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To: PhilDragoo
"We Were Soldiers" is the definitive Vietnam movie IMHO. In a different class than the sludge propaganda films Hollywood has pumped out to try to justify the actions of the Fonda faction, including Kerry.

McNamara's folly began even before the disastrous decision not to bomb Hanoi. McNamara was initially told we'd need about 600,000 troops to win a ground war but he browbeat the Chiefs into telling the President much less would do, to the eternal shame of all concerned. After toppling Diem and installing an unstable regime, Strange knew Vietnam could not hold out without U.S combat troops, but lied to the American people with his "hold until November" strategy that allowed LBJ to decieve the people and run as a "peace" candidate. Since they'd lied to the people all along about things being just ducky in Vietnam without ground troops, LBJ and Strange had to lie about the Tonkin Gulf incident to have a pretext to do what they knew they would have to do before the election.

When they finally sent the troops in, they hamstrung them with the stupidist rules of engagment ever - Cambodia and Laos off limits, most of Hanoi off limits, no stoppage of Haiphong cargo traffic. Stupid tactics - let's take the same ground two, three, four times and give it back so we can fight a war of attrition against a fertile Asian country more than capable of filling the ranks.

The d*mn thing is that despite the lies, stupidity and treachery, the American fighting man still defeated the enemy in the field by 1968, so the American press intervened to lie to the American people once again and snatch defeat from victory.

Rant over. CT out.

64 posted on 11/12/2003 4:25:46 PM PST by colorado tanker ("There are but two parties now, Traitors and Patriots")
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To: colorado tanker; PhilDragoo
Power projection and deception....we can follow this back even to the times of the Ceasars and the Legions...even to Sekunder[Alexander the Great].

Just moments before posting this..watched a segment where U.S. troops overseas from Afghanistan to the Gulf spoke of not being paid on time..of injured soldiers..some even in Hospital still having certain support funding terminated.

This reality ..where the soldier gets the nix from the top as per concern runs past party lines....makes me mad as hell!

Legions marched out of Rome on a mandate that devolved in time finding them set against another Roman Legion or 2 in battle.
Troop stood by their comand...but their command was manipulated by the above crowd [Senate].

I see this happening again..The Hill..the Pentagon...D.C. with its CFR types tampering as the media weather vane moves.

A soldier leaves all for his least he should have some clarity to what he/she is about to forfeit all for.

During the Battle of Britian..R.A.F. Pilots saw their buddies buy the farm in a matter of weeks...they knew the reason for thier duty..and the reality set upon their nation.
Since seems the clarity lines for why the troop is out on Geostrategic projection blurrs..
Gov seems to at least find the means to send their soldiers in harms way..but mismanages them in diverse ways...eventually to become some segment on the news..which we either ponder or wretch party line and social lean from the media drive. the ancient days of Rome..the legion marches out...knowing the Senate is going to tamper with the original mandate.

68 posted on 11/12/2003 6:09:18 PM PST by Light Speed
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To: colorado tanker; Light Speed; PhilDragoo; Vets_Husband_and_Wife
I really appreciate your CLARITY
70 posted on 11/12/2003 6:36:52 PM PST by ALOHA RONNIE (Vet-Battle of IA DRANG-1965
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