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Couple demands halt to neighbor's smoking
Akron Beacon Journal ^
| 1/23/04
| Phil Trexler
Posted on 01/24/2004 9:17:05 AM PST by mylife
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To: MississippiMan
You are wrong. I won't even waste my time explaining why you are wrong, but just because YOU can't smell the stuff or are bothered doesn't mean you shouldn't have compassion. I see a great lack of compassion here.
To: CurlyDave
"No, you failed to understand the answer. Actually you changed the question you thought I was answering. I did answer the original question, you just couldn't understand the answer."
This was the statement: "By his reasoning many boomers should have birth defects since they were born to parents who probably smoked.Smokers were 50% of the population then and the chances are good that at least one parent smoked."
You responded with: "Let me give you a link:
http://www.pcrm.org/issues/Ethics_in_Human_Research/ethics_human_birthdefects.html and then a quote from that link: "If smoking during pregnancy were eliminated, infant mortality could be reduced by 10% and LBW by 25%."
We have not seen a decline in birth defects that is consistent with the decline in the smoking population. If the statement you point to was fact, we should be able to see the correlation. Instead you spew propoganda as fact.
That is not an answer to the question. It is a failed attempt to answer the question.
"You try to conclude this but only through very invalid logic, once again demonstrating the negative correlation between smoking and intelligence."
You provided the link as an answer, I provided additional information on that link that would end up with ALL WOMEN RECEIVING PRENATAL CARE. Regardless of health coverage. That means that it would be funded by the public. In order to reduce birthdefects prenatal care at a 100% rate would be necessary. (according to the info YOU provided) That means you would support it. The conclusion to that is that you would support a national health care initiative!
Are you picking bits of info and discounting the rest of the information? Probably, you seem to take the same approach with regards to private property rights.
"You have missed the point entirelyno one woman can have enough babies to produce a statistically valid sample. A large number of women can produce statistically valid samples."
Well, then let's see the statistically valid samples! Provide the information that correlates the decline in smoking to the decline in birth defects. Then provide the information that ties it to smoking, rather than medical improvements or genetics. You won't be able to.
"It is this type of insulting & idiotic blather which causes me to leave."
It may be insulting to you, but it is factual. You make claims, state falsehoods as facts then claim you are leaving the thread. That is the typical leftist approach to debate, why deny it? If we make you uncomfortable, you should check out DU, they take the same approach to debate.
"You are free to smoke, just as you are free to waive your arms in the air. Your freedom to waive your arms ends at the tip of my nose. Your freedom to have your smoke bother me ends at my property line."
Wrong. You have to show that the behavior is causing you harm. You can't. Given your position, I would be able to call the government to ensure that you don't wave your hands in the air. It bothers me.
"The real problem is that smokers are the leftists. They want to create a nuisance for the rest of society in order to indulge their own pleasures and then want the rest of society to bear the cost of their nuisance."
You don't even bother to claim harm anymore. Instead you claim that the person that believes in liberty and private property is the leftist. You claim that the use of government force to ensure that you don't have to encounter a nuisance is conservative. You need to rethink your position, given the chance you will soon be losing the ability to do something you enjoy because it is a nuisance to your neighbor.
"You want to impose your will on me me by forcing me to accept the costs & burden of your smoke."
What costs and burden? You have failed to provide any proof of any cost or any burden. You fall back on the offensiveness and nuisance arguments. These do not constitute a cost or burden! Instead you support forcing your preferences on the rest of society.
"Over the years that the government protected your "right" to smoke almost anywhere,..."
The government never "protected" the right to smoke anywhere, they never required that all "public" places allow smoking. They left that choice up to the property owner and I agreed with that. Why tell another lie?
"Despite trampling the rights on non-smokers."
What rights were trampled upon? Were they forced to go onto any privately owned property?
"Now that we have started to realize the consequences of smoking, smokers are still demanding the "right" to pollute. Well, the rest of us are fighting back. And winning."
What consequences. The results of every study are ambigous at best. No one would claim that smoking is healthy, but the "facts" that are spread around are not true either. Instead, the actual consequences are not known.
In addition, this statement really lets us know the true agenda that you have. The conversation is about SHS and the potential "risks" of exposure. Now you turn it into a "consequences of smoking" discussion. You would rather control the behavior of all others to the point that they would not be allowed to smoke. Regardless of any SHS exposure you may suffer.
1,062
posted on
01/28/2004 9:50:46 AM PST
by
CSM
(Council member Carol Schwartz (R.-at large), my new hero! The Anti anti Smoke Gnatzie!)
To: Paved Paradise
"We KNOW secondhand smoke causes problems."
What problems. Show us the studies.
1,063
posted on
01/28/2004 9:51:44 AM PST
by
CSM
(Council member Carol Schwartz (R.-at large), my new hero! The Anti anti Smoke Gnatzie!)
To: Paved Paradise
I don't smoke BUT since you brought it up... one person's odiferous perfume is MY constant sneezing, watery eyed allergy but I'm not outlawing cheap a$$ walmart cologne.
To: Paved Paradise
"I've even had a nice drive on a beautiful day ruined because the loser in front of me is puffing away and I can smell it. My advice to all the smoking whiners is JUST SAY NO and quit trying to make us out to be the bad guys. You wouldn't want to be smelling someone's crackpipe nor would you want to be around someone cleaning with noxious fumes. Well guess what?"
Yep, those nice beautiful drives ruined by smoking is a reason to restrict the use of private property. My quite time sitting in my front yard was ruined by the smell of your exhaust, why do you think you have the right to ruin my day. We better ban any leisure driving!
While we are at it we better ban cleaning, those noxious fumes stink and it ruins my day!
1,065
posted on
01/28/2004 9:55:11 AM PST
by
CSM
(Council member Carol Schwartz (R.-at large), my new hero! The Anti anti Smoke Gnatzie!)
To: mylife
SHOOT THEM!
It's what they really want.
1,066
posted on
01/28/2004 10:00:09 AM PST
by
Lady Jag
(It's in the bag)
To: CSM
Leisure driving, from someone who chose the moniker "Paved
Paradise", no less.
I sense another Perfect one who has it's own particular cravings, in this case a verbal thrashing to within an inch of it's life for it's hypocrisy. But I'm growing tired of the "I'm better than you are" types who in twisted fashion waltz in here seeking a Father/Confessor. I banish it also from the ideological gene pool.
1,067
posted on
01/28/2004 10:25:37 AM PST
by
JoJo Gunn
(Help control the Leftist population - have them spayed or neutered. ©)
To: LisaMalia
I,like your mother,smoked and had five healthy ,normal birth-weight, babies.
When I packed my little suitcase to go to the hospital for delivery (we stayed 5 days at that time),the first thing I packed were my cigarettes.
Ah,the good old days,when people believed in "live and let live".
1,068
posted on
01/28/2004 10:29:11 AM PST
by
Mears
To: Paved Paradise
My advice to all the smoking whiners is JUST SAY NOMy advice to you is to read the article more carefully. "Love Thy Neighbor"? This "nutty professor" is stalking this woman. He should be arrested.
loser in front of me is puffing away and I can smell it.
Did someone force you in the car with them? If not, who's the loser here????????????
1,069
posted on
01/28/2004 10:31:50 AM PST
by
LisaMalia
(Buckeye Fan since birth!!)
To: CurlyDave
I used to live in a condo and your ridiculous suggestion that she just put up a little garden shed and smoke in it really makes me laugh.
I doubt if the condo association would allow it,just as they don't allow a lot of things.
1,070
posted on
01/28/2004 10:32:29 AM PST
by
Mears
To: Mears
Live and let live? What's that mean? (snicker snort)
People who have never smoked will never understand..regardless of their own bad habits..whatever they may be. The exhaust fumes are a perfect example..we are addicted to our cars..we can't live without them. No one could possibly tolerate the smell from horses exhaust either. :-\
1,071
posted on
01/28/2004 10:33:26 AM PST
by
Freedom2specul8
(Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
To: Mears
Yep, but apparently they allow smoking on the common grounds!
1,072
posted on
01/28/2004 10:39:10 AM PST
by
CSM
(Council member Carol Schwartz (R.-at large), my new hero! The Anti anti Smoke Gnatzie!)
To: Paved Paradise
You are wrong. I won't even waste my time explaining why you are wrong, but just because YOU can't smell the stuff or are bothered doesn't mean you shouldn't have compassion. I see a great lack of compassion here. I have NO idea where you drew your conclusions from. I LOATHE the smell of cigarette smoke. LOATHE it. I also hate the smell of certain spices when cooking. And dogs pooping. But I also realize that other people have different tastes and opinions, likes and dislikes; I understand that I'm not the center of the universe, that I don't have the right to inflict my preferences on everyone around me.
MM
To: CSM
The issue of smoking outdoors probably never came up until this jerk arrived.
The deck on which she was smoking and the driveway to the unit's garage are considered common property but the owner(or tenant) of the unit has "exclusive use".
This idiot wouldn't be happy no matter what the smoker did,he just wants her gone.
1,074
posted on
01/28/2004 10:48:49 AM PST
by
Mears
To: Mears
"This idiot wouldn't be happy no matter what."
nuff said!
1,075
posted on
01/28/2004 10:50:49 AM PST
by
CSM
(Council member Carol Schwartz (R.-at large), my new hero! The Anti anti Smoke Gnatzie!)
To: Mears
At our last house, we had a neighbor who enjoyed cigars..his wife wouldn't let him smoke in the house, so he spent time on the deck. Maybe once a week.
If I was outside, I just went back in until he was finished. It didn't bother me....it's all a give and take thing. We had 2 dogs that barked during inconvenient times...such as when we were gone. BUT...if they had company outside, I brought my dogs in out of courtesy.
The guy in question.."Robert Zangrando" should have known that moving into condos forces one to be connected EVEN CLOSER in proximity to the neighbors. He chose to live there. There are other living options that could have been more suitable to his needs. This is just ridiculous.
1,076
posted on
01/28/2004 10:57:37 AM PST
by
Freedom2specul8
(Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
To: MississippiMan
And
you are the kind I willingly chose years ago not to be a militant and go outdoors.
1,077
posted on
01/28/2004 11:10:59 AM PST
by
JoJo Gunn
(Help control the Leftist population - have them spayed or neutered. ©)
To: CSM; JoJo Gunn; Mears; Paved Paradise
These are things/people that contribute to any
stress-related health issues I may have now or in the future.
Pompous, obnoxious people
Domestic violence
Liberal rhetoric
Babs Streisand, Alec Baldwin, Michael Moore, and other Hollyweirders
Coffee drinkers who OD and talk incessantly
Men and women who bathe in cologne/perfume
Defense attorneys who get rich off of making sure famous murderers/rapists/child abusers go free
People who bilk the welfare system, and take my money when they could be out working
Liberal politicians who promote the welfare system
The so called "Kennedy legacy"
Bleeding hearts who degrade smokers, while they pollute the air with the cars they drive
Farm Aid, for being a fraud
Environmentalists who put people out of jobs
PETA for putting animals before people
The ACLU for defending causes such as NAMBLA
Racism
Unpatriotic Americans
These things/people are inflicted on me by watching or reading the news, or just living my everyday life. And that is just the beginning of my list.
1,078
posted on
01/28/2004 11:15:41 AM PST
by
LisaMalia
(Buckeye Fan since birth!!)
To: Gabz
It's all pretty surreal sometimes, huh?
1,079
posted on
01/28/2004 11:27:14 AM PST
by
JoJo Gunn
(Help control the Leftist population - have them spayed or neutered. ©)
To: r9etb
Maybe the Liberal retired professor is living too close to GOODYEAR!! ..huh, maybe?
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