Posted on 04/26/2019 3:56:33 AM PDT by knarf
There’s one in my area that exists because they needed one that would respond to the Catholic church. The Protestants who ran the other fire department allowed the church to burn to the ground, so the church built one on its property right across the street.
The small town I'm in now is hybrid mix of volunteers and professional firefighters. There is a minimal staff of paid firefighters there. In the event of a call, they get the equipment rolling and on site quickly- ensuring good response times. Volunteers are called in for bigger jobs such as brush fires, fully involved structure fires etc.
Wait....what?
Are you serious, Clark?
Economy of scale. In a large city, firefighters have enough calls to keep them busy, to jutify the considerable expense their services represent.
Contrast that with a small-town fire service, which may get a call once or twice a month but which incurs much of the same expense.
I’m an old guy who moved to a town of 2800 about 20 years ago. 15 Years ago I volunteered for our fire police and got to see first hand what the other volunteers do. They work very hard to keep the “house next door” from burning. Containment is the goal and one house burning (unless it is yours) is better than multiples going down. I am honored to keep these people safe while they do their job.
I understand. I am not saying anything bad about the FD. It’s just a fact of life living down here. My apologies if needed. DM
I grew up in an Illinois hamlet of about 100 people with one fire truck and about a dozen volunteer firefighters. When a fire started the siren at the firehouse would call the firefighters, who dropped all other work and raced to the fire. Fire departments from nearby small towns joined the fray. It was a system that worked imperfectly but it was better than no fire department at all, which is what we would have had if “professionals” were required.
This may give some perspective...
In the county where I’m currently working (and used to live), there are less than 6,000 people and it covers less than 250 square miles. There is one town with less than 1000 people and it’s the county seat. Town doesn’t even have a traffic light and there are multiple ways to drive through without even coming to a stop sign.
It takes about 30 minutes to drive from one side of the county to the other - if you stay on the paved State Routes. Get off those, and the “roads” are mostly gravel if you’re lucky, mud if you’re not.
It’s said that there are more deer than people, and I don’t doubt it. There are probably more cattle than people too.
In town, the fire department does a pretty decent job. Fires are rare and the dept always contains them to the structure, but structures are rarely saved. The town was founded in the mid-1800s and most of the structures are stick-built and getting on 100 years old. They go up quick.
Outside of town, the primary purpose of the fire department is to keep the brush and/or woods from alighting/spreading and offer medical assistance if needed. Even if there was a “professional” fire department, they won’t get there in time to affect the outcome of the structure fire. In fact, because the volunteers are spread out and go directly to the fire rather than going to the station first, chances are that they can get there faster than any centralized organization. Might not affect the outcome of the blaze itself, but having an experienced person on scene early likely saves lives if only by preventing the occupants from doing something reckless out of desperation.
Also to put this area in perspective, the town has no local police force. There is a county sheriff with two deputies for the entire county, and the state police regularly patrol the main routes and assist the sheriff when they can.
There’s also a separate EMS service with one or two ambulances.
Crime and fires are so rare here that they are big news.
This may give some perspective...
In the county where I’m currently working (and used to live), there are less than 6,000 people and it covers less than 250 square miles. There is one town with less than 1000 people and it’s the county seat. Town doesn’t even have a traffic light and there are multiple ways to drive through without even coming to a stop sign.
It takes about 30 minutes to drive from one side of the county to the other - if you stay on the paved State Routes. Get off those, and the “roads” are mostly gravel if you’re lucky, mud if you’re not.
It’s said that there are more deer than people, and I don’t doubt it. There are probably more cattle than people too.
In town, the fire department does a pretty decent job. Fires are rare and the dept always contains them to the structure, but structures are rarely saved. The town was founded in the mid-1800s and most of the structures are stick-built and getting on 100 years old. They go up quick.
Outside of town, the primary purpose of the fire department is to keep the brush and/or woods from alighting/spreading and offer medical assistance if needed. Even if there was a “professional” fire department, they won’t get there in time to affect the outcome of the structure fire. In fact, because the volunteers are spread out and go directly to the fire rather than going to the station first, chances are that they can get there faster than any centralized organization. Might not affect the outcome of the blaze itself, but having an experienced person on scene early likely saves lives if only by preventing the occupants from doing something reckless out of desperation.
Also to put this area in perspective, the town has no local police force. There is a county sheriff with two deputies for the entire county, and the state police regularly patrol the main routes and assist the sheriff when they can.
There’s also a separate EMS service with one or two ambulances.
Crime and fires are so rare here that they are big news.
Please excuse the double post.
No. That is what pancake breakfasts are for.
“Sorry for the rant, but I gotta keep going.”
Geez, that’s sig worthy!
A buddy of mine started off as a volunteer fire-fighter and moved up the ranks. Town of Eden Prairie, MN - population of 65,000 and rapidly growing.
I see that now they 9 full-time firefighters, the rest are volunteers. Back in the day it was all volunteer - he used to get something like $8 if he showed up fast enough to get on a truck. I think it was the $8 per call - not per hour.
If he was too slow and the truck had enough guys he didn’t get anything. Although he and the other late arrivals would sit around for a bit, maybe put some burgers on the grill, play a round of cars, smoke a cigar. Then head back to their full-time jobs after a bit.
“Hey - you never know if they’re going to want some help - best to hang around the station for a bit!”
At the time they were the largest volunteer fire fighter force in the country iirc. I’m guessing they still are.
I recall him complaining when it was “just” a medical call - but he would be in there doing chest-compressions, etc.
He really did love fighting the fires though - and from what I can tell they all did. (I don’t get it!)
“The best ones are the entries! Any schmuck can stand in the street putting water on the fire - but getting inside, figuring out which flames to hit first, and where they are hiding - that’s the fun stuff!”
I live in a county in Texas that the total population is a little over 8,000. Only the county seat 25 minutes away has a paid Fire Department. The volunteer departments have a ten minute of less response time vs. twenty-five to thirty minutes if we relied on the in town FD.
Our local VFD is fully self supporting, but does get grants from the State & Federal Government to partially fund purchase of refurbished trucks and equipment on an at cost basis that one of the Fire Truck manufacturers has as a program for VFDs.
Funding comes from annual BBQ, garage sale and fish fry. They also collect scrap metal & aluminum cans and sell that.
No apology necessary. The first priority is containment.
Jenkintown, PA. Yep. The Catholics had to look out for themselves.
Because small towns can’t afford full time fire fighters. Ours has one captain, one EMT/FF and one FF. All else are volunteers (trained)
Now translate that ratio to smaller towns and you can immediately see the problem:
1. Towns with fewer than 500 residents cannot justify the expense of full-time firefighters and EMTs -- especially when you consider how infrequently fires occur that require a major response.
2. Towns that cover a large area will typically require more fire personnel even if their population is low -- just because they'll need multiple fire stations to provide adequate response times for the whole town.
3. There are economies of scale in many fire department positions. You'll need at least one dispatcher on duty at all times regardless of whether your town has a population of 500 people, 5,000, or 50,000. The cost per resident for a town of 5,000 people will be far higher than the cost per resident for New York City ... and the town of 5,000 people doesn't have anything close to NYC's tax base.
4. I am very familiar with a town near me that has transitioned from a volunteer fire department to a mixed professional-volunteer force. The fire chief and senior officers are paid, and the officers drive the fire engines to the scene of a call. The rest of the force is volunteers. One of things I've noticed is that there is now a lot of political pressure for the municipal government to justify the expense of the paid force, so this town has seen two things that are almost non-existent in a volunteer fire department: (A) the fire department responds to each and every incident that anyone reports, and sends more equipment and staff than needed, and (B) the paid officers spend a lot of time in the community doing things like building inspections, meticulous fire code enforcement, etc. Item (B) isn't onerous because they are extremely lenient in giving property owners time to deal with violations (this is NOT being done for municipal revenue purposes), but I'd say 90% of what they're doing is a waste of time and is only done to show the residents and business owners that the cost of the personnel is justified.
West Virginia funds fire departments through an insurance surtax. All departments in the state receive the same amount which is a bit more than $40,000 per year. That’s not enough to run most depts. which means local fund raising and in some counties tax levies provide the rest.
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