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What We Can Do To Help Defeat the "Gay" Agenda
self | February 11, 2004 | little jeremiah

Posted on 02/11/2004 9:00:13 PM PST by little jeremiah

What We Can Do To Defeat The "Gay" Agenda

Dear Fellow Freepers,

The following informal essay has two parts, the first consisting of ideas of what individuals or small groups can do to help thwart, roll back, defeat and otherwise throw a monkey wrench into the onslaught of the "gay" agenda and their stated goal to destroy the moral fabric of society. I am hoping that discussion will ensue, with theoretical ideas as well as accomplished plans. Information and knowledge are the key. Since most people just watch TV and read the establishment media, which are lapdogs of the "gay" elite, they just do not know the truth about homosexuality.

The second part is my analysis of the root cause of the homosexual movement, going a bit deeper than environment and molestation. It is "religious" or "spiritual" in aspect, so anyone who wishes to avoid that type of discussion can avoid it! This analysis is germane to the cure, not only of the homosexual agenda, but the untrammeled hedonism and libertinism of which homosexuality is the poster child.

[Note: I am not attempting to recap the immediate causes of homosexuality, or prove that it is not inborn, or give evidence as to why same sex acts are abnormal, unhealthy, or immoral, or to prove that homosexuals can change. FR already has hundreds of archived articles of this nature.]

Part One: Ideas on Promoting the Truth about Homosexuality

A friend of ours homeschools her children, so as to protect them from the horrible influence of public schools, instill her personal moral values, and give them the best education possible. She knew that homosexuality was unhealthy, immoral, and unnatural, but until I gave her books and booklets I purchased from Scott Lively's website (www.abidingtruth.com) she was not able to articulate her viewpoint. After studying the materials I provided, she became a one-woman task force, gave her elderly father books to read, and shared the books with the charter/homeschool teacher. The teacher, who also had not been very well-informed, had her mind blown (so to speak) and ordered more materials for herself, and placed a link to Lively's website on her personal website. Lively has a number of very informative booklets that can be purchased in bulk cheap, and they are great for distributing. So because I informed one friend, many others have been informed. This particular charter school is all for homeschooled children, and there are about 500 families involved.

By purchasing Lively's materials (or reprints from other groups such as NAARTH and the Family Research Council) and making them available at your church, synagogue or other house of worship, many people can become informed. Materials can be purchased and mailed or given to pastors at other churches, or any organization or club that you belong to.

I have found that if I talk to people in the line at the grocery store, or the cashier, often people are happy to find that others have the same viewpoint, but they are afraid to admit that they think same sex acts to be unhealthy or wrong. Just by speaking up in public, we can encourage others to think for themselves, and not be intimidated by social pressure.

Of course, letters can be written to newspapers (they've never printed one of mine!), legislators, and media people. We could try calling up local talk radio shows to tell the truth or attend school board meetings to protest the homosexual infiltration of the schools. Of course, by doing any of these things we will be "outing" ourselves as homophobes ;-) but that's the risk one takes by speaking the truth.

And then there are guerilla tactics: print up some fact sheets about the nature of and diseases spread by homosexual acts, statistics about molestation rates, etc - make them colorful and readable, and broadcast them about town. Laudromats, bulletin boards in stores, public facilities, rest stops, community college or other educational institutions, any place you can find. Good places would be where there is a lot of foot traffic, especially where high school kids can see them. High schools kids are really being targeted by homosexual activists, so the more they can see the truth, the better.

Another post-it tactic: make or obtain stickers with the names and phone numbers of organizations that help people overcome homosexuality, and stick them near high schools, colleges, downtowns, and so on. You never know whose life might change because of one phone call. Or, place ads in the classified ads section of local newspapers or weekly magazines with the same information.

Other promotional ideas are bumper stickers (make you own, or maybe someone knows where to order pro-family stickers). Ideas for slogans: Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve; Marriage=One Man+One Woman; Children Need a Mother and Father, Not Two of a Kind; Same Sex Acts Are Not Healthy For Living Things; Want to get AIDS? Be Gay!; Don't confuse "Exit" with "Entry"; Don't Mess With Marriage; "Gay" Sex Isn't Gay…. These could also be signs in car windows, yard signs, signs held at rallies.

Protest at "Gay Pride" Parades. If protesting at such public events, wear protective clothing and go in groups, carry antiseptic handwipes and have a camera and maybe tape recorder. No telling what might ensue. Here's an idea that someone freepmailed to me, and it sounds good:

"I have an idea I'd like to pass your way. I suggest that we get permits to set up tables in front of (or near) our respective churches/synagogues along the local "Pride" parade routes this coming June, with literature about reparative therapy. Each table should also have someone there to document all the juvenile insults and threats thrown our way on a videocam, and send copies of the films to the local tv news to include as part of their coverage."

These are just a few ideas. Let's hear yours!

Part Two: The Root Cause of Homosexuality

Everyone needs happiness, love and pleasure. These needs stem directly from the soul, and get interpreted through the body - think of how many people eat because they are lonely, depressed, or in anxiety. A healthy balanced person will eat when hungry, and when in need of companionship will turn to a relative, friend, or even pet for company. The need for love is really paramount, a deeper need than the bodily requirements. What hurts more, a broken heart, or a hungry stomach? Our culture has denied the fact - basic to all religions (probably a few exceptions, but this is not the debate here) - that human beings even have souls, what to speak of the needs of the soul. In fact, the accepted "scientifically based" theory is that humans are just machines, made of chemicals, evolved by accident, and the "self" doesn’t even really exist. In an atmosphere of such impersonal nihilism, it is natural that many people will be easily convinced that real love, real happiness, real heart to heart connection, don't exist.

What can take its place? Instant pleasure. Shopping. Drug and alcohol abuse. Or, most seductive of all, orgasms. And since the sexual organs have no conscience, a wide variety of options is available to people who have been convinced that God doesn't exist, there are no rules - or higher purpose - to life, and instant gratification is the only yardstick to measure happiness with.

There are two kinds of happiness - the kind that comes from the outside - eating, sex, comforts, and the devices or arrangements that facilitate such, as well as more intangible pleasures such as accomplishments, goals achieved, music, arts, learning, and so on. The second kind of happiness comes only from within the heart, and this happiness is our relationship with God. Jesus said that the Kingdom of God is within us, and the same truth is stated in Hindu scriptures (the Vedas) as well. A surrendered soul can experience the loving embrace of God anywhere, any time - if he truly desires and strives for this loving relationship. The experience that God is my best friend, my only refuge, my source of happiness, and indeed, the very foundation for and purpose of my existence - is the only real meaning of religion. Currently, in many religions, the concept that God is a real Person is left out, glossed over, He is described as an amorphous mystery, or that "we are God", or that He is just energy or a force. But according to Jesus, the teachings in the Old Testament, and the teachings of the Vedas, re-establishing a loving relationship with the Supreme Person is the only thing that will fill the emptiness in our hearts. If this knowledge is denied, as in most of our culture, people will seek to fill this void by any means at hand. And if the moral absolutes that are part of God's instructions to humanity are tossed out, then anything goes. If sexual pleasure is the goal of life, and there are no eternal moral truths, then there is no reason to not accept same sex acts, or, for that matter, any kind of sexual activity.

Therefore, the real antidote to the "gay" agenda, as well as the breakdown of civilization it heralds, is the spiritual awakening of many individuals, and the understanding that such an awakening is not only important but essential.


TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Culture/Society; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: culturewar; culturewars; gayagenda; glsen; homonazi; homosexualagenda; homosexuality; prisoners; profamilyactivism; romans1
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To: MEGoody
I found it terrifying because it was like getting punched in the face - with the hatred and venom oozing from the author and others like him.

Terrifying because he in not isolated, he speaks on behalf of many, and the many are currently making policy, laws, court decision, and in our schools.

The "gay" activists and radicals are not going to go away quietly. They want no co-existence - they want to dominate and control, and if anyone has any remaining doubts about it, read the links.
251 posted on 03/09/2004 5:49:32 PM PST by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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To: All
This interview with Alan Keyes should be read in its entirety.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1096038/posts?page=1

Here are the last couple of paragraphs:

***Has this push for gay "marriage" — especially with regard to what's happened in recent days and weeks — put us in a new era?***

Well, I don't know. I think we're in an era where at both a political and social level we're witnessing the dissolution of the republic. I don't know that that's a new era. It's a tragic era. It's an era that our civilization is not likely to survive if we don't deal with these issues in an urgent fashion in order to reestablish the basis for our civilized life and freedom. So, I can't see that this is some new day, no. This is actually the twilight of a day, if we're not careful.

Right now, we are in the midst of a tremendous crisis that will decide the fate of our society.

***Certainly, this is a process that has long been ongoing. I guess what I was wondering was whether this crisis has intensified so greatly that it's brought the issue to a head?***

Yes, I think if there were people who thought that this was not serious, and they weren't paying attention, they ought to pay attention now. This is coming to a head. In this generation, we will decide the fate of the American republic and of the civilization that we know. We can either sit back and let abusive courts and gutless politicians make these decisions, or as citizens who understand what's at stake, we can get involved and demand that steps be taken to act aright. If we do not, this crisis will intensify.

I believe — and this is something I will work to avoid — that a mishandling of this situation will lead to dissolution of our union, because at the end of the day, the Founders put us on a basis that would allow us to handle these questions without confrontation, conflict and violence. These abusive judges and lawless officials are now abandoning that understanding. This is going to have dire consequences for the future of our people.


252 posted on 03/12/2004 9:22:36 PM PST by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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Comment #253 Removed by Moderator

Comment #254 Removed by Moderator

Comment #255 Removed by Moderator

To: All
Hmmm - I guess whatever Seraphim Rex thought would help fight the "gay" agenda, TPTB didn't agree with him/her/it.

Another idea:

Anyone who in their business or professional life has to deal with homosexuals that are claiming that they are "married" and therefore want the honeymoon suite, special deals on car insurance, travel rates, health insurance, or whatever - refuse them. Tell them that legally they aren't married and you can't accomodate (whatever it is they want).

These people need to have their balloon popped. And we need to not kowtow to them. It's worth getting in hot water for this. It's worth even losing our jobs, being called "hater", "bigot", and "homophobe". If we don't stand up against this, we're assisting them.

We need to be on the right side of history.
256 posted on 03/15/2004 2:10:28 PM PST by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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To: All
OK, this is what we should do - and if I lived closer to SF I would do it. Or maybe I'll take a couple of days off and do in.

What should we do, you ask? Why, get married, of course! To our brothers, our sisters, parents, or children, and groups of friends. We should DEMAND marriage licenses! Demand our rights to be married to both our brothres, or our sisters, or Grandma!

Foursomes, threesomes, etc. "Gay" activists and homosexual rights people have NO EARTHLY reason why all these marriages shouldn't take place. Just their bias and bigotry against incest, group marriage, and so on.
257 posted on 03/16/2004 2:17:14 PM PST by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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To: mvonfr
The costs of gay healthcare are unproportionally high, insisting on it means trying to get an unproportional share of resources.

Please would you explain why they would be higher if gays were legally married. Don't they have healthcare cover anyway? Aren't their treatments already being paid for in that way? I don't understand what difference it would make from that point of view. Thanks

258 posted on 03/17/2004 1:00:34 PM PST by deb-bee
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To: deb-bee
Hello, new FR member. I notice that this is the only comment you have made on FR so far.

Here is my explanation: If someone is employed by a business that provides healthcare benefits, said employee is paying for some of that with his own money. If said employee has a wife or husband, then the insurance benefits are spread to said spouse, often with not much more money paid out by said employee.

Since a much higher percentage of homosexuals have AIDS, which can cost between $12k up to $17K a year (or more, with complications), and since homosexuals have much higher rates of various kinds of hepatitis, parasites, TB, many other venereal diseases, higher rates of alcoholism, drug abuse, mental problems, and so on - that means the people who are NOT homosexual will be helping pay the higher cost of the homosexual partners' health insurance.

Let homosexuals each pay their own health care insurance. Since they choose to engage in behavior that entails a higher cost, let each of them foot the bill. Why should people who don't engage in such dangerous behavior have to endure higher medical insurance rates so that homosexuals' pretend "spouses" can get covered?
259 posted on 03/17/2004 7:48:44 PM PST by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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To: little jeremiah
Yes, I think if there were people who thought that this was not serious, and they weren't paying attention, they ought to pay attention now. This is coming to a head. In this generation, we will decide the fate of the American republic and of the civilization that we know. We can either sit back and let abusive courts and gutless politicians make these decisions, or as citizens who understand what's at stake, we can get involved and demand that steps be taken to act aright. If we do not, this crisis will intensify.

I believe — and this is something I will work to avoid — that a mishandling of this situation will lead to dissolution of our union, because at the end of the day, the Founders put us on a basis that would allow us to handle these questions without confrontation, conflict and violence. These abusive judges and lawless officials are now abandoning that understanding. This is going to have dire consequences for the future of our people.


I'm concerned about that too. I remember as far back as the 1970's, my father said that "America will not survive as a political entity" and even said "we will see a second Civil War" and I would be around to see it (I'm 37, will be 38 in July). Dunno if he really saw something coming or was reaching for the tin-foil hat, but I think he was on to something when I saw the fighting over the 2000 election and now issues like this.

If this issue of homosexual marriage keeps going the way it is, then other standards of society will be changed and will fall like a set of dominoes. I've gotten into debate with people from the other side and they call us homophobes, rednecks, old fashioned, and Bible Thumpers. Well, I tried to present our side of the debate but they still shout you down with the same old rhetoric. I've pretty much stopped trying to talk to them, let's face it, you cannot "show a blind dog anything." I might sound harsh here but deep down inside, I feel these people are dead spirtually or if I want to be nice about it, "on life support." I mean they just shout you down like the robots they are, instead of thinking, they react, much like a roach does when you shine a light on it.

I've resolved one thing is that I'll try my best to fight for what is right, I work a lot of hours, sadly, I cannot devote a lot of time but I'll do my best to do my part, albeit small, to try to turn the tide. Somedays I'm optimistic, others I am not, but I do feel that within the last year, there was a sleeping giant that did awake because most of middle America does not want this.

I think the homosexual lifestyle is dead wrong, goes agaisnt God, nature, logic, and so on, but despite trying to reach out, not everyone will be guided to the straight and narrow. I resolved that as long as they keep it private, like all sex lives should be, then it should be live and let live. However, when you come to knock down a staple of our society, then that's when we arch our backs like a cat.

Getting back to my father, well, maybe one day the America we know will break up, I don't know how, but I'd be willing to cut Frisco loose and they become a free sovereign city of its own if they want homosexual marriage, but leave the rest of us alone. Better yet, if they want to marry, they can go to Holland and live there, just leave us and our society alone.
260 posted on 03/21/2004 4:13:41 PM PST by Nowhere Man ("Laws are the spider webs through which the big bugs fly past and the little ones get caught.")
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To: Nowhere Man; little jeremiah; scripter; GrandMoM

I've resolved one thing is that I'll try my best to fight for what is right, I work a lot of hours, sadly, I cannot devote a lot of time but I'll do my best to do my part, albeit small, to try to turn the tide.


Most people have access to a computer these days, so copy, paste, print and pass (or email) the following information on to family and friends; leave copies in waiting room; etc.:


The Overhauling of Straight America
( www.abidingtruth.com/pfrc/archives.php?id=8142838 )

The Homosexual Propaganda and Media Manipulation Game
( www.takebackmaryland.org/ASP/XcNewsPlus/XcNewsPlus.asp?cmd=view&articleid=23 )

Seven Steps to Recruit-proof Your Child
( www.scottlively.com/sevensteps/ )

Recruit-proof your child against homosexuality
( www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=13894 )

Choice 4 Truth
( www.choice4truth.com )

National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality (NARTH)
( www.narth.com )

Thought Reform and The Psychology of Homosexual Advocacy
( www.leaderu.com/orgs/narth/1995papers/socarides.html )

Homosexual Activism in the APA and the Removal of Homosexuality from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM)
( www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1026551/posts?page=46#46 )


11 Ways You Can Fight the Homosexual Agenda
( www.cwfa.org/articles/4434/CFI/resources/ )

Q & A: The Homosexual Agenda
( www.family.org/cforum/feature/a0027070.cfm )

Queering the Schools
( www.city-journal.org/html/13_2_queering_the_schools.html )


Homosexual Agenda: Categorical Index of Links (Version 1.1)
( www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1026551/posts )

What We Can Do To Help Defeat the "Gay" Agenda
( www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1076476/posts )



**********************

Note to Little Jeremiah: The ScottLively.com server seems to be down (I haven't been able to access it during the past week) - have you heard anything about his web site?

Note to Scripter: I'm having problems accessing the "Take Back Maryland" page - can you access it?

Note to GrandMoM: Here's another page for you to print out and pass out.

261 posted on 03/26/2004 9:07:08 AM PST by EdReform (Support Free Republic - All donations are greatly appreciated. Thank you for your support!)
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To: Nowhere Man; little jeremiah; scripter; GrandMoM; All

I've resolved one thing is that I'll try my best to fight for what is right, I work a lot of hours, sadly, I cannot devote a lot of time but I'll do my best to do my part, albeit small, to try to turn the tide.


Please copy, paste, print and pass (or email) the following important information on to family and friends; leave copies in waiting room; etc.:


(Note that the dates listed in the links below are from the April 10, 2002 event. The dates will need to be changed to April 21, 2004 for this year's event).


TRUTH WITHOUT INTERRUPTION DAY-- APRIL 21, 2004
( www.choice4truth.com/twid.htm )

On April 21, homosexual activists and their supporters will hold "Day of Silence" events on high school and college campuses throughout the country, sponsored by GLSEN, the Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network. (For more details, see www.dayofsilence.org.) It will be a silent vigil and the usual victimhood and "gay" rights claims. Participants will hand out material promoting homosexuality, bisexuality and cross-dressing.

How would you like to hold a counter-event the same day? We are calling it the Truth Without Interruption Day! Finally - a chance to get a word in edgewise!

If you'd like to organize one at your school, see below. You'll find links to: Talking Points (feel free to print this off and hand out); Tips for Organizing a TWID event; and a sample news release.

Open Letter (to hand out to Day of Silence victims)
( www.choice4truth.com/twid_open.htm )

Talking Points (feel free to print this off and hand out)
( www.choice4truth.com/twid_talk.htm )

Tips for Organizing a TWID event
( www.choice4truth.com/twid_tips.htm )

Sample news release
( www.choice4truth.com/twid_news.htm )


262 posted on 03/26/2004 9:16:51 AM PST by EdReform (Support Free Republic - All donations are greatly appreciated. Thank you for your support!)
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To: *Homosexual Agenda; EdReform; scripter; GrandMoM; backhoe; Yehuda; Clint N. Suhks; saradippity; ...
Homosexual Agenda Ping ~ ~ ~ Good information to copy'n'paste, email to friends and relatives, and print out to distribute as widely as possible.

If people are mis-informed (which, unfortunately, most or many are) they can't possibly DISCRIMINATE properly.

People need to be rightly discriminating - everyone makes choices every day. If those choices are not based on fact and knowledge, the choices will likely be wrong and have bad consquences for them personally, and for society as a whole.

Helping people learn the truth about the Homosexual Agenda is a great service.

Let me know if anyone wants on/off this pinglist.
263 posted on 03/26/2004 9:54:57 AM PST by little jeremiah
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To: EdReform
Note to Scripter: I'm having problems accessing the "Take Back Maryland" page - can you access it?

I had the same problem a couple of days ago and apparently the problem still exists. We have this copy: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1045646/posts

I think we have a copy somewhere on the development server (for the database).

264 posted on 03/26/2004 10:05:14 AM PST by scripter (Thousands have left the homosexual lifestyle)
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To: EdReform
Here's a link to Scott Lively - I couldn't get to www.defendthefamily.com as usual. I know they're always hard up for money, so maybe they couldn't pay for the domain name or something.

http://www.abidingtruth.com/
265 posted on 03/26/2004 7:04:15 PM PST by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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To: little jeremiah; John O
bookmark bump

(John, read posts 250-263 and email out.)

266 posted on 03/27/2004 5:20:13 AM PST by John O (God Save America (Please))
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To: little jeremiah; John O
Truth Without Interruption Day (April 21, 2004)
267 posted on 03/27/2004 11:02:13 AM PST by EdReform (Support Free Republic - All donations are greatly appreciated. Thank you for your support!)
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To: little jeremiah
I have an idea. This is one that I have used myself. Enter a website that is for gay/lesbian people to gather and chat (actually used most often to meet up for one-time, and often unprotected sexual encounters). There are many porn sites that are adverstised in the chat rooms using some sort of suggestive phrase to get chatters to click on the site. Create a user name on the site, and a phony ad for a porn site, with the link going to some site that will expose them to the truth about the illness.
268 posted on 03/28/2004 1:04:58 PM PST by joedownthestreet
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To: joedownthestreet
Hmm, sounds interesting...

IMO, the most important information to get to homosexuals is that fact that they CAN change. That there are many ex-homosexuals. That is the worst weapon the homosexual radicals have. If a person struggling with homosexual desires, or even someone dedicated to homosexuality, keeps reading or hearing that he or she can change, it opens to door to reparation.

It is the foulest lie to claim that homosexuals are born that way and cannot change. This lie condemns thousands or millions to misery.
269 posted on 03/28/2004 2:10:26 PM PST by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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Comment #270 Removed by Moderator

To: little jeremiah
Yes, that is the way that I see it precisely. The best way to deal with this situation with true love, is to help those who would welcome the truth, to the truth, and let the rest be offended.
271 posted on 03/28/2004 2:23:02 PM PST by joedownthestreet
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To: joedownthestreet
Thnking over your idea, another thought comes to mind. That it might not be the greatest thing in the world to hang out on those kinds of boards... There might be a more wholesome way to get the message out to homosexuals that they can change.
272 posted on 03/28/2004 8:27:27 PM PST by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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To: little jeremiah
Bump

National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality (NARTH)


Spitzer Study Just Published: Evidence Found for Effectiveness of Reorientation Therapy

The results of a study conducted by Dr. Robert L. Spitzer have just been published in the Archives of Sexual Behavior, Vol. 32, No. 5, October 2003, pp. 403-417.

Spitzer's findings challenge the widely-held assumption that a homosexual orientation is "who one is" -- an intrinsic part of a person's identity that can never be changed.

The study has attracted particularly attention because its author, a prominent psychiatrist, is viewed as a historic champion of gay activism. Spitzer played a pivotal role in 1973 in removing homosexuality from the psychiatric manual of mental disorders...

Although examples of "complete" change in orientation were not common, the majority of participants did report change from a predominantly or exclusively homosexual orientation before therapy to a predominantly or exclusively heterosexual orientation in the past year as a result of reparative therapy.

These results would seem to contradict the position statements of the major mental health organizations in the United States, which claim there is no scientific basis for believing psychotherapy effective in addressing same-sex attraction. Yet Spitzer reports evidence of change in both sexes, although female participants reported significantly more change than did male participants...

Is reorientation therapy harmful? For the participants in our study, Spitzer notes, there was no evidence of harm. "To the contrary," he says, "they reported that it was helpful in a variety of ways beyond changing sexual orientation itself." And because his study found considerable benefit and no harm, Spitzer said, the American Psychiatric Association should stop applying a double standard in its discouragement of reorientation therapy, while actively encouraging gay-affirmative therapy to confirm and solidify a gay identity.

Furthermore, Spitzer wrote in his conclusion, "the mental health professionals should stop moving in the direction of banning therapy that has, as a goal, a change in sexual orientation. Many patients, provided with informed consent about the possibility that they will be disappointed if the therapy does not succeed, can make a rational choice to work toward developing their heterosexual potential and minimizing their unwanted homosexual attractions."

Is reorientation therapy chosen only by clients who are driven by guilt--that is, what's popularly known as "homophobia"? To the contrary, Spitzer concludes. In fact, "the ability to make such a choice should be considered fundamental to client autonomy and self-determination."


273 posted on 03/28/2004 8:47:02 PM PST by EdReform (Support Free Republic - All donations are greatly appreciated. Thank you for your support!)
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To: EdReform
It's so amazing that Spitzer - who helped turn homosexuality into "normalcy" - is now seeing the light. He must be considered a heretic. After all, the Big Lie is that "gays can't change".

Just for the record, here's a great article about "gays" who did change, and the outrage that engenders:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1106892/posts
274 posted on 03/28/2004 9:42:58 PM PST by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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To: All; little jeremiah

"Turning our backs on the culture and retreating into conservative or religious enclaves is what got us into this mess to begin with. Let's contact our local schools, find out what's going on, and join with other concerned citizens to make some changes this next school year."

-- Linda P. Harvey, Homosexual Agenda Escalates in Public Schools, July 15, 2001, NewsWithViews.com



"I would rather walk a mile barefoot on broken glass than endure a confrontation with homosexual zealots. However, that less painful path cannot be responsibly taken. What choice is there but to stand in opposition to homosexual activists with their in-your face arrogance, their malicious attacks on religion, family values and moral standards, and, in essence, their demand that American society be turned upside down and inside out to accommodate their sexual disorientations?

It is unconscionable that homosexual invectives and threats have effectively shut down most attempts to expose bogus research or address the cultural implications of the homosexual agenda. It should be, but apparently is not, a matter of serious concern, even shame, that so many of our politicians, our journalists and commentators, our scientists, our government schools teachers, our university professors and our clergy have either been seduced to advance the homosexual agenda, intimidated into passive assent, or cowed into silence.

It is one of the great ironies of modern-day America that it is liberals who are not only enabling but spearheading a vicious version of McCarthyism at its worse. Rarely in the history of our republic has there been such a successful effort to keep lies alive, suppress the truth, censor speech, and engage in blatant character assassination."

-- Linda Bowles, Defending Dr. Laura and America, May 31, 2000, TownHall.com

275 posted on 03/29/2004 7:10:09 AM PST by EdReform (Support Free Republic - All donations are greatly appreciated. Thank you for your support!)
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To: joedownthestreet; All; EdReform; scripter
Thinking about the topic of changing peoples' minds about the legitimacy of "gay" marriage and the promotion of homosexuality, and there are two avenues.

1. People who are not homosexuals themselves, but are ambivalent about the question of "gay" rights and marriage. Most such people are cruelly misinformed about what homosexuals do, their degree of promiscuity, the viciousness of same sex acts, the percentages of homosexuals who molest children, and so on. People like this NEED to become informed, and the media AIN'T going to do the job.

That's where people like us can help - even if by just printing out the information that EdReform and Scripter have compiled, and handing it out at clubs, churches, family gatherings - thereby becoming the black sheep of the family ;-), and so on. Or by using the facts contained therein to write educated letters to the editor, emailing friends and foe, and maybe writing papers at school, or otherwise informing people who just haven't heard the truth.

Once people actually KNOW what homosexuals (a) do sexually, (b) their stated plans for us, (c) their pernicious rates of child molestation, (d) how they spread noxious disease, (e) the fact that homosexuals can and do change and that there are thousands of "ex-homosexuals, and (f) what they are doing in schools across the country right now, most will be opposed to "gay" rights.

2. Concerning those who actually consider themselves homosexual, or identify with homosexual behavior, it's a different story.

Citing facts, figures and truth as above only inflames homoseuxals and they see such as an attack. So be it. I think the only way to actually touch them is to keep repeating the truth that homosexuality is NOT inborn, NOT genetic, NOT innate. That they can change - and become either a functioning heterosexual, or at least chaste and not tormented by same sex desires and acts.

Reparative therapy helps many, and there are many organizations, both religious and non-religious, that have helped thousands. The pro-homosexual media refuses to publicize this information, and marginalizes and demonizes those who really help the suffering homosexuals.

I think it would be useful to make some kind of flyer or brochure of the organizations that help homosexuals change, and hand them out at "Gay Pride" events, put them up on bulletin boards, and so on.
276 posted on 04/05/2004 1:14:04 PM PDT by little jeremiah (...men of intemperate minds can not be free. Their passions forge their fetters.)
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To: EdReform
Note to Scripter: I'm having problems accessing the "Take Back Maryland" page - can you access it?

I finally heard back from the site and the link is now back up:

The Homosexual Propaganda and Media Manipulation Game...

Along with all their archives:

News Archive

277 posted on 04/05/2004 7:52:11 PM PDT by scripter (Thousands have left the homosexual lifestyle)
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To: little jeremiah
A good resource to email or print out and distribute to family and friends:

The Homosexuality Debate in the Public Arena - A One-Sheet Strategy for Turning the Sexuality Tide ( See also 21 page expanded version )


Another resource:

Mission America Homosexuality Library

278 posted on 04/19/2004 8:45:37 AM PDT by EdReform
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To: little jeremiah; All
Student Survey of Middle and High School Students: Attitudes about Homosexuality: The Gay, Lesbian & Transgender Issue at Your School

Your Help is Needed on the Mission America STUDENT SURVEY

You may have heard statements like the following: " 92% of high school students say they have heard homophobic remarks on their campus in the past month." Such statements come out of student surveys conducted by GLSEN, PFLAG and others, and are picked up by reporters sympathetic to their cause. They are used to persuade school boards that programs must be adopted to stop "homophobia" (defined primarily as attitudes or speech unaccepting of homosexuality).

We need a survey that tells the truth! The climate in some schools actually prevents students and teachers from speaking out to warn others about the grave risks of homosexuality, and to provide the information that it can change.

Our goal is to have at least 1000 students in U.S. public middle and high schools take the survey above.To do this, we need your help.

Simply identify students you know who attend a public middle school or high school. They may be your children or grandchildren, nieces or nephews, neighbors, or kids from church. Make copies of the survey...as many as you need--and give them to these students. Ask them to return them to you by a certain day. If you feel it's appropriate, ask them to have one or two friends complete the survey as well. If you can, have them fill out the questionnaire while you are present or nearby.

They should give their own opinions when completing the survey, and not "consult" with others as a group activity. When you have all the surveys, simply fill out the bottom of at least one of the group of surveys with your name and address, paper clip them together and mail them back to us. Our address is at the end of the survey.

You are our survey administrators...we are counting on you! The results will be published in a future issue of Mission America! Thank you in advance for this important effort.


279 posted on 04/19/2004 9:19:31 AM PDT by EdReform
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To: little jeremiah; scripter; GrandMoM; maica; Born Conservative; presidio9; ArGee; ...
(Reference: reply 279 )

I recently received the following email from Mission America:


Subject : Initial Results of our Student Survey

Survey Reveals: Students Lack Vital Information About Homosexual Risks

Your help on collecting survey information is still needed! See below.

The survey of middle and high school students Mission America has been conducting over the last six months is yielding some startling news about vital health information students are not getting from schools. We have tabulated the surveys we've received and we're very excited (as well as dismayed) about some of the trends.

So far, we have received surveys from around the country, with a higher concentration in the Great Lakes area. We would like to get many more, so we are keeping the survey open through the next few months and will give a final report in our fall issue.

But so far, students are indicating huge gaps in basic information schools have provided about homosexuality and its risks. The majority of students, for example, have NOT learned in school that two-thirds to three-fourths of HIV in the U.S. is the result of homosexual sex between men. Many students are, instead, attending classes throughout the curriculum that are delivering messages promoting tolerance of homosexual behavior. Students are also reporting incidents where some have spoken out in opposition to homosexuality in a responsible, non-bullying context, and are often treated with intolerance by not only students but also teachers and staff.

There is also a high correlation between the existence of a homosexual club at a school, and other pro-homosexual events and units of study. We are eager to document this to hopefully provide information school administrators can use to keep homosexual clubs out of the school environment.

PLEASE HELP! We’d like this study to be as comprehensive as possible and represent many regions of the U.S. If you’d like to help out by getting students you know to fill out the survey, it’s available at www.missionamerica.com/surveyform.php in PDF format, and in plain text also at www.missionamerica.com/agenda.php?articlenum=8 . The survey is only for students in public schools or private, non-religious schools. Have them complete the survey, then mail it back to us at PO Box 21836, Columbus, OH 43221 .

We are so grateful for the great help we’ve gotten from readers so far, and for your help in the future.

280 posted on 05/04/2004 8:50:41 AM PDT by EdReform
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To: little jeremiah
I live in Rhea County, TN. You've probably heard of us by now. We're the county whose commissioners voted unanimously to ban gays from our community. Stupid move, as it only served to label us all as homophobes, when their original intention was to ban gay marriage.

The result of their action is that we now will have the first annual "gay day" in Rhea County on May 8th. It is expected that the weirdest of weirdos from across the country will be in attendance.

Problem is, I am not an activist, can't imagine myself holding up sign that would put me in the corner with the true, die-hard homophobes in our area. I'm more inclined to observe from a distance -- 'cause this is bound to be grand entertainment. Instead, I'll probably just stay home so as not to contribute to the audience they are seeking. In my view, ignoring a protest is the grandest of insults. Especially when I never would have approved of our commissioners vote to ban gays from the community.

Ban gay marriage? - yeah, but attempting to ban persons who never made their sexuality an issue, and basically remained "in the closet", no.

And if you knew the history of our county, you would know that our schools will never promote the gay agenda (we recently battled the ACLU over bible classes in school - and lost, BTW)

Unlike the gay activists that our commissioners unintentionally invited here, our local gays seem to prefer anonymity as to their sexual preference.

So , in your opinion, am I better of ignoring this invasion of outside activists?

281 posted on 05/04/2004 10:18:38 PM PDT by bjcintennessee (Don't Sweat the Small Stuff)
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To: bjcintennessee
First of all, do you have a link to an article about the law "banning" homosexuals from the county? I can't imagine a law like that lasting 45 minutes without being slammed by the ACLU and several other organizations. What does the wording actually say, and what is being banned? Does the law ban same sex acts? That's already been judged to be worthy of legal protection by the SCOTUS (one very stupid, evil and unconstitutional decision, BTW).

Unfortunately, this issue is rapidly becoming one in which there will be no fence-sitting. Radical homosexual activists are calling the shots, and the vast majority of homosexuals (or people who self-identify as homosexuals for the time being) do not speak out against their radical brethren and sistern. Those of us (actually the majority) who do not want the definitions of morality and family and marriage deformed are constantly put on the defensive and attacked as "haters", "bigots", and the newly invented word, "homophobes".

By sitting out this fight you are actually assisting the radical homosexual activists, who have directly stated that they want to change the very meaning of family, morality, and marriage. One of their stated goals in the beginning of the "gay rights" movement was to eliminate the age of consent, as well as the number of people (and sex) entering into marriage. Do you want to see a society that calls two or three grown men and a couple of adolescent boys a "marriage"? Some homosexuals want to see that. Do you want to see a society that smiles upon sex between adults and children? NAMBLA wants to see that, and members of that organization often march in "Gay Pride" parades along with the "regular" homosexuals - such as those dressed up as nuns, adorned with giant fake phallus, simulating sodomy (and sometimes not just simulating), men half-dressed in leather with little boys on leashes and chains, and more.

Homosexuals and their supporters have made it one of their main goals - openly stated - to have a huge presence in public schools, K-12, to change the way little children think about sexuality and families. Have you read any of the links that are on this thread? You state that you are sure such indoctrination is not current in Tennessee schools, but I'm not so sure you're right. And if you are right, you many not be for long.


The sad truth is that by being silent, you are helping the destruction of the moral foundation of civilization.


(P.S. There are no such things as "homophobes". That is a prop-speak word invented by homosexual activists to label those who oppose the normalization of homosexuality as bigots, mentally ill, and repressed homosexuals themselves.)
282 posted on 05/04/2004 10:58:08 PM PDT by little jeremiah
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To: little jeremiah

(Regarding my query above about "banning" homosexuals from the county - or was it state? What happened was the law was meant to ban "gay" marriage but either was worded or understood wrongly.)

Note this article about "Sexual deviance as a legitimate course of study":

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1138370/posts?page=1

Many (probably most) universities and colleges, both private (still given YOUR tax dollars) and state, provide nauseating pornographic and ultra homosexual/other propaganda masquerading as academic research and legitimate courses of study. They are nothing more than recruiting more people into the grossest sexual hedonism as participants, and smearing a phony veneer of legitimacy over what should be criminal deviance and a mentally sick obsession with weird sexuality.

SO: Alumni, find out what is being taught at your school, and protest if you find it not to your standard. Withold any donations or behests, and let the administration know that you are doing so and why. Parents who plan to send your children to institutions of higher learning, check VERY carefully into the cirriculum and DO NOT SEND them to schools which promote profligacy and deviance in the name of academic study!

As usual, letters can be written, emails, phone calls and even personal visits to those in charge, both by alumni and prospective parents.


283 posted on 05/19/2004 8:43:43 AM PDT by little jeremiah (Moral decay leads to anarchy which leads to totalitarianism.)
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To: little jeremiah

I know I've mentioned this before, but it is time to TAKE BACK THE RAINBOW!

Rainbows are known in every tradtion as the symbol of beauty, purity, and unearthly perfection. They have ZERO to do with same sex sodomy. I'm sick and tired of seeing rainbow symbols and immediately thinking "Hmm, homosexuals".

TAKE BACK THE RAINBOW!

Someone should investigate bumper stickers (could be signs as well) with a picture of a rainow and words such as:

Rainbows belong to everyone!

Rainbows don't mean sodomy.

I want my rainbow back!

Homosexuals don't own rainbows!

Rainbows are God's promise!

Etc.


284 posted on 05/24/2004 8:07:16 AM PDT by little jeremiah ("Gay Marriage" - a Weapon of Mass. Destruction!)
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To: Old Professer
You may not want to hear what I'm about to say, but if I don't say it,then I won't be true to my beliefs. All of you people are saying that gay relationships wrong and that they are trying to go against society. This isn't true. You say that they're only in it for the benefits of a married couple, but why would someone willingly subject themselves to this verbal abuse and hatred just for a few benefits? You people are saying that being gay is immoral and wrong, but who said it was up to you to decide what's right and what's wrong? This should be between them and God! You have no right to punish these people for being themselves! You should applaud them for having the courage to come out and tell the world who they are when they know they will get persecuted! When two people love each other they should have the right to get married! Being a homosexual is not a choice or a decision! Its not like by protesting this, you can change the way they are? What if, in the beginning God had created a woman and a woman instead of a man and woman, then every one you people would be persecuted right now for being straight instead of gay! Just because something goes against the norm, doesn't mean its wrong! I mean really, if it wasn't for Dr. Martin Luther King going against the norm, African Americans would still be treated badly! Its the same with women's rights and many other things! The tittle of this page was "What We Can Do To Help Defeat The "Gay" Agenda. What "agenda" are you talking about? You people are acting like homosexuals are out to get us all! That's ridiculous!!! Aren't YOU the ones that are out to get THEM? Honestly, think about what you're doing to these people! Subjecting them to toucher basically because of who they are! Ever since I was A small child, my father used to say this to me :Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.Its called the Golden Rule, if more people followed that, this wold would be a different place. I'm not saying that you don't have the right to disagree with how they choose to live their life, I'm saying that you don't have the right to hate them for it. Now, I'm only 15, and if I know this, then why shouldn't you? I mean, you people are supposed to be lecturing US on right and wrong, what has this world come to if we are now lecturing you?
285 posted on 05/27/2004 10:18:19 PM PDT by peachy08 (E-mail me if you wish to debate this with me. My e-mail addressis lyssa_chica89@hotmail.com)
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To: peachy08
Wow, are you either very young or very stupid; my take in this is and always has been that I will not accept as fact a "condition" of gayness; to me, it is the same thing as choosing to wear a grey suit or a pair of coveralls.

It is currently a fashion fad and probably will be left behind when something more outrageous comes along; I am not one of "those people" to whom you refer.

286 posted on 05/31/2004 11:28:48 AM PDT by Old Professer
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To: *Homosexual Agenda; EdReform; scripter; GrandMoM; backhoe; Yehuda; Clint N. Suhks; saradippity; ...

Here is a link to the Concerned Women of America website, and their offer of what looks to be a very good pamphlet or booklet telling the truth about homosexuality. Looks very good for distribution at schools (!), churches, meetings and so on, or giving to kids, grandkids, their friends, to Boy and Girl Scouts (get your girls out of GS, btw, heavily infiltrated by lesbians and wacko feminazis), other youth groups like 4-H and any others you may be involved in.

http://states.cwfa.org/articledisplay.asp?id=5459&department=FIELD&categoryid=family

*****“At the End of the Rainbow” of Homosexuality 4/5/2004

In an effort to better educate schools, churches, government and the public concerning homosexuality, CWA-VA has produced a colorful brochure, “At the End of the Rainbow,” that reveals the top eight lies of homosexual propaganda. The brochure is available in a color or black and white version.

Homosexual behavior is dangerous and it puts individuals at high risk to life threatening diseases, premature death, mental illness and domestic violence.

People have the right to know that homosexual behavior is not genetic and that everyone is born a heterosexual. There are not two types of human beings. Various factors create an environment for homosexual behavior, but unwanted same-sex attraction is changeable.

It is not “mean spirited” or bigotry to share the truth. A true friend shows compassion by warning someone of impending danger rather than accepting a behavior that leads to emotional, physical and spiritual death.

Give someone you care about an “At the End of the Rainbow” brochure.

Link to color brochure: http://states.cwfa.org/images/content/At%20the%20End%20of%20the%20RAinbow%20brochure%20final.pdf

Link to B&W brochure: http://states.cwfa.org/images/content/AttheEndoftheRainbowbrochurefinalbw.pdf

Download your free copy, or call the CWA-VA office at (703) 444-1740 and place an order today.*****


287 posted on 06/04/2004 11:50:25 AM PDT by little jeremiah (Take Back The Rainbow! Take back the word "GAY"!)
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To: peachy08; Old Professer

First of all, calm down. You say you're 15. When I was 15 I though I knew everything, too. And just like you, I was incredibly naive, ignorant, misled, and had no idea of reality or how to think for myself.

There's a basic rule that everyone should follow, if they want to learn the truth of a matter: learn and listen and read first, then contemplate upon the matter, pray if you can, and THEN speak about it.

If you speak first, as you have just done, but know nothing, you only reveal yourself as, I'm sorry to say, a foolish person.

I wish you well, you may have many years of life in this world ahead of you, and I would that you use that precious time well. I advise the following:

Read the Categorical Index of Articles about Homosexuality that are linked to on this thread. Read all if not most of them. Consider them deeply. Then adjust your thinking to fit the truth, don't try to adjust the truth to fit your thinking.


288 posted on 06/04/2004 11:56:09 AM PDT by little jeremiah (Take Back The Rainbow! Take back the word "GAY"!)
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To: All
ItsOurTimeNow organized a rally in support of marriage in the liberal bastion of Rhode Island, with great success (even though most area churches *and* Republican elected officials refused to take part or even inform parishioners!). Here's a link to his after action report:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1160838/posts

He should be an inspiration to many of us! And he's going to do an even bigger rally later in the fall.
289 posted on 06/29/2004 11:50:29 AM PDT by little jeremiah (http://www.mikegabbard.com - a REAL conservative running for Congress!)
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To: EdReform
The link to Recruit-proofing your child is broken.

Are there any printable flyers available? I can't afford books, etc. but would enjoy printing and handing out flyers.

290 posted on 08/01/2004 12:35:17 PM PDT by Mockingbird For Short ("When the Son of Man comes, will He find faith on the earth?" Luke 18:8)
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To: EdReform; little jeremiah; scripter

(See previous comment) I mean a printable flyer other than the Rainbow pamphlet. That one is geared toward a class of people that is a bit more educated than the folks I'd be reaching with it. I need something very basic, in simple 6th grade language--- also something in Spanish would be very helpful. Any suggestions?


291 posted on 08/01/2004 12:44:21 PM PDT by Mockingbird For Short ("When the Son of Man comes, will He find faith on the earth?" Luke 18:8)
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From Max Lucado's article HERE:

Marriage is a covenant publicly sealed between a man and a woman. God could have given Adam a man, but he didn't. God could have given Adam two women, but he didn't. God could have given Eve to Adam for one night, but he didn't. He gave her to him for life. And, in doing so, he gave us his definition of marriage. One man-one woman for life. Heterosexual monogamy.

  We cannot overestimate how radical this was. In the ancient east, no other religion honored the female as an equal partner of man and no other moral code called husband and wife to sexual fidelity.

  By the time the Torah was presented through the Jews to mankind, religions were promoting flagrant, unbridled sexual activity. Egypt, Mesopotamia, Phoenicia, Cyrus, Canaan...religious life in each of these nations was marked by temple prostitution and ritual sex. This is understandable since early religions saw their gods as sexual beings. The Babylonian god, Ishtar, seduced a man. The Egyptian god, Asiris, had sex with his sister. Krishna, the Hindu god, had many wives. According to the Greeks, Zeus married Hera, and Poseidon married Amphitrite.

  In such a sexually-saturated era, homosexuality was widely practiced. Martha Nussbaum of Brown University describes gender as a non-issue in ancient sexual activity. Sex was seen not as interaction, but more as doing something to someone.

"Homosexuality," agrees Jewish commentator Dennis Prager, "was universally accepted, valued, and practiced." David Greenburg writes: "...none of the archaic civilizations prohibited homosexuality per se."

  It was into such a world that the Torah entered. And it was against such a downstream flow that the teachings of Yahweh swam. According to the Torah, God is not sexual, but holy. Man was not conceived in a sexual act, but created in a divine one. Men and women were not intended for identical gender but opposite. Woman is not a sexual object, but a God-given partner. And sex is not a recreational sport but a matrimonial privilege. The God of the Jews put the genie of sex into the bottle of heterosexual marriage. Homosexuality, by its very nature, resists this truth. Which takes us to the next question:

  What Does God Say About Gays?....

For complete article, click HERE.

292 posted on 08/01/2004 12:54:47 PM PDT by Mockingbird For Short ("When the Son of Man comes, will He find faith on the earth?" Luke 18:8)
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To: Mockingbird For Short

My computer is flaking badly so I probably will be away from FR for at least a week

>:-( - Sniff...

Here is a great website with lots of resources, quite cheap and a lot you can just print out from the website. I can't reccommend them highly enough:

http://www.abidingtruth.com/index.php?viewmode=resources

They do a lot with school age kids, have seminars and stuff for teenagers, and kits for kids that have to go to school. Check it out!


293 posted on 08/01/2004 10:57:14 PM PDT by little jeremiah (The Islamic Jihad and the Homosexual Jihad both want to destroy us.)
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To: little jeremiah

What about a new Federal Marriage
Amendment??

Several polls have demonstrated that
about 70% of Americans are opposed to
the impending judicial activism which
will dramatically redefine a social
structure that greatly predates the
adoption of our Constitution.

We have warnings stretching from Thomas
Jefferson to Justices Powell (1977) and
Rehnquist (1997) about the hazards of
an unfettered judiciary.

An important point is to protect our
right to self-government, and pre-
emptively tell the Courts to let us
continue to fight the "culture war" on
a level playing field.

If we win the culture war then a
Constitutional definition of marriage
is unnecessary. If we lose the culture
war, such a definition is useless (cf
Amendments 18 and 21).

And if we let the referees rig the game,
we will certainly lose.

So then, I propose a revised FMA for
scrutiny and feedback:

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =

Section I
Nothing in this Constitution shall be construed
to require marriage to be recognized as anything
other than the union of a man and a woman; nor
shall this Constitution be construed to require
that the legal incidents of marriage be conferred
upon unmarried individuals, couples, or groups.

Section II
This amendment shall not limit the ability of any
State, or the Congress, to alter their definition
of marriage by legislation or amendment. However,
no Federal Court, nor any court of any State, shall
have the power to redefine marriage, nor the power
to force another branch of government to do so.

Section III
Nothing in this Constitution shall be construed to
empower any court to extend changes of marriage law
from one State to another, or from any State to the
Federal government.

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =

I solicit your honest and candid reactions.

I request that you pay less attention to my
preface and more attention to the proposed
amendment language.

- Gordon


294 posted on 08/03/2004 11:31:49 PM PDT by Thinking-in-PDX
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To: little jeremiah
"What We Can Do To Defeat The 'Gay' Agenda."

I say that we let them all get married.

In a few years, they'll be too damned busy in beating the emotional crap out of one another in divorce courts, to try to push any kind of agenda on the rest of us, and those alimony payments will take a huge chunk out of their gay PAC's donation budget.

295 posted on 08/03/2004 11:41:20 PM PDT by Luis Gonzalez (Sin Patria, pero sin amo)
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To: Thinking-in-PDX

My computer is flaking, heats up after a few minutes. When it comes back or gets replaced, I'll reply. Can't do it now.


296 posted on 08/04/2004 6:32:58 AM PDT by little jeremiah (The Islamic Jihad and the Homosexual Jihad both want to destroy us.)
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To: Luis Gonzalez

Nope. Excuses. Already the "gay" agenda people have achieved a tremendous amount of their goals - and they not only have not slacked off, they're monitoring churches, imprisoned a pastor in Sweden, passed strict "hatespeech" laws in Canada and want to do the same here.

Nope.


297 posted on 08/04/2004 6:34:39 AM PDT by little jeremiah (The Islamic Jihad and the Homosexual Jihad both want to destroy us.)
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To: little jeremiah

I tend to agree with MEGoody. Swift's essay is very disturbing, and its venomous punch is wrenching. But I cannot say "terrifying", and I fear that too many people are taking such extremism too seriously.

I agree that there are indeed homosexual activists with an agenda, and that we must recognize and counter their efforts. But if we simply polarize the debate we will destroy our country even as we try to save it.

There has always been a silent majority, but we do ourselves and them a disfavor by assuming their agreement with our assessments. It will take an immense effort of good will to awaken the conscience of our nation, but one necessary way to defend marriage against the "gay agenda" is to defend it against the growing apathy about hetero offenses against marriage. This may not be the most attractive message to many "moralphobes", but it is much more rational than claiming that extremist rants are the heart of the "gay agenda".

- Gordon


298 posted on 08/04/2004 5:47:38 PM PDT by Thinking-in-PDX
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To: Askel5

I wish everyone understood it as well as you do....AMEN TO WHAT YOU HAVE SAID...

TRUTH STANDS ALONE and IS A LIGHT IN A DARK WORLD.


299 posted on 08/04/2004 5:53:30 PM PDT by Kackikat (,Kerry=the counterfeit, GWBush is the real deal!)
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To: Askel5; little jeremiah

Little Jeremiah -

Yes, but....

Yes, I agree that deceit and Truth often advance in
the vastly different ways that you outline.

But I believe that people of Truth must strive to be
an effective influence in the political fray as part
of our commission to be salt and light - and we need
to acknowledge that political parties are **not**
churches.

When we discuss politics and law (rather than Truth
and Law) we must consider that politics is the art
of the possible and that our success depends upon
addition rather than subtraction - joining with those
who partially agree with us rather than separating
from those who don't agree with us entirely.

- Gordon

p.s. If your point is that people of Truth ought to
avoid politics and law, then I have misunderstood your
posts.
- gb


300 posted on 08/05/2004 9:31:22 AM PDT by Thinking-in-PDX
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