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pay estimated taxes after windfall year income? (turbotax, independent consultancy)
steveh | 4-14-2017 | steveh

Posted on 04/14/2017 2:29:46 PM PDT by SteveH

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To: SteveH

i’m not an expert but at one time looked into paying estimated quarterly taxes and it seemed to me like if one did that, and didn’t get the amounts right, the penalty was worse than not doing it at all.

Also, one of the clauses about withholding penalties stated that if one had withheld at least 90% of what one owed during the previous tax year, then no penalty would apply to the current year no matter what. i interpreted that to mean every other year could be a freebee withholding-wise and did actually take advantage of it.

You might want to look into the above.


21 posted on 04/14/2017 3:04:46 PM PDT by catnipman ( Cat Nipman: Vote Republican in 2012 and only be called racist one more time!)
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To: SteveH
Yes, generally if you underpay your taxes during the year you're earning they can nail you for penalties for doing so.

A couple years back they selected my MIL's estate tax return for an audit, and the audit resulted in a reduction of the estate so they sent a check back for $125K in over-payment of the estate taxes. Then, they levied a fine for not paying the estimated taxes on the tax refund.

22 posted on 04/14/2017 3:08:29 PM PDT by Cementjungle
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To: SteveH

link for you:

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/estimated-taxes


23 posted on 04/14/2017 3:15:36 PM PDT by DOGHEAD
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To: SteveH

Your required to pay 90% of your actual 2017 tax. (The exception to not pay a penalty is 100% (or 110%)of 2016 tax, but this does not benefit you if you have lower income.

You can be penalized if you pay less.

Check out Form 2210. There are exceptions for annualized calculation.


24 posted on 04/14/2017 3:16:37 PM PDT by ADSUM
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To: SteveH

What did your CPA tell you?


25 posted on 04/14/2017 3:18:25 PM PDT by Jeff Chandler (Everywhere is freaks and hairies Dykes and fairies Tell me where is sanity?)
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To: SteveH
the one year jump is about $125k

Griping or bragging?

LOL -- probably OK on a one-time windfall, because they can't expect you to anticipate such a thing. But if you look for another spike in the following year, you need to prepay, or there's a penalty.

Also, if you're on Soc Security/Medicare, you will get means-tested out of some of your SS check, as it will be used to pay for a larger chunk of your Medicare premium. Because, for one year, you were too rich.

26 posted on 04/14/2017 3:19:29 PM PDT by Migraine (Diversity is great- -- until it happens to YOU.)
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To: SteveH

You should consult a CPA. Not this buncha rightwing reprobates.


27 posted on 04/14/2017 3:20:43 PM PDT by Seruzawa (I keel you V1orga feelthy.)
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To: Dilbert San Diego
Good advice. If we need tax advice, financial advice, legal advice, among others, it is wise to seek out good professional help........

Yup. I do enjoy these threads though. The advice given is quite often good for a few chuckles.

28 posted on 04/14/2017 3:30:17 PM PDT by Wissa (I took a little stroll to the Red Dog Saloon.)
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To: SteveH

Do your best to estimate the actual amount of tax and pay that in quarterly. If you are short, you will only have to pay 3% to 4% of the underpayment on the average outstanding balance. So if you owe 10,000 and did not pay it in with estimates your average balance would be $5,000 and your penalty is $150 to $200.

Don’t sweat it.

However, some states have much larger penalty percentages and you might want to over estimate the amount due.


29 posted on 04/14/2017 3:32:20 PM PDT by Raycpa
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To: freedumb2003; SteveH
This is INCORRECT. The IRS does not cut "new taxpayers" any special break. If you have income not subject to withholding that is not a capital gain or other form of special income you MUST make quarterly payments on the income not subject to withholding that cover either 100% of your previous liability or 90% of next year's liability. If your income subject to withholding covers either of those two cases you don't need to make quarterly payments, otherwise, you do.

Oversimplified example: you make $90,000 on a W2 job, $10,000 on outside work not subject to withholding. You do not have to make a quarterly payment. (YOU WILL have to pay taxes on the $10K next April.) If you make $15,000 on the outside job, you MUST make quarterly payments or you WILL be charged penalties and interest.

Note I am Oversimplifying, and talking here about net taxable, not gross income. Also some seasonal work and farmers and fisherman have special exemptions.

30 posted on 04/14/2017 4:48:10 PM PDT by FredZarguna (And what Rough Beast, its hour come round at last, slouches toward Fifth Avenue to be born?)
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To: freedumb2003; SteveH
This is INCORRECT. The IRS does not cut "new taxpayers" any special break. If you have income not subject to withholding that is not a capital gain or other form of special income you MUST make quarterly payments on the income not subject to withholding that cover either 100% of your previous liability or 90% of next year's liability. If your income subject to withholding covers either of those two cases you don't need to make quarterly payments, otherwise, you do.

Oversimplified example: you make $90,000 on a W2 job, $10,000 on outside work not subject to withholding. You do not have to make a quarterly payment. (YOU WILL have to pay taxes on the $10K next April.) If you make $15,000 on the outside job, you MUST make quarterly payments or you WILL be charged penalties and interest.

Note I am Oversimplifying, and talking here about net taxable, not gross income. Also some seasonal work and farmers and fisherman have special exemptions.

31 posted on 04/14/2017 4:48:31 PM PDT by FredZarguna (And what Rough Beast, its hour come round at last, slouches toward Fifth Avenue to be born?)
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To: Lakewood; freedumb2003

That’s 100% correct. Freedumb, you’ve said a number of things on this thread which are not correct. You need to get an accountant — and he should review your recent filings. The IRS WILL usually send you quarterly vouchers IF you file Schedule C, but whether they do or not, they WON’T exempt you from penalties because of an error on their part.


32 posted on 04/14/2017 5:08:07 PM PDT by FredZarguna (And what Rough Beast, its hour come round at last, slouches toward Fifth Avenue to be born?)
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To: freedumb2003

i should have paid as it was happening but busy. i was consulting, not an accountant, and i actually did not know what would happen from week to week. as it turned out, the spigot shut off in july. i panicked in december and mad YUGE payments to fed and state but by then too late to affect this year’s 1040ES as turbotax calculates (which i imagine is correct). this year is only the second year i was consulting and it was only about 9 months total, spanning a winter. The large checks kept rolling in and fortunately i did not spend it. it could have been worse had i regarded that money as “mine” for some odd reason lol. I think i could do better in the future, but i doubt that i will ever be in a similar situation again, so in all likelihood it is a one-off or two-off situation. The original plan was to go to an accountant at the beginning of last year. I ended up going to one a week ago and offering to cast my lot with him, but he wanted all original documents such as mortgage which would require even more plowing through more rooms stacked high with layers of papers, ugh. He briefly answered the one open question i had off the cuff and that brief answer was (to my pleasant surprise) enough to get me through turbotax a week before the deadline. To gather all the old paperwork might have taken several more days (I know, procrastination, guilty as charged lol). Turbotax makes it relatively easy to coast through year by year if one started using it way in the past. I also always doublecheck to make sure i am well inside the green band for audit danger and i try to keep any ambiguity errors in favor of the government in case of any later audits. For better or otherwise, I don’t think I have ever had to pay a penalty using my methodology.


33 posted on 04/14/2017 5:32:48 PM PDT by SteveH
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To: Texan

That is an idea. No, I won’t have another extraordinarily high year (unless perhaps DC gets down to some really hardcore DOD retooling). I will look into that, thanks. Those were only at the $2k/quarter level for me this past year, so no biggie if i can just remember to make them all...


34 posted on 04/14/2017 5:38:07 PM PDT by SteveH
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Comment #35 Removed by Moderator

To: SteveH

Only $125k over what you normally make.? : )
I wish I was smart like you!


36 posted on 04/14/2017 5:46:35 PM PDT by minnesota_bound
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To: dp0622

It is funny-wierd. I panicked last December and wrote a YUGE check to the IRS and another to California, based on my straight line extrapolation estimation of 2016 taxes based on my 2015 taxes. Over christmas vacation, i panicked again because i realized that i had neglected to factor in the progressive bump that occurs at a certain level. so i made a more careful estimate based on the 2016 tax tables. However, as it turned out, turbotax told me that my original december YUGE checks were more or less sufficient (putting me within 1k or 2k of the actual taxes owed, one way or another). I’m not sure why that happened, but I think when all the dust settled, my income estimate of mid January of this year was about $25k on the high side. Maybe subtracting that amount brought me on the low side of one of the progressive tax rate singularities. With all the large amounts floating around, and not being a CPA myself, I was reasonably happy with being on the safe side in my over-estimates. Due to lack of spending spree I was able to afford writing the extra checks in January and I am now anticipating getting that money back. If I made a minor mistake somewhere, the IRS will hopefully catch it and recalculate my correct tax rate, dipping into the extra reserve tax that I have already paid (on the order of $6k which I imagine should ordinarily be enough to handle some relatively minor accounting error).


37 posted on 04/14/2017 5:48:58 PM PDT by SteveH
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To: freedumb2003

Yah i seem to have skated around the edge of disaster this past two years so far without an S-corp. but if a certain project ever gets fired up again then i may have to revisit that decision. I am not however holding my breath that that will happen. So la la, live for today.


38 posted on 04/14/2017 5:53:00 PM PDT by SteveH
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To: JohnBrowdie

I find FR folks are mostly reasonable and trustworthy. I am keeping my eyes out for “the usual suspects.” If I see any of them, I will probably just silently discount their advice. So far, so good, I think.


39 posted on 04/14/2017 5:54:56 PM PDT by SteveH
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

No, I do not. Yes, your assumption is correct.

Thanks.


40 posted on 04/14/2017 5:56:52 PM PDT by SteveH
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