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Internet Censorship Coming to a Computer Near EU (And they're talkin' 'bout US!)
The Digital Freedom Network ^ | November 12, 2003 | A. E. Huggett

Posted on 11/12/2003 10:13:08 AM PST by quidnunc

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Comment #21 Removed by Moderator

To: DeinBabbes
And another thing, Fritzl, don't attempt to get into an intellectual debate with people whose culture is alien to your way of thinking and who speak in what to you is not your first language.

What Porterville was demonstrating is that we here in America — unlike you there in Europe — have freedom of speech.

We don't have to worry about 'xenophobe laws' designed to stifle opposition to the post-modern, multicultural nitwittery which bids fair to lead to the extinction of Western Civilization in Europe.

My advice to you; Don't bring a knife to a gunfight.

22 posted on 11/12/2003 12:49:23 PM PST by quidnunc (Omnis Gaul delenda est)
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To: Fee
Don't be so fast to let Europe censor thought. These same minds think that the UN should run and tax the internet; they don't like how ICCANET is based in the US.

American Free Speech will be silenced in the local and global market if these people get their way.

23 posted on 11/12/2003 12:55:33 PM PST by weegee
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To: jonatron; quidnunc; Porterville
I think that was his whole point. Do you need a laugh-track to cue you in on a joke?

No, just a few more english lessons and i´ll be fine.

We'll just begin posting articles to illustrate the resurgence of anti-Americanism, anti-Semitism and fascism in Europe in general and German in particular.

I think this would be a lot of work, but i think fascism is nothing you have to worry about in Germany and anti-semitism is reserved to some very special left wing forums but i wouldn´t consider them a threat. Their argumentation is so bad that even though their replies are in german i have a hard time to differ between "serious" and satires from people like you. After the "end" of the Iraq war anti-americanism is no topic here anymore. People here just don´t give damn as long as there are no tabloids(like the Bild for example) to stir their interest. We´re very busy with our own problems.

Oh, you are new. Get use to people joking around and shed that thin skin of yours or go to the DU where they just love being sensitive. P.S. screw the EU... I'm sorry was that mean???

Well i´m not thin-skinned, just in a bad mood today, so i was careless when i read your comment. Maybe i´m becoming an anti-american without realizing it (just kidding)
It´s sometimes just a bit difficult for me to discuss political matters in english so take it easy on me.
24 posted on 11/12/2003 1:07:55 PM PST by DeinBabbes
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To: quidnunc
What Porterville was demonstrating is that we here in America — unlike you there in Europe — have freedom of speech.

And who exactly is restricting my freedom of speech here in Germany? Do your homework before you belittle me Uncle Sam.
25 posted on 11/12/2003 1:11:51 PM PST by DeinBabbes
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To: DeinBabbes
DeinBabbes wrote: And who exactly is restricting my freedom of speech here in Germany? Do your homework before you belittle me Uncle Sam.

Don't try to bullsCENSOREDt me Fritzl, your government is restricting your freedom of speech.

Two examples spring immediately to mind.

Early this year criminal prosecution was being considered against a German named Voss, who made Internet comments expression admiration for the events of 9/11.

And just you have a bunch of pro-Nazi, pro-Hitler handbills printed up and start handing them out in front of the Reichstag or on the K'damm in Berlin and see how long it is until you find yourself in the stony lonsome.

In Europe you can get your butt jailed for 'hate speech', and don't bother to deny it.

The remedy for repugnant is not government cinsorship, it's even more speech pointing out and excoriating the repugnance.

26 posted on 11/12/2003 1:32:53 PM PST by quidnunc (Omnis Gaul delenda est)
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To: DeinBabbes
Well then you are welcome into the fold, feel free to practice English here and also realize, we only dislike communist.... it is hard humor here and it is a lot of fun, we do a lot of tongue and cheek comments and we are (in general) hard core capitalist. Just be prepared to take criticism when you take a stand counter to the mood of the room. I do it all the time, you can't take it personal, it is just good ole' fashion exchange of ideas and freedom of speech. :)
27 posted on 11/12/2003 1:35:32 PM PST by Porterville (Grow some leather or go away.)
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To: quidnunc
What wretched typing!

The last line of my Reply #26 above, "The remedy for repugnant is not government cinsorship, it's even more speech pointing out and excoriating the repugnance." should read "The remedy for repugnant speech is not government censorship, it's even more speech pointing out and excoriating the repugnance."

28 posted on 11/12/2003 1:48:18 PM PST by quidnunc (Omnis Gaul delenda est)
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To: quidnunc
Now i know what you are talking about. Take a look at our history. There´s no room here anymore for organised fascism. Yes this is a restriction to my freedom of speech but i think i´ll accept this one. This restriction dates back to the time when everyone hated us for what we had done to the jews. At that time it was necessary to take a stand against such elements in our society. If we remove it, everyone would think we forgot what happened.

btw could you please stop calling me Fritzl? I know you have your freedom of speech. It´s just a matter of politeness.
29 posted on 11/12/2003 1:50:55 PM PST by DeinBabbes
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To: DeinBabbes
DeinBabbes wrote: Now i know what you are talking about. Take a look at our history. There´s no room here anymore for organised fascism. Yes this is a restriction to my freedom of speech but i think i´ll accept this one. This restriction dates back to the time when everyone hated us for what we had done to the jews. At that time it was necessary to take a stand against such elements in our society. If we remove it, everyone would think we forgot what happened. btw could you please stop calling me Fritzl? I know you have your freedom of speech. It´s just a matter of politeness.

The point is that this time the restrictions on speech apply to those advocating fascism, but what kind of speech will the next restrictions prohibit… and the next… and the next?

This is what's called a slippery slope; once you start down it it's impossible to go back.

As for politness, you'll find that in the dictionary between "piss" and "puke".

Europeans are not highly-esteemed by most here on Free Republic because we've finally figured out where you Euros are coming from and we now consider "Old Europe" — the chocolate makers and cuckoo-clock tinkerers — to be beneath our contempt.

You've irritated one of the most veteran flame warriors on this forum, namely me, and — to paraphrase Harry Truman — if you can't stand the heat then get out of the kitchen.

30 posted on 11/12/2003 2:12:07 PM PST by quidnunc (Omnis Gaul delenda est)
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To: quidnunc
Europeans are not highly-esteemed by most here on Free Republic because we've finally figured out where you Euros are coming from and we now consider "Old Europe" — the chocolate makers and cuckoo-clock tinkerers — to be beneath our contempt.

I´m beneath your contempt? Well then why are you wasting your time replying to my comments. Thanks anyway for blessing me with your wisdom. Shall i start crawling in front of the new Herrenrasse mein Führer? Beneath you contempt, don´t make me laugh.

You've irritated one of the most veteran flame warriors on this forum, namely me, and — to paraphrase Harry Truman — if you can't stand the heat then get out of the kitchen.

Oh now i´m trembling with fear. I´m here to discuss this issue. If you want to flame then go on. Freedom of speech remember? I consider flaming as beneath MY dignity.
May i quote Ali G? "Speak to the hand cause the face ain´t listening"
And yes i know this quote is childish, but so are your comments.

...on of the most veteran flame warriors...

I´ll remember that phrase. It´s just too funny.



This is another satire isn´t it? Come on you can´t be serious^^
31 posted on 11/12/2003 2:49:00 PM PST by DeinBabbes
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To: DeinBabbes
This may not say it all, but it says a lot:

Canned Kraut

Gen. Reinhard Guenzel, the head of Germany's Special Forces Command (KSK), got the hobnailed boot on Tuesday. His mistake? He expressed a bit too publicly the sort of Jew-hating sentiment tens of millions of Germans harbor privately.

In a letter to a vicious right-wing extremist who sits in Germany's parliament, the general praised the claim that Jews bear at least as much blame for the bloodshed of the Russian Revolution as Germans do for the Holocaust.

Next, we'll hear from Berlin how Jews planned the Holocaust all along. Just as we hear that Israel is the only terrorist state in the Middle East and that Palestinian suicide bombers who butcher women and children are freedom fighters.

Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder's flacks have begun their damage-control effort, insisting that the general's views are rare and isolated. Bull. I lived in Germany for 10 years while serving in the U.S. Army. I speak German. My family's bloodlines are half German. And because of all that, the Germans among whom I lived assumed I shared their bigotry and, eventually, spilled their guts.

It wasn't pretty.

Of course, there are good Germans. Plenty of them. But they live in Philadelphia, not Frankfurt. They or their ancestors all left Germany by 1938. Those who stayed didn't just support Hitler — they loved him and fought for him to the bitter end.

The whopping difference between the Allied occupation of Germany and our occupation of Iraq is that the overwhelming majority of Iraqis welcomed their liberation. We had to force freedom and democracy on the Germans at gunpoint.

They'll never forgive us — no more than they'll forgive Jews for surviving the Holocaust, making a success of Israel against all odds and enriching the United States in virtually every field of human endeavor.

And Germany? In the 19th and early 20th century, German-speaking countries led the world in culture and science. Then they killed or drove away their Jews. The result? Germany's greatest contributions to world culture since 1945 have been Milli Vanilli and Gummi Bears.

What about the charge that the terror in the wake of the Russian Revolution was the work of Jews? Like so many of the Big Lies "made in Germany," there's a tiny grain of truth in it. Yes, Jewish subjects of the Czar played a prominent role in the Russian Revolution. Had I suffered as horribly as Jews suffered under the Romanovs, I'd like to think that I would have been a revolutionary, too.

But Lenin wasn't a Jew. Stalin wasn't a Jew. And just by the way: Hitler, Himmler & Co. weren't Jewish, either, although I fully expect a revisionist historian from Munich or Marburg to argue that they were all secretly manipulated by the International Jewish Banking Conspiracy and guided by the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

In Germany today, there's an utterly repulsive movement — ranging from such dreary literary "stars" as Guenter Grass down to Herr Meier behind the wheel of his Opel — to shift the blame for World War II atrocities away from Germany and to insist that the Allies were equally evil.

Tell it to the ghosts of Auschwitz. And Babi Yar. And Warsaw. And, for that matter, Malmedy.

The German resistance? Almost as big a lie as the denial of the Holocaust. Count von Stauffenberg and his fellow aristocrats, whose inept attempt to kill Hitler with a bomb in 1944 is forever cited as an example of German courage, never lifted a finger against the Nazi regime until the Red Army closed in on their hereditary lands in East Prussia. They weren't fighting for high ideals. They were defending their real estate.

The only thing most Germans regretted was that they lost.

And now we hear that it's high time for an end to German guilt, that the present generation had nothing to do with the Holocaust, that Germany paid its dues for its misdeed and, anyway, it was all a long time ago.

Sorry, Fritz. It wasn't long ago. Holocaust survivors just had a reunion in Washington, D.C. When the wind's just right, we can still smell the smoke of the ovens.

And let's not forget that the Third Reich was supposed to last a thousand years. There's no reason why German guilt shouldn't last 500. That's a 50 percent discount.

Oh, sure, making anti-Semitic remarks is a crime in today's Germany. But anti-Israeli remarks are just fine. You've merely got to choose your words carefully. Don't say the J-word. Talk about "Zionists" instead.

The truth is that we're still so close to the Holocaust that, despite all the books, films and debates, we still have not come to grips with just how much the Germans destroyed. The annihilation of the great Jewish cultures and populations of Europe's heartland may have been the single most tragic loss in human history.

What is to be done?

For a start, don't buy German products. The boycott of French wine sent a strong message, but if Americans stopped buying Mercedes, BMWs, Audis and Volkswagens, it would really hurt.

Anyway, German cars of recent vintage have become a lot like the Germans themselves — grossly overrated and unreliable. Let Gen. Guenzel buy one.

(Ralph Peters in the New York Post, November 6, 2003)
http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/10058.htm

32 posted on 11/12/2003 3:09:53 PM PST by quidnunc (Omnis Gaul delenda est)
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To: DeinBabbes
Hey DB -

I'm glad you're lurking and posting on FR. I've spent a lot of time in Europe over the last five years and I'm sorry that there is such large and increasing disagreement across the Atlantic these days. I wish there were more Europeans on FR. I always talk politics when I visit Europe (just like I do here, it's what I like to do) and though I usually encounter a lot of distrust and even disrespect toward America, I also see that Europeans are intelligent, educated, and rational people (for the most part, no more or less as compared to Americans). I think that if more Europeans were exposed to friendly, polite American conservatives (that's a hint to all the rest of you FReepers on this thread, by the way) it would be better for all. Just like I think that Americans can in some cases learn a lot from Europeans. We're the same people at the bottom in many ways. We Americans are more religious and capitalistic and individualistic. But compared to Muslims, Africans, most Asians, etc., etc. our similarities far outweigh our differences. It's a messy, dangerous world and not even the U.S. can afford to tackle all of our problems alone. Let's keep up the dialogue.

Prost!


- rogue yam
33 posted on 11/12/2003 6:55:59 PM PST by rogue yam
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