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The Bush Proposal (Interesting article by Linda Chavez on the Immigration Proposal)
Town Hall ^ | Jan 8, 2004 | Linda Chavez

Posted on 01/08/2004 8:03:21 AM PST by PhiKapMom

The Bush proposal

Linda Chavez

January 8, 2004

President Bush announced a sweeping new immigration reform proposal this week that could become a hot-button issue in the November election. For months, insiders have hinted that the president would propose a new guest worker program aimed at allowing more foreign workers into the country on a temporary basis. Widely favored by the American business community, a guest worker program would allow employers to fill jobs in industries that routinely experience shortages of workers willing to do the often difficult, dangerous jobs Americans shun -- at least at wages that allow employers to remain in business.

But the guest worker provisions won't be the most controversial part of the administration's new proposal. Although some groups that want to limit immigration altogether -- such as the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) -- oppose guest worker plans, even such staunch restrictionists as Rep. Tom Tancredo (R-CO) are on record supporting the idea of guest workers. The real battle will be over what to do with those millions of illegal aliens who are already here.

Some 8-12 million illegal aliens reside in the United States now -- up three- or four-fold from a decade ago. An estimated 60 percent of these are from Mexico alone, and it is no accident that the Bush plan was announced in anticipation of the president's meeting with his Mexican counterpart, President Vicente Fox, next week. The White House announced less than a week before the Fox meeting that millions of illegal aliens from Mexico and elsewhere will be allowed, over time, to earn legal status in the U.S., so long as they have been working continuously, paid taxes and not broken other laws. The plan will impose some penalties on these workers -- most likely fines similar to those proposed in legislation sponsored by Republican Representatives Jeff Flake and Jim Kolbe and Senator John McCain, all from Arizona.

These proposals may not offer perfect justice -- who can blame those who resent rewarding "line jumpers" with legal status while millions of other would-be immigrants wait patiently to enter the country legally. But "earned legalization" is probably the best solution to a largely intractable problem. There is no way that the United States can find and deport 8-12 million illegal aliens in this country, and even if we could, we would do more harm than good.

The American economy depends on these workers, who, along with legal immigrants, contributed significantly to the economic boon of the 1990s. If FAIR could wave a magic wand and make these illegal aliens disappear overnight, the rest of us would suffer by having to pay more for everything from the food we put on the table to the houses in which we live. Our office buildings wouldn't get cleaned, our crops wouldn't get picked, our meat wouldn't get processed, nor our tables cleaned when we go out to eat.

Sure, we could double wages to attract American-born workers to some of these jobs, but at even twice the salary it would be difficult to fill the nastiest of these tasks, like processing poultry. But why would we want American workers, who we've spent trillions of dollars educating for 13 or 14 years, on average, to perform jobs that require only the most minimal skills? Even if we got rid of all illegal aliens in the U.S., these jobs would likely go to foreign workers, like it or not.

What sense does it make to insist that we get rid of the very people doing these jobs now in order to make way for other foreign workers to take them under a new guest worker plan? It makes a lot more sense to figure out how to get those illegal aliens already employed at these jobs to come in from the shadows and become part of the legal system. They should pay a penalty for having broken the law in the first place by sneaking into the country or overstaying their visas, but it is better for all of us if they earn their way toward legal status than remain in the illegal netherworld where they now hide.

Linda Chavez is President of the Center for Equal Opportunity, a Townhall.com member organization.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aliens; amnesty; bushishillary; bushisliberal; buyingvotes; commonsense; culturewar; illegalaliens; illegalmexicans; illegals; immigrantlist; immigration; lindachavez; mexico; nationalsuicide; rewardingcriminals; thirdworldcountry
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Please read this article by Linda Chavez with an open mind as she makes some very good points.
1 posted on 01/08/2004 8:03:23 AM PST by PhiKapMom
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To: All
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Thanks for donating to Free Republic!

Move your locale up the leaderboard!

2 posted on 01/08/2004 8:04:21 AM PST by Support Free Republic (Happy New Year)
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To: MeeknMing; onyx; My2Cents; JohnHuang2; Dog Gone; Dog; isthisnickcool; OKSooner; VOA; mhking; ...
This article by Linda Chavez is very good. Encourage everyone to make their comments in a manner that lends to discourse from a variety of views but leaves out the animosity that is appearing on some threads. It is much easier to read and comprehend a position someone is advocating when that animosity is removed.

Thanks in advance!

PKM
3 posted on 01/08/2004 8:05:32 AM PST by PhiKapMom (AOII Mom -- Support Bush-Cheney '04)
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To: PhiKapMom
But why would we want American workers, who we've spent trillions of dollars educating for 13 or 14 years, on average, to perform jobs that require only the most minimal skills?

Its not a question of wanting such a job. If more and more white collar jobs are sent abroad or HB1'ed to death, then those who have families to support will take almost any job to make ends meet as well as to pay those staggering taxes the illegals have been and will continue to use. The problem though is that since there will be a flood of low skilled immigrants coming in, wages will drop like a stone and job opportunities will be scarce.

4 posted on 01/08/2004 8:08:45 AM PST by KantianBurke (Don't Tread on Me)
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To: PhiKapMom
The government is contiuing to abdicate it's primary responsibility to secure the borders. Bush's proposal does nothing to address the problem.

The plan in unacceptable. A redux of Reagan's 1986 amnesty (which turned out to be a great big lie). We were promised that problem was supposed to be fixed then, remember?
5 posted on 01/08/2004 8:09:09 AM PST by SolutionsOnly
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To: PhiKapMom
What, that our supposed high tech miracle economy depends on the smoke and mirrors of an endless supply of stoop labor? That Chavez can get a gardner on the cheap while our taxes go up, the deficits spiral out of control to pay for her luxury? What a scam privatized profits, socialized costs and we are supposed to believe this is conservative?
6 posted on 01/08/2004 8:09:52 AM PST by junta
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To: PhiKapMom
There is no way that the United States can find and deport 8-12 million illegal aliens in this country, and even if we could, we would do more harm than good.

Sure they could. They are criminals, and the Federal government is to blame. We have many illegals here in Georgia, we might be thrd behind Texas and California. I know several people personally that decided yesterday, after the speech, not to vote for Bush in 2004. Everyone has a line that has been drawn ...

7 posted on 01/08/2004 8:11:09 AM PST by 4CJ (Dialing 911 doesn't stop a crime - a .45 does.)
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To: KantianBurke
I think most people are approaching this problem from the perspective that the economy is not going to expand and create more jobs. Remember, there was a pretty severe labor shortage in the mid-nineties.
8 posted on 01/08/2004 8:11:38 AM PST by stylin_geek (Koffi: 0, G.W. Bush: (I lost count))
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To: 4ConservativeJustices
Bush is on the right track. There is now way this country will deport 12 million people. Use your freakin' heads.
9 posted on 01/08/2004 8:12:26 AM PST by CheezyD
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To: PhiKapMom
Lou Dobbs emphatically made a very good point last night:

"we are not a market.
we are not an economy.
We are a NATION!"
10 posted on 01/08/2004 8:14:10 AM PST by SolutionsOnly
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To: All
What % of the 10 million illegal aliens are parents to children who are US citizens? What would be the cost of having the US government assume all responsibilities for the upbringing of those US citizens, born on US soil, were their parents to be deported?
11 posted on 01/08/2004 8:15:17 AM PST by Owen
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To: PhiKapMom
I saw a piece last evening re: the housing market. It was pointed out that the job paid $8/hr. and if wages had to be raised (to attract "legals"), the house would cost $10,000-$15,000 more.
12 posted on 01/08/2004 8:15:26 AM PST by sarasota
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To: SolutionsOnly
I guess it helps if you look at the United States as a "business" instead of as a "nation." Importing millions of illegal aliens might make a lot of business sense, and a country that can't (or won't) secure its own borders should not even be considered a sovereign nation, anyway.
13 posted on 01/08/2004 8:16:29 AM PST by Alberta's Child (Alberta -- the TRUE North strong and free.)
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To: PhiKapMom
The flip side of this argument is how much money does it cost to the economy in terms of health care, education and social services, etc. to care for illegals? We might find that money saved from these areas would more than offset paying people a decent wage.
14 posted on 01/08/2004 8:16:34 AM PST by HarleyD (READ Your Bible-STUDY to show yourself approved)
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To: 4ConservativeJustices
A lot of cops will not do it. Ask any cop if he is willing to get illegals and try to get them to a detention center somewhere or lock them up. And also, how do you find out if someone is illegal??? By their looks. The judicial system would be shut down with cases of racial discrimination.
15 posted on 01/08/2004 8:17:58 AM PST by futureceo31
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To: sarasota
that's assuming of course that there will be people able to afford it in the first place. Now Mr. Illegal and his 30+ roommates sure. But out of work techies with a wife and kid? Uh uh.
16 posted on 01/08/2004 8:18:05 AM PST by KantianBurke (Don't Tread on Me)
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To: PhiKapMom
But why would we want American workers, who we've spent trillions of dollars educating for 13 or 14 years, on average, to perform jobs that require only the most minimal skills?

Yeah, better they be on unemployment insurance and welfare.

17 posted on 01/08/2004 8:18:06 AM PST by kevao
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To: SolutionsOnly
Lou Dobbs had it all wrong, though I wish it were otherwise. A nation has a common language, customs, traditions, etc. -- I can assure you that the United States has not had any of these things for a long time.
18 posted on 01/08/2004 8:18:09 AM PST by Alberta's Child (Alberta -- the TRUE North strong and free.)
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To: HarleyD
I am not sure what % of these illegals use health care, education and social services. For healthcare, dont you need to have medicaid or medicare to get healthcare. You cannot just walk into a hospital and get health care. Social services need a SSN# if I am not mistaken and someone being an illegal does not have an SSN#. I am not sure how the education concept works but I was also under the impressiona that a majority of these illegalas have most of their family back home...
19 posted on 01/08/2004 8:20:55 AM PST by futureceo31
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To: Alberta's Child
I would venture to say that the US Is a nation of 260 million immigrants, thought most of them came illegally, and probably quite a few had checkered pasts and were fleeing their own countries to come to the land of opportunity. The differnce is, it could have been 200 years ago or 2 years go but we are still mostly all immigrants...
20 posted on 01/08/2004 8:22:25 AM PST by futureceo31
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To: SolutionsOnly
The plan in unacceptable. A redux of Reagan's 1986 amnesty (which turned out to be a great big lie). We were promised that problem was supposed to be fixed then, remember?
Remember it all too well.
21 posted on 01/08/2004 8:22:33 AM PST by wjcsux (If you can read this, you are in range.)
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To: SolutionsOnly
We were promised that problem was supposed to be fixed then, remember?

From White House proposes illegals plan:

Sen. Edward M. Kennedy, Massachusetts Democrat and a key member of the Senate Judiciary Committee, which will consider the proposal, [yesterday] called it "woefully inadequate" and said it "falls far short of being the serious reform our country needs to fix our broken immigration system."

I has been broken for decades. It is still broken. Congress and the Presidential Administrations since Regan won't fix it. It will continue to be broken because elected representatives are inept at trying to fix it. Regrettably, it will take one or more 9-11 atrocities for that to happen. GWB's proposal only adds to the problem and encourages more illegals to bust ass to get here for this or the next amnesty (yes, there will be other amnesties, bet on it).
22 posted on 01/08/2004 8:23:26 AM PST by TomGuy
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To: PhiKapMom
"But "earned legalization" is probably the best solution to a largely intractable problem. There is no way that the United States can find and deport 8-12 million illegal aliens in this country, and even if we could, we would do more harm than good."

Thanks for posting this, PKM. And thanks for your comments regarding avoiding the venom of some of the other threads. Chavez presents a reasoned argument supporting a solution which is both pragmatic and compassionate. I expect this will pass in Congress with at least 75-80% support as members and citizens have more time to study and think it through. For my 2-cents, the President has provided exactly the right balance in offering a common sense answer to a long-term problem. This is true leadership.

23 posted on 01/08/2004 8:24:48 AM PST by Reo
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To: Alberta's Child
The problem from a business perspective is that you'll have a huge influx of minimum wage workers - and all the incumbent social and political problems that go along withy it(more welfare and other government programs and democrat/labor union votes).

A ready supply of low-cost labor also is a disincentive to automate or increase productivity in other ways.

I sometimes think that Bush considers mexico more a 51st state rather than a antion that has it's own responsibilites to it own people. He is permitting mexico to offload it's problems on the US.
24 posted on 01/08/2004 8:24:51 AM PST by SolutionsOnly
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To: futureceo31
You cannot just walk into a hospital and get health care.

Per federal law (Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act), no one can be turned away for basic emergency services.

25 posted on 01/08/2004 8:25:44 AM PST by 4CJ (Dialing 911 doesn't stop a crime - a .45 does.)
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To: All
The most salient sentence in the entire article is this.....

There is no way that the United States can find and deport 8-12 million illegal aliens in this country, and even if we could, we would do more harm than good.

She's right. She could have also added that President Bush didn't create this problem so the question to ask is...."Wny are so many Repubs blaming him for it"?

26 posted on 01/08/2004 8:26:52 AM PST by moondoggie
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To: Reo
Prosecute those who hire illegal aliens and the problem will dry up at its source.

27 posted on 01/08/2004 8:26:58 AM PST by SolutionsOnly
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To: PhiKapMom
Jobs is the key to making this entire process work. Most of the the illegals are here for jobs. Control the employment process and a lot of the illegal problem disappears. No jobs no reason for the vast majority to be here..... How this will be done is the catch.

We haven't seen the legislation proposals much less the regulation details.... However the government is going to have to build a huge data bank with easy access for the employer to be able to determine if the applicant has comported with the registration process. Then the employer must be held accountable with stiff penalities if necessary in order to enforce the 'hire only registered' applicants....

doable..... maybe
28 posted on 01/08/2004 8:27:47 AM PST by deport (..... DONATE TO FREEREPUBLIC......)
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To: CheezyD
Bush is on the right track. There is now way this country will deport 12 million people. Use your freakin' heads.

I don't really care about trying to track down and deport the 8 to 12 million illegals. I am concerned about a Bush policy that does nothing to secure our borders and turns over our immigration policy to employers. How will be able to enforce the Bush plan? How many illegals will sign on knowing that they could be deported after three years or sooner if they lose their jobs? Bush will now allow them to bring in their families increasing the numbers further and making citizens out of any children born here.

I can see an Underground Railroad being developed by unscrupulous employers bringing workers in for a fee and then setting them loose. I can see a marked increase in the volume of illegals to get in here before the plan is approved. I can see documented workers disappearing after the 3 years are up. I can see the Bush Plan affecting not only low, paying menial jobs (supposedly not wanted by Americans), but also, skilled jobs now covered and limited by H1B visas.

The bottom line is we have no control over our borders and the Bush plan does nothing to improve the situation. We can't absorb all the workers that want to come here. Mexico has a population of 100 million with 33% of the population under 15. Its GDP per capita income is one seventh of ours. The economic pressures for Mexicans and the most of Latin America to come to America will continue to increase.

29 posted on 01/08/2004 8:28:05 AM PST by kabar
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To: CheezyD
If there are 8 million illegals here, kick them out. We did it under Eisenhower 50 years ago in operation wetback and there is no reason we can't do it now. Heck, if we put 12 men and 2 suvs on the MOON! more than a quarter of a century ago! If we can send 200 thousand troop to the other side of the earth and take over 2 countries with over 20 million people in the middle of a hostile middleast! we can sure as heck kick 8 million Illegal immigrants out of our own country of 280 million, now.

We have a perfect excuse, 911. We need to take advantage of this window of opportunity. We need to secure this country and security without borders, is no security at all. We can't afford to have 8 million people in this country, driving down wages, destroying our education system and overloading our hospitals and prisons.
30 posted on 01/08/2004 8:29:04 AM PST by TomasUSMC (from tomasUSMC FIGHT FOR THE LAND OF THE FREE AND HOME OF THE BRAVE)
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To: PhiKapMom

31 posted on 01/08/2004 8:29:23 AM PST by MeekOneGOP (Howie Dean in the South !!: http://Richard.Meek.home.comcast.net/IowaRatsLastMealNewDeal.JPG)
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To: TomGuy
That's an excellent point. If the immigration system has been broken for decades, then we probably never really had much of an "immigration system." Most of the people who arrived in this country before the 1920s would be considered "illegal immigrants" by today's standards because there were few (if any) immigration laws in force at the time. Most people just hopped on a boat in Ireland or Italy, sailed to the United States, and settled in whatever happened to be the first city they reached in the U.S.
32 posted on 01/08/2004 8:30:06 AM PST by Alberta's Child (Alberta -- the TRUE North strong and free.)
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To: PhiKapMom
There is one compelling argument for rationalization that I'm not surprised the administration won't make publicly.

But I am surprised that no FReepers have tumbled to it yet.

Down the road, as the Boomers retire, Social Security projections are looking at a worker:retiree ratio of, what, 1.18:1?

Under the circumstances, bringing, say, six million more workers into the Social Security system is not a bad idea.

To my mind, this is one of the compelling reasons for normalizing the status from illegal aliens to guest workers.

33 posted on 01/08/2004 8:30:38 AM PST by okie01 (www.ArmorforCongress.com...because Congress isn't for the morally halt and the mentally lame.)
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To: PhiKapMom
Linda Chavez ~ Bump!
34 posted on 01/08/2004 8:30:40 AM PST by blackie
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To: moondoggie
President Bush didn't create this problem so the question to ask is...."Wny are so many Repubs blaming him for it"?

People aren't blaming Bush for creating the problem; they're blaming him for proposing a policy that will simply exacerbate the problem.

35 posted on 01/08/2004 8:31:10 AM PST by kevao
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To: Reo
from Merriam Webster;

Main Entry: am·nes·ty
Pronunciation: 'am-n&-stE
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -ties
Etymology: Greek amnEstia forgetfulness, from amnEstos forgotten, from a- + mnasthai to remember -- more at MIND
Date: 1580
: the act of an authority (as a government) by which pardon is granted to a large group of individuals
- amnesty transitive verb
36 posted on 01/08/2004 8:31:38 AM PST by SolutionsOnly
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To: KantianBurke
But didn't technology forsee that this would happen? If work can be done with a computer, location doesn't matter. Why is Bush at fault when companies decide to do what is best for their bottom line? Do you want him sign legislation that makes this corporate practice illegal? How else are you going to stop it?
37 posted on 01/08/2004 8:31:39 AM PST by Pan_Yans Wife (Freedom is a package deal - with it comes responsibilities and consequences.)
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To: SolutionsOnly
Prosecute those who hire illegal aliens and the problem will dry up at its source.


Yep.... but the employer must have some type process that allows him to follow so that he isn't held accountable for the illegal/legal status of the applicant. In other words, he should be held liable for false papers/documentation provided by the applicant. Rather the applicants should be approved by some agency other than the employer.

This may become the test program for biometric identification......
38 posted on 01/08/2004 8:32:29 AM PST by deport (..... DONATE TO FREEREPUBLIC......)
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To: PhiKapMom
Her thoughtful points are related to the guest worker program, which isn't the most objectionable piece of this proposal. The other is amnesty for illegals already here. The only case she makes is that we can't deport 10 million illegals, might as well make them legal. This is lunacy. If the illegals know that the U.S. grants amnesty every few years, there is an incentive to break our immigration laws and come to the U.S. illegally, and wait for a liberal president to make them legal.
39 posted on 01/08/2004 8:34:12 AM PST by Texas Federalist
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To: okie01
Under the circumstances, bringing, say, six million more workers into the Social Security system is not a bad idea.

But these workers aren't going to be in the Social Security system. Once they have their legal status, they must be paid at least minimum wage. At that point, these newly legalized illegals will be undercut by a new wave of illegals, who will work for less than minimum wage. And we're back to square one.

40 posted on 01/08/2004 8:34:31 AM PST by kevao
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To: Pan_Yans Wife
I don't pretend to know what the best course of action is regarding the loss of white collar jobs. However inundating this country with MILLIONS of low skilled workers will most certainly hurt many middle to lower class American CITIZENS who do not have the education for University graduate jobs.
41 posted on 01/08/2004 8:35:37 AM PST by KantianBurke (Don't Tread on Me)
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To: PhiKapMom
The San Diego Union Tribune:

Illegal immigrants cost the taxpayers $20 billion every year.

34 percent of legal Mexican immigrants are on welfare right now.

25 percent of illegals are as well.

This number will rise with the amnesty.

Most illegals are willing to work hard, but as the numbers prove, millions are not.

42 posted on 01/08/2004 8:36:04 AM PST by kellynla ("C" 1/5 1st Mar. Div. U.S.M.C. Viet Nam 69&70 Semper Fi! HAPPY NEW YEAR!)
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To: Owen
What would be the cost of having the US government assume all responsibilities for the upbringing of those US citizens, born on US soil, were their parents to be deported?

If you are born on US soil, you are a US citizen.

43 posted on 01/08/2004 8:36:14 AM PST by Texas Federalist
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To: CheezyD
There is now [sic] way this country will deport 12 million people. Use your freakin' heads.

It doesn't matter how many illegals we are able to deport. We do not need to create an incentive for more to come here. Do you not think that more illegals will flood over when they realize our pattern of giving amnesty every 10 years or so?

44 posted on 01/08/2004 8:38:03 AM PST by Texas Federalist
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To: PhiKapMom
If [we] could wave a magic wand and make [them] disappear overnight, the rest of us would suffer by having to pay more for everything from the food we put on the table to the houses in which we live. Our office buildings wouldn't get cleaned, our crops wouldn't get picked, our meat wouldn't get processed, nor our tables cleaned when we go out to eat.

And that is why, Mr. Lincoln, the south simply cannot tolerate--nor can this nation tolerate--the elimination of slavery at this point in time.

45 posted on 01/08/2004 8:39:30 AM PST by Kevin Curry
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To: kabar
turns over our immigration policy to employers.

Having immigration in the hands of the employers is nothing new. How many CEO's are going to be arrested because an illegal alien works at Walmart or Lowes?

They come here for the work. It is best to use the system to our advantage.

There already is an underground railroad! The employers know how to get the immigrants here to work. That has never been a problem.

This is not a Border Plan, nor is it a National Security plan... this plan deals with the immigrants who are already here.

46 posted on 01/08/2004 8:41:29 AM PST by Pan_Yans Wife (Freedom is a package deal - with it comes responsibilities and consequences.)
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To: KantianBurke
But America always will need skilled and unskilled labor. The university jobs are not the ones that propel the nation. Obviously there are enough jobs, otherwise why would the immigrants be filling the job placements? Why do the corporations hire them?
47 posted on 01/08/2004 8:43:18 AM PST by Pan_Yans Wife (Freedom is a package deal - with it comes responsibilities and consequences.)
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To: PhiKapMom; *immigrant_list; A Navy Vet; Lion Den Dan; Free the USA
<< There is no way that the United States can find and deport 8-12 million illegal aliens in this country, and even if we could, we would do more harm than good. >>

What absolute BS. Chavez had better sit this one out.

We can and must enforce our nation's laws and we can and must round up these felons and their spawn and we can and must deport them all.

Better that we accept and absorb the consequences of righting this awful criminal-alien invasion now, than cause our children and our grandchildren to have been denied our nation's Rule of Law -- and with it the civilization we have long vanguarded and must forever guard.
48 posted on 01/08/2004 8:43:35 AM PST by Brian Allen ( Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God - Thomas Jefferson)
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To: kevao
"But these workers aren't going to be in the Social Security system. Once they have their legal status, they must be paid at least minimum wage."

Exactly.

"At that point, these newly legalized illegals will be undercut by a new wave of illegals, who will work for less than minimum wage. And we're back to square one."

Then, being without a job to justify their work permit, they'll have to go home, won't they?

Eventually, Bush's program depends upon enforcement of a.) minimum wage laws and b.) legal entry.

But it's not unrealistic to think that such can be done. Because, prior to 1967, much the same "guest worker" policy was in force -- the so-called bracero program. It's noteworthy that, while the bracero program existed, there was no illegal immigration problem.

Indeed, the problem didn't begin to occur until the LBJ administration cancelled the bracero program at the behest of Cesar Chavez and his United Farm Workers union.

49 posted on 01/08/2004 8:43:54 AM PST by okie01 (www.ArmorforCongress.com...because Congress isn't for the morally halt and the mentally lame.)
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To: sarasota
If the house cost more because we hired Americans at a fair wage, then I'd pay it.

I refused to allow a crew from a roofing company who could not produce any ID to do the work. It cost me $1000 more to do the roof, but I did not contribute to the underground of illegals working for construction companies around here.

Integrity has a price. We have the lowest cost vegetables and fruits in the world. I am still paying the same price for fruit and vegetables except for oranges and grapefruit, that I paid when I first moved into my own apartment 30 years ago. Don't you think it's time for the cost of this produce to go up so that American kids can have as their first job, picking fruit for a local grower?

If Greenspan hadn't put so much pressure on companies not to raise prices for "fear of inflation" which is the Boogeyman to Greenie, we wouldn't have farmers using illegals to keep the costs down and we wouldn't have had Silicon Valley, CA and the Beltway Bandits, No. VA, resorting to H-1B's to keep the costs down. Are you aware that a programmer's career ends at 35, because at that point, his company can hire two H-1B's for his salary? And for engineers, the end of his career is 40. Most people have no idea how many unemployed in this Country are our programmers and engineers.

There is a price to pay for everything. In order to keep jobs for Americans, we need to stop the illegal aliens from working for so little that they drop the wages paid for every job, so that Americans are forced out of their own farms and industries. What is true is that the illegals work for so little, live in houses of 15 at a time, so they can send money back to relatives in Mexico, and they force the payscale downward.

With accountability, first of all, we get them to pay taxes on their earnings. Second, we can track them (although I sure hope the programmers they hire to do that programming are not H-1B's as they really are not good programmers,) and that we bring these illegals out of the shadows. Being able to track them is not a bad idea. We are starting to get a handle on the illegal alien problem by starting where we are, which is in some heckuva pickle.

I believe that ultimately, control of our borders has to be addressed, and that is where the President is heading. You just can't correct years of ignoring the problem by rounding up and deporting 8-10 million of them in one full swoop. But forcing them to come out of the underground is sure a start.

TNT
50 posted on 01/08/2004 8:45:23 AM PST by TruthNtegrity (I refuse to call candidates for President "Democratic" as they are NOT. They are Democrats.)
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