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Did George W. Bush help the GOP or hurt the GOP?
Jmikes20

Posted on 11/20/2008 1:40:22 PM PST by jmikes20

Over the last 8 years, did George W. Bush help or hurt our party? We did see 2 electoral wins, and the first majority win since his dad trounced Dukakis. He helped keep a Democrat out of the White House for 8 years, and stave off out and out John Kerry liberalism, who is probably more liberal than Barack Hussein Obama. however, we got trounced pretty badly on November 4, all across the board, even in Governor's mansions, where Dems managed to do well in 2002. The Dems ranks grew over the '90's, going from 43% of the vote steadily up to 52% of the vote now. He kept us from losing Appalachia, which was starting to go for Clinton stronger than his predecessors. (With the matter of Ross Perot, while most agree he took from conservatives, I'm starting to believe Clinton might still have won 1992, given Bush I's poor approvals in 1992, and if enough Perot voters would have stayed home without him, Bush would still have lost. Clinton did solidify CA, IL, MI, NJ, CT, VT, ME, DE, and PA securely into the Democrat column, even after Perot was gone. Perot was also an abortionist, anti-family, and protectionist, but none the less, may have took from our demographics). Will conservatism survive, now that the brand his been so tarnished by incompetence? Will people see the achievements once the Messiah Hussein sees Iraq succeed, and us come back? One thing President Bush did was to put marriage on the table, which may well be the death knell for the Dems if Prop 8 managed to pass in the most liberal Democrat of Democrat states, California. Bush also kept Texas from even reverting Dem, as Gore, Kerry, and Obama won fewer counties there than Clinton, who won some in northern Texas. Do you think George Bush will have helped our party, or hurt it?


TOPICS: Issues; Parties; U.S. Congress; U.S. Senate
KEYWORDS: bush; electoral; republicanparty
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1 posted on 11/20/2008 1:40:23 PM PST by jmikes20
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To: jmikes20

He damn near killed the GOP.


2 posted on 11/20/2008 1:42:33 PM PST by pgkdan ( All Catholics should know supporting Obama constitutes material cooperation with intrinsic evil.)
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To: jmikes20

By what measure is Kerry “probably more liberal” than Obama?


3 posted on 11/20/2008 1:43:24 PM PST by Malesherbes (Sauve Qui Peut)
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To: jmikes20

Overall, he hurt the GOP. At first he seemed to be doing well, but as time passed, he sold out Domestic policy to the Dems, turned his back on the platform and principles, and made Republicans unelectable. 7 years later and he still has done little to close the southern border with Mexico.


4 posted on 11/20/2008 1:44:16 PM PST by theDentist (Qwerty ergo typo : I type, therefore I misspell)
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To: jmikes20

The GOP is dead to me.


5 posted on 11/20/2008 1:44:54 PM PST by wolfcreek (I see miles and miles of Texas....let's keep it that way.)
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To: pgkdan

Maybe so, but he was killing a patient that was already in the throes of death by suicide.

There is simply no explaining what we saw our Party did to itself and those of us who entrusted them with our vote and control of the game plan.


6 posted on 11/20/2008 1:45:10 PM PST by jwpjr (Sigh)
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To: jmikes20

We lost Indiana and North Carolina.


7 posted on 11/20/2008 1:45:25 PM PST by trumandogz (The Democrats are driving us to Socialism at 100 MPH -The GOP is driving us to Socialism at 97.5 MPH)
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To: jmikes20
My belief is that overall he did great harm to the Republican Party and the conservative movement.

He was popular enough among conservatives that we by and large were cajoled into just barely supporting him and his ilk (e.g. Tom DeLay, etc.) enough to keep them in the majority.

If instead of just limping along with quasi-conservatives we had given support to true conservatives, then we may have lost some of the previous battles, but we would more likely win the ultimate war with liberalism.

What is happening with the Republican Party now is similar to what is happening with the economy: both Republicans and Democrats did things to keep the bubble from bursting sooner than it did, but it burst anyway.

Unless and until Republicans get back to being sound managers of smaller governments then whatever bubble of approval they receive will soon pop.

8 posted on 11/20/2008 1:45:38 PM PST by who_would_fardels_bear (The cosmos is about the smallest hole a man can stick his head in. - Chesterton)
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To: jmikes20
If you don't know the answer you'll get at this forum . . .

The only recent Prez to escape flame is Ronaldus Magnus. The rest are traitors doncha' know?

9 posted on 11/20/2008 1:46:10 PM PST by Jacquerie (Islam - A barbaric political system in religious drag.)
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To: jmikes20

The United States hads’t been attacked since 9-11.


10 posted on 11/20/2008 1:47:02 PM PST by InvisibleChurch (Grace = unmerited favor; Mercy = punishment withheld)
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To: theDentist

He did appoint conservative judges and he’s done good with war on terror.

He’s way better than Gore or Kerry. Of course, I would have taken Gore or Kerry over Obama.


11 posted on 11/20/2008 1:47:31 PM PST by luckystarmom
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To: jmikes20
This IS a trick question, right?
12 posted on 11/20/2008 1:48:39 PM PST by SFR
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To: jmikes20
He protected the country for 8 years. He does not deserve the hatred and derision and bile sent his way from the left, or from the right, or from the world.

That having been said, he did not advance conservatism. Under his watch, Republicans became the caricature that the left always claimed we were. Ted Stevens, Mark Foley, Medicare, No Child Left Behind...

I realize much of this was not George W. Bush's fault-- but actually, it was. In that he could have stopped it. Or he could have advanced conservatism. He could have controlled spending.

But the point is he is a patriot, a true American-- and in comparison to Terrorist-Elect Obama-- a great man.

13 posted on 11/20/2008 1:49:50 PM PST by exist
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To: pgkdan
Agreed. As President, he's also the head of the Republican Party, and after his re-election in 2004, he could have cared less about what happened to the GOP in 2008. All he was interested in doing at the time was securing his legacy, trying to fix the mess in Iraq, and shoving amnesty down our throats.

Emblematic of his attitude toward the GOP was his selection of his crony Mel Martinez to head up the RNC, which turned out to be the disaster we all predicted.

Screw Bush! I hope I never hear that name again come January.

14 posted on 11/20/2008 1:50:33 PM PST by Virginia Ridgerunner (Sarah Palin is a smart missile aimed at the heart of the left!)
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To: who_would_fardels_bear

why the hell did we nominate him in the first place? Because he had a machine? i would love to know why, was it because McLame was his only real opponent? In many senses, he was our own Bill Clinton, a man who could come off moderate to enough, a young, Southern Governor. We see where slickness takes us now.


15 posted on 11/20/2008 1:51:47 PM PST by jmikes20
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To: jmikes20

If he had of helped their would have been no Obama.

It is plain and simple he did NOT adhere to tried and true conservative principles.


16 posted on 11/20/2008 1:52:06 PM PST by mkcc30 (Reagan's shadow had more substance than Obama!)
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To: jmikes20
Regarding the destruction of the conservative agenda within the GOP, Bush is a symptom rather than the disease (as was his father, and McCain and Dole, etc.)

It's time for conservatives to realize that we are the RINOs. The big government hordes own the party and we just tag along because we got nowhere else to go.

17 posted on 11/20/2008 1:52:20 PM PST by dead (I've got my eye out for Mullah Omar.)
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To: exist
He protected the country for 8 years. He does not deserve the hatred and derision and bile sent his way from the left, or from the right, or from the world. That having been said, he did not advance conservatism. Under his watch, Republicans became the caricature that the left always claimed we were. Ted Stevens, Mark Foley, Medicare, No Child Left Behind... I realize much of this was not George W. Bush's fault-- but actually, it was. In that he could have stopped it. Or he could have advanced conservatism. He could have controlled spending. But the point is he is a patriot, a true American-- and in comparison to Terrorist-Elect Obama-- a great man.

I can agree with that- and I'll add a snippet I wrote elsewhere:

Like many who voted for the man twice, I went through stages of lukewarm support, enthusiast support, and finally “just wish he'd go away,” but...

Big “but.”

But I think shortly most of us will wish he were still in office, due to the imminent Obama Thugocracy”...

18 posted on 11/20/2008 1:52:46 PM PST by backhoe (All across America, the Lights are going out...)
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To: jmikes20

Is the Pope Catholic?

After 8 long years you are asking this question?

Where have you been?


19 posted on 11/20/2008 1:53:17 PM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: jmikes20
On the one hand Dubya was too "reach across the aisle; can't we all get along?" for the good of the party (or the nation). And I simply do not understand his inaction on Ramos and Compean.

But I predict that history will show that the Dims and the media were happy to hold US safety and security hostage and to teeter on the edge of throwing the country under the bus and thus force him to fecklessness in any number of areas. I think history will show, that is, that the libs were perfectly happy to cripple our fighting forces and our security efforts if it would get them more socialism.

I think Dubya will look better when the facts come out.

20 posted on 11/20/2008 1:54:08 PM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: jmikes20

One of the worst Presidents ever, turned the GOP into a minority party, possibly for years to come.


21 posted on 11/20/2008 1:54:28 PM PST by LowTaxesEqualProsperity
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To: jmikes20
The GOP was already set in their high spending ways before GWB came to Washington.
22 posted on 11/20/2008 1:55:08 PM PST by Dixie Yooper (Ephesians 6:11)
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To: jmikes20

It all depends on one thing - if we get attacked again under a Democrat Administration.


23 posted on 11/20/2008 1:55:09 PM PST by eCSMaster
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To: jmikes20
No!

It's not writing in paragraphs that kills off political parties!

Just ask the Federalists and the Whigs!

Bush won by appealing to that 50% of the population that was disposed to vote for him.

He wasn't active or imaginative enough to try to build on his support. He thought if we just kept on pushing the same buttons we'd go on winning.

Some of those were very good and important buttons, but politics is an active sport. You can't just sit on a majority and expect to win every time.

In general, he didn't risk much. He didn't even risk vetoing bloated appropriations bills.

Bush had his good qualities and some fine principles, but when the country needed leadership on some issues he was a status quo president and didn't even aspire to be much more than that.

24 posted on 11/20/2008 1:55:17 PM PST by x
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To: backhoe

Yeah. “Compared to what?” is always a good question to ask. WE don’t know what the media and the Dims would have done to another president or how another president would have reacted to the Dim willingness to hold the country’s safety and security hostage to their agenda.


25 posted on 11/20/2008 1:56:40 PM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: backhoe

I don’t know what happened with W. But I know he’s a good guy. So it could be that the War on Terror just sucked up so much time and energy that he couldn’t do much else.

I mean, think about it: Would anybody give a crap about any of the issues that today seem so important— if 911s were happening once a year?

Of course not. It’s only because we believe we’re safe— that we can go around complaining about what we complain about.


26 posted on 11/20/2008 1:59:32 PM PST by exist
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To: Mad Dawg

He is a liberal BUSH ,,,,,,,,,,


27 posted on 11/20/2008 2:00:00 PM PST by libscum (don't sit out- vote Mccain)
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To: x

I’m starting to think the only reason he ran was the allay his father’s loss in 1992, which I’m beginning to think less and less was Ross Perot’s doing, and I listed why above. all those states I said Clinton solidified went GOP in the elections before him, Perot or not, not to mention Perot wasn’t really one of us. Bush would have needed too many of his votes to get to 50% anyway. Bush Sr. wrecked us in the first place by not controlling spending with his Congresses or bringing marriage or immigration around in the first place, where we could have gotten willie. Willie was the most pro-gay candidate ever, before Hussein, who actually mentioned them in his acceptance speech. Bush Sr. made people stop believing in Reagan. He was no Reagan. he merely served him because Ford wouldn’t do as VP, and Bush had machine and connections to get on the ticket.


28 posted on 11/20/2008 2:00:54 PM PST by jmikes20
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To: jmikes20

What’s a GOP?


29 posted on 11/20/2008 2:00:55 PM PST by AngelesCrestHighway
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To: jmikes20

Horrendous. The President is the de facto leader of his party. The last 8 years have seen a free-fall of Republican principles and ideals. If only he had stood against big government like he did against terrorism we might be a little better off.


30 posted on 11/20/2008 2:03:58 PM PST by LiberConservative (Typical white guy)
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To: luckystarmom
He’s way better than Gore or Kerry. Of course, I would have taken Gore or Kerry over Obama. Do I disagree with him on other things? You betcha. But it very well could have been worse.
31 posted on 11/20/2008 2:04:04 PM PST by Bearshouse
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To: x
Bush's primary job was not get more republicans elected of to govern so that he appealed to a slight majority of the people. His job first and foremost was to be CIC and protect America. He took on the job that nobody else would do. Not Carter, not Reagan, not Bush Sr and certainly not Clinton.

He lanced the boil of the Middle East before it became terminal. Clinton took on nothing big and coasted to nice approval ratings based on the republican Congress that actually walked some of the conservative talk.

Bush? He inherits a housing bubble and loose money not of his making that was a disaster waiting to happen. Concurrently he had to wage war against jihadism with the headwinds of a fickle populace, a disgraceful media and the two faced scumbags on the left who were for the war before they were against it.

So where does that leave Bush? It leaves him abandoning fiscal sanity in an attempt to gather the votes required to put some steel in Congress' backbone while not having enough juice or communication skills to ram through some restraints on Fanny and Freddy that could have mitigated the current crisis in financial markets.

Washington DC is a cesspool.

32 posted on 11/20/2008 2:05:08 PM PST by jwalsh07
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To: exist; InvisibleChurch
>>He protected the country for 8 years.<<

The World Trade Center bombings happened in 1993.

Clinton was pres. from 1993 to 2001.

So, that flaming a$$h###, Clinton did the same thing.

Bush didn't do squat to protect us. He just lucked out.

33 posted on 11/20/2008 2:05:34 PM PST by bimboeruption (Proud daughter of a Normandy Invader)
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To: luckystarmom
Only half of this post went through the first time.

He’s way better than Gore or Kerry. Of course, I would have taken Gore or Kerry over Obama.

Given the choises we had, I can not regret that I voted for W. His tax cuts were a positive and he did understand that national strenth equates to national security. His 2 choices for the Supreme Court were excellent (with only a little goading).

Do I disagree with him on other things? You betcha. But it very well could have been worse.

34 posted on 11/20/2008 2:06:27 PM PST by Bearshouse
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To: pgkdan
Any President has little or no real power other than his position to make short term decisions and directives, then wait for congress to act.

I would suggest that the congresscritters have to account for most of the blame. The Republicans in the House and Senate showed remarkable little spine during President Bush's administration. A pretty fair number of them got indicted too.

When you review the records, President Bush pretty much got everything he wanted usually without congressonal help and with a great deal of dim pissing and moaning.

35 posted on 11/20/2008 2:06:36 PM PST by pfflier
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To: jmikes20

Daddy Bush countered all of Reagans policies, Bubba destroyed the militia groups & GW bankrupted us all the while they pushed us toward One World Government. A pox on all 3 schmucks.


36 posted on 11/20/2008 2:07:12 PM PST by Digger (If RINO is your selection, then failure is your election)
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To: jwalsh07

idk if this matters, but the deficit did go down in 1993-1994, when the Dems still ran Congress with Clinton. Nonetheless, spending cuts, not just tax hikes helped with the surplus. a President DOES have to help with Congress and political business. Clinton did manage to help increase Dems in the electoral college big time, which further shows why we hated him so. The Dems gained seats in 1996, 1998 even with Monica, and in 2000. With Bush, we lost more seats in 2006 and 2008 than the Dems in 1994 combined. We’ve been cursed with poor leaders. Newt fucked us over big time after such gains, and Bush let us become a southern party only. Bush could have worked fiscal sanity, but not signing so much pork.


37 posted on 11/20/2008 2:09:42 PM PST by jmikes20
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To: jmikes20

Definitely hurt us. There were so many things that he’s done that go against our base.


38 posted on 11/20/2008 2:10:18 PM PST by montesquieu
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To: jmikes20

“Did that iceberg help the Titanic or hurt the Titanic?”


39 posted on 11/20/2008 2:11:55 PM PST by Cecily
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To: Cecily

Katrina sunk the Titanic(in this sense.) letting it get that bad really killed our image all over. He had 50%+ approvals until that happened. Conservatives are supposed to be prepared. Bush wasn’t.


40 posted on 11/20/2008 2:15:29 PM PST by jmikes20
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To: pgkdan

2001 - 2003 helped. 2003 - 2008 - hurt.


41 posted on 11/20/2008 2:18:16 PM PST by IYAS9YAS (Ever notice that Obama supporters chant "O-Bahm-AH" while McCain/Palin supporters chant "U-S-A".)
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To: jmikes20
It's easy to be critical of George Bush. Most importantly, we have not been attacked.

That being said, George Bush operated under hostile circumstances in Washington, media and even his own party! On the other side, he killed our party when he began to push citizenship to illegals. Once he began to make deals with the dems, some in our party followed him off the cliff

So Yes, George Bush has hurt us in a major way. His tin ear toward the conservative side of the party was a killer. I honesty believe he is a man of integrity, it's just that many of us felt betrayed by his policies and willingness to sign expensive budgets.

Lets ditch the RINO’s and go back to our core beliefs.

42 posted on 11/20/2008 2:19:48 PM PST by rjamesca
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To: jmikes20
I really dont care what he did to the GOP! I am mad about the fact he set the CONSERVATIVE movement back 20 years!
43 posted on 11/20/2008 2:21:46 PM PST by TheRedSoxWinThePennant
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To: jmikes20

Probably the 4th (possibly third) worst president in our history.


44 posted on 11/20/2008 2:23:54 PM PST by Founding Father (The Pedophile moHAMmudd (PBUH---Pigblood be upon him))
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To: jmikes20
Image and video hosting by TinyPic
45 posted on 11/20/2008 2:25:06 PM PST by imfrmdixie
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To: jmikes20

Spending has increased every year since 1968. Revenues dropped precipitously in beginning in 2001. Any guess why?


46 posted on 11/20/2008 2:27:00 PM PST by jwalsh07
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To: wolfcreek

That wasn’t the question.


47 posted on 11/20/2008 2:29:17 PM PST by Rocky Mountain High
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To: imfrmdixie

this picture is poignant. Bush 41 let Clinton into office, which killed us in the Northeast first and foremost. Dems have won every state north of DC on the east coast ever since Bill Clinton in 1992(minus NH in 2000), and we have never recovered California, Illinois, and Michigan either. Ohio and Florida are battlegrounds, going Republican heavily in elections before 1992. 1992 may have been a realigning election which came to full fruition in 2008. Bush 41 began the trend by catering to Congress, and barely governing. he didn’t do shit on the domestic front, which killed us. He ignored health care and jobs, all of which have conservative solutions.

Why did Bush even win the nomination in 1988, other than his machine? Jack Kemp may have been better, as he was more Reagan than Bush ever was. He sponsored the tax cuts, which Bush called voodoo economics. He was in Congress, which would have let him rail heavily against the other side. it would have prevented W.


48 posted on 11/20/2008 2:32:29 PM PST by jmikes20
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To: jwalsh07

Well said!


49 posted on 11/20/2008 2:32:56 PM PST by Rocky Mountain High
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To: jwalsh07

tax cuts for the middle class may have saved us. I’m a strong believer in supply side, but when you give too much to the top bracket, you risk losing too much money, and too many votes. I think the problem is we let our hatred of Clinton control us into taking things a little too far.


50 posted on 11/20/2008 2:34:45 PM PST by jmikes20
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