Contact Tom Tancredo (R-Co), Chirman of the House Immigration Reform Caucus

Contact Congressman Tancredo ^ | 1.7.04 | Remember_Salamis

[lentulusgracchus]

Put INS to work doing their job catching and fining employers TO THE MAXIMUM UNDER CURRENT LAW and the fines will more than cover the cost.

Prison time. And no namby-pamby, like Andy and Leah Fastow are getting.

That's what it'll take. And an active plan to ensnare and sting wannabe bribe-givers.

[lentulusgracchus]

Thank you for undermining your own argument and support mine.

Please explain how his argument that guest-worker programs feed illegal immigration is self-undermining.

The Bush plan deals with this reality.

Please support your statement.

[lentulusgracchus]

I see where my congresscritter, Dr. Michael Burgess, is a member of the caucus.

I don't have a congresscritter. My district is "represented" by Sheila Jackson-Lee.

Ugh.

[Stallone]

He is saying that if Germany, a much smaller country, can't protect its borders, how can America?

Exactly.

Without the co-operation and support of everyday Americans, without them buying into the plan, it will be impossible.

The reality is that there is a pressing demand for the labour of these aliens, and it is relentless. It has been condoned out of some necessity for years and years, long before Bush inherited the mess.

By creating a new legal channel, that of temporary work, Bush will ensure there is NO EXCUSE for not legally registering the presence of any alien. NONE.

He will have political cover to BEAR HARD on the remainder and secure the homeland.

And will preempt the creation of future illegal aliens by providing the opportunity to apply to this legal channel from abroad.

End of story.

[Stallone]

Is there anyone here willing to discuss the plan in non-emotional terms?

If so, please try to answer these simple questions:

1. If not this plan, what? The status quo, on-going for decades, obviously isn't working. What do you suggest?

2. If you want a McNader round-up and deportation, explain how it will not be political suicide. Some of these aliens and their families are 'Elians', winning the sympathy of even many on the Right. Some of them are far better than the 'Rat scumbags who call themselves Americans.

3. Similar to illegal music downloads, do you support the RIAA approach of legal prosecution, or the Apple approach of market reality, to meet the demand?

4. Americans, and American companies, sustain them and employee them. Why?

5. By creating a legal channel to APPLY to, how does this equate to amnesty?

6. How would you suggest preventing illegal aliens from entering the country in the future?

7. Why do illegal aliens come to America?

[hedgetrimmer]

In order to secure our borders, we must get out of the Organization of American States, (OAS), get out of the Summit of the Americas, get out of NAFTA and never never never ratify the FTAA. These supranational organizations and rules are behind the lack of border security and the inexplicable (with respect to our national sovereignty) behavior of the president on immigration so called reform.

Then we can concentrate on making Congress do their job, enforce the laws already on the books.

[hedgetrimmer]

Common sense says if you do not hold your elected politicians to their Constitutional duties, then you will get tyranny by and by.

This proposal is a tyranny of the executive office. It completely ignores the will of the people and the Constitutional duty of the president to maintain the borders and follow the rule of law.

No emotions in this post, just plain common sense.

I hope you see the foolishness in policy this policy in time.

[Stallone]

Illegal aliens for years were the moral equivalent to Americans of music downloads, satellite signal interception, software copying, and tax cheating.

In the latter case, if tax rates are kept reasonable (i.e. low and fair), most people would not only be happy to comply, but would support cracking down hard on the cheats.

Similarly, if the market demand for entry-level labourers is met with a simple application channel, most aliens and their enablers will not only comply, but support cracking down hard on the cheats.

Our homeland is at risk in this age of terrorism. The time to respond has long past.

By creating a legal and simple means to apply for worker status, Bush has scored a political coup.

He can concentrate fully on those who would harm America.

[lentulusgracchus]

End of story.

Well, not exactly.

He is saying that if Germany, a much smaller country, can't protect its borders, how can America?

Sorry, I understood him to be saying that, registration or no registration, guest-worker program or no guest-worker program, the Turks returned illegally nevertheless, proving that registration schemes don't do much to insure compliance or to exclude illegals.

The reality is that there is a pressing demand for the labour of these aliens, and it is relentless. It has been condoned out of some necessity for years and years, long before Bush inherited the mess.

True insofar as your statement goes, but so to say doesn't show a reason why we should grant the lawbreakers tenure or condone their lawbreaking.

By creating a new legal channel, that of temporary work, Bush will ensure there is NO EXCUSE for not legally registering the presence of any alien. NONE. He will have political cover to BEAR HARD on the remainder and secure the homeland.

I think you misperceive the political dynamic here. The thrust is coming from employers who are annoyed that their undeserved profits from underpaying the help should be disturbed by INS raids like those last month. They have sent their towel-boy-in-chief, the President of the United States, to Congress to grant them the relief that they, in their arrogance, believe they deserve.

This is about wage-breaking, period. The President is acting at the behest of those to whom he is beholden, to use his power to help them break wages, by admitting Malthusian masses to the United States, swamping the labor market with desperate people who'll work for peanuts.

And will preempt the creation of future illegal aliens by providing the opportunity to apply to this legal channel from abroad. End of story.

[lentulusgracchus]

Erratum: Please ignore the last two lines of my last post. Editing error.

[Stallone]

The Right are obsessed with the idea that we are a nation of laws, and that Bush is giving the aliens a pass.

What he is saying is quite different.

He is saying that if you apply to the new temporary worker channel and you qualify, you will be given status as a temporary worker. He also says you can apply from another country.

HERE'S THE POINT:

There is no 'reward' for those who chose to break the law to come here in the decades before Bush was elected.

They are not treated any better than those who apply from other countries.

And those that do not qualify will be deported with the political cover to make it happen. Those that do will be allowed to be temporary workers, just like those who apply from other countries.

Bush is saying it is not REALITY to deport everyone first and then decide who can come back. He is saying he is helping the best to move from illegal status to legal status if and only if they qualify.

If this distinction and finesse is lost on Freepers, it is because it is not understood.

Most here are far smarter than their 'Rat enemy who want to make all aliens automatic citizens.

[lentulusgracchus]

Similarly, if the market demand for entry-level labourers is met with a simple application channel, most aliens and their enablers will not only comply, .....

There is no wage low enough, that employers won't try to find someone who'll work for a lower one, and minimum-wage laws be damned.

Furthermore, their objective isn't just to procure day labor or even skilled labor: it's to undermine wages all the way through the workforce.........stopping, of course, at the door to the executive suite.

[lentulusgracchus]

There is no 'reward' for those who chose to break the law to come here in the decades before Bush was elected.....He is saying he is helping the best to move from illegal status to legal status if and only if they qualify.

That is the reward. You just contradicted yourself.

[4.1O dana super trac pak]

BTTT

[FUMETTI]

Good point....you make a compelling point because I forgeot all about the fines incurred for breaking the law. Walt Mart can pay through the nose.

I also think that It is not "nativist" to secure the boarder. Yesterday on FOX that squinty eyed loser Morte Kondracke (am I the only one on FR that wants to deck that four-eyed jerk?) said it was "nativist" to want the "Mexicans out." Give me a bat, I am going after Kondracke. I am shocked Fred Barnes did not want to strangle that little wimpy geek.

[FUMETTI]

Karl Rove is evil. Not only does his interests only center on gaining and keeping power, he will do so at the mercy of American culture and traditions. I am sure it is Rover who wants Bush to downplay great Americans like Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt (GW Bush I noticed, of all the presidents I have watched, he invokes the names of his predessors the least (but please lionize ML King like he is the only American hero!).

That twerp Rove may have even been behind that leak re: the CIA agent. Bush needs to dropkick that bastard out of his inner circle.

[FUMETTI]

Police doing background checks can find out if anyone is illegal. That is, if they are allowed to!!!

[FUMETTI]

If I knew someone was in my realm and was an alien you bet your bottom dolllar I would report the SOB...that is, if the police are allowed to arrest him or her.

[FUMETTI]

If I knew someone was in my realm and was an alien you bet your bottom dolllar I would report the SOB...that is, if the police are allowed to arrest him or her.

[FUMETTI]

Karl Rove is shaping the NEW GOP and he needs to be cleansed from the leadership. He is a real bastard and needs to be censured by fellow Republicans.