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Conservative Leader calls Dean Dean Too 'Mentally Unstable' to Be President
Talon News ^ | January 1, 2004 | Jimmy Moore

Posted on 01/01/2004 9:19:32 AM PST by nwrep

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1 posted on 01/01/2004 9:19:32 AM PST by nwrep
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To: *Clash of Civilizatio; *Christian list; *Christian_list; *Election President; Jim Robinson; ...
PING
2 posted on 01/01/2004 9:21:38 AM PST by nwrep
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To: nwrep
Damn,,they need to keep a low profile till he gets the nom. And this strategy is not a good one,,we need to let Dean self-immolate, and he will.
3 posted on 01/01/2004 9:22:03 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: nwrep
bttt
4 posted on 01/01/2004 9:22:22 AM PST by lainde (Heads up...We're coming and we've got tongue blades!!)
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To: nwrep
You know, this over-the-top rhetoric from our side doen't help. While I privately wonder about Dean, it is easier to say he is "tempermentally unsuited" to be president. That allegation is easier to prove and doesn't make us sound like wild-eyed fanatics.
5 posted on 01/01/2004 9:22:56 AM PST by Miss Marple
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To: nwrep
As for Dean's children, Murray said, "it gets worse." "The Deans told their children to pick a religion, any religion, and that they would not get involved in their decision one way or the other," Murray lamented. The two children subsequently chose to become Jewish.

Jewish? How terrible! </ sarc>

6 posted on 01/01/2004 9:24:31 AM PST by Mr. Mojo
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To: nwrep
They'll probably attack this guy and his group for being "Dean haters" (while of course in their minds it is noble to hate Bush)
7 posted on 01/01/2004 9:29:07 AM PST by Cubs Fan
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To: Miss Marple
"You know, this over-the-top rhetoric from our side doen't help. While I privately wonder about Dean, it is easier to say he is "tempermentally unsuited" to be president. That allegation is easier to prove and doesn't make us sound like wild-eyed fanatics."

Over the top rhetoric?

Do you have any idea how foolish you sound?

I didn't think so.

8 posted on 01/01/2004 9:30:07 AM PST by G.Mason ( Oh Hillary? ....... GWB is waiting.)
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To: nwrep
Hey, I thought I just saw Dean in an old ep of Twilight Zone! (on Sci Fi's New Years Day marathon)
9 posted on 01/01/2004 9:30:31 AM PST by Ciexyz
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To: cajungirl
"Damn,,they need to keep a low profile till he gets the nom. And this strategy is not a good one,,we need to let Dean self-immolate, and he will."

You're right, and I'm concerned about that as well. However, it seems that his primary-voting base becomes even more rabidly pro-Dean with each of the anti-Dean messages. So, it's a tough call.

I view it this way: his base is not so much pro-Dean as it is anti-Bush. They HATE Bush. Therefore, any anti-Dean message is received by his supporters as pro-Bush, which reminds them of how much they hate Bush, which reinforces their support for Dean.

Or, maybe I'm wrong.
10 posted on 01/01/2004 9:30:59 AM PST by Buck W.
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To: Miss Marple
"While I privately wonder about Dean, it is easier to say he is 'tempermentally unsuited' to be president. That allegation is easier to prove and doesn't make us sound like wild-eyed fanatics."

Why does stating the obvious "make us sound like wild-eyed fanatics"??

Isn't it a fact of the matter the majority of this year's Democratic Party candidates for President can be considered certifiable loons?

I submit the following mental patients: Dean, Kucinich, Sharpton, and Kerry.

11 posted on 01/01/2004 9:31:42 AM PST by F16Fighter
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Comment #12 Removed by Moderator

To: Miss Marple
Prudent rhetoric? How uh...uh...uh...conservative of you.
13 posted on 01/01/2004 9:32:59 AM PST by KC Burke
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To: G.Mason; Miss Marple
Whoa Bubba! I agree with her. Our rhetoric is important.
14 posted on 01/01/2004 9:34:07 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: nwrep
One of my best friends growing up was Unitarian. The Mom was Jewish and the Dad was Catholic, so it was a compromise. Guess it was more socially acceptable for the kids, because the Unitarian Church was still considered a "church".
15 posted on 01/01/2004 9:37:47 AM PST by Ciexyz
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To: KC Burke
I think we really need to discuss this without flaming each other. I agree with the article. But to publicly start calling a man crazy, and that is what he does, is low and doesn't bring the issue up to the level of discourse. It is better to be smart than right in this instance in my opinion. I absolutely think Miss Marple has the key. We need to get a President reelected and we need to be smart about it. Polarizing talk, about Jews, Unitarians, gays, etc is not going to get the large middle moderate section of voters on our side. Heck, it won't get alot of freepers on our side. The author's bring up of cheneys lesbian daughter was over the top in my mind.
16 posted on 01/01/2004 9:37:49 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: Miss Marple
I think no matter what we do, Dean will stumble and fail to get the nomination.

Better plan for Clark.

17 posted on 01/01/2004 9:39:56 AM PST by eddie willers
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To: F16Fighter; G.Mason
While I privately agree that Dean and some of the rest (certainly Kucinich) are nutty as fruitcakes, how one presents the message to the public is very important.

To the average voter, this writer is saying that a medical doctor, former governor of Vermont, and a presidential candidate is clinically insane.

First of all, he is not insane. He is hot-tempered, arrogant, a liar, and willing to ditch any previously held position in order to get the nomination. None of these characterists, nor all of them together, make him insane. It makes him tempermentally unsuited for the office.

Secondly, accusations such as this one sound so ridiculous to the general public that they begin to ignore anything substantive coming from our side. Please remember how the conservatives worries about Clinton's contacts with China were ignored by the public who had come to believe that everything Clinton did was being attacked by the right.

This type of diatribe is counterproductive.

18 posted on 01/01/2004 9:41:47 AM PST by Miss Marple
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To: nwrep
Howard Dean is God's gift to George Bush in 2004.
19 posted on 01/01/2004 9:44:17 AM PST by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: nwrep
In title, Dean Dean, is that sort of like a date date? Not really a date, not really a dean?
20 posted on 01/01/2004 9:44:35 AM PST by bwteim (Begin With The End In Mind)
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To: eddie willers
Clark is even LESS tempermentally suited for the presidency.

I submit "Help, Mary!" as Exhibit A.

In addition, he has no loyalty to anyone but himself, is also a liar, and has an inflated sense of his intellect and leadership skills.

I also privately think he is another nutso, but we will need to focus on sounding reasonable in our objections.

21 posted on 01/01/2004 9:45:14 AM PST by Miss Marple
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To: cajungirl
Flame? You must be confusing me with someone else. I am the epitome of decorum.

I was teasing Marple, who is familiar with my stance on the shortcomings of internet discourse.

What you say is exactly my point. We don't need to be circumspect, but Prudence is the chief conservative virtue according to Edmund Burke.

Some of our exchanges on a conservative site are reasonably passionate -- that's okay if within lawful bounds.

22 posted on 01/01/2004 9:55:24 AM PST by KC Burke
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To: Miss Marple
>>>He is hot-tempered, arrogant, a liar, and willing to ditch any previously held position in order to get the nomination.

I think being hot tempered, arrogant and an outright liar makes Howie Dean emotionally unstable and emotionally unstable individuals aren't fit to be elected POTUS.

23 posted on 01/01/2004 9:59:30 AM PST by Reagan Man (The few, the proud, the conservatives.)
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To: Miss Marple
To the average voter, this writer is saying that a medical doctor, former governor of Vermont, and a presidential candidate is clinically insane.

This is nothing different than what is being said in every back room and party in the country, including in democrat circles. We are all looking at him and shaking our heads in wonder that he got this far. Every party needs one or two people who are not elected (thus if they go to far in what they are saying can be denounced by the party) to be able to throw out what is really being said behind closed doors, basically be the bulldogs of the party.

This does not hurt us in any way, but does let those who are willing to listen understand some real concerns being thrown around.

24 posted on 01/01/2004 10:00:07 AM PST by Lady Heron
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To: eddie willers
> Dean will stumble and fail to get the nomination.

... on the first vote. What Billary wants is for the nom
to be up in the air, so that they can control the conv
and dictate who the candidate will be. Billary will do
whatever it takes to prevent Dean from having it sewn up
by convention day.

They might even encourage loose-cannon conservatives to
attack Dean.
25 posted on 01/01/2004 10:00:21 AM PST by Boundless
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To: Miss Marple
His talk and manner speak for themselves. Some of the pictures of him on the campaign trail are so expressive that without a caption, and without comment, the general population will ask themselves the right questions on temperament and character without prompting.
26 posted on 01/01/2004 10:04:13 AM PST by KC Burke
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To: Miss Marple
THis isn't over-the-top rhetoric, it's something that needs to be said. We've played the nice guy too long and it's left the Dems unchecked to allow the likes of Dean, Daschle, and *shudder* Hillary to take control of the party. The first step in getting people to realize it is saying it.
27 posted on 01/01/2004 10:05:11 AM PST by Sofa King (-I am Sofa King- tired of liberal BS! http://www.angelfire.com/art2/sofaking/index.html)
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To: Miss Marple
you know, this over-the-top rhetoric from our side doen't help

Actually, I hink it is very effective when we use their tools against them. This is the type of thing they do all the time, very sucessfully I might add.

I also think it's great that we are turning the label of intolerance right back at them. Soon, they will be known as the intolerant ones. A label that Republican's had to wear for quite some time.

Only problem with this is that it comes from the "religious right". And as a former northeasterner I know that is a very effective phrase to scare most folks into not listening to anything you have to say.

28 posted on 01/01/2004 10:05:17 AM PST by riri
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To: nwrep
"Perhaps Howard Dean would have been better off in a Unitarian Church, but then he would have had trouble winning any elections as a member of a near atheistic institution."

Wasn't Nixon Unitarian?

29 posted on 01/01/2004 10:06:50 AM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: Reagan Man
But we cannot say "insane". That doesn't quite describe it in terms that the public can think about. We all know people like Dean and we don't call them insane. Temperamentally unsuitable is a better term. And for the record, Dean is not insane nor are the rest of them. They all have personality disorders which is not insanity per se.
30 posted on 01/01/2004 10:07:37 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: KC Burke
Thanks,,I didn't mean to flame you. And I have found the ideal term for Dean as I have been thinking. He is NOT CENTERED,,that implies he has something wrong, waffles and appeals to the women of the world who know "not centered" means just a smidgen short of nutso.
31 posted on 01/01/2004 10:09:16 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: nwrep
Thanks for the PING.
Unfortunately Dems have shown they will support candidates no matter what they say or how mentally unstable they are.

Remember all the absurd and outlandish stories Gore used to make up? He was a proven chronic liar and he almost won the Presidency. Scarey!

32 posted on 01/01/2004 10:10:52 AM PST by Jorge
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To: Lancey Howard
Quaker,,Nixon was.
33 posted on 01/01/2004 10:11:05 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: nwrep
Mentally unstable? That's politics. If changing in mid-stream is unstable - then what was Clinton?
34 posted on 01/01/2004 10:11:41 AM PST by The Raven
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To: The Raven
If changing in mid-stream is unstable - then what was Clinton?

Impeached.

35 posted on 01/01/2004 10:13:53 AM PST by KC Burke
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To: riri
You know the point where al gore lost the election, when it became obvious he was unhinged? we all knew it, some said it and it did not resonate. It was the moment in the debate when he walked over to Bush in this intimidating strange way and Bush just looked at him. Bush didn't say "you looney tune, get outa my space", he just looked and the look spoke volumes. Dukaikis displayed his nuttiness with the question about Kitty. Kennedy displalyed his empty suit with Roger Mudd's famous interview. Dean will be outed but better not by us untill we have to, and not at this stage.
36 posted on 01/01/2004 10:14:16 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: Jorge
You make my point, no matter what we said, he was going to win until he outed himself at the debate. Crazy people have a way of letting one know they are crazy without us having to prove it. And by trying to, we look small.
37 posted on 01/01/2004 10:16:23 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: nwrep
"It says something about our nation that a great political party consisting of millions of Americans could possibly pick someone as mentally unstable as Howard Dean to lead their party...

First of all, the Democrat Party is not a great party. Not any longer. Once upon a time, there were elements of greatness--facing down threats, cutting taxes, protecting innocent life--but now? Give me a break. The elevation of Dean is the inevitable evolution of the Democrats.

Secondly, this is nothing new. Look at the individuals nominated by that Party since 1972--George McGovern, Jimmy Carter, Walter Mondale, Mike Dukakis, Bill Clinton, and Al Gore. Not a worthy man among 'em--the fact that two--count 'em two were able to slip enough lies past the electorate to hold the reins of power is incredible, yes--but not at all unusual for the Democrats.

Finally, Dean's ascendancy should be greeted as good news by Republicans. Fooled by the facade of Clinton's "success", liberals now apparently believe they can fool most (or a plurality) of the people most of the time. They cannot. They'll fail miserably, and though liberalism won't die completely (we have to remember that lesson from '94) it could be sent into deep hybernation--at least politically.

38 posted on 01/01/2004 10:20:08 AM PST by Recovering_Democrat (I'm so glad to no longer be associated with the Party of Dependence on Government!)
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To: cajungirl
The author's bring up of cheneys lesbian daughter was over the top in my mind.

That line was where I wondered if the whole article was some kind of 'reverse-psychology' operation. You know, when somebody brings something up that most people have completely forgotten about (like me for example)? And then blows it up into a reason that a man like Cheney gets dumped for Chuckie after a weird chain of events....? Well anyways, I'm not sure that I trust the author.

39 posted on 01/01/2004 10:20:30 AM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: Mr. Mojo
As for Dean's children, Murray said, "it gets worse." "The Deans told their children to pick a religion, any religion, and that they would not get involved in their decision one way or the other," Murray lamented.

The two children subsequently chose to become Jewish.

Jewish? How terrible! </ sarc>

No kidding! What would Mr. Murray have said if they became Moslems?

40 posted on 01/01/2004 10:21:45 AM PST by muleskinner ("Oh, please")
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To: cajungirl
I respectfully disagree. Labeling Howie Dean insane is over the top for sure, but calling him "temperamentally unsuitable" is too PC for me. After careful analysis and evaluation of recent public remarks made by Dean, in my book he definitely comes across as a highly emotional and irrational person.

"-US no safer w/Saddam in custody"
-"Bush knew about 9-11 beforehand"
-"most dangerous admin in his lifetime"
-"Bin Laden shouldn't be pre-judged"

These aren't just statements by an over the top and desperate candidate. They are remarks by an irrational person.

Dean is far too unstable to be my president. I prefer the more conservative minded, rational, controlled and sensible leaders like Ronald Reagan and GWBush to lead America.

41 posted on 01/01/2004 10:23:01 AM PST by Reagan Man (The few, the proud, the conservatives.)
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To: Miss Marple
To the average voter, this writer is saying that a medical doctor, former governor of Vermont, and a presidential candidate is clinically insane.

In a close reading of this article. I don't see where Murray is saying Dean is "clinically insane." Where did you find that?

I see where Moore writes that Murray is "alluding to possible schizophrenia," but I don't see where Murray actually makes that accusation. There's a ton of difference between being mentally unstable and being clonically insane. Don't you agree?

BTW, Murray's reference to single-mindedness is a Biblical reference, not a psychological one. (James 1:8, "A double minded man [is] unstable in all his ways.")

42 posted on 01/01/2004 10:23:18 AM PST by savedbygrace
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To: Reagan Man
I agree with what you say, now how to we get the message out and when? That is the question to me. Privately we can all agree he is a major grandiose whack job but to get it out in a form that makes people agree is the issue.
43 posted on 01/01/2004 10:25:17 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: nwrep
Dean is a complete nut job. This is of course obvious to everyone but liberal nut jobs. Bush is a shoe in, unless he blows it over amnesty. But if that is the case you can be sure the communist media will run all kinds of reasons for his defeat other than "It's the illegals stupid".
44 posted on 01/01/2004 10:28:05 AM PST by MissAmericanPie
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To: Lancey Howard
To bring up Jews, Cheney's daughter is the kind of thing that makes me wonder also,,is this article supposed to help us or hurt us. I am not dissing fundamentalists but that is the part of the conservative movement that mosts mobilizes up the left and the center part of the population. Plus Bush is getting Jewish supporters now. I keep thinking of Reagan's big tent, we need to keep it big.
45 posted on 01/01/2004 10:29:51 AM PST by cajungirl (I adore the Brits!! Tony Blair is my hero!!)
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To: cajungirl
>>>... how to we get the message out and when?

For some, following PresBush`s low key lead will get the job done. Some of us will have to ratchet up the rhetoric to get the attention of the independent voters. Others, like Jimmy Moore, will go over the top to make their point.

I think its fair to say, short of getting down in the gutter and using trash talk as a first option, nothing is really out of bounds. Repeating the same anti-Dean slogans over and over, will also work to get the messge out. OTOH, for about 1/3RD of the electorate who consider themselves hardcore liberals and/or anti-Bush haters, nothing will work.

46 posted on 01/01/2004 10:33:54 AM PST by Reagan Man (The few, the proud, the conservatives.)
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Comment #47 Removed by Moderator

Comment #48 Removed by Moderator

To: cajungirl
It was the moment in the debate when he walked over to Bush in this intimidating strange way and Bush just looked at him.

This is one thing I do love about Bush - he just totally ignores the nutcases, he doesn't even attempt to reason with them nor does he hardly acknowledge that they even exist. He just quietly and steadily goes about his job and allows them to walk off the cliff themselves.

az

49 posted on 01/01/2004 10:38:57 AM PST by Arizona
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To: G.Mason; Miss Marple
"You know, this over-the-top rhetoric from our side doesn't help. While I privately wonder about Dean, it is easier to say he is "temperamentally unsuited" to be president. That allegation is easier to prove and doesn't make us sound like wild-eyed fanatics."

Over the top rhetoric?

Yes, it is over the top rhetoric. You are as ignorant of what it takes to win an election as Howard Dean. Elections are won by getting more than half the centrist voters. And what was posted above is as over the top to the centrist voters as is the left calling Bush a gun toting international law breaking cowboy.

Saying what the base wants to hear in an election makes as much sense as Dean saying what the left wants to hear. You both do the same thing to opposite sides of the political spectrum.

I am sure that if Miss Marple ever wants to know how to lose and election by epic proportions, she will call on you... you are undoubtedly a great expert on how to get whipped at the polls by an inferior candidate.

If you are a typical Mason then Dixon must have drawn that line.


50 posted on 01/01/2004 10:40:19 AM PST by Common Tator (I support Billybob. www.ArmorforCongress.com)
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