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Hilaire Belloc: The Great and Enduring Heresy of Mohammed [Chilling Clairvoyance]
The Great Heresies ^ | 1938 | Hilaire Belloc

Posted on 10/18/2003 1:02:52 PM PDT by nwrep

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To: Keme
Egyptian Copts, according to the author. ( Book was Plague Wars - a bit of a "droner" , but worth plowing through. )
51 posted on 10/19/2003 4:01:19 AM PDT by genefromjersey (So little time - so many FLAMES to light !!)
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To: Destro
Destro,that's by comparison. Before the plague hit them, they were pretty close to being the "state religion" of Egypt, and had begun expanding into what is now Arabia.
52 posted on 10/19/2003 4:03:22 AM PDT by genefromjersey (So little time - so many FLAMES to light !!)
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To: genefromjersey
Mohammed, I read somewhere, was originally

You read wrong. Or were informed wrong.

Mohammed was an Arab from Mecca....worshipping a tribal moon god name allah.

53 posted on 10/19/2003 4:33:44 AM PDT by xzins (Proud to be Army!)
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To: xzins
Don't know about moon gods-moon pies,yes.
From what little I've read about Islam ( as written by Islamic people )they weren't into moon gods.
54 posted on 10/19/2003 6:09:33 AM PDT by genefromjersey (So little time - so many FLAMES to light !!)
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To: jocon307
>I support standing up for our Judeo/Christian values. I oppose Islamic jihad for world domination. I support opposing those in Islam who would through Jihad impose their perverse Sharia laws on us or anyone, even Muslims. If you wish to see that as a perversion of Christ, you go right ahead and do so.



Just for the record,
when Christ was walking around,
Romans were bent on

world domination.
Many Jews viewed Herod's rule
as perverse Roman

imposition... But
Jesus wasted little breath
on such politics.

Paul, too, didn't waste
a single epistle on
sundry politics.

So, yes, I do wish
to see attempts to recast
the Gospel
into

a Steven Seagal
script
as a perversion of
Christ. But, hey, that's me...

55 posted on 10/19/2003 11:19:21 AM PDT by theFIRMbss
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To: genefromjersey
This is from YOUR post #7 Mohammed, I read somewhere, was originally a Jew-though he and his tribe might have been long separated from anything resembling orthodox Judaism.

This is inaccurate.

If you go here Islam and Mohammed you can read a bit about "allah's" place in Mohammed's arabic tribe.....allah was a moon god. Given the history of moon god's in that region, that puts him in league with that pantheistic groupings of god names that come from that region.....ba'al, ashtoreth, molech, in particular were associated with heavenly bodies that were worshippped.

56 posted on 10/19/2003 12:36:45 PM PDT by xzins (Proud to be Army!)
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To: xzins
This was hardly written by a Muslim !
57 posted on 10/19/2003 12:39:38 PM PDT by genefromjersey (So little time - so many FLAMES to light !!)
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To: genefromjersey
It appears that ELSEWHERE you read things NOT written by muslims. No muslim would've written that Mohammed was a jew. Where'd you read that?

And since you read non-muslim material and used it in your proclamations, why not read something else.

Unless, of course, you feel like 'fessing up that you didn't really read anything about mohammed being a jew.....that you...uh...made it up misunderstood and misstated.

58 posted on 10/19/2003 12:44:14 PM PDT by xzins (Proud to be Army!)
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To: theFIRMbss
well, you know, what can I say. Render unto Ceaser, etc. I agree with that.

But, it is the Muslims who have started a relious war, not us. But for us it may end up a religious war, altho' we may get ALL the atheists on our side.

It would be nice to be able to be Christ-like and above it all, but in the fallen world that is not an option.

(OK, and forgive the tagline, my inclination is to remove it, but I am not sick of it yet, so just ignore it, if you will - thanks)
59 posted on 10/19/2003 6:34:51 PM PDT by jocon307 (Chi-town, Bean-town, LITTLE OLD ITALIAN LADIES, they can take your curses off!)
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To: pram
Get tabbed browsing & popup suppression with lean browser Mozilla Firebird from Mozilla dot org.

You can load other pages in the background while reading your current page. Saves me a lot of time, and I've got a hot Net connection.

60 posted on 10/20/2003 2:07:30 PM PDT by an amused spectator
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To: genefromjersey
With all respect to M. Belloc, Islam was hardly a "Christian" heresy. Mohammed, I read somewhere, was originally a Jew-though he and his tribe might have been long separated from anything resembling orthodox Judaism.

No he wasn't. he was Arab, of an Arabic tribe. There were Jewish clans in Mecca too and he did associate with them initially to conquere Meccaa and Medinah, but then when he had finished with them he slaughtered them.

Although the Copts now say they never waged war,they did in fact mount a punitive expedition against one of their neighbors - who happened to hold Mecca - using Assyrian mercenaries.

err... Assyria was destroyed by the Persians in 500 BC, Nineveh was sacked and ruined not to found until the 19th century.
61 posted on 02/17/2004 6:07:36 AM PST by Cronos (W2K4!)
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To: genefromjersey
Although the Copts now say they never waged war,they did in fact mount a punitive expedition against one of their neighbors - who happened to hold Mecca - using Assyrian mercenaries. During the seige of Mecca, the Coptic forces were infected with smallpox ( early germ warfare? ) which killed them in such numbers they fled the battlefield: bringing the deadly plague home with them.( Source: PLAGUE WARS )

The ETHIOPIANS tried to conquer Mecca, or to be more precise, the Ethiopian Kingdom in Yemen (which was Christian) tried to do so.
62 posted on 02/17/2004 6:08:24 AM PST by Cronos (W2K4!)
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To: Cicero
Nobody knows for sure, but the usual opinion is that Muhammed was a pagan Arab who had spoken with Jews and Christians and was familiar with the Bible at second hand. Islam is partly based on the Bible, but gets a lot of the facts, as well as the theology, wrong.

Quite correct. It's also aimed squarely at the Arabs -- telling them they are grand folks. It was an Arab nationalist movement. Even now, Arabs are considered to be better Muslims than other Muslims and the Koran can only be read in Arabic. The Koran contains such inaccuracies as stating that Abraham was to sacrifice ishmael not Isaac and that Christ was born under a tree in the desert (obviously Mo heard about Reveleations but didn't hear about the Gospels). It's mostly contradictory too. But it contains one command -- anyone who doubts this book is to be killed. Pretty good way of preventing criticism.
63 posted on 02/17/2004 6:13:48 AM PST by Cronos (W2K4!)
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To: ChinaGotTheGoodsOnClinton
TODAY NO CHUCH THAT IS AN EXACT COPY OF THE CHURCH IN ACTS!

err... small community described in Acts, large community presently. Do you seriously think that if the Church hadn't had it's formidable organisation by the 5th century that The Germanics would have been converted? That the Slavs and hte Nordics would have been converted? That Christianity wouldn't have been destroyed under hte onslaught of organised outsiders? Many English kings became Christian to ensure that they had trade links to the civilised world and the civilised world was Christian.
64 posted on 02/17/2004 6:18:14 AM PST by Cronos (W2K4!)
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To: muawiyah
Actually, both the Baptists and the Mennonites have a BETTER claim to being first than do the Orthodox or Coptics or the church in Rome.

The first church was the Orthodox-Catholic church the predecessor to the churches of Rome, Byzantium, Alexandria, Jerusalem, Antioch etc. This continues in a direct line to the Roman Catholic church, to the Orthodox churches in Constantinople, Alexandria and Jerusalem. Among the other Ancient churches are the Armenian Church, the Chaldean church, the Marthomite church, the Ethiopian church, the Coptic church and the Nestorian church in Persia. These can be dated to the first or second century after Christ.
65 posted on 02/17/2004 6:25:36 AM PST by Cronos (W2K4!)
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To: genefromjersey
From what little I've read about Islam ( as written by Islamic people )they weren't into moon gods.
Middle Eastern religions had quite a bit of moon worshipping -- for example Abraham's family were worshippers of the moon god Sin when they moved from Ur. Islam is based on the lunar cycle and it's symbol is the crescent moon -- that's why you don't have the Red Cross in those countries -- you have hte red Crescent.
66 posted on 02/17/2004 6:31:20 AM PST by Cronos (W2K4!)
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To: muawiyah
If I may jump in: OF COURSE a Christian community, whether Mennonite or Baptist or Presbyterian, will claim a lineage to the theological tradition of the beginnings of the Christian community in 30 A.D. No Christian community, not even one tied firmly to a great hero like Martin Luther, would be so foolish as to state that their movement BEGAN in 1517! In fact, in my readings in current books in Theology and Biblical Study, I am struck by the number of books dealing with the theological-social-economic-political conditions of the first few generations of Christians; and these books are written not by Catholics but by people opposed to the the Roman traditions, namely, Evangelicals and Fundamentalists. To them I echo what someone on this forum said: there is no way to go back there, to 30 AD. Even what we read in Gospels and Acts is shot through with theological convictions. The real question is: what community has--and has demonstrated--the authority to provide the genuine interpretation of the Christian Tradition in keeping with God's will?
67 posted on 02/17/2004 6:52:45 AM PST by Remole
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To: ChinaGotTheGoodsOnClinton
Of existant churches none has a better claim to this authority than the one Centered in Rome.

You mean all the idol and sainthood and papal worship was what Jesus was really speaking about? The worship of Mary when Jesus clearly said he is the way, truth and life( Jn 14:6)? I respect so many Catholics but for me to disbelieve the Eucharist doesn't miraculously transform into the body and blood of Jesus and for me to refuse to call a priest,"father" nor confess my sins to anyone but Jesus as there is no other mediator except Him to God creates many questions in my heart/ mind that the catholic church is the authority..but you're free to believe what you wish until those that take away our freedom to choose become all powerful( see Defamation of Religion, UN 57 islamic nations want to prescribe for so many). Of course the pope seems to think islam and Christianity worship the same God? or am I wrong on that?

68 posted on 07/28/2008 9:07:02 AM PDT by Karliner ("Things are more like they are now than they ever were before. DDE)
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To: ChinaGotTheGoodsOnClinton

OMG five years old?? Sorry about this. I was searching about Hillaire Belloc and didn’t check the danged date!! DOH.


69 posted on 07/28/2008 9:18:12 AM PDT by Karliner ("Things are more like they are now than they ever were before. DDE)
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