THE PASSION -- WILL IT CHANGE THE DYNAMICS OF THE 2004 ELECTION?

Vanity Press ^ | 02-08-04 | CWW (Vanity)

[Sloth]

The Passion of the Christ + gay marriage in Massachusetts + Janet Jackson's right boob = a moral 'perfect storm'?

[mdmathis6]

I think he means the movies like "Left Behind 1 and 2" or the Apocalypse series, or the Omega code 1 or 2

[Sloth]

How many atheists do you know that have read a Left Behind book? The same number will go see Passion.

I have a brother who's an atheist, and I'm confident that he'd never waste his time reading a 'Left Behind' book (nor would I). But it would not surprise me if he did see 'the Passion' either in the theater or later on DVD.

Note, btw, that I actually agree with your overall point that this movie is not going to have a big impact on non-religious people. It's not going to spark a moral revolution. But I also don't think this movie is going to be quite the niche film that you make it out to be.

[discostu]

Given a prospective audience of about 150 million people in America (if you take the surveys that are least favorable to Christianity) I'm not sure it's a true niche. The Superbowl only had an audience of 90 million.

[discostu]

There was a sequel to Omega Code?! There are a lot of bad religious movies out there that's why it's hard to guess which right thinking POS somebody is refering to. And as long as we're complaining about bad entertainment geared towards a religious audience what's up with modern day Christian rock? Shouldn't religious music have soul.

[mdmathis6]

yeah and Michael York and Michael Beihn (if you can believe it of Beihn) starred in Omega Code 2.

It was less about the code and more about the personality of the antichrist which Michael York played convincingly in an otherwise mediocre movie with cheesy special effects. On the other hand if Michael York had had a better script and story line, his portrayal of the AC would be down right scary. Michael Behn played the AC's brother and president of the united states, and seems to broad for this B grade flick.
The movie had an interesting scenario in that as Armegedden was being unleashed, the Chinese(kings of the east fame) who were long chafing under the AC's rule turned its armies against him as well as armies loyal to the president of the US(who had been thrust out of power due to his opposition of his brother the AC).

The performance of York and Beihn were A+, movie was a C-.


Apocalypse 1 had Richard Harris as the apostle John, receiving the book of Revelations while exhiled on Patmos.
I didn't see 2 and 3. #4 had the likes of Gary Busie and Margot Kidder(who had recently converted after hitting bottom personally in Hollywood...drugs,alcohol...she had been found wandering around in a daize with her upper partials missing...but Christ changed her around.).

[mdmathis6]

Christian Rock seems to have morfed into more of a Christian contemporary(ie. pop music that middle class and middle class impersonating Christian parents feel comfortable about letting their 10 to 17 year olds spend their allowances on) style. To me AD, especially when Kerry Livgren from Kansas joined then was the last best Christian Rock band, they disbanded and did a couple of studio items when so called Christian promoters ripped them off from their concert proceeds. When I played a few of their songs to a Christian man in his fifties, he was begging me for a copy of the albums. Kerry's skillfull blending of scriptural doctrine, caustic social commentary("We are the Men" "Progress") and that sense of Kansas orchestral rock perspective put the struggling AD band(early 80') miles beyond where even secular rock bands were interms of artistry(as Michael Omartien had done for Christian Contemporary in the late 70's).

Jars of Clay seem to be the only Christian Rock band worthy of the name at the moment, I remember first hearing "Flood" and being blown away by it. I saw the MTV video and the other video that MTV didn't want shown(rain mud and blackwater), the second works much more than the first.

The Newsboys are another group that stands out.

Unfortunately, much of Christian Rock seems to have devolved into a series of personality cults that get together for WOW reunions and albums; praising each other and doing what else.......(drum roll please)...giving each other "BUTTERFLY KISSES"!

[discostu]

I've always been a big fan of Gospel, and given it's close roots to the blues that to me is the true Christian rock. Good beats, fun, joyful, and with tons and tons of soul. I had an intern that was a big fan of Christian rock (the new dull stuff) and I was always aghast at how mayonaise plain it was. Of course given how cruddy pop music has become I suppose I shouldn't blaim the CR bands, but there's something extra annoying about uninspired inspirational music.

[PeoplesRep_of_LA]

LOL! They haven't been doing that for YEARS!

I just saw 10 Commandment a couple years ago on ABC in its entirety. Is that the best "evidence" you got?

There are NOT many Christians around. Yes, I've seen a census. Many claim to be "Christian" but how they live and vote tells me otherwise.

Uhhhhh, thanks "God". I didn't realize I was actually posting with the Judge of all Judges.

It's just like some want to be labeled "Republicans" however their ideology is diametrically opposed to Republican ideology however it makes em feel good to call themselves "Republicans".

Feel good to be labeled "racist, sexist, bigotted homophobic pigs"? I know there are alot of RINO politicians, but I know no one who votes who found being called a "republican" made them feel good. Not one. Its just like filling out Christian on a Census. You think its somehow desireable, well I have a newsflash for you, in America it feels alot better to be called an Independent who is an Agnostic. Being open minded is thought of as the ultimate virtue. If you were "observing" half as much as you are bragging to me about, that would be patently obvious.

I'm simply applying prophecy to the obvious that is happening. I do wish you'd read the Bible ... then you'd understand.

*slaps forehead* Judge of all Judges, first you put down American Census takers as not being Christian enough for You, now you repeatedly claim that I don't read the Bible? With all due respect, you don't know what you are talking about (again). I do read the Bible, and your assumptions and attempts to put me down have made you look like an a$$.

I look forward to the future. I have faith in the Bible since that is God's Word. His Words tell people what to expect but not when He will return. I suspect it will not be too long till He comes again.

Are you sure you are listening to this book you are lecturing about? It does say no one knows the hour, yet in the same breath you are going on about how its right around the corner!

There's a very good reason God doesn't want us to always think the end is near, because then there are you are Chicken Little's like yourself throwing in the towel because you think there is no responsibility because its all coming to an end soon because its always the worst its ever been. People have been talking like this since the first Century, about how bad the culture is, about War and Famine yet time keeps marching on. Could it be that the world not ending is God's Will???

Yes, that is defeatist, it explains alot about your first post.

It's time to understand what it is you claim to believe and put your faith in Him.

Ah, good advice, you should try following it. Instead of banking that the world will end because of grossly misrepresented Biblical prophesy, you should put your faith in Him and fight for what is Right in the here and now. How do you do that? You be Optimistic about this movie about His Passion for one thing. Its never going to be perfect here on Earth, it never has been, but its worth fighting for.

[mdmathis6]

The newer Christian artists feel they have to imitate not innovate to get markey share. Many Christian recording companies have been bought up by the secular agancies who see that the Religious artists are making more money than the secular artists(another untold dirty secret of the music biz...another secret is that many christian artists don't care about the MP3 downloading peer to peer craze as it gets the WORD out...much to the consternation of their secular masters). Some Christian music is being homogenized by the secular companies to make it less "edgy" more like the secular crap that's out there to "broaden the marketability".

Oh Lord, let there be another group like AD, or the Resurrection Band again, or Petra(circa1986)!

[nmh]

You: I just saw 10 Commandment a couple years ago on ABC in its entirety. Is that the best "evidence" you got?

Me: Yes "a couple of years ago" is correct. I'll repeat again what YOU wrote, you saw the Ten Commandments on TV a COUPLE OF YEARS AGO. Today we don't dare display them for fear of "offending" someone. Things have changed from a couple of YEARS AGO.

Me: There are NOT many Christians around. Yes, I've seen a census. Many claim to be "Christian" but how they live and vote tells me otherwise.

You: Uhhhhh, thanks "God". I didn't realize I was actually posting with the Judge of all Judges.

Me:From what you've written you may very well be in that bunch. Besides, if you read the Bible ... it tells you to make a righteous judgment call. It's really a no brainer seeing Christianity disappearing. I wonder why you can't see that and why you need to become so flippant when confronted with that fact. Could it be that you are really an atheist and not an agnostic? After all you admitted that "feeling good is an aginostic and an independent"?

Me: It's just like some want to be labeled "Republicans" however their ideology is diametrically opposed to Republican ideology however it makes em feel good to call themselves "Republicans".

You: Feel good to be labeled "racist, sexist, bigotted homophobic pigs"? I know there are alot of RINO politicians, but I know no one who votes who found being called a "republican" made them feel good. Not one. Its just like filling out Christian on a Census. You think its somehow desireable, well I have a newsflash for you, in America it feels alot better to be called an Independent who is an Agnostic. Being open minded is thought of as the ultimate virtue. If you were "observing" half as much as you are bragging to me about, that would be patently obvious.

Me; Christians see it as closest to what is written in the Bible. Funny how you suggest Christianity is flourishing out there and then again, you view being a Christian and being labeled a Republican as something to be more or less ashamed of. By your own words you convict yourself of what I have said - Christianity is dying in America. A Christian doesn't need to "brag" about the obvious and I'm certainly not doing that.

Me: I'm simply applying prophecy to the obvious that is happening. I do wish you'd read the Bible ... then you'd understand. You: *slaps forehead* Judge of all Judges, first you put down American Census takers as not being Christian enough for You, now you repeatedly claim that I don't read the Bible? With all due respect, you don't know what you are talking about (again). I do read the Bible, and your assumptions and attempts to put me down have made you look like an a$$.

Me: There you go again, ridiculing what is clearly written in the Bible and trying to ridicule me because I dare speak it. If you ever did read the Bible we wouldn't be having this conversation. I made no attempt to "put you down" and I certainly don't look like an "a$$" however I can't say the same for you.

Me: I strongly suggest you read your Bible - especially on Prophecy. It's actually difficult to avoid reading about it since it's written about all over.

Me: I look forward to the future. I have faith in the Bible since that is God's Word. His Words tell people what to expect but not when He will return. I suspect it will not be too long till He comes again.

You: Are you sure you are listening to this book you are lecturing about? It does say no one knows the hour, yet in the same breath you are going on about how its right around the corner!

Me: I'm not "listening" to a book. I'm paraphrasing what is written in the Bible. I don't know exactly when He'll come but I do know that it's not so far off due to what is written in that Book. Signs are all over the place but since you are not familiar with the Bible and lack belief you do not see it and don't want to see it.

You: There's a very good reason God doesn't want us to always think the end is near, because then there are you are Chicken Little's like yourself throwing in the towel because you think there is no responsibility because its all coming to an end soon because its always the worst its ever been.

If God didn't want us to know signs of His coming He would not have clearly stated them in the Bible. I'm not the one that is afraid ... nor am I, as you put it "Chicken Little". I haven't heard that phrase since I was a little. "Throwing in the towel" - LOL!

Me: Till He comes, I will do what is right and from how youdescribe yourself, an agnostic we won't have the same guidelines ... . Unlike you though I have alot to look forward to. I don't have to panic and fear the future as you appear to do. I'm not desperate as you are. Being "saved" removes me from that.

You: People have been talking like this since the first Century, about how bad the culture is, about War and Famine yet time keeps marching on. Could it be that the world not ending is God's Will??? Yes, that is defeatist, it explains alot about your first post.

Me: People do love to "talk" however events such as Israel becoming a nation back in 1948 and the war in 1967 give teeth to prophecy. This had to happen right before He comes. As more events take place prophecy becomes clearer. It's a joy to just think about His coming. I'm sorry you feel defeated.

You: It's time to understand what it is you claim to believe and put your faith in Him. Ah, good advice, you should try following it.

Me: I do! I wish you'd look into it. It would calm you down and give you something to look forward to. You know, you don't have to remain an agonostic or atheist... .

You: Instead of banking that the world will end because of grossly misrepresented Biblical prophesy, you should put your faith in Him and fight for what is Right in the here and now.

Me: Believers know it is foolish to "bank" on this world as it is. It also doesn't take a mental giant to read in the Bible what I have stated so to "grossly misrepresented Biblical prophesy" is very difficult to do. My faith is in Him and not of this world. While here I do, do what is right but I have much to look forward to as prophecy is fulfilled.

You: How do you do that? You be Optimistic about this movie about His Passion for one thing. Its never going to be perfect here on Earth, it never has been, but its worth fighting for.

Me: LOL! This movie will not change a thing. It will be preaching to the choir. You are right that it's never been perfect on this earth but it's not been as bad as this either - atleast not since the flood. Fighting to have evil prevail - thanks but I'll pass. Besides it's rather clear where we are headed ... .

[karenbarinka]

Every story originated with Michael Moore -- ALL LIES.

[PeoplesRep_of_LA]

You need to join the 90s and learn HTML, you posts are borderline illedgable.

Could it be that you are really an atheist and not an agnostic? After all you admitted that "feeling good is an aginostic and an independent"?

Wow you caught me /sarcasm. I never said I was an Agnostic, (which you know, you are only saying that to make me mad. You failed.) I said that is fashionable now to be an Independent and and Agnostic, which it is. So you don't FURTHER muddle the point, I said that because people don't have any need to pretend to be a Republican, I'm pleasantly surprised when I find out that anyone is a Republican, I am also heartened to learn when someone publicly admits to being a Christian.

See, that is the difference between us. I am an Optimist--you are a Pessimist. You can go on these longwinded tangents about Bible prophesy with Israel becoming a nation, and the black UN helocopters, and Illumnati,(ok, you didn't say those things, but you might as well have, you are off in kookville here) but the simple fact is you are interpreting the Bible, and profaning by saying that because I don't believe the The Sky Is Falling, that I am not a True Christian, according you, self appointed Judge of All Judges. Thank God you are wrong.

By your own words you convict yourself of what I have said - Christianity is dying in America.

Dying? Well no wonder you want God to kill everybody, you have what they call "issues" in Psychology that far outweigh what is printed in newspapers.

I was right from the get-go about you, you are a quitter. Your whole goal is to drag others down to the depths of despair about Christianity's future, etc. Now I believe you when you tell me you are a Christian, so going from that, you need to sit down and ask yourself why you wouldn't mind for time to come to an end, and if it doesn't, what does Jesus want from you in this life.

You don't have to tell me--just think about it.

[OmegaMan]

Lol. Ok, nevermind.

[nmh]

You: You need to join the 90s and learn HTML, you posts are borderline illedgable.

No. My posts are legible and my html is just fine. I've moved beyond the "90's" so I can't join you there. I'm in the year 2004. Care to move on to 2004 too?

Me: Could it be that you are really an atheist and not an agnostic? After all you admitted that "feeling good is an agnostic and an independent"?

You: Wow you caught me /sarcasm. I never said I was an Agnostic, (which you know, you are only saying that to make me mad. You failed.) I said that is fashionable now to be an Independent and and Agnostic, which it is. So you don't FURTHER muddle the point, I said that because people don't have any need to pretend to be a Republican, I'm pleasantly surprised when I find out that anyone is a Republican, I am also heartened to learn when someone publicly admits to being a Christian.

Me: You're the one that stated you were an agnostic. I lack the ability to read minds. I can only respond to what you write since I do not know you. I have no intention of angering you. If you wish to personalize things that's your choice. I have no control over that.

You: See, that is the difference between us. I am an Optimist--you are a Pessimist. You can go on these longwinded tangents about Bible prophesy with Israel becoming a nation, and the black UN helocopters, and Illumnati,(ok, you didn't say those things, but you might as well have, you are off in kookville here) but the simple fact is you are interpreting the Bible, and profaning by saying that because I don't believe the The Sky Is Falling, that I am not a True Christian, according you, self appointed Judge of All Judges. Thank God you are wrong.

Me: LOL! I'm not a "pessimist". I have every reason to be an optimist but not for the same reasons as you. You are attached to this world so much that it frightens you to see it falling apart. Again, this is clearly written in the Bible that this will happen. It only validates Scripture.

Me: I never mentioned "black UN helicopters", or the "Illuminati" or even hinted at such. All I did was allude to the Bible and what it says in there which you consider "off in kookville here". No the "sky is not falling" either. Take a deep breath ... all I have stated is what is in the Bible which you don't want to hear about but want to claim to be a "Christian". Don't fret. There are alot of people out there claiming to be "Christians" and have no clue on what it is they should know or believe since they don't to read the Bible. Since you don't bother to read it, it's no wonder you react as you do.

Me: Again, my Bible tells me to make a righteous judgment call. It'd obvious to me that you like to consider yourself a Christian, now, but don't believe in reading it nor knowing what it says. In fact you prefer to ridicule it and others that refer to it. Ever hear of the word "scoffer" or "hypocrite" ? It's easy to draw a conclusion from that.

Me: By your own words you convict yourself of what I have said - Christianity is dying in America.

You: Dying? Well no wonder you want God to kill everybody, you have what they call "issues" in Psychology that far outweigh what is printed in newspapers.

Me: From what you have written you demonstrate that genuine Christianity is dying. I never said that I wanted "God to kill everybody" and nor would I consult a medical professional, however you may want to consider it ... . It's just amazing ... the extremes you go to in feebly attempting to be insulting, name calling - all the while NOW claiming to be a Christian but when prophecy is spoken about you haven't a clue and scoff at it and try to ridicule me ... . Even newspapers and magazines, SECULAR sources are wondering about prophecy. Even they sense something is going on out there that defies the usual ups and downs in morality. But you ... all you can think of is sending me off to a psychologist, getting angry at prophecy and wanting to conform to this world no matter what.

You: I was right from the get-go about you, you are a quitter. Your whole goal is to drag others down to the depths of despair about Christianity's future, etc. Now I believe you when you tell me you are a Christian, so going from that, you need to sit down and ask yourself why you wouldn't mind for time to come to an end, and if it doesn't, what does Jesus want from you in this life.

Me: You've been wrong about everything you've said but pride and ego blind you. You really are clueless on my "goals" and I am not in "despair". Even more humorously you think I would take advice from the adversary of Christianity? LOL! I call high and direct and know what is wanted from Him. I also know I have much joy to look forward to when He comes.

You: You don't have to tell me--just think about it.

Me: There is nothing to tell YOU! I've already suggested what you should do. Stop being so desperate and fearful. Reading the Bible will direct your path in life. It's not to late to try that.

[PeoplesRep_of_LA]

This is sad nmh. Your entire post is consisting can basically be summed up as "I know you are, but what am I?" I've dealt with people on here before that try to distort every point one makes on its head at the poster in a kind of schoolyard shouting match, but I expected more of the Religious. I was wrong. I mean, you don't even know what HTML is, or get a joke about joining the 90s that popularized it. For crying out loud that means that you italicize the things you are quoting, then add a blank line and type your response. Have you noticed that this is the practice of 90% of the people on FR?

There's nothing wrong with not know HTML, but with your attitude about it, it annoys me when you don't understand the point, then clumsily claim I should "join 2004", but when you get so caught up in defending yourself that you make false statements, and you claim to be a Christian, that's when you cross the line. I got this far into your post and could read anymore; You're the one that stated you were an agnostic.

Unless you can show me at any point that I ever, EVER said that I was Agnostic, you are flat out LYING. For someone to repeatedly lecture others they need to read the bible, in such an obnoxiously elitist way completely ignoring the hints that I told you already do and there is nothing in there about the world ending in the 21st Century, you need to read the IXth Commandment. Without looking for paranoid interpretations about wars, the 9th Commandment on the otherhand is nice and clear. I don't care that I got you aggravated in pointing out what a pessimist you are, sometimes in a way that I'll admit was too insulting, but I was only did that for your own good. That's no excuse for distorting what I said to the point of falsehood. Can we just get past this petty "you are, no you are!" talk and just agree that Mel Gibson's movie is a good thing for Christianity?