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Roman Holiday (The world has seen few more champions of human freedom than Pope John Paul II)
Wall Street Journal ^ | Thursday, October 16, 2003 | REVIEW & OUTLOOK

Posted on 10/16/2003 6:03:43 AM PDT by presidio9

Edited on 04/22/2004 11:50:08 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

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To: Arthur McGowan
Do you go to Birthday celebrations and pee on the cake?

Is it too much to expect a priest, you are a priest, correct?, ought to restrain himself from criticising his Pope on his anniversary?

"Happy Birthday, Dad. You are Aces. Well, 'cept the time you...and when you....and when you...."

Imagine "wright is right" a non-Catholic serving as a model of how to treat another on the day of a major milestone while a priest can't resist getting in a shot.

When you next criticise the Pope for the way things are in America, grab a mirror...

21 posted on 10/16/2003 1:37:01 PM PDT by Catholicguy (MT1618 Church of Peter remains pure and spotless from all leading into error, or heretical fraud)
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To: Catholicguy
I'm not in Rome. I'm not at a Papal Audience. And I doubt that the Pope is a Freeper. I seriously doubt that I dampened the celebration for the Pope.
22 posted on 10/16/2003 3:37:10 PM PDT by Arthur McGowan
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
The Pope, along with Ronald Reagan is one of the true giants of the 20th Century. I always wondered if something more than just earthly was going on with both men. Consider that both were elected around the same time, were both shot around the same time, overcame it, managed to defeat Communism, which I have to believe is of Satan, and then later were both crippled by debilitating, progressive disease.
23 posted on 10/16/2003 5:24:30 PM PDT by Conservative til I die
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To: Catholicguy
Oh give me a break. Really.
24 posted on 10/16/2003 5:26:09 PM PDT by Conservative til I die
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To: presidio9
The man of the Century. He saved the Catholic Church. He gave the Darwininan treatment to the dissidents. Their corruption will wipe themselves out - Nuns, Orders, Gay controlled Dioceses, etc. Only the remmant true to Jesus will survive for renewal. May all who believe in Jesus be united. Thanks be to God.
25 posted on 10/16/2003 5:36:30 PM PDT by ex-snook (Americans needs PROTECTIONISM - military and economic.)
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To: presidio9
Sto lat! sto lat!
Niech zyje, zyje nam!
Sto lat! sto lat!
Niech zyje, zyje nam!
Jeszcze raz, jeszcze raz!
Niech zyje, zyje nam!
Niech zyje nam!
26 posted on 10/16/2003 5:54:34 PM PDT by Dajjal
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To: presidio9
Many thanks for your post.
27 posted on 10/16/2003 7:54:36 PM PDT by MVV
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To: NYer; mickie
Ditto! We do love this wonderful pope, we pray for him daily!
28 posted on 10/16/2003 7:56:50 PM PDT by MVV
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To: Catholicguy
Why drag [Reagan] into this thread?
Transcending Communism (as Mr. Reagan put it) was in fact a major historical result toward which John Paul II and Mr. Reagan worked with signal success, and not entirely independently. And since this is after all a conservative political web site, it is not clear to me that my allusion is even slightly off-topic.
publicly lived in adultry in the white house as a divorced and remarried man.
It may seem like a fine point to some but Mr. Reagan was, by what I have read, stunned and bitterly disappointed by the decision of Ms. Wyman (apparently because she thought Reagan was too dedicated to the Screen Actors' Guild and the problems of Communist activism in Hollywood) to divorce him. To style someone who is abandoned by his wife an adulterer is IMHO a harsh--and not clearly scriptural--judgement.
The size of govt more'n doubled under his . . . presidency
Yes, in the US, the revenue of the Federal Government doubled--but not by raising tax rates but by lowering them. Is your complaint that he did not raise tax rates further into the counterproductive and exorbitant realm in which he found them? By the measure of revenue, I suppose, that would have "reduced the size" of the government . . .

Consider also, that Mr. Reagan and Pope John Paul II labored to--and succeed in--reducing the size of hypertrophied government in what was then the Soviet Bloc--not only Russia but Catholic Poland and the Ukraine and many other nations.

Mr. Reagan proved that the US government didn't have to be utterly disfunctional in the Carter mold, and it is a historical fact that his presidency was followed (albeit not immediately) by the immoral x42. Is the x42 administration somehow therefore the doing of Mr. Reagan?

he gave smashing speeches.
That, he did. Speeches which were bitterly criticized but, historically, had positive effects nationally and internationally.

29 posted on 10/17/2003 7:57:49 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion (The everyday blessings of God are great--they just don't make "good copy.")
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To: conservatism_IS_compassion
When one is divorced and remarried while their spouse is alive does committ adultry. That is scripture.

Everything you posted as a "conservative" proved my point.

You have been inured to the reality of the death of Federalism having been bedazzled by the sturm und drang of electoral politics for only a "conservative" could think it admirable the federal government doubled its collection of taxes.

30 posted on 10/17/2003 8:17:10 AM PDT by Catholicguy (MT1618 Church of Peter remains pure and spotless from all leading into error, or heretical fraud)
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To: Arthur McGowan
I seriously doubt you oppose the Pope as an innovator or heretic opposed to Tradition yet we have on these threads catholics who do and even they were gracious enough to not attack the Pope on his Anniversary.

If the soi disant lay traditionalists are gracious enough to understand such rudimentary good manners, why don't you?

31 posted on 10/17/2003 8:20:58 AM PDT by Catholicguy (MT1618 Church of Peter remains pure and spotless from all leading into error, or heretical fraud)
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To: Catholicguy
When one is divorced and remarried while their spouse is alive does committ adultry. That is scripture.
There is however a catch--adultery is, scripturally, a justification for divorce. So then, if a wife divorces a husband and marries another, she commits adultery--which then is scriptural justification for the husband to divorce her, and marry another. Since however his wife has already done the legal work, I would hope God doesn't judge the husband too harshly for assuming that he was free to remarry.

I am not certain that Ms. Wyman actually remarried first, tho Mr. Reagan was not even acquainted with Nancy Davis until after Ms. Wyman had divorced him--but if so, scripture would likewise forbid the original husband and wife to remarry under any circumstance. In any case I think you are splitting hairs on that issue.

You have been inured to the reality of the death of Federalism having been bedazzled by the sturm und drang of electoral politics for only a "conservative" could think it admirable the federal government doubled its collection of taxes.
You prefer increased tax rates to increased tax revenue, on grounds that the government wouldn't have the money to be tyrannical if it set the tax rate so high that nobody did any work. I didn't even suspect that there was a strain of libertarianism which is that wierd.

32 posted on 10/17/2003 6:33:16 PM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion (The everyday blessings of God are great--they just don't make "good copy.")
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To: conservatism_IS_compassion
Once married, if you divorce and remarry, you are committng adultery. That goes even for "conservatives."

"You prefer increased tax rates to increased tax revenue, on grounds that the government wouldn't have the money to be tyrannical if it set the tax rate so high that nobody did any work. "

The fact I said no such thing deterred you not a whit. Have you submitted your name as a substitute for Rush?

I am Catholic. I am not a Libertarian. I happen to agree with Thomas Fleming of "Chronicles"

This is a part of human nature which no libertarian theory can eradicate, and my advice to them is to find another planet where they can all live in solitary caves, where they can snort coke and watch porn videos to their hearts content. Their ideas are irrelevant, not just to present circumstances, but to the human condition.

33 posted on 10/17/2003 8:06:32 PM PDT by Catholicguy (MT1618 Church of Peter remains pure and spotless from all leading into error, or heretical fraud)
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To: Catholicguy
You prefer increased tax rates to increased tax revenue, on grounds that the government wouldn't have the money to be tyrannical if it set the tax rate so high that nobody did any work. "
The fact I said no such thing deterred you not a whit. Have you submitted your name as a substitute for Rush?
You have complained bitterly that I approve of the fact that government revenue increased in the '80s. Yet the predominant reason for that increase was the improvement in the economy, and the predominant reason for the improvement in the economy was the tax rate cut. Was the tax rate cut an evil plot to expand the government, or prudent management, or both?

Excuse me if I don't take it for granted that you are right to condemn someone who got the country going again, whipped inflation, ended the energy crisis, and transcended Communism. Self-righteousness is a temptation which is ever near.

34 posted on 10/18/2003 1:12:45 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion (The everyday blessings of God are great--they just don't make "good copy.")
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Don't forget Margaret Thatcher.
35 posted on 10/18/2003 1:46:14 AM PDT by Fledermaus (I'm a conservative...not a Republican.)
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To: Fledermaus
Wife and I got to see Margaret Thatcher in Minneapolis in the early 90's. It was a powerful experience.
36 posted on 10/18/2003 6:31:43 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: Catholicguy
And who appointed you the Enforcer of Papal Etiquette, anyway?
37 posted on 10/18/2003 9:24:30 AM PDT by Arthur McGowan
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To: Catholicguy
Your criticism of Reagan is misplaced.

But, so was your criticism of George W. Bush, IMO.

Don't get bounced again.

38 posted on 10/18/2003 9:37:44 AM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from a shelter! Save a life, and maybe you'll save your own, too!)
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To: Arthur McGowan
The Bishop of Burlington (VT), who,in St Mary's Catholic Church in a small machine-tool town on the Black River in So. Vermont, Confirmed me in the early 1960's. That is when I accepted the responsibility to be a Church Militant, which, back when I was Confirmed,was a time when it was considered unnecessary to tell us one didn't attack the Pope ever, and certainly not on an important Anniversary.

I would think the real question is why do you, a priest, need an official present to prohibit you from takin a shot at the Pope on his Anniversary?

39 posted on 10/18/2003 11:35:53 AM PDT by Catholicguy (MT1618 Church of Peter remains pure and spotless from all leading into error, or heretical fraud)
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To: sinkspur
You're tellin an Irish-Algonquin not to get bounced? My life has been nothing if not an imitation of the motion of a super ball dropped onto the tarmac from the Space Shuttle.

I know you like Reagan. Faux conservatives are like that:)

40 posted on 10/18/2003 11:38:38 AM PDT by Catholicguy (MT1618 Church of Peter remains pure and spotless from all leading into error, or heretical fraud)
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