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Famous American Strategist Calls for Support of Iranian Students (by SMCCDI)
TransNational Radical Party ^

Posted on 01/24/2004 8:48:59 AM PST by William McKinley

One of the most famous American analysts called, yesterday, for the increase of official US support of the Iranian Student Movement and the Secularist forces who are seeking to overthrown the Islamic republic regime. Dr. Jack Wheeler, the mastermind behind the famous "Reagan Doctrine", who was speaking in a public forum in Dallas (TX/USA), stated: "More than ever we shall adjust our policy and bring a public and firm support to the brave students and freedom fighters who are fighting against a barbarian and terrorist regime". "Without doubt, these young Iranians who are forming more than 70% of Iran's population are our best friends for years to come and they're our natural allies against fanatism and terrorism" he emphasized.

Dr. Wheeler slammed those "Opportunistic European Countries" who are blinded by the money made on the back of the oppressed people of the World and predicted a soon end to their colonial rules. Following Dr. Wheeler's description of the current geopolicy, Aryo Pirouznia, speaking on behalf of SMCCDI, asked from the audience for an increase of Americans moral support for Iranian freedom fighters. Pirouznia stated:" Your moral support and pressure against those countries dealing with my Motherland is an important step in the Iranian Freedom process. Such help is less costly than any type of military war which will dammage my country and undermines the increasing US popularity among the majority of the Iranians." "Help us to determine our future by ourselves. Just support us moraly and we will overcome of a shacky regime" he emphasized.

Jack Wheeler who's a Geopolitic expert and a maverick explorer is well known for his role in support of the non-marxist freedom movements across the globe and his role in the dismantelment of the defunct Soviet Empire. He's the author of several books and is managing an online news service named "Tothepointnews.com"


TOPICS: Extended News; Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: iran; smccdi; studentmovement
Emphasis mine.

While there is probably some disagreement around here on how much involvement the US should have in regime change in Iran, I don't think there is too much disagreement that it would be in our interests if the current regime in Iran was replaced with one more open to the ideals of liberty and freedom.

I tend to fall on the side that we should not be completely isolationist in this regard, and should help to some degree those fighting to bring about regime change. However, I tend to not like those who are supported by or supportive of Marxists or socialists. I see that as replacing one problem with another problem that is not necessarily better (and due to the turmoil during a revolution, probably worse).

It is for this kinship there seems to be with the TransNational Radical Party that I am starting to wonder about the SMCCDI, whose goals and alliances to date I had thought to be totally compatible with the goals of our country.

For example, here we see that the TRP has set up a complete section of their website just for the SMCCDI. You can see over on the right, the following ad:

http://www.radicalparty.org/iran/banner.gif
Here is a complete photo gallery of the SMCCDI with the TRP. Here is an appeal from the TRP and SMCCDI, published on the SMCCDI's website. Here is a press release detailing some of the coordinating activities the TRP and its umbrella groups were taking with the SMCCDI.

Here is a press release from the TRP in Italian. The translation, courtesy of babelfish:

RADICAL IRAN /: TOMORROW MANIFESTATION In front of the EMBASSY IRANIAN To ROME

In the light of the events that are having place in Iran, tomorrow 8 July 2003, Left Radical Transnational one, Radical Italiani and Radicaliroma will be present in front of the Embassy Iranian in order to ask the respect for the right of the students to manifest the following day, in all the Iran where day in memory of the tragic events of 1999 is previewed one. In that occasion, the manifestations of the students of Tehran, like in China of Tienanmen Public square in 1989, were repressed in the blood from the teocratico regimen Iranian, from the so-called "reformist government" of Khatami.

Against Hush of this Europe that once again chooses not opporsi to antiliberal governments, isolating and disarming the hopes of the young people Iranians, the radicals will manifest raising the faces of the killed students, and will deliver one letter to the ambassador sanctioned Iranian in order to remember the obligation from the Universal Declaration of the rights of the man.

They will be present:
MARK PANNELLA and MARK CAPPATO, European deputies,
SERGIO STANZANI, President of the PRT,
SERGIO Of ELIA, Secretary of Nobody Touches Caino
DANIEL CAPEZZONE, Secretary of Italian Radicals
NICOLE SADIGHI, journalist Iranian and exponent of the Student Movement Coordination Committee for Democracy in Iran (SMCCDI)

Here's a story showing the involvement of some other leftist organizations:
It was to an audiance composed of Italian officials, activists and journalists that, on Saturday, Mr. Kaveh Mohseni, the SMCCDI's Special Representative to the Cagliari (S. Italy) Conference, called for the support of the "Iran's Freedom Process" and its "Secularist forces" by Italy and its European partners of EU...

This meeting, coordinated by Ms. Stefania Lepanna and Mr. Michele Demontis, was organized by Italy's "Radicali Sardi" and the "TransNational Radical Party", and several Italian deputies from groups such as, the "Democratie-Socialisti", were among the supporters and speakers.

That was not 100% correct though, as this Italian girl pointed out on her blog:
However,In the text that SMCCDI has published there is something incorrect:

The event in Italy has been organized by the "Transnational Radical Party" and Association "Radicali Sardi"

The "Socialisti Democratici Italiani" did not organize the event, they will be there as special participants.

It's very important to modify this piece of text..

Love the smiley. Ahem.

So who exactly are the TransNational Radical Party? It's a bigger, more powerful leftist organization than you would expect for a group you have never heard of. Their website is here. Gandhian, socialist, "libertarian socialist" (which is also often known as "anarchist". Here's how they described themselves back in 1998.

Here is some info on one of the leaders.

In his political career, Mr. Pannella co-founded a series of organizations such as the League for divorce, the League for objection of conscience, the League for the abrogation of the Agreement between the Catholic Church and the Italian State (Concordato), the Centre of legal initiative “Pietro Calamandrei”, as well as the Italian Association for Demographic Education (AIED). He has been at the forefront of the promotion important reforms regarding narcotics, facing incarceration on various occasions for his civil disobediences. He played a prominent role in the pro-choice movement in Italy that led to the legalization of abortion in the early 1980s...

Engaged in the defence of civil rights in Eastern European countries, in 1968, he was arrested in Sofia for having distributed leaflets against the Communist regime. He is one of the first promoters and founders of the “Green” and “ecologist” political movements in Europe....

Mr. Pannella was one of the first European Federalists and fought, through non-violent means, for the creation of the European Union...

He is honorary President of the Party of the Rom (ROI) in the Czech Republic and he is also honorary member of the Socialist Slovene Youth. The KKL, Karen Kalehm Le Israel dedicated him a reforestation area in the desert of Negev in Israel.

I think this flirtation or marriage (depending on just how tight things are between them) is a tragic mistake on the part of the Iranian students.
1 posted on 01/24/2004 8:48:59 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: DoctorZIn; nuconvert
ping
2 posted on 01/24/2004 8:50:56 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: Cacique
Ping?
3 posted on 01/24/2004 9:00:36 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: William McKinley
This is all interesting, but I'm seeing these 2 organizations attending the same conference, and using each other to promote a common cause....democracy and freedom for Iranians. I'm not seeing more to it than that. Am I missing something?
4 posted on 01/24/2004 9:23:48 AM PST by nuconvert ( It's a naive domestic Burgundy without any breeding, ..I think you'll be amused by its presumption)
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To: nuconvert
I see a lot more than that.

I'm seeing a complete website set up by the TRP for the SMCCDI.

I'm seeing coordinated appeals and efforts.

I'm seeing joint press releases.

And I am seeing an entire photo gallery dedicated to the TRP and no other examples of any other group that just happened to attend a same conference as the SMCCDI getting similar treatment.

So yes, you are in my estimation missing something. Clearly, there is more kinship between these two organizations than they just happened to cross paths once.

The question I have is, how much kinship?

5 posted on 01/24/2004 9:32:38 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: nuconvert
Plus, I think that when you say this:
using each other to promote a common cause
I think it is pretty important for us to determine just how common their cause is. Is it just to get rid of the anti-American, rights abusing, axis-of-evil theocratic regime? Or is it to install a pro-abortion, pro-drug, anti-religion (not just anti-theocracy), pro-socialist, radical government who would be just as much of a thorn in the side of the US as the current regime is (and, come to think of it, would unlikely bring freedom to the people of Iran-- far left governments never do).
6 posted on 01/24/2004 9:38:12 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: William McKinley
"coordinated appeals" and "press releases" for 1 common cause. I don't see anything else. These conferences are attended by the same groups all the time. The website seems to belong to TRP. smccdi doesn't reciprocate on their site. And look at the dates on the site. They're July. Do you know whether there is a connection of any sort since then? Maybe they've parted ways?
If Amnesty Int'l or Reporters without Borders had "spots" on smccdi, would there be a problem with that? Or vice versa? Those two certainly aren't right wing, but they do share common causes. I don't think it would necessarily mean that each support everything the other group says or does.

You certainly have a point about the type of leadership Iran ends up with. That's very important.
7 posted on 01/24/2004 9:56:41 AM PST by nuconvert ( It's a naive domestic Burgundy without any breeding, ..I think you'll be amused by its presumption)
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To: nuconvert
These conferences are attended by the same groups all the time.
Yes, predominantly very left wing groups.
If Amnesty Int'l or Reporters without Borders had "spots" on smccdi, would there be a problem with that? Or vice versa?
Damn straight I would find it problematic.
I don't think it would necessarily mean that each support everything the other group says or does.
True. But finding out exactly where the support begins and ends becomes very important.
8 posted on 01/24/2004 10:02:05 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: William McKinley
"Yes, predominantly very left wing groups."

So where are the right wing groups?


"...finding out exactly where the support begins and ends becomes very important."

Exactly.
Maybe the best way to find out is to write to smccdi and ask about their affiliation with TRP?
9 posted on 01/24/2004 10:22:47 AM PST by nuconvert ( It's a naive domestic Burgundy without any breeding, ..I think you'll be amused by its presumption)
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To: nuconvert
Where are the right wing groups? One is right here. And the DC Chapter, for example, has been more than glad to share its stage with groups representing Middle Eastern interests concerned with peace and liberty for their people.

We've got plenty of people who push the SMCCDI on here. Perhaps some are involved with them- they seem to get 'inside reports'. They should be able to contact someone who could make a statement.

It would be very interesting to see if they would be willing to distance themselves from the leftist goals of TRP.

And it will be very interesting if such a request is denied.

10 posted on 01/24/2004 10:27:27 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: William McKinley
What I was aking was, the right wing groups that do the work of "Amnesty ..." or Reporters...". They go into these countries and talk to the locals and get the numbers of people who are in prisons and killed and tortured, and pictures, etc. I don't agree with their left wing agendas, but they're kind of a necessary "evil", so to speak. They're the ones that do the dirty work. And they put out the reports. The right wing groups use their reports.

I don't know if people are really "pushing" SMCCDI, as much as using them as a source for stories and information.
11 posted on 01/24/2004 10:42:31 AM PST by nuconvert ( It's a naive domestic Burgundy without any breeding, ..I think you'll be amused by its presumption)
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To: William McKinley; nuconvert
You are asking interesting questions. I admire your efforts and concern.

SMCCDI works with many groups on both the right and left.
I have regular contact with their US leadership and they are very supportive of our president and his efforts.

There is a lot of pressure on groups like this to be inclusive. Even our greatest supporters in the US Senate have asked Iranians in the US to create a single group that can represent the Iranian people's cause, from far left to far right.

I believe SMCCDI is simply trying to work with all those that will champion their cause.

I think your real question is whether these radical left wing groups will be able to exert undo influence on a post Islamic regime. If we refuse to work with them because the left also supports their cause, the left will be the only ones giving them counsel and advice.

This would be a greater mistake.
12 posted on 01/24/2004 11:39:16 AM PST by DoctorZIn (adi)
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To: DoctorZIn
I think that leaving totally unanswered what type of governance will be fashioned after the theocracy is deposed is not an acceptable stance.

The revolution that took place and put the Islamic Republic Party in place was leftist in style and tactics, and was supported by the Iranian left. They may feel they ended up being betrayed, but any leftist movement or revolution leaves the people who supported it feeling betrayed- it is only a matter of if it happens right away or later.

It was students, as every American recalls, who took the hostages. The left was a major force in the universities of Iran, as is generally the case.

The Islamic Republic Party formed a government based on a form of Islam but with the typical leftist tight control over the economy by the state-- and without economic freedom there can be no real freedom.

The destabilization of the Shah's regime was accomplished with the street demonstrations, propaganda, and general strikes that the left always employs.

It would be incredible naivety for us to believe that the leaders of the SMCCDI have not thought about what their plans are, should they succeed. They have. They don't want to say. They need to if they want to get the support of people like me-- for if they are leftist they will end up under a form of repression just as bad as they live under now, but in getting there there would be many risks for American lives and wasted American dollars.

13 posted on 01/24/2004 2:27:40 PM PST by William McKinley
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To: sauropod; Cacique
Read whole thing please. :D
14 posted on 01/24/2004 3:16:38 PM PST by hellinahandcart
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To: William McKinley
I never said that we should not be concerned with the type of governance to be fashioned in Iran after the theocracy is deposed.

I do agree that in the late 1970's the students we largely left leaning. Large numbers of people were frustrated that the US had supported the Shah and were looking to soviet style solutions. These we mostly crushed. Their leaders executed by the Islamic Republic while others joined the MEK. So your concern with the replacement of the Islamic Republic is perfectly legitimate.

You seem to infer that street demonstrations, strikes, etc are the tools of the left. I disagree with this premise. These tools can and have been used by whoever has the courage to use them.

I was surprised at you statement..."It would be incredible naivety for us to believe that the leaders of the SMCCDI have not thought about what their plans are, should they succeed. They have. They don't want to say...."

What is your proof for such an accusation? Although they represent a wide spectrum of political ideologies, they have been rather specific in their declarations of what they are seeking. See below.

http://www.daneshjoo.org/article/publish/article_2919.shtml

http://www.daneshjoo.org/article/publish/article_446.shtml

They are not trying to force anything on the people. They support a referendum on their form of government.

BTW, they are not the only group that is working for regime change in Iran. We publish information from numerous groups and support them where appropriate. They are looking for our support. They are now attracted to America democracy and we just need to stay engaged with them through the entire process. There are no guarantees... unless we ignore them for fear they may go left. Then they will likely make the mistakes you fear.

Finally, as I said before, I have spoken with them many times and consistently hear of their support for President Bush and their fear that he may not be reelected. I believe your fears are misplaced.
15 posted on 01/24/2004 3:25:00 PM PST by DoctorZIn (Until they are Free, "We shall all be Iranians!")
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To: DoctorZIn
What is your proof for such an accusation? Although they represent a wide spectrum of political ideologies, they have been rather specific in their declarations of what they are seeking. See below.

http://www.daneshjoo.org/article/publish/article_2919.shtml

Yes, I already had read that. They have made clear not what government they want, but rather that they "trust the Iranian people to later decide as to which ideology or leader suits them best."

In other words, the link you provided does not answer my question, but rather it says "we aren't going to answer that; we'll let the people later answer it."

That is not good enough. Obviously, whenever a revolution occurs, the leaders of the revolution will have great sway with the people in getting what they want as the form and content of the governance.

Saying "set aside our political preferences" is another way of saying "trust us", and history has shown time and again that leftists cannot be trusted, even when their intentions are completely noble, because the ideology is hopelessly flawed.

There is a lot which is very good in the articles presented in that link. The devil can be in the details. For example,

Everyone who works has the right to just and favorable remuneration ensuring for ones self and family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection, such as pension plans for government employees.
This could mean something innocuous, or it could mean state mandated socialism. Taking it on faith that it won't be the latter would be foolhardy. Similarly
Everyone has the right to rest and leisure, including reasonable limitation of working hours and periodic holidays with pay. Motherhood and childcare are entitled to special care and assistance
Again I am seeing the foundation of state socialism.
Everyone is entitled to a universal medical coverage, with a major focus on preemptive medicine.
And again.
Everyone has the right to education... Free education shall be provided from elementary until the completion of a masters program. Elementary education shall be compulsory. Technical and professional education shall be made generally available.
More free stuff! Everything is free! Isn't that why they call it freedom?
After seven years and subject to the specific educational facilitys discretion, high school and above teachers/professors have to be given lifetime employment, without fear of dismissal for any reason.
Oh yeah! Let's give the universities to people and give them total freedom from responsibility! Imagine the state run education system in the hands of lifetime appointed full-fledged Marxists. No, there is no risk of that! And no risk of the education system turning into a propaganda factory and brainwashing apparatus.

And so forth throughout.

No wonder they want us to "set aside our political preferences and unite in establishing these rights". I'd love to go to my foes and say "let's not fight. Let's instead unite in establishing everything I believe in as a starting point."

You aren't dispelling my fears. You are magnifying them. I fear you are desiring to send the people of Iran from the hell of a state run theocracy to the hell of a state run socialist meatgrinder.

16 posted on 01/24/2004 4:01:21 PM PST by William McKinley
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To: William McKinley
You seem to need to know, in great detail, the exact form of government that will replace the Islamic Regime if the popular movement inside of Iran is successful, before you can give your support.

OK... You are entitled to your position.

You and I probably share many of the same concerns and preferences in what should replace their current government. But I am sure you would agree that at some point the people of Iran will have to make up their own minds and choose the form of government they want to live under. In the meantime, we can engage them now, encourage them and educate them as to why we believe one system is superior to another.

There are many Iranian groups that are willing to state their preferences in detail.

SMCCDI is an umbrella organization and represents a broad spectrum of thought inside of Iran. It is trying to provide a unifying voice that western governments and the US government seems to want. They also need this unity to push for a national referendum on the type of government the people want. Some want a constitutional monarchy, some a secular democracy and others want an Islamic Republic, to name a few. Without this unity they do not stand a chance at having a vote on such a referendum.

You claim…”They have made clear not what government they want…”

But below are a few examples of the kind of the government they did speak about …

http://www.daneshjoo.org/article/publish/article_446.shtml

“The Separation of Religion and State:

History has shown the mixture of religion and politics is a deadly combination, regardless of epoch, society or the religion involved. We are not blaming Islam as some of us are devout Muslims, but rather simply the mixture of religion and politics.

We seek the separation of religion and state and the establishment of a secular government.

“ The Separation of Powers:

The Islamic republic has clearly demonstrated the undesirability of unrestricted, unaccountable power. Power centralized in the hands of one or a few and without accountability or checks and balances is a recipe for dictatorship.

As such, the executive, judiciary and legislative branches of the government need to be independent of each

“A Decentralized Government:

The overbearing hand of the central government needs to be strictly regulated. More political and economic authority needs to reside with the local, city and regional provinces. Without compromising Iran’s territorial integrity, the elected local authorities should be given more rights to settle their own affairs.

A decentralized system is best suited for our country, as the Iranian people have been living together as one people for almost 3 thousand years. They are not newly formed states trying to form a federation or a union.

The central government in Tehran has the exclusive authority to maintain a standing army, conduct foreign policy, regulate the nation’s financial markets, and to ensure the proper functioning of the welfare system.

“Free Markets & WTO:

Why have we failed to become a rich, industrialized country, despite our abundant natural resources? Maybe the answer is self-evident. As a nation, we have focused too much on tapping what lays underneath the ground, rather than in the minds and hearts of our people. The quest for oil has led to foreign manipulation and interference. Even worse, oil has functioned as an easy and independent source of income for the governmental authorities, making them indifferent and insensitive to the economic plight of the people.

Creation of wealth from natural resources relies on political connections and, hence, is far more likely to lead to corruption than when a society has no other option but to organize the creative resources of its people. The latter requires an appropriate legal framework and institutions, whereas the former mostly relies on who one knows.

That is why other countries rich in natural resources have also fallen into the same trap. Not one member of OPEC has a viable non-petroleum based economy. In much the same way, Argentina, boasting so many natural resources, today has almost the same income per capita as it did 100 years ago. Conversely, countries that prospered such as Taiwan, South Korea and Hong Kong did so without being "blessed" with abundant natural resources.

Realizing that they had nothing to offer the world but the skills of their people, these countries focused on loosened, labor-intensive industries for exports to create jobs for their people (since they had no domestic market per say to sell to). They, subsequently, moved up the food chain and increasingly engaged in more sophisticated industries. Jobs were their first and foremost priority. Similarly, creating jobs should be our country’s number one economic policy. We have much to learn form the dynamic economies of these three countries.

The foundation of their economic miracle was based on an appropriate legal framework. With the theocracy’s arbitrary decision making, compounded by its corrupt and inefficient bureaucracy, no wonder entrepreneurs have no incentives to take risks and create jobs for the people. Its so-called foundations have a monopoly on a number of vital industries and are not accountable to public in any form. There is no transparency. To encourage private investment in the economy, we must first protect the rights of both the investors and workers against the overbearing hand of the government.

Private property must be protected to provide the right set of incentives for risk taking in order to create jobs for the people. Central to this objective is international trade. We need to engage the world economy and join the World Trade Organization.”




In my opinion, whatever form of government they ultimately chose would be greatly superior to what they currently endure.

I support them because I believe they simply want what we have (and all too often take for granted). We can try to help them build it or sit on the sidelines and criticize their efforts.

There are many Iranians who read our posts here and if you want to engage them in this debate I would encourage you to do so. This will take time and energy. They won’t necessarily be satisfied with your criticisms any more than you are of some of their “public position statements.” But if you are willing to spend the time and energy necessary, please join in.

Oh, and one last comment. You said…I fear you are desiring to send the people of Iran from the hell of a state run theocracy to the hell of a state run socialist meatgrinder…

What do you base that on???? I am a believer in free markets; I am a student of Hayek, Von Mises, and Friedman myself. Why would you accuse me of that? Lets not start making wild accusations of one another.
17 posted on 01/24/2004 5:43:27 PM PST by DoctorZIn (Until they are Free, "We shall all be Iranians!")
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To: DoctorZIn
I fear it because I see the imprint of socialism on the articles presented, because I see them flirting with the TRP, and because neither of these things seem to bother you.

The people of Iran will need to decide. But after a revolution there is a vaccuum, and we need to know who is going to step into that vaccuum. The leaders of a revolution will be part of that. Knowing their goals and their political inclination beyond just wanting change is a must.

Let me share with you some interesting words.

Mass-popular organisations and trade unions, should by their very nature remain above ideology. They unite people on basis of their immediate and direct democratic demands. They should combine over what unites them - trade, profession, gender, ethnicity, sexuality - rather than what divides them - ideology. Political groupings need to operate within these structures, formulating demands and arguing for changes in policy and direction, all within the framework of the raison d'etre of the mass organisation. Ideological issues, whether political, religious or cultural, must be kept out unless it has direct bearing on the purpose of the association.
What does that mean? Does that seem to fit what you see? What the modus operandi here is?

It is from a Marxist critique of the failure of the Iranian Revolution of the late 1970s. From the same critique:

The struggle for a non-ideological state is inseparable from that for socialism.
I can't speak for anyone else here. But until I see the SMCCDI explicitly denounce socialism as incompatible with freedom, and while I continue to see in their declared goals many of the goals of the international socialists, and while I see them making join declarations and presentations with the TRP, I not only will not be supporting them, I will be actively spreading the word that they deserve ambivalence at best from American conservatives.
18 posted on 01/24/2004 5:52:30 PM PST by William McKinley
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To: William McKinley
When I first started reading your posts I thought you might have discovered something new and important. If you had found proof of some kind of insidious conspiracy I would be would be ever so thankful.

But as I have read your posts, you appear to take a kind of moral or ideological absolutist position.

I appears that you are saying that unless these Iranians can prove they are ideologically pure and committed to your version of anti-socialism, then we should stop all support for their quest for freedom and give them over to the socialists.

I take an opposite position. I don't believe they are socialists, but simply welcoming support whereever they can find it. If we find socialist leanings among them, then we should educate those Iranians that may be tempted by the allure of socialism of its price in personal freedom and liberty.

The Iranians I know are extremely entrepreneurial and take personal responsibility for their lives and the people as a nation just need our encouragement to extend this understanding into their government's social policy, which many already do.

It is easy to criticize others but more difficult to help them.

I don't have a problem with your keeping your eye on SMCCDI but we could use your help more than your criticism.
19 posted on 01/24/2004 10:16:03 PM PST by DoctorZIn (Until they are Free, "We shall all be Iranians!")
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To: F14 Pilot
Ping for later!
20 posted on 01/25/2004 5:33:55 AM PST by F14 Pilot ("Terrorists declared war on U.S. and War is what they Got!")
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To: DoctorZIn
When I first started reading your posts I thought you might have discovered something new and important. If you had found proof of some kind of insidious conspiracy I would be would be ever so thankful.
I always try to be helpful. And you are more than welcome to try and be dismissive of me and my concerns. It is always an option.

But pardon me if I pull the string on some of my concerns. Even if I am a bit of a moral absolutist, in as far as I grasp how devastating far-left governments are to the people under them. I hate theocracies, and I hate repressive regimes. I also hate leftist regimes, and do not see them as being measurable better than theocracies.

I was on board with your efforts when it seemed to me that those behind the scenes (such as the person, Aryo Pirouznia, who set up the SMCCDI website were people who were supportive of Reza Pahlavi. And I fully appreciate the need to find support (and resources) whereever possible. But there is a rule of thumb, which is that any organization which is not expressly right wing eventually becomes or is taken over by left wing interests (if they weren't that way from the start).

And despite your dismissive attitude towards me, that is a legitimate concern especially when I am seeing joint declarations (hosted on the SMCCDI website) and joint initiatives (hosted on the TRP website) and photo galleries of meetings (when none are made of similar meetings with non-leftist groups). How deep is the involvement? Obviously, Nicole Sadighi -- a spokeswoman of the SMCCDI-- is deeply involved ("Nicole Sadighi is also a member of our Transnational Radical Party"-- Stefania Lepanna).

DoctorZIn, I came with questions and concerns, and you are cementing my concerns with your lack of concern over these matters.

21 posted on 01/25/2004 6:50:31 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: DoctorZIn
I just wanted to ad, that Sadighi is not just an unimportant figure in the SMCCDI. According to this posted on the SMCCDI website, she is "SMCCDI's Representative" and the "European co-ordinator of the main opposition movement to the ayatollah regime".
22 posted on 01/25/2004 7:14:33 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: William McKinley
“Excessive partiality for one foreign nation and excessive dislike of another cause those whom they actuate to see danger only on one side, and serve to veil and even second the arts of influence on the other. Real patriots who may resist the intrigues of the favorite are liable to become suspected and odious, while its tools and dupes usurp the applause and confidence of the people, to surrender their interests”

George Washington

23 posted on 01/25/2004 8:03:37 AM PST by JohnGalt ("...but both sides know who the real enemy is, and, my friends, it is us.")
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To: William McKinley
What makes you think they are not supportive of Reza Pahlavi now?
24 posted on 01/25/2004 8:31:44 AM PST by nuconvert ( It's a naive domestic Burgundy without any breeding, ..I think you'll be amused by its presumption)
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To: DoctorZIn
I appears that you are saying that unless these Iranians can prove they are ideologically pure and committed to your version of anti-socialism, then we should stop all support for their quest for freedom and give them over to the socialists.

If the main goal has always been to further democracy while defeating the terrorists, in line with the Bush administration's goal... wouldn't it also be true that when it comes time to rebuild a nation after its revolution, the US would be there to help? Prior to the uprising of the Islamic republic, didn't the US and Iran enjoy many years of common goals and mutual agreement? Won't it be possible to return to such cooperation, in peace?

I think of socialist Europe, and realize that the EU is not reaching out with open arms to the Iranian people, but instead props up the regime. In the war in Iraq, we have support from former Eastern Bloc nations that recognize the dangers of communism, Poland chief among them. In the aftermath of revolution in Iran, wouldn't those that recognize the evils of communism rally around the Iranian people as they begin to form their government?

In gathering support for freedom in Iran, the people are desperate for resources. If we do not stand up to help them, and show them the power of a republican form of government, then we have failed. Leaving them to the leftists is not an answer. Railing against the evils of socialism will not show the people the danger. Their movement is so young and so weak, why dash their hopes before they have even begun to fight?

The media and leftist movements in America appear to ignore Iran. If a socialist agenda could gather strength, wouldn't we hear more about it in the press? Why is it that the regime's greatest ally, the socialists in Europe, cannot keep the puppets in power? They cannot protect them from themselves.

This is all much ado about nothing, unless revolution comes. And with the boot of the mullahs on the necks of the people, I do not see revolution on the horizon. And that is the tragedy, not the concern over the specter of socialism in the future.

25 posted on 01/25/2004 8:42:08 AM PST by Pan_Yans Wife (He who has never hoped can never despair.)
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To: nuconvert
I think that almost certainly, some are.

I am equally convinced, some are radical leftist. Sadaghi's involvement is enough to make that apparent.

Understanding how much sway each faction has is important. One of the reasons that Iran is in the mess it is now is that in the late 70s, groups bought into change without having a true understanding of who would be empowered by the change.

Perhaps some think a crapshoot is a good idea-- hey, let's roll the dice. It can't end up worse than we have now, can it? Get rid of the theocracy, and let's take our chances.

My answer is, it most certainly can end up worse than we have now. You see, a far left regime would be just as tragic for the Iranian people, but would be harder to remove because instead of being the focus of the left-controlled humanitarian groups like Amnesty International, they would get only cursory attention from those groups. They would have the support of far-left groups worldwide, they would have apologetics in the United States media preventing any groundswell of support.

In other words, pretty much there is one shot here once the regime is deposed for the Iranian people for several decades. If the far left, such as those of the same mindset as the TRP, win the day, the opportunity for freedom for the Iranian people will be gone for an entire generation.

26 posted on 01/25/2004 8:44:27 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: William McKinley
I understand your concerns. No one wants Iran to end up with a far left government.

As far as I understand, they are still supportive of Pahlavi.
27 posted on 01/25/2004 8:53:25 AM PST by nuconvert ( It's a naive domestic Burgundy without any breeding, ..I think you'll be amused by its presumption)
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To: William McKinley
Reading anything by Jack Wheeler is worth it..especially about Muslims, Islam or the Quran....
28 posted on 01/25/2004 9:34:13 AM PST by hosepipe
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To: William McKinley; DoctorZIn; F14 Pilot
I recognize your concerns on this matter, however, the history of revolutions show that they're far more effective when all opposition groups unite.

All opposition against the Islamic Republic must unite under one banner to be able to effectively battle the regime. The regime has it's supporters, some 15% are fiercly loyal and will gives their lives in a second to defend the regime. They also have supporters in Europe, Russia, China, and even in the United States so in order to psychologically, and politically battle the regime and their supporters --opposition must be united.

Don't worry- "Leftists", don't have a chance of taking over Iran's government in free and fair elections. A Leftist organization is the MKO, or MEK, and they have very minimal support inside the country. Of course, there is always the possibility of them taking over with brutal force, but i think our government is more prepared to take on that possibility and won't allow it to happen.

But you bring up a good point in that we have to be careful that what happened in 1979 doesn't happen again. The majority of the people demonstrating against the Shah were Social Democrats, Nationalists, and some Leftists, strangely enough because of promises of free and fair elections and democracy they all united under Khomeini.

After taking over Khoemini's followers killed off thousands upon thousands of the people that supported his calls for democracy, whereby he installed the Theocratic Dictatorship we see in Iran today.



29 posted on 01/25/2004 11:33:34 AM PST by freedom44
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To: freedom44
If only one could say that the MEK/MKO were indicative of the entire support of the Iranian left, isolated, without the backing of the people, and completely looney.

Unfortunatley, that is not the case.

The TRP is not involved out of the goodness of their hearts. They aren't just voicing some support because they give a damn about the people of Iran. They are doing so because they believe it advances their strategic and political interests. They obviously feel that they will be well positioned when the revolution comes.

The cavalier attitude being shown to me regarding their influence is not comforting.

And yes, you are correct that the history of revolutions shows that they most often succeed at toppling the regime when all opposition groups unite. But the history of revolutions also shows that more times than not, the people do not end up in any better of a situation, and the history of revolutions in modern times shows that quite often, it is because the far left grabs power.

30 posted on 01/25/2004 12:20:33 PM PST by William McKinley
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