From savior to assassin - How killer germs have defeated our last antibiotic

Newark Star Ledger ^ | 12/7/03 | AMY ELLIS NUTT

[Incorrigible]

The only thing Robert Thompson knows for certain is that his patient died. Almost everything else about Ryan Donahoe's illness remains a mystery -- and a warning. Now, five months later, the Seattle physician still asks the same question.

How could a strong, athletic 19-year-old walk into a hospital emergency room complaining only of fever and lower back pain and seven days later end up dead?

[patton]

hmmmmmm........

[Ichneumon]

Ozone kills all bacteria, viruses, pathogens and fungi upon contact.

Well sure -- at high enough concentrations, in a test tube. But then so does hydrochloric acid.

Zero side effects.

Exsqueeze me? The same concentrations of ozone that "kill all bacteria, viruses, pathogens and fungi upon contact" will also cause damage to other kinds of living tissue, including in humans. That's why ozone is one of the pollutants tracked by most air pollution regulations.

Ozone is no "magic bullet". It's just a corrosive variant of oxygen, which will bleach and/or corrode just about anything it contacts. Yes, enough ozone will damage single-celled organisms including the ones that act as pathogens. It will also damage human tissue, as well as rubber, nylon, plastics, dyes, and paints.

That sounds like a lot more than "zero side effects" to me.

From http://www.airinfonow.org/html/ed_ozone.html:

Ozone Concentrations and Your Health

Two of the most important factors are the concentration of ozone and duration of exposure. Numerous epidemiological studies show the relationship between health effects and specific ozone ranges. EPA has gathered information about health effects through research, studies comparing health statistics and ozone levels in the communities, and controlled testing of human volunteers. 

The EPA has developed the Air Quality Index (AQI) for reporting the levels of ozone and other pollutants, and their effects on human health. The AQI scale has been divided in different categories, which range from 0 to 300. Each category corresponds to a different health impact (Table1). The NAAQS for ozone are 0.120 ppm averaged over 1 hour and 0.08 ppm averaged over 8 hours.

0.125 (1-h) TO 0.404 (8-h) ppm (VERY UNHEALTHY)

At ozone concentrations from 0.125 to 0.404 ppm, sensitive people experience severe respiratory symptoms and impaired breathing.

Recent studies of humans exposed to these ozone concentrations have shown pulmonary function impairment during heavy exercise (7). Another study, conducted in Mexico City, shows that exposures from 0.170 to 0.250 ppm 1-h, increase the occurrence of respiratory symptoms, such as cough, phlegm, difficulty in breathing, and reduce PEFRs among children with mild asthma (2). In addition, ozone exposure to 0.30 ppm 1-h induces lower airway inflammation. This is manifested by PMN influx measured by bronchoalveolar lavage (3). Also, at this concentration with continuous exercise, FEV1 decreases.

0.105 to 0.124 ppm (UNHEALTHY)

1 HOUR EXPOSURE. A study conducted in Atlanta indicated that when the maximum 1-h ozone level equaled or exceeded 0.110 ppm, the number of emergency visits to the hospital for asthma or reactive airway disease increased in children. During this exposure, many children and adults progressively developed substernal pain on deep inspiration, coughing, and reduction of vital capacity and FEV1 (1).

8 HOURS EXPOSURE. Reduction in lung function is observed with exposures of <0.12 ppm over 6-8 hours with moderate exercise, manifested by decrements in FEV1. (4,5).

0.085 TO 0.104 ppm (UNHEALTHY FOR SENSITIVE GROUPS)

1 HOUR EXPOSURE. Sensitive people, active children and adults, and people with respiratory disease under heavy outdoor exertion, may experience respiratory symptoms such as coughing or pain when taking a deep breath, and reduced lung function. Other studies have associated 0.100 ppm ozone concentrations with increased respiratory hospital admission in elderly (12).

8 HOUR EXPOSURE. In accordance with AQI, sensitive people, active children and adults, and people with respiratory disease under prolonged outdoor exertion, may experience respiratory symptoms such as coughing or pain when taking a deep breath, and reduced lung function, which can cause some breathing discomfort.

A series of studies conducted in the USA (1,3,6) demonstrated that with 0.09 ppm ozone, the number of hospital visits for asthma increased and people undergoing moderate exercise increased their sensitivity to ozone. Also, 0.100 ppm ozone induces neutrophilic influx into the airway and resulting inflammation, and a decrease in forced expiratory volume (FEV1) and PEFR in asthmatic people (children and adults).

0.065 to 0.84 ppm (MODERATE)

1 HOUR EXPOSURE. In this specific range, based on the AQI standards, ozone health effects are not expected. However, in a study of 154 children aged 10-12 years in Tennessee, 0.078 ppm of ozone was associated with decrements in FEV1 and FEF25-75 (5), and with 0.082 ppm an increase in asthma-related hospitals visits was observed.

8 HOURS EXPOSURE. Sensitive people may experience respiratory effects from prolonged exposure to ozone during outdoor exertion. In addition, other studies (1,6,8) have demonstrated that ozone concentrations at 0.080 ppm produce adverse effects on human health such as PEFR decrements in asthmatic children (6), decrements in FEV1 with intermittent exercise in healthy men (5,7), and increased hospital visits for asthma (1,8).

to 0.064 ppm (GOOD)

In accordance with NAAQS and AQI, at ozone levels from 0.0 to 0.64 no health effects are expected and the air quality is considered "GOOD". However, recent studies have demonstrated that at these concentrations ozone can exert adverse health effects.

1 HOUR EXPOSURE. A study conducted in Brisbane, Australia by Simpson et al. demonstrated an association between 0.030 ppm ozone and daily mortality in the elderly (11). In a study in Mexico, the relationship between ozone exposure in asthmatic children (5-13 years of age) and mild asthma was evaluated. Exposure to 0.050 ppm increased the occurrence of lower respiratory symptoms such as cough, phlegm and difficulty breathing, and reduced PEFRs. A different study suggests that 0.065 ppm ozone increases respiratory symptoms in asthmatic children. (5).

8 HOURS EXPOSURE. No information available.

24 HOURS EXPOSURE. Sartor and co-authors (1994) analyzed low levels of ozone and daily mortality in Belgium. This study demonstrated a relationship between 0.050 ppm ozone, high temperatures, and the number of daily deaths (9). An increase in elderly deaths with 0.034 ppm for 24-h was also observed (9, 11). Schwartz utilized Medicare records for the years 1986-1989 to study the association between ozone concentrations and respiratory admissions among elderly. In this study a significant relationship was observed between 0.050 ppm 24-h ozone concentration and hospital admission for pneumonia. (12).

Ironically, if you're trying to use ozone as a disinfectant:

Evidence also suggests ozone exposure lowers the body's defenses, increasing susceptibility to respiratory infections (24)(25).

Used routinely in Europe for over 50 years.

Actually, for almost 100 years (since 1906), but who's counting? It has been used in the US almost as long, although not as widely.

Illegal in America.

Horse manure! That's going to come as a big surprise to the folks in Fargo, North Dakota, who use ozone in their water treatment plant.

Or the Colorado-based H2O Engineering" which manufacturers and domestically sells various kinds of ozone-treatment machines for water and food treatment.

The California-based Dime Water company does likewise.

The world's largest water-treatment plant (600 million gallons a day) to use Ozone for disinfection is in Los Angeles, which the last time I checked was still in America.

Want to buy an air purifier for your home that uses Ozone to help clean the air? Visit Janesco, Inc., or any of countless other ozone-generating air purifiers that are perfectly legal.

The only federal regulations regarding ozone air purifiers is that the EPA recommends that settings should be selected (by the user) so that the ozone level is less than 0.05 ppm.

There are other regulations concerning how much residual ozone is left in water after treatment is finished, but that's hardly the same thing as it being "illegal".

Whatever source you got that twaddle from, please do not consider it a reliable source in the future.

Finally, while ozone is a pretty good disinfectant for materials and surfaces where the ozone can be applied in controlled situations (i.e., in the tubes of a water treatment plant), it is *not* suitable for topical use on the skin or body or for internal use -- thus it is hardly any kind of substitute for antibiotics, which unlike ozone are able to target microbes without causing similar damage to human tissue (as ozone does). For that matter, use ozone as a disinfectant long enough and microbes will develop resistance to *it* as well (like corrosion-resist spore coats, etc.)

It's a "profit" thing.

Actually, it's a "baseless conspiracy urban legend" thing...

[handk]

A quick search turned up the following 186 articles, papers, essays.

I guess they're all quacks, eh?

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Oxytherapy.com - OxyFile #032 - Chronological Ozone Medical References

OxyFile #32 This is the most complete set of English language Ozone Medical references available to date. It took Ed McCabe 7 years of ...
/users/outpouring/oxyfiles/OXY00032.HTM - 85 K - 22 Oct 100

Oxytherapy.com - OxyFile #345 - Ozone: Life-Threatening Pollutant or Powerful Healing Agent?

OxyFile #345 Ozone: Life-Threatening Pollutant or Powerful Healing Agent? Nathaniel Altman author of Oxygen Healing Therapies It's summer in New York City and the ...
/users/outpouring/oxyfiles/OXY00345.HTM - 27 K - 22 Oct 100

Oxytherapy.com - OxyFile #038 - Ed McCabe Rebuttal of Negative APLA Ozone Article

OxyFile #38 ED McCABE REBUTTAL OF NEGATIVE 2/94 APLA OZONE ARTICLE or WHAT'S THE REAL AGENDA, HELPING PEOPLE OR SOUNDING SMART? Copyright 1994 by ...
/users/outpouring/oxyfiles/OXY00038.HTM - 39 K - 25 Oct 100

Oxytherapy.com - OxyFile #034 - Ozone is not Smog - Ozone is Good and Natural

OxyFile #34 Adapted from Ed McCabe's "Oxygen Therapies" Copyright 1990 by Ed McCabe OZONE IS NOT SMOG OZONE IS GOOD AND NATURAL By Ed ...
/users/outpouring/oxyfiles/OXY00034.HTM - 25 K - 22 Oct 100

Oxy00038

OxyFile #38 ED McCABE REBUTTAL OF NEGATIVE 2/94 APLA OZONE ARTICLE                    or WHAT'S THE REAL AGENDA, HELPING PEOPLE OR SOUNDING SMART? Copyright 1994 ...
/users/outpouring/oxyfiles/Oxy00038.htm - 42 K - 27 Oct 100

Oxytherapy.com - OxyFile #128 - DOD Positive Ozone / HIV Results Ignored

OxyFile #128 Canadian Medical Research Mystery DOD Positive Ozone / HIV Results Ignored C. 1994-2000 by Ed McCabe, Investigative Reporter, and author of the ...
/users/outpouring/oxyfiles/Oxy00128.htm - 28 K - 27 Oct 100

Oxytherapy.com - OxyFile #128 - DOD Positive Ozone / HIV Results Ignored

OxyFile #128 Canadian Medical Research Mystery DOD Positive Ozone / HIV Results Ignored C. 1994-2000 by Ed McCabe,Investigative Reporter, and author of the bestseller ...
/users/outpouring/oxyfiles/OXY00128.HTM - 26 K - 25 Oct 100

/home/sites/site22/users/outpouring/web/wbjwarburg.htm

The following article appeared in Well Being Journal’s "Special Edition: Healing Cancer Naturally" national magazine on news stands for all of 2000 "Medical Ozone ...
/users/outpouring/wbjwarburg.htm - 27 K - 25 Oct 100

Oxytherapy.com - OxyFile #031 - Ozone Therapy: The Science Behind the Scandal

OxyFile #31 AIDS NEWS SERVICE Michael Howe, MSLS, Editor AIDS Information Center VA Medical Center, San Francisco (415) 221-4810 ext 3305 April 15, 1994 ...
/users/outpouring/oxyfiles/OXY00031.HTM - 24 K - 22 Oct 100

Oxytherapy.com - OxyFile #605 - Ask Mr. Oxygen by Ed McCabe - Column 6

OxyFile #605 ASK MR OXYGEN Questions about oxygen's use in the treatment of disease that were commonly put to Ed McCabe - the author ...
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[Ichneumon]

Ack -- for some reason the line "It's a profit thing" in my prior post was not italicized. Please note that was actually a quote from handk's post which I was responding to, not something I wrote myself in my post.

[RedWhiteBlue]

I've had experience with this problem through my husband. In 2000, he had a heart attack. I took him to the emergency room because he wasn't feeling well, and they hooked him up to an EKG that showed a heart that was working normally. Then it hit him, and the EKG chart went crazy. They could tell immediately from the EKG where the problem was, and they explained to him and me what was going on. The heart attack was considered a "mild" one, and they administered clot busters and opened the clogged artery before any damage was caused to the heart muscle.

Actually, the whole process was very interesting, and as his wife I felt the seriousness of the situation but it was not terribly frightening. I was able to stay by his side in the emergency room, and the doctor and emergency room personnel were very reassuring, and all in the space of 10 -15 minutes we saw a normal EKG go to abnormal and then back once again to OK. The next day, he had a heart catheterization and a stent implant, which fully opened up the clogged artery. Throughout the entire hospital stay, every blood test showed that he had no damage to his heart. He came home two days after the angioplasty.

What started the real drama came three days later. He had been fine that morning, but I came home from work to find him looking terrible and all washed out. I felt of his forehead and man was he burning up. Also, one the the sites where he had been given an IV was red and warm.

Even though he was supposed to see his cardiologist the next day for a follow-up appointment, I took him to the emergency room. This time I was scared. I was fully aware of what the fever might mean. To have it make it through the heart attack with flying colors and no heart damage, only to get heart damage or die from a bacteria. They took some blood samples in a couple of very interesting looking vials (I assume one was to grow and identify MSRA, and the other one was identical except it also contained vancomycin), and they performed a Doppler ultrasound on his arm to look for a clot.

His cardiologist was called, and he gave the order to give MrRedWhiteBlue some sort of antibiotic capsules and send him home. When the nurse told this to the attending physician in the ER, he went ballistic. I could hear him yelling "WHAT DO YOU MEAN DR X WANTS TO SEND HIM HOME! MR RWB JUST HAD ANGIOPLASTY LAST WEEK. WE CAN'T SEND HIM HOME. GET DR. X BACK ON THE PHONE RIGHT NOW." The attending physician was not going to accept the original request of the cardiologist.

They started IV antibiotics, but they didn't do anything. They transfered him to another hospital affiliated with a different hospital system due to lack of beds. (I've always wondered if they did this because they didn't want to show in their records that a patient returned to their facilities within a few days with MSRA). Hubby was almost delirious with a fever that Tylenol or aspirin wouldn't budge. I was really frightened at this point. He didn't understand what was going on, but I did. I would stay with him all day and come home at night and break down so that he would not know.

After 2 1/2 days, the results came back on the blood test that showed that sure enough he had MSRA in his bloodstream. His infectious diseases doctor called and told me the news, but said not to worry because it was treatable with vancomycin. When the article says that vancomycin is "liquid gold," that is exactly was it was in this case. Around 15 minutes after they started his first IV that morning, the fever was gone. It was his first bit of relief. The fever did come back gradually during the afternoon, which worried me a bit. On one hand, the first dose of antibiotics never gives a complete cure, but on the other hand I was worried that the vancomycin had only killed off the weaker bacteria and now what we were seeing was the stronger bacteria growing and taking their place. But the second IV that evening had results that were just as dramatic as the first, and after that second IV the fever was gone.

The next morning, a nurse from the office of the infectious disease specialist called and said "you are leaving the hospital today. There is nothing they can do for you there. You can do handle this yourself at home. I've arranged for you to check out now. Come to my office ASAP." She inserted a special IV into hubby's arm, and then she trained me how to hook him up to an IV and keep a sterile field. They supplied us with everything needed -- IV containers of vancomycin, syringes, heparin, saline solution, alcohol swabs, etc. This was a Friday, and he returned to work the next Monday. Every morning and every evening for the next two weeks, I hooked him up to a dose of vancomycin for about an hour.

I can't imagine what would have happened if I had not brought him to the emergency room that evening or if the attending physician hadn't stuck up for us when the cardiologist wanted to send us home with antibiotic capsules. If I had waited until the next day for the scheduled office visit with his cardiologist, it might have been several more days before he had the blood tests that he needed to identify the problem. By then, the whole thing would have been screwed up due to receiving ineffective antibiotic treatment and it would have been too late for vancomycin.

Since that time, I have known two people that died in a similar situation -- MSRA infections that took hold after a heart attack and angioplasty. I don't know if it is true, but I have read that when people get hospital induced staff infections, the #1 reason for the original hospital stay was angioplasty. Many people I work with had their own stories to tell of hospital induced infections in their relatives. It is not as uncommon as one might think. I just hope that we've had our share and we never have to deal with this again.

[dennisw]

We are prepared. I have a colloidal silver generator and a colloidal gold generator.

[Doe Eyes]

I agree. From now on our position should be whaaa, whaaa. I want my mommy.

[sick1]

There's hope from other angles. Check out what the Russian's have been up to. SICK1

[Old Professer]

Key points:

Today, more than 70 percent of infections acquired in a health- care setting are resistant to at least one antibiotic.

Hospitals, where patients with compromised immune systems offer an ideal breeding ground for germs, began to see infection rates soar. Today, more than 70 percent of infections acquired in a health- care setting are resistant to at least one antibiotic.

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, deaths from nosocomial, or hospital-acquired, infections jumped from 19,000 in 1992 to close to 70,000 last year

While the article implies that the problem is widespread, the very fact that the great majority of these drug-resistant cases occur and spread in a hospital environment argues for better hospital procedures where ordinary antiseptic measures are too often neglected.

Go to Tractor Supply and you can buy horse needles and Penicillin in bulk like farmers do; if the bacteria are so far ahead of the antibiotics, why isn't there a crisis in animal care, or better yet, why haven't we heard of it if there is?

The most bothersome part of this story is that it is put out by a layperson, not by a medical journal and it comes at a time when hospitals are under scrutiny for the great number of patients lost to simple sepsis.

Perhaps Americans overuse the system.

Science has no choice but to go on trying to kill these germs or to give up on the notion of curing patients.

[Ichneumon]

I guess they're all quacks, eh?

In a word? Yes.

And your links are broken.

But I kind of like this ozone therapy page, which talks seriously about the benefits of pumping ozone up your ass several times a day.

[Old Professer]

Bacteria, not viruses.

[Old Professer]

As harsh as it sounds, if a hospital has multiple cases of one type of infectious disease the only prudent thing to do is to mive them all in together to prevent the disease from spreading to the staff and general population.

[Mamzelle]

re: if the bacteria are so far ahead of the antibiotics, why isn't there a crisis in animal care, or better yet, why haven't we heard of it if there is?)))

With animals, practitioners are freer to use their judgement. Animals not only die with their germs, but are often euthenized. Notice what happened with the recent bovine infections in England. One excellent way to stem the spread of infection is to kill and burn the infected.

"What, no prescription? Don't you love me, doc? Do I have to call hospital admin to get my antibiotics, or shall I call my lawyer?"

Things are complicated with people--you can't just shoot them.

[Yaelle]

I have a colloidal silver generator

Be careful. I lived in a town once where there was this elegant woman going about with perfectly silver/grey skin. The color of an elephant. I marveled at her and asked over the years about how a person could get like that. She looked horrible, even though she attempted to appear as normal as possible.

Finally, one doctor friend said that she had probably ingested colloidal silver. A certain amount of it will turn you PERMANENTLY SILVER.

[Old Professer]

Your scenario doesn't fit the paradigm; disinfectants "kill" germs in a different manner than antibiotics; to me, having worked in one, hospital laundries are a much more suspect area.

If it were up to me, every single garment, sheet, blanket, towel, cloth and diaper would be sterilized with UV light before being returned to use.

[Old Professer]

Let's make http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/idlh/10028156.html a working link

[VOA]

While this is certainly a cause for concern, this article strikes me as unduly
alarmist, almost sensationalist. The medical community has been predicting this
biological disaster for a decade now, and it is not coming to pass any more
than the AIDS pandemic.

Having nearly lost a leg to such an infection (the doctors called it "flesh eating
bacteria, Jr."), I hope you are right.
Took two weeks of intravenous antibiotics to finally bring it to a halt.

There was an article posted here in the past year about a fisherman who died from
such an infection. The doctors (probably in full CYA mode) were saying they'd
never seen such a thing.
My guess from my experiences? They probably followed the "don't use antibiotics
unless you have to" mania and by the time they decided they were dealing with a nasty
bacterial infection...too late.

In my case, the MORON M.D. initially prescribed a steroid for what I realize now
any decent military medic would have recognized as a bacterial infection requiring antibiotics.
STAT!

[Old Professer]

Ethylene oxide is so unstable as to present a hazard in open use; it once was a policy to adulterate it with CFC 12 but that has become so restricted that only special exemptions allow its use.

[Old Professer]

Iodine is used as a detectant for ozone gas, it turns purple.

[aMorePerfectUnion]

Two things that may hold the key to effectively conquering these killer bacteria...

First, and available now...

NutriBiotic's Capsules Plus - which has demonstrated effectiveness against these types of pathogens and can be purchased inexpensively now.

Ultimately, MACROPHAGES!

While the west was wooed by pharmaceutical companies promoting antibiotics, the USSR continued research into macrophages, which are bacteria specific and attack and multiply themselves until the bacteria they target is wiped out. This Soviet research has come back to our country and is in testing against animal disease now. Do a google search.

The solution isn't more antibiotics. The solution will be in a different field and different approach.

Just my two cents from reading.

ampu

[Old Professer]

Dirty needles don't pick patients.

[Old Professer]

Mive should have been move, sorry, clumsy fingers.

[Old Professer]

Sure you can, but we aren't there yet.

[IronJack]

Gee, I'd love to hear an alternative cleaning protocol for using disenfectants in hospital. Since you know what is too much, care to share about what exactly is enough?

See any of the dozen posts above re ozone, UV radiation, or other options.

Gee, I'd love to hear why you're so defensive about this. It's pretty obvious that there's a problem here, and misuse of disinfectants may very well have contributed to it. You must have a dog in this fight or you wouldn't have overreacted so strongly.

[handk]

You conveniently miss the point. Several actually.

When I speak of ozone not being avaiable in America, it should have been clear that I was speaking "medically", not industrially. Same for my mention of Europe.

Secondly, there is such a thing as "medical ozone", which is produced from pure medical-grade oxygen.

And yes, I'm well aware that ozone is used worldwide, including America, to purify drinking water, to clean pools, to clean interior air, and so on. However, to the best of my knowledge, it cannot be used to treat disease in America, even though thousands of doctors in Europe have been using it for over 50 years.

I believe your position is basically one of "pay no attention to that man behind the curtain."

The fact is, a simple search at Google under "ozone therapy" will turn up a ton of information on the subject, both pro and con. However, if everyone took your "con" on the subject at face value, they'd never bother searching out the pro, and that's what you obviously want to occur.

[Stop Legal Plunder]

Bump for later reference...

[DannyTN]

I agree it's alarmist.

I don't think the bacteria are any worse than if we had never used antibiotics. It's just that we would have been dead sooner. So it's not like we are creating a nightmare.

I also object to the turn overuse of antibiotics. Seems to me that the problem is underuse of antibiotics. Not knocking infections completely out. Not quarantining individuals with compromised immune systems. Etc.

[dennisw]

That's a lot of guesswork there with no proof she overdosed on colloidal silver. What was the time frame since CS has only been real popular in the last ten years? A Libertarian party candidate last year was laughed at for taking colloidal silver way too much and turning his skin blue-gray. I have very good information that he made his CS incorrectly.  

I rarely make colloidal silver. I make colloidal gold and drink a glassful each day. It's 20 ppm which is a homeopathic dose. What I make is 75% as good as what these folks make --->  http://www.purestcolloids.com/mesogold.htm

 

[rmlew]

We need to lessen the FDA administrative process on anti-biotics and reduce liability for them.

[Dan from Michigan]

Scary as hell. I got Scarlet Fever twice as a kid.

[Judith Anne]

Thanks for the ping. Unfortunately the colloidal metals and the ozone folks have sort of muddied the water here. Other threads, other times.

[longtermmemmory]

Even in European countries such as Italy, Germany, Belgium, Greece and France, where prescriptions are required, pharmacies will dispense antibiotics without a doctor's permission.

*** *** *** **

That is a product of the socialized medicine system and a huge history of no doctors available. What are people who live the little villages supposed to do when there is no doctor and the needed pills are just sitting on the shelf "right there"? I am not excusing it, I am just giving a dose of reality to the circumstances that cause such looser interpritation of pharmacy rules.

[Lord_Baltar]

Wow, great senitments...

"Those who would be like to die, let them, and decrease the surplus population"

Pardon me Ebenezer, but would you strike such a cavalier position if it was someone you did care for caught up in some sort of epidemic?

[BlackVeil]

Who needs bio-warfare, when one can have socially induced effects like this?

Personally, I am very suspicious about the role of anti-biotics in pig and chicken farming. I find it quite dangerous.

[not-an-ostrich]

Yes we're all gone to die but I hate it when it's the children. I noticed this article never mentioned all of us mothers who requested/expected antibiotics for our children cause we couldn't take them to daycare if they were running a fever. The high percentage of mothers working so we could have the luxury and entitlement items bear a portion of the blame. So does the meat production businesses for pumping up the use of antibiotics.

[A CA Guy]

I said this, not what you said:

It's not a big deal, let's say half the world's population dies...so what?

First, we are all going to die.
Secondly, it makes more room for new people.

There have been things that have taken out large portions of populations historically, this is just another one.

The world (Minus some people) will go on.

[A CA Guy]

It isn't that those have used anti-biotics have killed themselves over non users, the issue was that it has been so sued on the population that viruses have grown immune to them and this will kill anyone at anytime.

On some level, this has happened to the population in different forms.

[Mamzelle]

The answer--steam and bleach. It's already done, cheaply and easily. As for dogs in the fight, I don't have any kind of financial stake in patents for expensive quackery. But steam and bleach work very well.

And it's easy to say that something is overused, but very hard to know what exactly is enough.

[Right Wing Professor]

A quick search turned up the following 186 articles, papers, essays. I guess they're all quacks, eh?

Ah, attempted proof by search engine. I can do that too.

I googled 'contrails' and got 37,800 hits. That means contrails are 200 times more legitimate than ozone. And since we all know contrails are the epitome of tin-foil helmet wackiness, what does that make ozone therapy?

[Right Wing Professor]

For example, Los Angeles treats it's water supply with ozone. I've seen video of huge glass tanks at the DWP with the words "Ozone Treatment Tank" imprinted on the tank.

You can treat water with ozone because it's so unstable, by the time it gets to the consumer, it's decomposed.

I refer you to Ichneumon's very detailed post. Ozone, like chlorine and chlorine dioxide, is a very strong oxidant that attacks all biological material. That means it can be safely used as a disinfectant only in circumstances where it will decompose before it encounters human tissue.

[Domestic Church]

"1. The actual reservoir of resistant bacteria is in the population (e.g., patients and visitors)"

You can easily find MRSA on the football fields.

[Cate]

Here's my observation on all of this. We (the American public) are paying the price for all the research and development for all the needed new medications to fight these bugs. Other countries receive our drugs at a reduced rate and again, we pay for all the trials and errors. I am thinking that other countries (like CANADA AND MEXICO) should have to pay at least 5 times the amount I do for any medication. It may seem harsh, but we should be able to take care of us first, and the rest of the world second. Just my opinion of course :)

[NightWriter]

"It's not a big deal, let's say half the world's population dies...so what?"

It'll be a big deal to you, I'll wager, if you're in the wrong half.

[boris]

"Iodine is used as a detectant for ozone gas, it turns purple."

Isn't iodine already purple?

--Boris

[Lord_Baltar]

Actually CA, the quote I posted for you, appropriatly for this time of year, in case you didn't know, was from Christmas Carol.

I'm not disagreeing with your premise, as much as I am the cavalier view of such a concept.

So, I ask you a simple question. Since it's your view that "It's not a big deal, let's say half the world's population dies...so what?"

Would you view it as a "so what" change if it was you, or those you love fall into the "surplus" column in that half that were going to shirk their mortal coils?

As to the "so what" sentiment, let's look at it. There are 6 Billion (or some such) people on this festering rock. Your view that if half of those were to suddenly die wouldn't be such a big deal strikes me as interesting. 3 Billion people. These bugs don't really care what flag their target supports and defends, so chances are good if such an event were to befall us, it wouldn't be relegated to 3rd world countries, or places that aren't on the Club Med catalog.

I suppose one could say such an event could improve economic situations for a great many industries. Casket manufactuerers, Grave Diggers, Mortuaries, Florists.

Traffic congestion might ease up just a tad.

Although, I hope your 401k isn't too dependant on Life Insurance Companies...

Sorry CA, while I understand the root of your premise, I can't share your dismissive appraisal of the end result.

[A CA Guy]

You are dying this very moment in the course of living your life.
All I can say is we better be ALL right with God since none of us are here long and we have nothing to say about whether a thing like this hits you or I first, last or never.
For heavens sake, we could get ran over by a rogue school bus full of Nuns...

This life is the test for the direction of your after-life... ENJOY!

[3Lean]

However, I would imagine that the pain of having your leg severely burned by the pure ozone in the bag would make you forget about that little wound that wouldn't heal...

[3Lean]

"You can easily find MRSA on the football fields."

Whenever I read a story about athletes (football, baseball, anything where cuts/bruises are likely) who participated in the days before anti-biotics it always amazes me that there were people who were willing to risk an agonizing death by infection just to play a sport. Nearly all of them had to have relatives or friends who had died from the proverbial "blood poisoning" after a trivial injury. I don't know if they were insane or just felt that when your time was up, it was up...
Being raised in a much safer era I don't believe my mindset (or my Mom) would have allowed me to take part in all the sports I did.

[Citizen of the Savage Nation]

May be some good info here, but it would come across a whole lot better if it wasn't such an obvious Scare Piece.

[Pirod]

Yes we're all going to die eventually... Try having your friend die from this "population control". Would you be able to tell his family his death was in the benefit of us all? I didn't even get to say goodbye...