigade (')
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To: IrishBrigade

As I thought, there are only two people on the planet that are stating the rape in the shower didn’t happen, Sandusky and FlJoePa.


23 posted on 07/30/2014 7:16:46 PM PDT by Go_Raiders (Freedom doesn't give you the right to take from others, no matter how innocent your program sounds.)
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To: Go_Raiders

Or maybe FlJoePa is Sandusky. That would explain a lot.


24 posted on 07/30/2014 7:18:22 PM PDT by Go_Raiders (Freedom doesn't give you the right to take from others, no matter how innocent your program sounds.)
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To: Go_Raiders

As I thought, there are only two people on the planet that are stating the rape in the shower didn’t happen, Sandusky and FlJoePa.

...for the record, I also do not believe that McQueary witnessed anal rape...I have reason to believe Sandusky was lifting the youth from behind up toward the showerhead, for what purpose I can only surmise...quite the bizarre scene, from McQueary’s point of view, doubly so considering the time of night and the emptiness of building...

...btw, Sandusky’s lawyer attempted to explain his client’s predeliction for showering with lone boys as a means to provide them with proper cleanliness habits...I kid you not...

...the point is, before I accuse Sandusky of anal rape, I need to see more evidence of it, which has not been forthcoming...

...and as I said before, the broader context in this regard is that PSU officials treated McQueary’s allegations as if they were consistent with horseplay, like towel snapping, and decided to deal in house with Sandusky, which means, essentially, that they did nothing...strange, when you consider that Paterno had no trouble understanding the darker tone of McQueary’s account, and recommended kicking it upstairs...in hindsight, of course, Paterno’s lack of involvement seems callous, but at the time, he at least realized the problem and made a suggestion, so we have to give him credit for that, and I believe that the PSU BOT erred badly in firing him the way they did...

...the only fault I find with Paterno in this matter was his stated reason for his inaction, that Sandusky no longer reported to him, and he didn’t want to corrupt the official response...I see little honor in this position, as Paterno was responsible for Sandusky being there in the first place, and if anybody could have gotten something done at PSU, it was Paterno himself...


25 posted on 07/31/2014 12:21:25 PM PDT by IrishBrigade (')
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To: Go_Raiders

Or maybe FlJoePa is Sandusky. That would explain a lot.

...I believe he is a PSU grad, who would prefer to pin the blame on outsiders, such as ESPN and NCAA, both of whom, arguably, made a hash out of this on several levels...

...I can understand his reluctance to see any fault in Paterno and the football regime, but fault is there notwithstanding...but, as I’ve repeatedly said, some other method of dealing with Paterno could have been found, other than outright disgrace...


26 posted on 07/31/2014 12:29:38 PM PDT by IrishBrigade (')
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To: MamaB
Exactly what did the 100+ players do? They continue to be punished. What about the 50+ players who were not even in college when it happened? They continue to be punished, as well. Exactly how is any punishment that harms the innocent NOT an "overreach"?

Some people lose all reason and rationality as soon as the words "child" and "sex" are put into the same sentence.

27 posted on 07/31/2014 12:33:27 PM PDT by Teacher317 (We have now sunk to a depth at which restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men)
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To: Teacher317

What did other athletes do at schools who were punished? They did not do anything wrong either but they suffered. It happens all the time so why should this school be different? Innocents suffer all the time.


28 posted on 07/31/2014 12:46:08 PM PDT by MamaB
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To: Teacher317

Some people lose all reason and rationality as soon as the words “child” and “sex” are put into the same sentence.

...you are aware, are you not, that all NCAA sanctions occur after the fact, with the current program made to suffer for the failure of previous programs...

...how could it be otherwise...?


29 posted on 07/31/2014 12:54:36 PM PDT by IrishBrigade (')
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To: IrishBrigade

You are splitting hairs. Any sexual act with a minor is statutory rape. Period.


30 posted on 07/31/2014 7:56:51 PM PDT by Go_Raiders (Freedom doesn't give you the right to take from others, no matter how innocent your program sounds.)
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To: Go_Raiders

You are splitting hairs. Any sexual act with a minor is statutory rape. Period.

...most assuredly I am splitting hairs, as must be done in any carefully constructed review of evidence...the question being did McQueary see anything ‘sexual’ going on; he clearly believed he did, and the Grand Jury agreed, and the rest is, as they say, history...

...but the fact is that had this been the only charge against Sandusky, he would be a free man today, Joe Paterno would have retired in glory, and PSU would be playing in bowl games, because there is no actual evidence that anything ‘sexual’ happened...the youth in question was never called to testify at trial (apparently he was quite volatile and unreliable as a witness, for either side), and Sandusky was acquitted of the McQueary based charge...

...of course, since Sandusky was a demented serial abuser, this was not the only charge, and he rots in jail, and PSU and the Paterno legacy pay the price for their inaction...

...and finally, I believe Paterno possibly could have survived this, had he kept a low profile and his mouth shut when the stuff hit the fan, but he didn’t, he called a press conference and announced he’d retire at year end...right after that the board made its phone call, as if to say ‘Mr. Paterno, your days of calling the football shots here, including your future, are over’...still wrong, IMO, but...


31 posted on 08/01/2014 6:30:59 AM PDT by IrishBrigade (')
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To: Go_Raiders

You are splitting hairs. Any sexual act with a minor is statutory rape. Period.

...most assuredly I am splitting hairs, as must be done in any carefully constructed review of evidence...the question being did McQueary see anything ‘sexual’ going on; he clearly believed he did, and the Grand Jury agreed, and the rest is, as they say, history...

...but the fact is that had this been the only charge against Sandusky, he would be a free man today, Joe Paterno would have retired in glory, and PSU would be playing in bowl games, because there is no actual evidence that anything ‘sexual’ happened...the youth in question was never called to testify at trial (apparently he was quite volatile and unreliable as a witness, for either side), and Sandusky was acquitted of the McQueary based charge...

...of course, since Sandusky was a demented serial abuser, this was not the only charge, and he rots in jail, and PSU and the Paterno legacy pay the price for their inaction...

...and finally, I believe Paterno possibly could have survived this, had he kept a low profile and his mouth shut when the stuff hit the fan, but he didn’t, he called a press conference and announced he’d retire at year end...right after that the board made its phone call, as if to say ‘Mr. Paterno, your days of calling the football shots here, including your future, are over’...still wrong, IMO, but...


32 posted on 08/01/2014 6:30:59 AM PDT by IrishBrigade (')
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To: IrishBrigade

...drat those double posting demons...


33 posted on 08/01/2014 6:31:54 AM PDT by IrishBrigade (')
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