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Governor Seeks New Trial Over Brain Damaged Woman's Wishes
Tampa Bay Online ^ | November 19, 2003 | Vickie Chachere

Posted on 11/19/2003 4:13:47 PM PST by sweetliberty

Gov. Jeb Bush fired a volley of legal shots Wednesday at the husband of a brain damaged woman who is at the center of a right to die case, saying there needs to be a jury trial on whether Terri Schiavo wanted to be kept alive artificially. The governor also sought to remove Pinellas Circuit Court Judge W. Douglas Baird from hearing the constitutionality of the new law enacted to keep Terri Schiavo alive after her feeding tube was removed last month. In yet a third legal filing, the governor argues that Terri Schiavo's rights under the Florida Constitution are being protected, not violated.

Terri Schiavo went for six days without food and water after her husband Michael Schiavo removed her feeding tube. Florida lawmakers and Bush intervened, enacting a hastily drawn law that allowed the governor to order the feeding tube be reinserted.

Michael Schiavo has challenging the constitutionality of the governor's action. He contends his wife had said she did not want to be kept alive artificially before she suffered severe brain damage in 1990. Doctors have ruled she has been in a persistent vegetative state since, but her parents believe she is aware of her surroundings and could be rehabilitated.

Bush's attorney Ken Connor said a jury has to establish what Terri Schiavo's wishes were before a court can decide whether her private health care wishes were violated.

George Felos, Michael Schiavo's attorney, could not immediately be reached for comment.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: attorneyfromhell; coma; cultureofdeath; drug; druginducedcoma; euthanasia; geiorgefelos; governorhebbush; guardianfromhell; hino; husbandfromhell; judgegreer; merchantsofdeath; michaelschiavo; reallifeghouls; terri; terrischiavo
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To: TaxRelief
So we're back to the Dean's Inner Circle at the University of Miami, again.

There's a group out there with an agenda, and I have a feeling they're lining up people across the country. This case is their test case.....on to other states next.

101 posted on 11/19/2003 8:08:36 PM PST by nicmarlo
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To: Chancellor Palpatine; No More Gore Anymore
The only thing we're repetitive about is telling you TROLLS to LEAVE US ALONE and post on a thread where there's something INTERESTING FOR YOU. YOU and your tripe DON'T INTEREST US.
102 posted on 11/19/2003 8:11:07 PM PST by nicmarlo
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
"shes a turnip"

She's a human being and a child created by God in His image. How dare you be so despicable!!

103 posted on 11/19/2003 8:11:45 PM PST by LADY J
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To: sweetliberty
Michael Schiavo and his lawyer have been 'kicking sand' in the face of Terrie, her family and even in the face of Governor Bush.

I hope Michael's 'team Shiavo' are beginning to get an idea of 'consequences' here. . .

104 posted on 11/19/2003 8:11:57 PM PST by cricket
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
If you could talk with Terri and ask her to blink her eyes twice for no and she was able to do this enough that you were certain she was communicating with you, would you still want her to die if she told you she wanted to live? Remember nothing will have changed. She will still be "a turnip, and can't contribute diddly and will still subtract resourses and consume time"
105 posted on 11/19/2003 8:13:12 PM PST by CindyDawg
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To: All
Here is info on the bone scan hearing.

by Steven Ertelt LifeNews.com Editor November 19, 2003

Pinellas Park, FL (LifeNews.com) -- Judge George Greer will hear a motion tomorrow filed by Michael Schiavo that would prevent discovery of information regarding a bone scan conducted on Terri Schiavo that shows she may have been a victim of physical abuse.

While most media outlets have reported that Terri Schiavo collapsed at home in 1990 as a result of a potassium imbalance, Terri's family has long suspected that the real cause may have been physical abuse at the hand of her estranged husband Michael.

A bone scan conducted on Terri in March 1991 showed she had several fractures and was the victim of "abnormal activity" that caused "previous traumas," indicating she may have been beaten or abused.

Attorneys for Terri's family had planned to depose Dr. Campbell Walker, the radiologist who conducted the bone scan, on Friday to obtain his further analysis of it.

Michael's motion asks the court to block the deposition saying that the court has already dealt with the bone scan in previous hearings.

Terri's parents Bob and Mary Schindler hope the information from Dr. Campbell will help show Judge Greer that Michael is unfit to be Terri's guardian. A case to change guardianship to Terri's brother Bob is pending before Greer.

The Schindlers have asked Pinellas County State Attorney Bernie McCabe on several occasions to call a grand jury to investigate the bone scan as well as other abuses during Michael's guardianship.

At the time, McCabe declined to investigate saying too much time had passed between the collapse and the scan.

Also, doctors other than those selected by Michael's attorney have reviewed Terri's medical records.

"It was found that a heart attack did not cause Terri's collapse as everyone was led to believe. Rather, according to one physician, Terri may have been a strangulation victim," Pamela Hennessy, a representative of the family, told LifeNews.com previously.

The Schindlers say Michael also wants to remove any possible evidence that could be used to substantiate accusations of wrongdoing.

Michael wants Terri's body cremated if she dies, which would deny any chance the family has to validate a long-held suspicion.

"Michael has instructed the judge to cremate her body upon her death, which adds even more suspicion to what really happened to Terri," Bob Schindler said.

He added, "We're trying to stop the cremation from happening if Terri does die, so hopefully, we get to the process of investigating what may have happened to Terri that evening."

In September, three nurses filed affidavits saying Michael has withheld proper medical care from Terri.

"He's been trying to kill her -- that's the bottom line," said Carla Sauer Iyer, a 39-year-old registered nurse who cared for Terri Schiavo at a nursing home in 1995 and '96. She says Terri has said words such as "Mommy," "help me" and "pain."

George Felos, the assisted suicide advocate who is Michael's attorney, calls the nurse's statements, "a bunch of garbage." He claims Michael has been insistent that Terri receive the best medical care possible.

106 posted on 11/19/2003 8:14:36 PM PST by pollywog (Psalm 121;1 I Lift mine eyes to the hills from whence cometh my help.)
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To: nicmarlo
Fine - I have no problem with that. Of course, in return, I'd ask that you quit trying to exert pressure on Florida officials regarding a case in which you aren't involved and have no direct contact with the evidence - which none of you would be willing to do.

I guess I'll have to keep on second guessing your observations and meddling.

107 posted on 11/19/2003 8:15:50 PM PST by Chancellor Palpatine
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Okay so you still don't get it.. why do we need to know that? We know you don't get .. you can rest soundly knowing that we got the point of all of your posts; You don't understand the function of the government, you don't understand this case, you don't understand the ramifications of this case on our Republic. Good heavens , you can stop repeating yourself. You don't get.. we know that already.
108 posted on 11/19/2003 8:17:53 PM PST by Diva Betsy Ross ((were it not for the brave, there would be no land of the free -))
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To: editor-surveyor
Thanks for the ping, editor ...and don'tcha just know that Feindish Felos is not available for comment because he's skate boarding around Floridah trying to find potential jurors... so he can stare into their eyes while giving them his own mental commands to "let Terri die"... "she told Prince Mikey she wants to die, so let her die, "... "show Governor Bush that YOU are the boss in this matter"... "let that freekin' vegitable die, dammit... cuz every other argument is just a bunch of garbage." !!!

.

109 posted on 11/19/2003 8:18:21 PM PST by GeekDejure (<H3> Searching For The Meaning Of "Huge" Fonts !!!</H3>)
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
I don't have to do anything in "return" for you to quit spamming threads that "don't interest you" because TO YOU it's irrelevant. This is not IRRELEVANT to me, and to those who post here. Only YOU are irrelevant. There is no point to your posts; however, there is a point to our communication with elected officials.
110 posted on 11/19/2003 8:19:10 PM PST by nicmarlo
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To: CindyDawg
Meaningful communication? Sure.
111 posted on 11/19/2003 8:19:58 PM PST by Chancellor Palpatine
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To: Ronin
About damn time, Jeb!

I was wondering when/if he was going to take the gloves off and realize that there is no down side to using every resource he has available.

I had to chuckle about this.
JEB hears from me constantly. I'm sure I am either on his annoy list, or nut list.
Seriously, anything I send to anybody, JEB gets a CC. Scathing emails included.
Back when the Senate was considering Terri's Bill, they ran an alert on FOX, stating the Senate was taking an afternoon break. I fired off an email to each and every one of them, asking if they were having lunch, or would they be starving and dehydrating along with Terri. I called them mindless.
Our entire group emailed them several times. 20 minutes later, the bill was passed. I would like to think our actions and words helped them along in their decision.
Patience may be a virtue, but there is a place for patience. Mine had run out that day.
112 posted on 11/19/2003 8:20:31 PM PST by KDubRN
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To: sweetliberty
I don't get the ping thing........duh
113 posted on 11/19/2003 8:21:46 PM PST by KDubRN
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Why? Her physical status would not have changed and she would still be all the things that you see her as now, wouldn't she? Not flaming . Just trying to understand why us wanting her to have that opportunity is wrong to you?
114 posted on 11/19/2003 8:24:04 PM PST by CindyDawg
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To: nicmarlo
Purple with rage on this one, aren't you? All the way in New York, screwing with people you don't even know and in a matter which is none of your business, and yet you have the audacity to claim that I shouldn't point out how stupid, imprudent and pointless this is?

Perhaps you should open up your checkbook. Reimburse Florida's taxpayers for its costs incurred here due to pressure you've helped bring to bear.

Its real easy to make other people pay the cost for your moral stances, isn't it?

115 posted on 11/19/2003 8:25:32 PM PST by Chancellor Palpatine
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Terri means everything to the Republic, she is the very epitome of the helpless crying out for a voice, you know, like a baby about to be executed in a partial birth abortion nightmare.

Terri's will to live must be ferocious, tenacious and desparate when considering the abuse she has taken, the neglect is staggering.

Join us as we defend her, fight with and for her, and lay before our fellowman the value of every single human being, we can brush aside those who claim a line in the sand, some arbitrary method of assigning worthiness to human life, in declining increments related to the severity of the imperfections or handicaps, as it were.

Walk a few days in the Schindler's shoes-try to vicariously live their experience with Judge Greer's court and MS, walk awhile in MS's shoes, paying careful attention to note his current lifestyle, what he enjoys, and what joy he has offered to Terri, and then, join us as we fight for this precious American family.

This story isn't too little, it is TOO BIG. It is life and death and where we stand, impacts the outcome.

The funny thing about life is, you never know when or if you will be next in line, suddenly vulnerable, and dependent upon others. Choose your friends wisely, with people like felos, groups like the ACLU, and any creep who would be willing subvert his or her integrity to work for janet reno (remember WACO, ELIAN, and Oklahoma?) against you, even written wishes could be twisted. And there you would lay, UNABLE to scream out...NO! NO! NO!

116 posted on 11/19/2003 8:25:47 PM PST by Republic
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To: Ann Archy
Who's got Jeb's e-addy so we can thank him?

Jeb.Bush@MyFlorida.com
117 posted on 11/19/2003 8:26:10 PM PST by KDubRN
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To: sweetliberty
I will see you tomorrow sweetliberty; time for me to hit the hay. Have a good one!
118 posted on 11/19/2003 8:26:16 PM PST by nicmarlo
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To: CindyDawg
Call it residual sentimentality.

Of course, half a century ago, she'd have been dead for years already. A century ago, they wouldn't have given her death a second thought.

119 posted on 11/19/2003 8:26:55 PM PST by Chancellor Palpatine
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
What is the difference between you and Terri, why do you think you are more valuable to society?

You have a problem with "me too isms"? Hi, welcome to freerepublic.com, bud. What I have finally figuree out about you is that you have a problem with other people getting things done, believing in something greater than themselves. You,OTH, don't stand for anything, fight for anything or believe in anything. You are here as you say" to make sure the fence sitters " get fair representation on a website dedicated to grass roots activism. Get a life.. Terri has one. She has been a mighty warrior in her fight to live.

Get this, a person you say is a turnip, has more conviction for life, in her little disabled finger, than you have within your entire body.

BTW, yes I am crazy obsessed with this country ,and what goes on with our government. "I am here, let me be clear , get used to it". :}

120 posted on 11/19/2003 8:27:06 PM PST by Diva Betsy Ross ((were it not for the brave, there would be no land of the free -))
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Its real easy to make other people pay the cost for your moral stances, isn't it?

We do it everyday, helping murderers appeal with their public defenders, don't we? And I'm not in a rage; I just find people like you revolting.

121 posted on 11/19/2003 8:28:08 PM PST by nicmarlo
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To: sweetliberty
Doctors have ruled she has been in a persistent vegetative state

Doctors have ruled ???

Gosh, I know some doctors have a high opinion of themselves, but this reporter thinks they rule. Jeez.

I know, I know, Ms. Cachere at least is not calling Terri "comatose" anymore, like she used to. But she still can't keep her bias from showing.

122 posted on 11/19/2003 8:29:40 PM PST by shhrubbery!
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To: Republic
I have no intention of being a burden on my family like Terri Schiavo has been, so I'd be silently screaming for release.

I won't be joining you.

123 posted on 11/19/2003 8:29:43 PM PST by Chancellor Palpatine
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Meaningful communication? Sure.

You really are a disgrace!! Yes, winking for someone who cannot speak IS COMMUNICATION!! You have stirred my dander!!! I HAVE A DEAF/AUTISTIC/DEVELOPMENTALLY DELAYED 25 year old SON. HE CANNOT SPEAK, HE HAS LIMITED ABILITY TO COMMUNICATE WITH HIS HANDS. DO YOU SUGGEST THAT WE HAVE HIM " PUT DOWN"??????

YOUR SICK......and YES I'M SHOUTING!!!!!!!!!

124 posted on 11/19/2003 8:30:48 PM PST by pollywog (Psalm 121;1 I Lift mine eyes to the hills from whence cometh my help.)
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To: pollywog
Get over yourself. Its not about you or him.
125 posted on 11/19/2003 8:33:30 PM PST by Chancellor Palpatine
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To: Chancellor Palpatine; nicmarlo
What, now there is some problem with purple rage? That is th only thing that gets me up in the morning....I am looking forward to the day when it is PC to be dedicated to and rady to fight for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness for all people.
126 posted on 11/19/2003 8:33:57 PM PST by Diva Betsy Ross ((were it not for the brave, there would be no land of the free -))
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Lucky for you then, that you can trust your family. Would you, as Terri, trust MS-say if he had beaten you to a pulp? Course we don't know this for a fact-for some strange reason (and perhaps you could shed some light on this), MS if filing to keep Terri's BONE SCANS forever locked. Gee. Interesting. Why no show them to the parents, debate them, and release all suspicion, if nothing is there. Why hurt the family? Why keep ANY medical records SECRET from her parents? Perhaps you have a really good reason for this to be done. Such cruelty, to people who raised her, and have known her since her birth, vs a man who was married to her for four years, is inexplicable. Cruel. Strange. And laden with hate.
127 posted on 11/19/2003 8:34:08 PM PST by Republic
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To: pollywog
Polly, it is about you and me and even those like PC, who take their freedom for granted. Indeed they ride on the backs of all freedom fighters, because they are too scared to fight themselves. Don't let him bug you.. we have always had hangers on, like this guy. He isn't important.
128 posted on 11/19/2003 8:37:13 PM PST by Diva Betsy Ross ((were it not for the brave, there would be no land of the free -))
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To: KDubRN
"I don't get the ping thing"

It just means that your name is included in the "to" field and will show up on your "my comments" page as posts to you to call your attention to a thread or post. If you want, I will add your name to my regular Terri ping list.

129 posted on 11/19/2003 8:37:47 PM PST by sweetliberty ("Better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.")
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To: Republic
He's litigated over the scans before - that issue is closed, been subject to an appeal, and is over.

They're not going to go back into them.

I have another great idea - why don't you simply have Jeb make a decree that from now on, every major family decision must also have the approval of one's parents in law, regardless of adulthood or competence. That way, everybody can know up front that their lives can and will be micromanaged via one's inlaws.

That is what you are asking for Michael Schiavo.

130 posted on 11/19/2003 8:38:21 PM PST by Chancellor Palpatine
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
I think this is a GREAT standard to promulgate.

I agree. There is no greater fight to bring to the public's awareness than the 'right to life'. This is a right that can never be regained. The most hedious criminals are given a trial but that right isn't given to our most helpless. The helpless are at the mercy of those, like yourself, who say they wouldn't want to live 'that' way. This is not your life..make your decision..put it in writing..but don't speak for the rest of us.

When I started following this case, I fought for Terri because of the injustice and I still agree with that. However, through this I've grown closer to God and I believe my life is His to give and take, and so is Terri's.

Say what you will..it won't dent my faith and I may or maynot answer. :-)

131 posted on 11/19/2003 8:39:08 PM PST by Krodg
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To: nicmarlo
Night nic.
132 posted on 11/19/2003 8:40:38 PM PST by sweetliberty ("Better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.")
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
No, efficiency versus life itself is a loser every time. The jury would only be required in cases where there was no agreement within the family. And I see nothing wrong with establishing a mechanism for review of judicial determinations of fact that could could deprive someone of life.

The case for killing Terri Schiavo is morally bankrupt without a new evaluation by qualified people without the existing investment in the outcome, that all of the involved parties currently have. Any argument that her husband wants her to die because he loves her is negated by how he lives today. He could just walk away, but I believe he fears what might be discovered about her.

My position is that a new evaluation is needed, due to the failure to provide the promised therapy, the conflict of interest of her husband, the absence of evidence of such a choice by Terri, the incompetence and arrogance of the judge, and the conflicting views of all of her natural family. But right now, with a life at stake, I don't trust what has been decided or what has been done, and I reserve judgement.

I have read your posts on this topic, and while I have no idea why you have taken your position to kill her, you seem convinced - although evidence for your position is no better than for mine. If at this point you believe you have all the facts, and this is really your considered and final judgement, I would genuinely fear having you on a jury.

I have no desire to argue the point further, so if you have nothing new to offer, I suppose our conversation on this is finished - at least, until I have new evidence.
133 posted on 11/19/2003 8:40:40 PM PST by MainFrame65
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To: Chancellor Palpatine; pollywog
This person is a liberal.

An enemy of the heart or a gamesman who enjoys taunting over an issue so close to the hearts and souls of those who 'get it', that he or she deserves not our time anymore.

This person seems intellectually dishonest, purposefully cold and lacking in compassion. A very hurt life jumps out here...basking in attention and enjoying a game...acting like a true sociopath might behave.

God Bless you for your love and concern, for the tenderness and understanding you show daily to your son, for seeing in him, the hope the Schindler's so hold for their daughter.

This person cannot be a FReeper in the FReeper tradition...FReepers, if anything, value life above death, and view inconvenience as a challange, not something to be trashed.

Let's ignore this person...something is deeply amiss there.

134 posted on 11/19/2003 8:41:49 PM PST by Republic
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
My healthy little granddaughter didn't take too well to being born and she might not have made it back then either. I am very grateful that she was born during a time when medical knowledge was available to help her. That said, Who knows what would have happened to Terri? I guess a lot would have depended on her caregivers.
135 posted on 11/19/2003 8:44:26 PM PST by CindyDawg
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To: nicmarlo
Thanks for posting the docketing notice.

I can't figure out which court this was filed in, though. Anybody know?

136 posted on 11/19/2003 8:45:24 PM PST by shhrubbery!
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To: shhrubbery!
"Doctors have ruled ???"

And even that should read some doctors have "ruled" and it should be qualified with: more doctors do not believe she is in a vegetative state, since there have been more who don't than do.

137 posted on 11/19/2003 8:45:47 PM PST by sweetliberty ("Better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.")
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
I'm glad you feel that way because I have seen posts where it seems people are saying that they want her to die because they would not want to live like that. I'm glad you would want Terri to live if she wanted to. We aren't that far apart here.
138 posted on 11/19/2003 8:48:03 PM PST by CindyDawg
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To: Republic
I don't know if he is a liberal or not, but I know he is deeply troubled. He is a self described fence sitter. He is here just to rile everyone up. He does that on every thread I have seen him on. I have never seen him take the conservative stance. IMO, he doesn't have a family.

Best to ignore him... he thinks he is some sort of expert, but he barley understands the technicial function of the government in this county , how laws are made, or what the Constitution has to do with this case.

139 posted on 11/19/2003 8:49:02 PM PST by Diva Betsy Ross ((were it not for the brave, there would be no land of the free -))
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To: appropos
The precedent-setting case of Estelle Browning involved a woman who had two written wills establishing she did not want to be kept alive artificially. There were no family members disputing that was her choice.

Besides the fact that being provided food and water isn't exactly what any reasonable person would call "artificial".

140 posted on 11/19/2003 8:50:55 PM PST by Shethink13
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To: mickie
"I'll just bet that pile of sh*t HINO never thought he would be up against the powerful office of the Governor of the State."

Not to mention all us right wing fanatics at FR (and a few other places).

141 posted on 11/19/2003 8:52:02 PM PST by sweetliberty ("Better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.")
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To: sweetliberty
sweetliberty, could you please add me, too?

Thanks!
142 posted on 11/19/2003 8:52:03 PM PST by Micavaga (DV can NOT be tolerated any longer in this country!)
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To: Politicalmom
I love it!

Hip - hip - hurrah!

143 posted on 11/19/2003 8:53:15 PM PST by msmagoo
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Get over yourself. Its not about you or him.

You are WRONG. Terri's case is about ALL OF US...laws are in the making Chancellor. You should know THAT much.

144 posted on 11/19/2003 8:54:04 PM PST by pollywog (Psalm 121;1 I Lift mine eyes to the hills from whence cometh my help.)
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To: Micavaga
Sure.
145 posted on 11/19/2003 8:54:09 PM PST by sweetliberty ("Better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.")
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To: nicmarlo
Fabulous post! Thank you :)
146 posted on 11/19/2003 8:54:39 PM PST by msmagoo
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To: Graymatter
"Uh, no, Felos was busy convincing the etherplasm that the walls have a right to holes"

ROTFL!

147 posted on 11/19/2003 8:57:24 PM PST by sweetliberty ("Better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.")
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To: pollywog
Everyone's worried that Greer will rule in MS's favor again, this time about the bone scan.
I take heart from a statement Greer is reported to have made on Nov. 22, 2002:

"The court concludes that while it might be interesting to pursue the issue of trauma as it may have occurred almost 12 years ago, that has nothing to do with Theresa Marie Schiavo in 2002."

The sentence in full is very discouraging, yes. But isolate this: "while it might be interesting to pursue the issue of trauma..."

This is more encouragement than most folks get from a judge ruling against them. In an offhand way he is implying that the Schindlers ought to pursue the issue. Saying that from the bench must have sent an awful chill down Schiavo's spine.


148 posted on 11/19/2003 8:59:27 PM PST by Graymatter
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To: No More Gore Anymore
Polly, it is about you and me and even those like PC, who take their freedom for granted. Indeed they ride on the backs of all freedom fighters, because they are too scared to fight themselves. Don't let him bug you.. we have always had hangers on, like this guy. He isn't important.

Thank you No More Gore Anymore. I recognize CP has no real value on human life. It just hurt me terrible to see his comment to Cindydawg about her winking not being communication. You have to raise a handicapped child to fully comprehend. Our George communicates. OH NOT like our other children. He has NO words. He only has looks, and a few words that he can try and sign language.Yet, to us , he is valuable. Some day we will know just why God allowed him into our lives. For now, we just love and accept his gift to us. Himself.

149 posted on 11/19/2003 9:02:02 PM PST by pollywog (Psalm 121;1 I Lift mine eyes to the hills from whence cometh my help.)
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To: LADY J
She's a human being and a child created by God in His image. How dare you be so despicable!!

Despicable people become that way by not having the capacity to see that they are despicable. I could feel sorry for such people if they weren't so destructive to the innocent lives of those around them.

150 posted on 11/19/2003 9:04:20 PM PST by lonevoice (Legal disclaimer: The above is MY OPINION)
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