The WB Cancels Joss Whedon's "Angel"

IGN Insider ^ | February 13, 2004 | KJB

[BibChr]

Yep. Ethically, spiritually, morally, Whedon is a burbling, ankle-biting idiot.

But DANG he puts out fresh, creative, well-done shows.

Dan

[BibChr]

Agree with a lot of what you say. That whole oh-look-Willow's-a-lesbian-now! trainwreck was lame, artificial, unbelievable, offensive, and so PATENLY geared to make Whedon the toast of the elite soirees.

It's even more painful when you watch through the DVD's. Came out of NO WHERE.

As to Buffy being a slut — ALL the women are sluts, and the men clintons, in the Buffyverse. Notice that? For all his excellencies as a writer, Whedon et al. evidently — like ALL Hollywood screenwriters — NEVER in his life met even one practicing Christian, let alone ANYONE who would EVER say a principled "no" to sex. With anyone. Anywhere. EVER.

Dan

[altura]

Wow, thanks for the info.

Do you ever know a lot about Angel!

[Johnny_Cipher]

Any main character (O'Neill) who says things like "General, request permission to beat the crap out of this man." deserves a second look.

SG-1 is great.

[Paul C. Jesup]

In the Buffy series prehaps but in teh Angel series what about; Wendon Price, Gunn and Lorne.

[mosel-saar-ruwer]

I don't see SG1 as right-wing at all. Daniel Jackson is a big lefty. It is sharply written and a great show though.

Dude - SG1 is up there with South Park as the most right-wing show on television. Possibly even more right-wing than South Park. [On South Park, a military guy like O'Neill would be missing a few teeth and he'd have at least one illegitimate child by his first cousin, or possibly even his sister...]

[BibChr]

I'm not immediately seeing your point -- I immediately think of Wes and Lylah (sp?). Gunn and Fred never married, but had sex{3}. Lorne... well, it's generally believed his character is supposed to be homosexual.

So could you help me see what you mean, if I missed it?

Dan

[Oztrich Boy]

If the Buffy t.v. show is ever made into a movie, I want everyone back in high school, Sophomore year.

but as all of them but Sarah are over 30, that'd look all Beverly Hills 90210.

[mosel-saar-ruwer]

Wes and Lylah (sp?)

In the universe of hot babes, that Lylah (sp?) chick was one sizzlin' hot babe.

Of course, an actress doesn't come within a country mile of a Joss Whedon production unless she's a hot babe to begin with...

[Owen]

Count me as an avid fan of the Buffyverse, not that anyone cares.

Whedon's strength is he treats his writers well. A lot of the storytelling excellence week to week comes from that. He can't personally write every episode. He has a marvelous staff. Call that skill in picking and skill in keeping.

Contrast that with Chris Carter. Quite a few of Whedon's staff are XF alumni and could not get away from Carter fast enough.

[altura]

Joss seems to be loyal to his actors ... he keeps finding them work in other series, i.e. two Firefly characters appearing in Buffy and Angel.

[Ciexyz]

I remember when they canceled Star Trek.

So do I! And William Shatner moved on to margarine commercials.

[Paul C. Jesup]

In the context of things: Wes turned to Lylah when Wes was outcasted from the Angel team for kidnapping Angel's son and being slashed in the throat and left for dead.

As for Gunn and Fred, they loved each other and they lived day-to-day as if it was their last because they could have been killed anytime.

And how many people in this country has had sex out of wed-locked, 80%?

When you say Clinton, none neither Gunn or Wes treated the women they dated like dirt, (it was Lylah's idea to dress up like Fred, NOT Wes'). And for the woman in Wes's closet, she slit his throat and left him for dead, I can see the logic for revenge.

[BibChr]

Thanks for the explanation!

I use "clinton" to meah "male slut," since there is no other term.

Yes, many people fornicate, lie, steal, cheat, do drugs; it's still immoral, and my point is that Whedon evidently thinks no one exists would would simply and consistently say "no" to sex outside of marriage. That simply is not true.

I still can't think of one character in Buffy/Angel matching that description. (Xander did, ONE TIME, to Buffy-under-a-spell; but not Anya, not Faith, I think not Cordelia, etc.)

Dan

[Paul C. Jesup]

I use "clinton" to meah "male slut," since there is no other term.

Gigalo or man-whore works. Neither of which would fit Wes or Gunn.

Yes, many people fornicate, lie, steal, cheat, do drugs; it's still immoral, and my point is that Whedon evidently thinks no one exists would would simply and consistently say "no" to sex outside of marriage. That simply is not true.

So Joss doesn't bury his head in the sand and create a clean world, but instead gives us a mix of the real-world and the supernatural.

I still can't think of one character in Buffy/Angel matching that description. (Xander did, ONE TIME, to Buffy-under-a-spell; but not Anya, not Faith, I think not Cordelia, etc.)

I think Zander learn his lesson on that one.

[BibChr]

Now Paul, I really don't think I'm writing that unclearly.

Whedon IS in fact burying his head and not living in the real world, in that he can't find it in himself to acknowledge EVEN ONE Christian or otherwise moral real person, whose sexual mores don't parallel dogs in heat.

This is a long-recognized phenomenon in Hollywood screenwriters in general. Whedon distills it. In his case, interviews pretty well indicate that it's because he finds God threatening and inconveniencing. Again, he shares that with Ho'wood screenwriters in general.

Dan

[BibChr]

...and if Xander learned anything by Faith, can you name any subsequent sexual offer he turned down? If there is one, I can't think of it.

Dan

[Paul C. Jesup]

Whedon IS in fact burying his head and not living in the real world, in that he can't find it in himself to acknowledge EVEN ONE Christian or otherwise moral real person, whose sexual mores don't parallel dogs in heat.

Well there was Holtz, but that is more of an Ahab/Mobydick situation.

If you want to compare most of the america population to dogs, go ahead, but some people are going to disagree with you.

[Paul C. Jesup]

Is sounds like you want Buffy/Angel to be something it is not. Angel is about fighting evil in the darkness. There are several Christian made series on the Chirstian channels that you may like more.

[Cinnamon Girl]

That's okay with me. Shows always stink once they get to college.