Forget Nipplegate, Prepare for Ponchogate

Zap2it.com ^ | 02/04/04

[Pokey78]

LOS ANGELES (Zap2it.com) - The Veterans of Foreign Wars have had it up to here with all of the fuss about the exposure of Janet Jackson's bejeweled breast during Sunday (Feb. 1) night's Super Bowl halftime show. Nudity is one thing, but messing with the American flag is a whole other kettle of fish. Hence, the VFW is taking aim at the unofficial Pimp of the Nation, Kid Rock. While a statement from the 104-year-old organization only describes Jackson's pastie flaunting as "nearly lewd," the VFW takes umbrage at Rock's even less revealing attire. The singer and "Biker Boyz" star took the stage at the halftime show clad in a poncho fashioned either out of an American flag or to look like an American flag.

Either way, the distinction is irrelevant to the VFW, which calls Robert James Ritchie (Mr. Rock to the overly obsequious) out for his "blatant and disgusting desecration of the U.S. flag."

"While MTV and CBS have issued apologies for the Janet Jackson incident, they have yet to address Kid Rock's disgusting use of an American flag as a costume prop," says VFW Commander-in-Chief Edward S. Banas. "The 1.6 million members of the VFW agree that Kid Rock's stunt was in poor taste and extremely disrespectful to the members of our armed forces who everyday pledge their allegiance -- and their life -- to our flag. I find it unconscionable that the entire news media, along with CBS, the NFL and MTV, have yet to address this." It is true that the media has certainly dedicated more time to Jackson's so-called wardrobe malfunction. Miss Jackson has been made into the designated scapegoat by MTV and the FCC is threatening an extensive investigation.

While it's unlikely that the FCC would find much to investigate in Rock's poncho (well, maybe in the pockets), but the VFW web site is happy to provide a lengthy discussion of the proper flag etiquette that has been breached in this case.

[Phantom Lord]

Mr. Rock meant no disrespect and poorly tried to show his patriotism and support of our country. Mr. Rock loves America and our proud military.

[Paradox]

Kid Rock is something of a libertarian/republican. He supports the Iraq War and the troops 100%. Whats next, they gonna go after the Asian fella who works at JPL too?

[Semper Vigilantis]

I was wondering when someone would get po'd about that. My wife and I were shocked when we saw that. Whatever happened to Citizenry classes in school?

...oh yeah, I forgot about that. What was I thinking...?

[anonymous_user]

Judge his intent, not his actions?

"Mr. Rock" needs some basic training in flag ettiquette. He looked like a damned fool.

[humblegunner]

Mr. Rock loves America and our proud military.

I'll bump that!

[OneTimeLurker]

I agree. Judge his intent. I have seen a photo of the President signing a flag with a Sharpie.

[joesnuffy]

I forgot...which branch of service was 'the kid' in again?

[George W. Bush]

He's going to catch flack on this. Ignorance of the flag protocol is no excuse. And he didn't have to wear it, he could have displayed it properly instead as a backdrop or found another way to display.

Casually demeaning the flag can be considered as worse than burning it outright.

I'm with the VFW on this one.

[Columbine]

I didn't like it and I hope the message gets through to Kid Rock and that it doesn't happen again.

But, he is not a military or US basher like so many of these guys.

For that reason, I won't bash him.

[Constitution Day]

Thank you.

[dwilli]

Anybody who thinks Kid Rock, Toby Keith, and that crowd loves this country more than they love selling records
is a little on the gullible side.

[mcg1969]

That's right, wearing a flag for show is just abominable. We should immediately speak up whenever it happens.

Wait a minute, are we talking about this year's halftime show, or the one that U2 headlined when Bono's jacked was lined with an American flag? I forget.

[HELLRAISER II]

I agree, I think in his own way he was trying to be Patriotic.

[Stew Padasso]

What is wrong with celebrating capitalism?

[johnb838]

Mr. Rock is not anti-American, he's just an idiot. He truly makes me want to vomit, but I will grant that he supported the troops and the war.

[George W. Bush]

From the VFW web page:

VFW Seething Over Super Bowl Halftime Entertainment

Kansas City, MO, Feb. 3, 2004--The commander-in-chief of the Veterans of Foreign Wars of the U.S. is outraged with U.S. media organizations for ignoring the blatant and disgusting desecration of the U.S. flag by rock singer Kid Rock during Sunday's Super Bowl Halftime Show. During the halftime performance, Kid Rock slit a hole in the flag and wore it as a poncho.

Edward S. Banas Sr., Voluntown, Conn., said the media have made much of Janet Jackson's raunchy and nearly lewd act, but they have ignored Kid Rock's inappropriate and disrespectful use of the American flag.

"While MTV and CBS have issued apologies for the Janet Jackson incident, they have yet to address Kid Rock's disgusting use of an American flag as a costume prop. The 1.6 million members of the VFW agree that Kid Rock's stunt was in poor taste and extremely disrespectful to the members of our armed forces who everyday pledge their allegiance--and their life--to our flag," Banas said. "I find it unconscionable that the entire news media, along with CBS, the NFL and MTV, have yet to address this."

[HELLRAISER II]

That may be, but I'd much rather buy a CD from some one saying "I love America" than one who constantly bashes America.

[Constitution Day]

12/20/2000: Kid Rock Show To Benefit Victims Of USS Cole Attack

2/24/2003: War talk from Kid Rock (He Backs Bush!!)

[Stew Padasso]

There has to be more pressing issues to tackle for the VFW.

[dwilli]

Not a thing but if'n Ford Motor Co. offers Toby a pile
of dollars to drive his F-150 while dragging the Flag behind, don't stand in front of his pick-up.

[eyespysomething]

Exactly. Give the poor guy a lesson in flag etiquette, but don't condemn him for trying to be patriotic. Its not in vogue now, and it is a statement for him to try to do something supportive.

At least he didn't burn it or pee on it.

[johnb838]

Bono isn't American.

[ken5050]

Jay Leno had his sideline comic at the SB..the guy yelled at Kid Rock, as he went by..."I have a tape of me and Pamela doing it.."..the look on KR's face was priceless..

[Pan_Yans Wife]

It was a paper, disposable flag. There was a thread on FR about it, that was planted by a LP troll. Great flame war, that was! :)

[Tanniker Smith]

Without further evidence to the contrary, I'd say that Kid Rock was just ignorant of the proper respect for the flag. Had he stomped on it or spat on it, my feelings would be different. When he first came out, I'd hoped that it was just a poncho with a flag design, and I flinched when I realized that it was a flag with a hole in it.

To his credit, when he took it off, he didn't just discard it. He handed it to a stagehand.... who promptly wadded it up and got rid of it. sigh.

I had a feeling someone might try to bring this up to deflect attention from Janet rather than to bring up the discussion of proper etiquette. We shall see.

ts

[HRoarke]

Ignorance of flag protocol is certainly not an excuse but I'm willing to give him a one time pass. He was among the very few people in this country to give a damn about the sailors on the Cole and raised money for their families.

The VFW isn't lilly white either. They of all people should understand that well meaning people can make mistakes, given their awful treatment of Vietnam vets for years. They should be more focused on putting out the truth about John Kerry and figure out how he is duping Vets to vote for him.

[HELLRAISER II]

I disagree, using the flag like he did may have been stupid & ignorant but I think intent is at least 75% of how I measure something and burning the flag is 100% worse than what Kid Rock did. He was singing I'm so proud to live in the USA wearing the flag, again he may have screwed up but he didn't outright mean to offend anyone in my opinion.

[RedWhiteBlue]

IMO, he WAS trying to be patriotic. Granted, the wearing of the flag was not appropriate, but I thought what he was singing was very supportive of the US. Keep in mind that this was being watched all over the world, including Europe, and that Europe is always trying to criticize our President for being a "cowboy." Kid Rock's was mocking them specifically when he sand that "I'm a cowboy, and I'm proud of the USA!" (Not verbatim, that is as close as I can remember).

[dwilli]

I won't argue that. I haven't bought a record or played
a juke box in many, many years. If I have to watch the
music commercials or record/self promotions over free broadcast, I feel no guilt while file-sharing.

[conserv13]

The 1.6 million members of the VFW agree that Kid Rock's stunt was in poor taste and extremely disrespectful to the members of our armed forces who everyday pledge their allegiance -- and their life -- to our flag.

Was it disrespectful when Kid Rock played concerts in Germany, Kuwait, and Qatar for the troops? Was it disrespectful when Kid Rock donated money to charities to support families of troops killed in Iraq and Afghanistan?

[dwilli]

Some of these patriots(I don't know exactly who) were
paid and seemingly overpaid for these troop-supporting
activities.

[Phantom Lord]

Casually demeaning the flag can be considered as worse than burning it outright. I'm with the VFW on this one.

Where are you and the VFW on President Bush's ignorance of flag etiquette and his defacing of the American flag?

After all, Ignorance of the flag protocol is no excuse.

[HostileTerritory]

That mitigates but does not excuse what he did. How on Earth can someone love the military and not know it was wrong to cut a hole in the flag and throw it over his head?

What kind of patriot doesn't know proper respect for the flag?

[conserv13]

Of course they were paid! It costs a lot of money to fly equipment and personnel around to entertain our troops. And it is money well spent, any homesick soldier will agree.

[cubreporter]

That's what I hear but ... I am doubtful because he took off his "poncho" and tossed it to one of his band members who in turn tossed it on the ground. That is what I heard. First of all, you don't "TOSS" the flag. You "properly handle" the flag. So, support or no...seems his support of the flag which represents the blood fo those those who died to make us free was not appropriate.

[HostileTerritory]

I was pretty stunned that President Bush signed that flag too, frankly. It doesn't seem as important because that photo was much less widely-viewed than the Super Bowl halftime show, and obviously not planned. He wasn't setting a bad example for as many children or offending as many veterans/patriots as Kid Rock was.

[mel]

Yes, perhaps

[conserv13]

Thanks. See my #32.

[eyespysomething]

A lot who maybe didn't feel quite so proud of their country, say, 5 years ago, and have some catching up to do.

[AuntB]

""Mr. Rock" needs some basic training in flag ettiquette"

I agree, but he's not the enemy...we've got plenty of those to worry about. Why not just contact him and let him know he needs to tone it down. Frankly, I'm thrilled when any of these rockers show any kind of patriotism. He's taken flak for it from his "peers".

[Phantom Lord]

Kid Rock, American Bad Ass!

[George W. Bush]

Miniature flag replicas, mostly made in Asia, are not American flags. Nor are flag decals.

Real flags are a different matter.

[AreaMan]

That mitigates but does not excuse what he did. How on Earth can someone love the military and not know it was wrong to cut a hole in the flag and throw it over his head? What kind of patriot doesn't know proper respect for the flag?

The kind that finds his patriotism after a couple of 40-ouncers of malt liquor.

[N3WBI3]

So ignorance is no excuse but obscurity is?

[Phantom Lord]

See post 34.

[dwilli]

My point is that we tend to regard people as super
patriots at times when patriotism is not the driving motive for the action.

The guy who quit the NFL to enlist and complete Ranger
training/combat is a patriot.

Toby Keith/Kid Rock etc. make noise while wrapped in the flag.

[lelio]

tossed it to one of his band members who in turn tossed it on the ground

To me it looked like that band member laid it on some speakers, but the shot pulled away too quickly.

[B4Ranch]

"But, he is not a military or US basher like so many of these guys. For that reason, I won't bash him."

It's time to start bashing this ex-military OFFICER!