Skip to comments.The Problem with Voting “Other” Whether Libertarian or 3rd Party
Posted on 10/19/2012 11:53:15 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
I have a lot of respect for my Libertarian friends, and they are frequently the first people Id like to have a discussion with about a new policy or political controversy. I find most of them to be intelligent, thoughtful, well-read people. I also find that in large part Independents (including the Tea Party) often have much in common with the right when it comes to the issues of this particular electioneconomics and the over-reach of the Federal government.
But I do think that to actually vote for a 3rd party candidate in a tight general election (as this one) is to actually harm the chances of someone whose views are probably most similar to your own. A vote for a 3rd party actually makes a TWO point difference in terms of real numbers, from +1 to a -1 vote that could have been received by one of the main candidates. Lets get practicalin a close election, a few thousand votes can make or break the entire Electoral College contribution of a state, which in turn can determine the winner of the election.
A recent Des Moines Register poll showed only a 1-point difference between Romney and Obama here in Iowa. And in both 2004 and 2008, other votes in Iowa made up . 1 percent.
So by all means, make your case to anyone who will listen in the off-years and primary season! In fact, the last 2 election cycles, Ive supported someone other than the eventual candidate at caucus time. But once the primaries are over, I think we do need to figure out which of the remaining candidates is closest in ideology to our own views.
As to Gary Johnson himself, I find myself agreeing with manyif not mostof his positions. I want education back at the local level. I absolutely believe that the 2nd Amendment has implications for the rest of the Bill of Rights. And he was right on when he reportedly said, My next door neighbors two dogs have created more shovel-ready jobs than this current administration.
My main personal concerns about any Libertarian candidate are the tendencies for fast change and the hesitancy to deploy the military. I frequently wonder if the drastic fix-it-now approaches of the Libertarian movement are the best approach. There are so many entrenched government programs and expenditures in place today that practically speaking, its going to take some time for states and individuals to adjust. My second concern is that a Libertarian president may put ideology ahead of national defense. In my opinion, there ARE times when we need to engage in combat, and I want a President who wont hesitate to do that if it becomes necessary.
Even so, I can certainly respect the 3rd party voteor even abstentionof someone who has deeply considered the issues and clearly done their homework.
But this election is not an apples-to-apples choice, but truly an apples-to-oranges choice between two very different ideologies. So I think those who chose to actually vote for Gary Johnson this particular election will actually be harming the chances of another candidate who isnt as far off from their views as they might think.
Voting 3rd party is political masturbation. It makes you feel good, but doesn’t accomplish anything.
Unfortunately, I suspect that "reality" is not going to provide time to adjust. The U.S. is like a binge drinker whose bouts have become longer, more frequent, and more intense. We've borrowed all the Chinese will supply. We have probably "borrowed" much of what the Fed can supply.
At the same time that the borrowing has been accelerating, we have been fast approaching the end of all our credit lines. There is no way for our weakened economy to be taxed sufficiently to provide the resources required.
We will all be "adjusting" rapidly whether we want to or not.
DMACC Professor Anita Morrill said that, not 2ndDivisionVet.
I agree that voting Libertarian isn’t pragmatically viablethe RD duopoly being what it is forces participation in the suboptimal R choice, since voting L merely increases the odds of greater undesirable outcomes (more Ds getting elected). The better approach for Libertarianism to gain traction would be to keep infiltrating the GOP; though the downside is that this would invite backlash from SoCons in the GOP who enjoy using government to play social engineer just like Liberals do, albeit with a different agenda of course.
I disagree with the author’s assumption that Libertarianism is incompatible with a strong national defense. I see Libertarianism as being more directly opposed to nation-bulding, as well as avoiding international entanglement in agreements that don’t serve national self-interest.
lol. My view is totally the opposite.
1. I think libertarians are insane.
2. I think they have every right to support and vote for a third party that better represent their views.
let me add
3. They are adults. Age-wise. I assume they can make decisions on their own what is in their best interest.
What the author of this article has failed to mention is that, since the presidential election is not a direct election, but rather a (with only one exception: Nebraska) winner-take-all, state-by-state election, voters in uncontested Democratic strongholds such as my home state (California) will not hurt Romney's (already dismal) chances by awarding their vote to the Libertarian Party.
Of course, voters with 3rd-party preferences in so-called "battleground" states would do well to reconsider "wasting" their votes. Conservative voters in such states would indeed be favoring Obummer by strictly "voting their conscience."
False! There are small, but non-negligible benefits to voting 3rd party (assuming that such a 3rd party indeed more-closely reflects your political convictions):
1) Matching campaign funds and
There are also huge — albeit fairly improbable — disastrous consequences to voting 3rd party. For example, if Romney loses VA by fewer votes than Virgil garners, and the Marxist wins another four years as a result, that would also be “non-negligible,” to say the least!
Have, in the meantime, determined that Maine likewise can split its electoral college votes.
No one, whether it’s me or anyone else, can tell you how to cast your vote. That franchise was won on the battlefields of the Revolutionary War and defended in every war since, from 1812 to Iraq. Each citizen who is not a felon or in an insane asylum get the same one vote. Use it or don’t use it as you see fit.
Those who harp on those voting third party seem to make the same assumption: if they do not vote third party, they will vote for Romney. There are other possibilities, most likely not voting on that line at all. Not everyone believes Romney has changed his views as radically as he claims. It is hard for some to pull the lever for someone whose history is opposed to their views.
Had the Libertarians in AZ8 voted for Jesse Kelly then Gabby Giffords would still have all of her brain because she wouldn’t have been at that shopping center.
In an election this important you would think that those “educated” libertarians would use their noggin to remove the dictator in office. I guess there’s a reason that the phrase, “educated fools”, was invented...: )
Surely, my fellow Americans understand that they have only ONE chance to remove a communist cabal from power peacefully. That chance is November 6, 2012 Who can afford to focus on anything else?
No true Patriot will be sitting out the election at home this time. No decent American will sit on the sidelines in some futile 3rd party fantasy or protest. There is simply too much at stake.
We currently have a known enemy of our nation residing in the peoples White House. The people didnt have the good sense to stop it in 2008. The courts didnt have the courage to stop it or rectify the disaster after the 2008 election. Congress hasnt had the backbone to correct the fraud and hold all accountable, even after the 2010 cycle that swept so-called Tea Party candidates into political power. Not even state governments have the honor and courage to block a known fraud from appearing on the ballot again in 2012.
That means that righting the greatest wrong ever perpetrated in American politics is left to the American people alone. They will get ONE CHANCE to end this charade, peacefully, on November 6th. If they fail to end it peacefully, they will be left with only a Second Amendment solution. There is no other solution at that point.
When did communism become an American Dream for some? A long time ago When the American people allowed it.
When did the communist dream become acceptable to the rest of America? Only YOU can answer this one, on November 6th, 2012.
No American can afford to sit this one out or play childish games with fantasy candidates. Removing this criminal communist cabal from power is the ONLY relevant issue of the 2012 election. Only a traitor, a coward or a fool would tell you any different!
I voted third party in 2008 because I consider John McCain a menace and the Judas Iscariot of the Republican Party. Mitt Romney may policy-to-policy be less conservative than McCain but I’d vote for Romney now simply because we no longer have a blank slate running against him. We have four years of economic illiteracy combined with incredible gall and arrogance.
A third party vote is simply doubling down on four more years of bad economic policy and four more years of lies about everything under the sun. No thinking American should allow that to happen.
I’d encourage “3rd-party” against:
GOP Roraback CT-5 (pro-gay-marriage, NARAL, physician assisted suicide, in a center-right district)
GOP Obsitnick CT-4 (NARAL)
GOP Bass NH-2 (NARAL, in a center-right district)
GOP Tisei MA-5 (gay radical activist, pro-death)
I oppose 3rd-party against:
Scott Brown (supports DOMA, voted ‘no’ on Kagan)
Linda McMahon, CT
Dold, Illinois (mixed voting record per National Right to Life)
Nan Hayworth, NY (mixed voting record per National Right to Life)
the prob is that anyone who lacks sound judgment on this matter is apt to do the 3rd-party thing against anyone who annoys them in the least. 3rd-party is a good thing, but in the hands of stooges, very dangerous tool.