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Vegan elementary
SF Chronicle ^ | 10-26-03 | Debra J. Saunders

Posted on 10/26/2003 4:36:02 AM PST by Oldeconomybuyer

Edited on 04/13/2004 2:44:33 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

IF YOU TOOK every failed, trendy educrat idea, packaged them in a school and put radical animal-rights activists in charge of it, you'd end up with something like the Humane Education Learning Community -- a K-6 charter school approved by Sacramento's San Juan Unified School District.


(Excerpt) Read more at sfgate.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Government; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: California
KEYWORDS: animalrights; bacon; beef; beer; buffalo; cheeseburger; chicken; chops; crab; education; elk; environment; fish; froglegs; gia; hamburger; humaneeducation; indoctrination; littleredschoolhouse; lobster; moose; peta; pork; publicschools; reeducationcenter; ribs; sausage; shrimp; steaks; taxdollarsatwork; turkey; turtlesoup; vegan; venison; youpayforthis

1 posted on 10/26/2003 4:36:02 AM PST by Oldeconomybuyer
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
This school is religion based -- on the worship of Gaia or "Mother Earth". Such extreme environmentalism is a religion. The school should be challenged on that basis. If the CA can rule that the words "under God" do not belong in a public school because it is a violation of church and state, it should be a slam dunk to nix a school based on the worship of Gaia.
2 posted on 10/26/2003 4:47:29 AM PST by randita
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
-geez, and they wonder why families choose to homeschool.
3 posted on 10/26/2003 5:21:45 AM PST by tioga (Weekends Rule)
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To: randita
Political correctness does not recognize logical consistency -- logic and consistency are the products of the hated Western civilization, after all. You will probably hear arguments to the effect that Christianity is an "oppressor religion" and must be restricted while Gaia worship is an "oppressed religion" and therefore the state must promote it. "Separation of church and state" only applies to Christians and Jews.

I am intrigued by the animal rights activists who insist that nature is peaceful and harmonious. The nature I have seen is violent and blood-thirsty -- most animals exist by devouring other animals. When I look at nature, I see war at every turn. The whole point of the civilization that the environmental extremists abhor is to shield people from this violent state of nature. I wonder what planet these extremists are from?

4 posted on 10/26/2003 5:24:17 AM PST by Wilhelm Tell (Lurking since 1997!)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
How dare a conservative attack this school?

If you believe in school choice, you believe in it most of all as a means for parents to choose a form of education which best reflects their values: educational, moral, political, etc.

The freedom of vegan parents to send a kid to touchy feely granola school with tofu in lieu of hot dogs is my freedom to send a kid to a school which emphasizes history, science and mathematics and spends no time at all on feelings or self-esteem. The market will determine who made the right choice.

5 posted on 10/26/2003 5:33:26 AM PST by only1percent
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To: only1percent
Fair enough.
6 posted on 10/26/2003 5:45:51 AM PST by Oldeconomybuyer (The democRATS are near the tipping point.)
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To: only1percent
The market will determine who made the right choice.

Your kids taxes will be paying for these intellectual freeloaders too.

7 posted on 10/26/2003 5:51:55 AM PST by Tijeras_Slim (SSDD - Same S#it Different Democrat)
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To: only1percent
The freedom of vegan parents to send a kid to touchy feely granola school with tofu in lieu of hot dogs is my freedom to send a kid to a school which emphasizes history, science and mathematics and spends no time at all on feelings or self-esteem. The market will determine who made the right choice.

You think these people will show the same consideration when its time to approve a reasonable school? Compromising with the loony left when they want something and expecting the same in return when we want something hasn't worked anywhere else, why is it going to be any different here?

8 posted on 10/26/2003 6:21:24 AM PST by CGTRWK
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To: only1percent
Unfortunately it is the children of these 'enlightened' parents who are at risk of paying the price of ignorance with a resulting job potential that ends at 'Do you want fries with that?'
9 posted on 10/26/2003 6:25:27 AM PST by auntdot
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
I'm all for specialty schools but this is outright pagan animist bought on the taxpayer's dime. I have nothing against looking under the bed for bogeymen, wearing tin foil hats when walking near the CIA headquarters and channeling Fluffy the poodle to solve philosophical conundrums, but it should be a private effort.

As an aside, if nuts in a fruitcake can start a specialty school using taxpayer cash, couldn't second amendment parents start a school, complete with shooting range, a free AR-15 for each student and pictures of George Patton on every wall?
10 posted on 10/26/2003 6:26:47 AM PST by sergeantdave (You will be judged by 12 people who were too stupid to get out of jury duty)
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To: only1percent
I don't think this was an attack on the parent's right to choose a school as it was on the results or consequences of that choice. It's goals, as reported, had little to do with education as I understand the concept and more to do with indoctrination at taxpayer expense. Even in California, I don't think this will have the support of those footing the bill.


If a parent wants a vegan diet for their children that's fine. Pack a animal-free lunch. But diet as a world view is shallow and limiting. Those kids will pay a price soon enough and the school will fold. Warning of the dangers to the children is a consequence of such a hairbrained scheme. The taxpayers are paying for this and do have the right to expect results for their money. They will not be getting it. If this were entirely privately funded, well, good luck to all.

If you view this as a religious facet , as it well may be, most religion-based schools have solid academics at the core. That is why faith-based schools have thrived. Catholic, Baptist, Methodist, Jewish, or Gaia faith based schools succeed only because they promote solid academics.


11 posted on 10/26/2003 8:00:47 AM PST by DirtyDave
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To: only1percent
The freedom of vegan parents to send a kid to touchy feely granola school with tofu in lieu of hot dogs is my freedom to send a kid to a school which emphasizes history, science and mathematics and spends no time at all on feelings or self-esteem. The market will determine who made the right choice.

My big problem here is that it will be taxpayer-funded, if it happens. Other schools in the district are being closed for lack of funding.

I wouldn't have a problem with this if it were a private school, even if parents were using vouchers to pay for it. In the end, the parents will decide whether it is worth more to them to have their children educated, or indoctrinated. But to have this experiment paid for by taxpayers is unconscionable.

12 posted on 10/26/2003 11:09:15 AM PST by exDemMom (Happy to be on the side of light.)
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To: auntdot
That >is< the market. Whether or not we like it, society only functions properly when children have to the pay the price for the parents' irresponsibility, and gain the benefit of their parents' responsibility. Your child's welfare is the most powerful and most effective incentive that exists.
13 posted on 10/26/2003 11:28:59 AM PST by only1percent
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To: only1percent
If it were a private school, I would have no BEEF with the concept. This is a public school and is venturing places in religious thought and in political posturing that would not be attempted in public schools with regards to conservative Christian beliefs.
14 posted on 10/26/2003 11:30:15 AM PST by weegee
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To: CGTRWK
Battles are being fought, and won, for standards-based charter schools all around the country, complete with uniforms, disciplinary problems, and traditional curricula. They are fiercely resisted by the teachers union, of course, but the teachers union isn't always winning.

We ought to be very careful in disregarding tactical alliance with hippy-type parents on educational issues.

The left wing is at least as unhappy with the public schools in many parts of the country as the right wing is.

Many lefties would love to live in big cities (whether for cultural lifestyle or the "diversity") but feel they cannot do so responsibly because of the poor state of the public schools and the $20,000 or more a year it costs to go to good independent schools in the big cities.

Many lefties regard the public schools in the exurbs and in the south and west as intolerably biased to the RIGHT wing; too much patriotism, too much Christianity (if not formally imposed by the school board), too few minorities in the honors and AP classes. They are absolutely in search of solutions.

Also, the influx of the counter-cultural left into the homeschooling movement has been very productive -- many communities which were prepared to do anything in their power to stop what they saw as a right-wing, fundamentalist Christian insurgency were shut right up when the counter cultural leftists started showing up and asking for the same right to be left alone and see to their children's best interests.

The bottom line is that school choice is a one-way ratchet: victories won are very hard to unwin, because parents will fight to the death to keep the benefits of it once they've got it. We need to do everything in power to get wins wherever we can find them, and to make tactical alliances with any group of parents with whom they can be made.

15 posted on 10/26/2003 11:39:19 AM PST by only1percent
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
Articles like this convince me more and more that we are headed for another Dark Ages.
16 posted on 10/26/2003 12:30:57 PM PST by Paul Atreides (Bringing you quality, non-unnecessarily-excerpted threads since 2002)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
The problem is aliens coming to the US from places like Vega, then people like Gray Davis give them their own schools.
17 posted on 10/26/2003 3:09:44 PM PST by Oztrich Boy (You realize, of course, this means war?" B Bunny)
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To: only1percent
You bring up some good points. I agree the public education racket is larger, better organized, and is doing much more harm than the hippie types. And anything we can do to reduce their power is a good thing.

But at the same time, the counter culture types hate me and just about everything I stand for, I feel about the same way towards them, and standing with them for something - anything - seems repugnant.

Is my enemy's enemy here my friend? I am going to have to think about this. Good discussion.

18 posted on 10/26/2003 4:04:08 PM PST by CGTRWK
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
My economics lesson to my sons - Hunt in VA, no permit required, we own the land - cost of 100# deer?

$1

Hunt in NY, we own the land, out-of-state permit required -$110.00 permit, $1.00 bullet.

Teaching my kids to recognize socialists? Priceless.

19 posted on 10/26/2003 4:12:21 PM PST by patton (I wish we could all look at the evil of abortion with the pure, honest heart of a child.)
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To: only1percent
my freedom to send a kid to a school which emphasizes history, science and mathematics and spends no time at all on feelings or self-esteem

I would venture to say that no such public school exists (at least in California). As long as the government denies parents the money, which was taken from them by force, then the government is in fact forcing us to send our kids to schools for indoctrination into their way of thinking.

Your post would be 100% correct, IF vouchers were in place.

20 posted on 10/27/2003 12:40:38 PM PST by Michael.SF. (" I really don't know... I have no memory of that... I just don't know...." Hillary)
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To: Michael.SF.
Charter schools, the level of school choice less than vouchers, have fairly broad authority over curricula, even in California. One wouldn't have a problem setting up a no-feelings, no-self-esteem curriculum.

One WOULD have a problem with a curriculum which contradicts state academic standards, such as one which refused to teach Asian/Latin American/African history (or ommitted the Civil Rights Movement from U.S. history), or which taught Bible-literal creationism, or which didn't teach math. Charters are required to administer the various state achievement exams, so a curriculum or instructional method which yielded significantly lower scores than the public school pool from which the students were drawn would certainly be a target for charter revocation, unless it had a mission of serving the worse students and can show that it drew its students from the lower end of the local pool in accordance with that mission.
21 posted on 10/27/2003 1:31:35 PM PST by only1percent
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To: only1percent
If you believe in school choice, you believe in it most of all as a means for parents to choose a form of education which best reflects their values: educational, moral, political, etc.

As long as everyone enjoys the same freedom, no problem.

22 posted on 10/27/2003 1:34:16 PM PST by AppyPappy (If You're Not A Part Of The Solution, There's Good Money To Be Made In Prolonging The Problem.)
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