The Europeans Keep Rejecting Liberty

American Thinker ^ | 7 Sep, 2019 | Robert Curry

[NorseViking]

I am not overlooking it. Let’s say when it comes to republic France would be near World’s top now.

[BEJ]

Think about the the countless years of Holy Roman Empire, the Pope, or Napoleon and you see the tendency towards unification under a single rule. It’s in Europe’s DNA.

[aspasia]

Europe's DNA? How about human nature?

But your analysis is contrahistorical. Bonapartism and the HRM were fundamentally antithetical.

[BEJ]

It’s still the attempt to unify Europe and was recently done with Hitler too.

[Cincinnatus.45-70]

Europeans have been bred, since the days of the Roman Legions, to be subservient to those in power. The Romans exterminated whole tribes of thousands of people if they were not suitably cowed by Roman authority. European history since that time has continued to breed peons and serfs. They are simply Darwinism writ large.

[aspasia]

Unify? The Holy Roman Empire existed without the unification you’re talking about. That’s why the unifiers went to war. Sort of like a United States getting rid of the states.

[Jim W N]

What about “entitlement” Americans who seem to love depending on a basically unconstitutionally totalitarian federal government?

[Wuli]

” Let’s say when it comes to republic France would be near World’s top now.”

How so???

[aspasia]

Your sectarian condescension is noted. It's appears to be a vice belonging to those who despise the liberty of others. Napolean hated the British.

[NorseViking]

Would you put Mexico or Congo above?

[Wuli]

Would I put Mexico or Congo above what/whom???

[Wuli]

It matters NOT where anyone would put Mexico or Congo.

The question is why do YOU put France at the top of republics today. What are your “qualifications” you reward France with??

[NorseViking]

You hinted France doesn’t rate well as a republic. I am not arguing as if it is ideal but I think the medium average isn’t that great.

[loveliberty2]

"Freedom is the most valuable of all human possessions, next after life itself. It is more valuable, in a manner, than even health. No human agency can secure health; but good laws, justly administered, can and do secure freedom. Freedom, indeed, is almost the only thing that law can secure. Law cannot secure equality, nor can it secure prosperity. In the direction of equality, all that law can do is to secure fair play, which is equality of rights but is not equality of conditions. In the direction of prosperity, all that law can do is to keep the road open. That is the Quintessence of Individualism, and it may fairly challenge comparison with that Quintessence of Socialism we have been discussing. Socialism, disguise it how we may, is the negation of Freedom. That it is so, and that it is also a scheme not capable of producing even material comfort in exchange for the abnegations of Freedom, I think the foregoing considerations amply prove."- " "A Plea for Liberty: An Argument Against Socialism and Socialistic Legislation," edited by Thomas Mackay (1849 - 1912), Chapter 1, final paragraph" - EDWARD STANLEY ROBERTSON

[BEJ]

Yes that did happen and to Catholicism and to Hitler and Napoleon. But the urge was there baked into the system, probably inherited from the Roman Empire.

[Wuli]

I didn’t “rate” France. You did. You said it was near the top of republics - without explanation for why.

Now you say it is “medium average”?

My comment about France and its many republics - so far - came in response to your error in saying that France got rid of its monarchs when the U.S. was formed - and I noted the error in you statement; it didn’t. I added, in addition to how it did not abandon its monarchy when you said it did, it has been unable to keep a republic long, having gone through five of them. My only point of that addition is that it does not hint at a stable form of republics.

Which again begs the question as to why you ranked France “at the top” of republics - under what qualifications?

That record is maybe only surpassed by how many governments Italy has had, even just since WWII.

[NorseViking]

Okay, we differ in definitions. It is not a monarchy now. It has a civil society, middle class and competitive elections.
I don’t say it is ultimately free but ahead of 8 in 10 other countries. That somehow puts it on top.

[Cincinnatus.45-70]

I failed to make it clear that I was speaking only of Continental Europe, not Britain. Sorry.

[aspasia]

Probably from way back in the Garden.

[Wuli]

At least you get clearer in what you mean.