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Israel promises painful response to bus bombing: BOMBER WAS A PA POLICE OFFICER
Jerusalem Post ^ | Jan. 29, 2004 | By BRET STEPHENS

Posted on 01/29/2004 10:23:15 AM PST by Cinnamon Girl

Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz are to convene Thursday evening to discuss Israel's reaction to the deadly suicide attack on a Jerusalem bus Thursday morning.

The meeting is to take place following the national ceremony planned to take place at 9:00pm in Ben-Gurion Airport, were the bodies of Omer Sawayid, Benny Avraham and Adi Avitan are to arrive from Germany.

Ten people were murdered and 50 wounded when a suicide bomber exploded inside a bus on the corners of Gaza and Arlozorov streets, near the Prime Minister's residence in Jerusalem's Rehavia neighborhood at about 8:45 Thursday morning.

It was the 29th suicide bombing in the capital's history. Israel's response to Thursday's attack will be painful, Channel One reported officials as saying.

The names of five victims have been released: Dana Itah, 24; Chana Anya Bonder, 38; Baruch Matziashvilli, 38; Eli Tzfira, 47, all from Jerusalem, and Yehezkel Goldberg, 42, from Beitar-Ilit.

Eli Tzfira was buried in the capital's Shamgar cemetery at 5:30pm Thursday.

Twelve people are listed in very serious condition in three Jerusalem Hospitals. [See bottom of story for Hospital telephone numbers].

Thirty-one of the wounded are still in hospitals around Jerusalem. Two of them, ages 73 and 13, are in critical condition and are fighting for their lives. Deputy manager of Shaare Tzedek Medical Center, Ovadia Shemesh, said to Channel Two he believes that the two patients will pull through.

Assistant director general of Hadassah Ein Kerem Hospital Prof. Shmuel Shapira said 10 wounded had arrived at the hospital. Five were seriously wounded, and five others moderately wounded. Most of those brought to the hospital were in their early twenties, Channel One reported.

Prof. Shapira said most of the wounded were suffering from lesions caused by metal shards and from the impact of the explosion. "They put into these bombs metal balls, nails and bolts," Shapira said.

Yasser Arafat's Fatah-linked al-Aksa Martyrs Brigades claimed responsibility for the attack in a call to Army Radio.

The suicide bomber, identified as Ali Jaara, 24, a Palestinian Authority policeman from the Aida refugee camp on the outskirts of Bethlehem, left a note saying that he wanted to avenge eight Palestinians killed in fighting with Israeli troops in the Gaza Strip Wednesday.

IDF officers said on Army Radio that Thursday's suicide bombing takes more than one day to prepare, and reject the claim it was carried out as a response to Wednesday's operation in Gaza.

Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz convened the heads of the security establishment and other agencies to discuss the implications of the bombing, and Israel's response.

Mofaz was joined in the meeting by IDF Chief of General Staff Lt.-Gen. Moshe Ya'alon, Shin Bet Chief Avi Dichter and other security chiefs. The bomb weighed between 6KG to 7KG and was packed with metal shards. It was placed inside a bag carried by the suicide bomber.

Mofaz decided not to clamp a full closure on the territories following the attacks. The defense minister said targeted action would be taken against the terror groups.

The al-Aksa Martyrs Brigades said the suicide bomber left his Bethlehem home at 4 a.m. Thursday to make his way to Jerusalem. Jaara, who lived with his parents and nine siblings, was described by relatives as quiet and a devout Muslim who showed little interest in politics.

"I was expecting to marry him, not to bury him," Jaara's father said.

Many family members said they opposed militant attacks against Israelis. "These operations are not only not good for us, but really bad for us. They only hurt us," said his 26-year-old sister, Ola.

Palestinian Authority officials condemned the bombing.

According to police reports, the suicide bomber managed to explode at the back of the bus, ripping off its roof. The bus driver said he did not notice any suspicious-looking person enter the bus, Israel Radio reported. Police are investigating how the bomber got through, and who assisted him.

Jerusalem Police chief Mickey Levy said there were a large number of fatalities. "The bomb was very big, the entire back end of the bus was ripped apart," he said. Levy added that the police had no specific warning for the attack.

"Jerusalem Police have recently managed to stop several attacks, including the seizure of three explosive belts. All of these planned attacks are still being investigated," he said,. "We had no specific warning of Today's attack and we couldn't stop it."

"The explosive was a large one," Levy continued, and "we will investigate with the Egged bus company why there was no security person on the bus."

Half the roof of the bus was lifted 12 meters in the air and was visible hundreds of meters away from the back part of the bus. On the bus itself, every window had been blown out. There were three entire human corpses inside the bus and two others lying outside.

There was a moped that was hit by the explosion, but it was not clear whether the moped driver was amongst those murdered or injured.

Keren, 14, an eyewitness who was waiting for the bus, told Army Radio that the bus blew up meters before it arrived at the station. People began running towards the bus, she said, and then police arrived followed by ambulances. "I remained rooted to the spot, crying, until I was taken to hospital."

Police and security service said they receive between 50 and 60 general terror attack warnings per day.

Islamic Jihad and Hizbullah welcomed the bombing but did not accept responsibility.

Abdel Aziz Rantissi, a Hamas leader in Gaza, stopped short of claiming responsibility but said, "It's not important who carried out this operation. The only thing which is very important is that we are resisting occupiers who came ... to occupy our land and to kill our people," he said.

The explosion occurred moments after the bus pulled away from the bus stop on Arlozorov street. The bus starts its route in Hadassah Ein Kerem and makes its way to Hadassah Mount Scopus.

Following the explosion, disoriented people were seen milling around, some were seen at the scene walking around with pieces of human flesh on them. A great deal of blood was seen on the ground, and broken glass littered the streets.

There was a ghostly silence immediately after the attack; the silence one feels in Jerusalem on Shabbat.

Many of the people had managed to get off and make their way to the corner of Arlozorov and Gaza Streets. Some were sitting there in silence. Some of them had pieces of flesh on their jackets.

One person seems to have had his ear torn in half.

Another women was bleeding profusely, her face covered in blood.

Police chief Insp.-Gen. Shlomo Aharonishky said, "This takes us back to the difficult days of the past. There is no change in strategy on the other side. They are always trying to carry out attacks. The thin line of defense comprises the work of the security services, the IDF, Police and Shin Bet. Even despite this we cannot thwart every attack," Aharonishky said.

Aharonishky said the security fence being built around the West Bank would help security forces thwart attacks, but added that there was no foolproof way to stop terrorism. "Let me remind you that even the Great Wall of China had holes in it," he said.

Road blocks were set up by police at all major exits from Jerusalem causing traffic jams at the Gush Etzion Tunnel road.

Scores of Palestinians have been detained at the roadside, and large vehicles are being searched.

US ambassador to Israel Dan Kurtzer expressed his horror and shock at the murder of innocent Jews and reiterated his belief that "the Palestinians must take all steps to make this stop. To stop incitements and assistance to this murder of Jews and to take very specific action to uproot terrorism from their midst."

The Council of Europe condemned the deadly suicide bombing as a "mindless and indiscriminate act of violence."

Israel's former ambassador to the UN Dore Gold said, "Only the deployment of the Israeli army has prevented more attacks and only the final completion of the security fence will prevent more attacks in the future."

Cancelling a trilateral meeting between Israel, the Palestinian Administration and US envoys John Wolf and David Satterfield, the Israeli foreign ministry and Prime Minister's office issued a joint statement saying, "On this difficult day for Israel, in which innocent Israelis are murdered on the streets of its capital, there is no room for concessions to the Palestinian public."

Shalom said that the PA must do all it has pledged to do – to fight terror; otherwise there will be no advance in the process.

Wolf and Satterfield have already met with the both sides, and were to host the trilateral meeting Thursday to re-ignite the stalled US road map.

PA Prime Minister Ahmed Qurei, who Thursday agreed to meet PM Ariel Sharon without preconditions, condemned the suicide bombing in Jerusalem.

Daniel Taub – a spokesman for the Israeli foreign office told the BBC, "this particular attack took place on a bus that runs between two hospitals and there is no depth to which these terrorists are not prepared to sink."

Jerusalem Mayor Uri Lupolianski said "a day that should have been a happy one started with many dead and injured. We are one family, made of hard stuff, but this kind of attack has implications for Jerusalem after several months of quiet."

"Terrorists will always find excuses to kill us," he continued. "There is no doubt that intentions exist. I'm glad the fence is going up. I only wish it was happening faster because we all know it protects us all."

The Palestinian Administration condemned the attack. Chief PA negotiator Saeb Erekat said they condemn any attack upon innocent civilians, Israeli or Palestinian.

This is the second explosion near the prime minister's residence, the first occurring on March 5, 2002 at the Moment Cafe. The Prime Minister was not at his Jerusalem residence at the time of the attack.

Diplomatic officials said the prisoner swap with the Hizbullah would continue despite the attack.

Emergency phone numbers for hospitals are: Hadassa Ein Karem – 1255122 Hadassa Mt. Scopus – 1255123 Sha'are Zedek – 1255125

New immigrants can call 1255081010

Jerusalem Municipality hotline – 1255023106

Special number for hearing impaired – 02-6430255

Tovah Lazaroff and AP contributed to this article


TOPICS: Extended News; Israel
KEYWORDS:
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The cycle of violence needs to end, the palestinians need to take steps, blah blah blah... SHUT UP! SHUT UP! STOP TALKING!
1 posted on 01/29/2004 10:23:17 AM PST by Cinnamon Girl
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To: Cinnamon Girl
Palestinian violence will end when either the Palestinians have successfully murdered every last Jew, or when the Palestinians themselves have been so utterly crushed they are at the feet rather than at the throat. It's how they are.
2 posted on 01/29/2004 10:27:08 AM PST by wizardoz ("Crikey! I've lost my mojo!")
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To: Cinnamon Girl
Arafat couldn't stand Hezbollah getting all the attention these days...Arafat's way of showing he's still a player.
3 posted on 01/29/2004 10:29:08 AM PST by Shermy
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To: Cinnamon Girl
Good thing we've got a RoadMap to peace to prevent this sort of thing.
4 posted on 01/29/2004 10:30:00 AM PST by Pubbie (We would have the WMDs if Powell and Rice hadn't made a 6 month UN detour)
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To: Cinnamon Girl
What Bush should be saying:

"Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war"
5 posted on 01/29/2004 10:30:20 AM PST by 2banana
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To: Cinnamon Girl
Ariel Sharon will bomb another empty outhouse, and the UN will call together the General Council to criticize it.

Then, Ariel will let the Palestinians back into Israel to "work," and George Bush will give Yasser Arafat more of our tax money.

At least, if history is any indication.
6 posted on 01/29/2004 10:31:04 AM PST by adam_az (Be vewy vewy qwiet, I'm hunting weftists.)
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To: Pubbie
See the Paleostinians have gone above and beyond the Roadmap for Peace! :p
7 posted on 01/29/2004 10:31:40 AM PST by adam_az (Be vewy vewy qwiet, I'm hunting weftists.)
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To: Cinnamon Girl
Israel's response to Thursday's attack will be painful

Good! And their response to the State Department and U.N. bitching and whining to Israel about "the cycle of violence" and "the Palestinians need to take steps" ought to be "GO TO HELL!"

8 posted on 01/29/2004 10:32:03 AM PST by StoneColdGOP (McClintock - In Your Heart, You Know He's Right)
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To: Cinnamon Girl
The cycle of violence needs to end, the palestinians need to take steps, blah blah blah... SHUT UP! SHUT UP! STOP TALKING!

More and more I wonder if there is any point talking to the followers of a cult of death that believe that their g*d demands them to kill.

The only language these savages appear to understand is FORCE and HUMILIATION.

9 posted on 01/29/2004 10:33:40 AM PST by USF
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To: Cinnamon Girl
"These operations are not only not good for us, but really bad for us. They only hurt us," said his 26-year-old sister, Ola.

...as she kisses her house BUH BYE...

May your brother burn in hell.

10 posted on 01/29/2004 10:38:00 AM PST by USF
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To: USF
Get the fence up Israel!
11 posted on 01/29/2004 10:38:39 AM PST by Nagilum
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To: Shermy
Arafat couldn't stand Hezbollah getting all the attention these days...Arafat's way of showing he's still a player.

I sure wouldn't mind reading that Arafat was a suicide bomber himself. Who managed to blow himself up while preparing, and took some other PA folks with him.

12 posted on 01/29/2004 10:44:09 AM PST by Professional Engineer (NASA bumper sticker: My other Rover is a FORD too.)
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To: Cinnamon Girl
And at the same time that the news of this atrocity were breaking on FoxNews, they were showing videos of a busload of smiling Palestinians who were being released by the Israelis!

The Israelis should have hit the bus with a Hellfire as it was driving away. Fair is fair, sez I...

13 posted on 01/29/2004 10:46:24 AM PST by Kenton ("Life is tough, and it's really tough when you're stupid" - Damon Runyon)
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To: Kenton
Did you get the exchange rate on that prisoner swap transaction? Apparently one Israeli life is worth the lives of 100 palestinians... Worth bearing that in mind when planning the retaliation on the terrorist swine for this barbaric attack.
14 posted on 01/29/2004 10:52:11 AM PST by USF
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To: Kenton
Where did they release them?
15 posted on 01/29/2004 10:54:10 AM PST by cookcounty (JohnFKerry: "The only man in history to be on both sides of 3 wars.")
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To: adam_az
Sadly, I totally agree with you.

The equivalent on the American side would be Clintoons responses to terror in the 90's.

2 million dollar into empty tent up camels a$$.

When is Israel gonna get serious?
16 posted on 01/29/2004 10:55:20 AM PST by Sabretooth (I'm not SabERtooth, Im SabREtooth.)
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To: 2banana
"Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war"

The very big dogs, indeed.

17 posted on 01/29/2004 10:57:37 AM PST by americanSoul (Better to die on your feet, than live on your knees. Live Free or Die. I should be in New Hampshire.)
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To: americanSoul
What the Palestinians should be saying:

"Who let the dogs out?"
18 posted on 01/29/2004 11:00:32 AM PST by 2banana
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To: Cinnamon Girl
This isn't going to end until Israel has the balls to declare absolute war against the PLO. Invade the refugee camps, kick them out into Jordon and Egypt and erect a bigger wall. Attack any nation in the region harboring terrorists.
19 posted on 01/29/2004 11:01:17 AM PST by StolarStorm
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To: cookcounty
I'm not sure where the release took place, but they went to Beirut.
20 posted on 01/29/2004 11:01:27 AM PST by Kenton ("Life is tough, and it's really tough when you're stupid" - Damon Runyon)
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To: Cinnamon Girl
Neutron bomb sunrise on the West Bank seems like a good idea now.
21 posted on 01/29/2004 11:04:02 AM PST by Centurion2000 (Resolve to perform what you must; perform without fail that what you resolve.)
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To: wizardoz
I thought they practiced the religion of peace? /so
22 posted on 01/29/2004 11:04:25 AM PST by Jaded (Personally, I think they should bring back flogging and burning at the stake. /so)
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To: Cinnamon Girl
The cycle of violence needs to end, the palestinians need to take steps, blah blah blah... SHUT UP! SHUT UP! STOP TALKING!

I have a couple of responses in mind, however they might be considered inappropriate. This will go on for eternity if something isn't done. Why should Israel put up with her citizens being murdered every day when they know who is responsible? I think everyone here is thinking the same thing I am....

23 posted on 01/29/2004 11:06:00 AM PST by TheSpottedOwl (Happy Iraqi Independence Day!!!!)
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To: Kenton
BOMB Mecca, BOMB Medina, BOMB Cairo, BOMB Aman, BOMB Damascus. the arabs must be treated as One nation as they themselves say that they are. They have declared war now give it to them.
24 posted on 01/29/2004 11:06:50 AM PST by kazatzkeh (Beware of the Socialist Humanist Intellectual Totalitarians)
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To: adam_az
Israeli promises of painful responses have become a joke. They were going to take out Arafat, they were going to take out Yasin, yet these guys are still around and leading the murder. The Israelis should just shut up and make their response. They should make it painful enough to upset everyone, since everyone will be upset with them in any case.
25 posted on 01/29/2004 11:07:23 AM PST by Honestfreedom
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To: Cinnamon Girl
Here is my standard, but simple response.

Kill Arafat and everyone else within a mile of him, and unleash the feriousity of the IDF on the terrorists with no gloves on.

26 posted on 01/29/2004 11:09:39 AM PST by lormand (Dead People Vote DemocRAT)
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To: TheSpottedOwl
see post #26
27 posted on 01/29/2004 11:11:11 AM PST by lormand (Dead People Vote DemocRAT)
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To: Honestfreedom
Israeli promises of painful responses have become a joke. They were going to take out Arafat, they were going to take out Yasin, yet these guys are still around and leading the murder. The Israelis should just shut up and make their response. They should make it painful enough to upset everyone, since everyone will be upset with them in any case.

I agree. Pain is a wonderful motivation tool."Everyone" hates Israel already, so it's not going to exactly be a public relations nightmare.

28 posted on 01/29/2004 11:12:37 AM PST by TheSpottedOwl (Happy Iraqi Independence Day!!!!)
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To: lormand
I wish the hell they would. I can't stand seeing these pictures of innocent people being murdered, while the murders get away with it.
29 posted on 01/29/2004 11:15:35 AM PST by TheSpottedOwl (Happy Iraqi Independence Day!!!!)
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To: Cinnamon Girl
Abdel Aziz Rantissi, a Hamas leader in Gaza, stopped short of claiming responsibility but said, "It's not important who carried out this operation. The only thing which is very important is that we are resisting occupiers who came ... to occupy our land and to kill our people," he said.

Its not your land barbarian, God gave the land to Israel and nobody else. You are an arab migrant worker and there is no such thing as a palestinian accept maybe an arab living in Jordan. You are a murdering subhuman barabarian guest worker that has overstayed your visit and need to be erradicated from the land.

It is hopeless to negotiate with these arab idiots as long as they are taught and believe the land they are trying to steal buy murder is theirs when it never was or never will be. Add to this a muslim religion that teaches to kill Jews and that heaven awaits you for doing so, makes for the most evil combination beyond radical kamakazi's or nazi hitler youth combined into an arab barbarian hord which needs to be erradicated or exterminated. There will never be peace until Israel removes every arab barbarian or until God puts an end to it.

30 posted on 01/29/2004 11:18:10 AM PST by Mat_Helm
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To: wizardoz; adam_az
Both right on! So, why doesn't Israel go for broke and break out of this slow death cycle? My patience has run out with the stupidity of those who believe in negotiating with the Palestinians. They should be exterminated ASAP!
31 posted on 01/29/2004 11:22:42 AM PST by fatidic
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To: Nagilum
Get the fence up Israel!
32 posted on 01/29/2004 11:38:23 AM PST by samtheman
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To: TheSpottedOwl
"Everyone" hates Israel already, so it's not going to exactly be a public relations nightmare.

Your comment is the absolute truth

No one likes us-I don't know why
We may not be perfect, but heaven knows we try
But all around, even our old friends put us down
Let's drop the big one and see what happens

We give them money-but are they grateful?
No, they're spiteful and they're hateful
They don't respect us-so let's surprise them
We'll drop the big one and pulverize them

They all hate us anyhow
So let's drop the big one now
Let's drop the big one now

Excerpts from "Political Science" - Randy Newman

It's so past time for the Israeli citizens to stop living in this nightmare of terror, murder and mayhem. What are the chances that Sharon will find a pair of brass ones?

33 posted on 01/29/2004 11:39:49 AM PST by lonevoice (Some things have to be believed to be seen)
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To: Kenton
That was my first thought too. Why on earth do the Israelis keep releasing these deviants to offer themselves up as their own next murderers?
34 posted on 01/29/2004 11:42:27 AM PST by freeangel (freeangel)
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Yehuda; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; ...
If you'd like to be on or off this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

Were I a terrorist, the threat of implorement would terrify me.

And I once again implore the Palestinian leaders, and especially Prime Minister Abu Ala, to do everything in his power, everything in their power, to ostracize these terrorists, to go after them, and to deal with this terrorist activity

Colin Powell, 1/29/04

35 posted on 01/29/2004 11:44:46 AM PST by SJackson
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To: SJackson
And I once again implore the Palestinian leaders, and especially Prime Minister Abu Ala, to do everything in his power, everything in their power, to ostracize these terrorists, to go after them, and to deal with this terrorist activity

Colin Powell, 1/29/04

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.................

36 posted on 01/29/2004 11:51:00 AM PST by Cinnamon Girl
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To: TheSpottedOwl
Reply to your comment: "I have a couple of responses in mind, however they might be considered inappropriate,,, Why should Israel put up with her citizens being murdered every day when they know who is responsible? I think everyone here is thinking the same thing I am...."



Well, the problem with that is that Israel's hands are bound by the Torah, which contains the Law. It is basically the first five books of the Old Testament.

There is a story in the Old Testament, where an entire city is spared, for the sake of only ten righteous persons.

AND there are actually at least ten righteous Palestinians (I think). So, measures that we might consider appropriate are outside the bounds of ethical Jewish behavior.

So driving out ALL the Palestinians out, as it appears they deserve, is just not an option for the Jewish state.

It is so strange that the Jews are demonized, and made to appear as though they are the "bad guys", and so many others are made to appear to be the "good guys", oppressed by the "Evil Zionist Entity".

I was sure that there was some passage in the Bible where it is stated, "for indeed the devil himself can appear as an angel of light", however, I cannot find it, maybe such a passage does not exist. However, I am sure that is true.



from the Old Testament:
Genesis Chapter 18, excerpted, parentheses inserted by me for clarity.

[23] Then Abraham drew near, and said, "Wilt thou indeed destroy the righteous with the wicked?

[25] Far be it from thee to do such a thing, to slay the righteous with the wicked, so that the righteous fare as the wicked! Far be that from thee! Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?"

[26] And the LORD said, "If I find at Sodom fifty righteous in the city, I will spare the whole place for their sake."

[27] Abraham answered, "Behold, I have taken upon myself to speak to the Lord, I who am but dust and ashes.

[32] Then he (Abraham) said, "Oh let not the Lord be angry, and I will speak again but this once. Suppose ten are found there." He (the Lord) answered, "For the sake of ten I will not destroy it."
37 posted on 01/29/2004 11:51:27 AM PST by RonHolzwarth
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To: SJackson
<< And I once again implore the "'palestinian' leaders" .... >>

Implore them be buggared!

Annihilate and/or deport them from all of Greater Israel. Send them back to their homelands in Trans-Jordan, Lebanon and Egypt! Or to the Egyptian, Dashle Arafat's. In France.
38 posted on 01/29/2004 11:51:43 AM PST by Brian Allen (Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God - Thomas Jefferson)
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To: USF
You commented: "Did you get the exchange rate on that prisoner swap transaction? Apparently one Israeli life is worth the lives of 100 Palestinians... Worth bearing that in mind when planning the retaliation on the terrorist swine for this barbaric attack."

------------------- My reply: Well, it was 400 Palestinian LIVES,
exchanged for ONE Israeli life and THREE dead Israelis,,,

So apparently one Israeli life is worth the lives of 400 Palestinians, instead.

Bodies are dead, just ashes and dust, they don't count in Jewish thought, except for the peace of mind of their families.

And, dead Jews don't look forward to 72 or whatever number of "virgins to f***" in "Paradise", instead, they expect a judgment for their actions on this earth.

There are a LOT of MIGHTY SURPRISED people right after death, I'm sure.
39 posted on 01/29/2004 12:05:18 PM PST by RonHolzwarth
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To: lonevoice
It's so past time for the Israeli citizens to stop living in this nightmare of terror, murder and mayhem. What are the chances that Sharon will find a pair of brass ones?

He needs to find them like yesterday. It's like world opinion of America being a bully. Ok fine, you think we're bad, we'll show you bad! This just has to stop, and the UN needs to be dismantled. They're a big part of the problem. Look at all the time they gave Saddam to hide those chemical weapons. Grrrrr....

40 posted on 01/29/2004 12:29:25 PM PST by TheSpottedOwl (Happy Iraqi Independence Day!!!!)
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To: wizardoz
AFAIK Islamics practice no form of birth control while Israelis are becoming less fecund with each generation; this means the tide will turn on sheer numbers only short of genocide.
41 posted on 01/29/2004 12:40:55 PM PST by Old Professer
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To: RonHolzwarth
May I remind you once again, you are not god.
42 posted on 01/29/2004 12:42:55 PM PST by Old Professer
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To: StoneColdGOP
Israel's response to Thursday's attack will be painful

As per usual, I expect Mofaz' response will be most painful to Israel, or the Settlements. He has decided against stopping the pallies from entering Israel again. All out war is all they will understand, and the people grow extremely impatient. THIS was so in your face, there shouldn't have even had to be a special meeting. I hope the delay was only in wait for Tannenbaum and the three DEAD Israeli Airmen, courtesy of hezbullah b*stard barbarians. But when Tannenbaum is home, there should not be a toothpick left standing anywhere the PLO, Hamas, and Hezbullah are. On to Damascus and Iran!!!

43 posted on 01/29/2004 12:54:39 PM PST by Nix 2 (http://www.warroom.com QUINN AND ROSE from 6-10 AM-104.7 FM in da Burgh&WWVA AM)
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To: RonHolzwarth
Well, the problem with that is that Israel's hands are bound by the Torah, which contains the Law. It is basically the first five books of the Old Testament.

I appreciate that, but doesn't God expect us (I'm RC) to stand up against the wicked and protect ourselves?

There is a story in the Old Testament, where an entire city is spared, for the sake of only ten righteous persons.

Sodom and Gomorrah. I remember that. Abraham pleaded with God to spare the city if he could find a certain number of righteous men. I'm starting to think that the only innocents in the Palestinian state are babies at their mother's breasts. The minute they're weaned, they're fed ideological poison.

AND there are actually at least ten righteous Palestinians (I think). So, measures that we might consider appropriate are outside the bounds of ethical Jewish behavior.

I was sure that there was some passage in the Bible where it is stated, "for indeed the devil himself can appear as an angel of light", however, I cannot find it, maybe such a passage does not exist. However, I am sure that is true.

It's true, in fact there is more than one reference to this. Heck, they're walking the streets. I don't want to be accused of having my tinfoil on too tight, but sometimes I wonder...

There has to be a "loophole" to allow Israel to protect her citizens from suicidal madmen bent on genocide. Somewhere in the bible it is said that Israel will rise again. A lot of us Catholics and Christians sit here and watch the carnage and wonder why can't this be stopped? I totally respect that your religion forbids killing the innocent with the guilty, it's just frustrating for us to watch. A lot of us pray for Israel's safety, and an end to this unending jihad.

44 posted on 01/29/2004 12:54:53 PM PST by TheSpottedOwl (Happy Iraqi Independence Day!!!!)
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To: adam_az
I wonder if this "policeman" was trained by US personnel or with US tax dollars since the US provides funding for the PA police and staff to provide police training
45 posted on 01/29/2004 12:59:13 PM PST by Truth29
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To: TheSpottedOwl
On the contrary. Jews were ORDERED to kill ALL of Amalek and leave no one. Not a single life was to be spared. What makes you ...or anyone...believe that these people ever have had innocence within them whatsoever? Saul disobeyed that order and Amalek is who we fight to this day. The order will not be fulfilled until Amalek is destroyed UTTERLY, and until then, Jews will continue to pay a heavy, heavy price for that disobedience.
46 posted on 01/29/2004 1:05:57 PM PST by Nix 2 (http://www.warroom.com QUINN AND ROSE from 6-10 AM-104.7 FM in da Burgh&WWVA AM)
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To: Truth29
Likely financed trained or both by US. And rest assured he passed his knowledge on to his fellow jihadists in Iraq.
47 posted on 01/29/2004 1:05:59 PM PST by SJackson
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To: Cinnamon Girl
I was going to ask what Pennsylvania has against Israel.
48 posted on 01/29/2004 1:07:52 PM PST by js1138
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To: Nix 2
On the contrary. Jews were ORDERED to kill ALL of Amalek and leave no one. Not a single life was to be spared. What makes you ...or anyone...believe that these people ever have had innocence within them whatsoever? Saul disobeyed that order and Amalek is who we fight to this day. The order will not be fulfilled until Amalek is destroyed UTTERLY, and until then, Jews will continue to pay a heavy, heavy price for that disobedience.

Excuse me for being rusty on the Old Testament. This could be the loophole I was mentioning in my post to Ron.

49 posted on 01/29/2004 1:09:14 PM PST by TheSpottedOwl (Happy Iraqi Independence Day!!!!)
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To: TheSpottedOwl
Yepper. This is the one. It is also the duty of Jews, if they are aware of a clear and present danger to themselves, or anyone else, to do something about it, even if it means another's death. In that case, it is not considered murder. The BIGGER sin is to do nothing.
50 posted on 01/29/2004 1:12:14 PM PST by Nix 2 (http://www.warroom.com QUINN AND ROSE from 6-10 AM-104.7 FM in da Burgh&WWVA AM)
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